Charles-Andres Brym

[Kadenge]

...and don't forget Simeon Jackson who down the stretch run, scored in buckets for Norwich to help win promotion to the EPL. He wasn't the same player for Canada. Occean was either tied for first or 2nd in B2 scoring when we played Honduras & Panama in 2014 Concacaf WCQ.  Occean missed a couple of sitters vs Honduras In Toronto (ended 0-0) which would have put us in the Hex 

[Free kick]

48 minutes ago, Kadenge said:

...and don't forget Simeon Jackson who down the stretch run, scored in buckets for Norwich to help win promotion to the EPL. He wasn't the same player for Canada. Occean was either tied for first or 2nd in B2 scoring when we played Honduras & Panama in 2014 Concacaf WCQ.  Occean missed a couple of sitters vs Honduras In Toronto (ended 0-0) which would have put us in the Hex 

True.  But if you look back on those Campaigns, we may remember this and that sitter that was missing but on the whole, we were not creating scoring changes in sufficient numbers in my opinion.  Players like Occean and Friends are like hitters in baseball,  no one is going to bat 1.000.   had they had 5-8 good chances (sitters) in those games, they might of converted one or two, then we might be saying they lived up to their billing.   But i dont think we had the squads to create scoring chances.  Also, We needed someone up front with more diverse skills and more versatile...   Yes, jackson seems to fit more of that bill

Edited May 13, 2022 by Free kick

[Obinna]

18 minutes ago, Free kick said:

Thats why i am not sure that they would even get named this squad.   One played in Norway and the other in the Bundesliga side but never on one of the top sides (at the time) in Germany.  

While it's true that he did play most of his career in Norway, Occean was more than just a Norwegian league player. He played 3 season in Germany at a time when he won the majority of his Canada caps, if I am not mistaken.

Just want to add that context to the discussion.

Like Friend, he scored tons of goals in the B2. He was actually the division's top scorer in 2011-12 with 17 goals. He did follow that up with a paltry 1 goal in 18 the following season in the Bundesliga, however. Then he only scored 3 the following season with FCK in the B2. 

[The Real Marc]

Success, for us at club level at that time, was a low bar. None of our strikers were consistent at the club level. Friend had one good season. Jackson a single half-season tear, and Occean three good seasons. I think that's pretty common for journeyman players.

Edited May 13, 2022 by The Real Marc

[Free kick]

8 minutes ago, Obinna said:

While it's true that he did play most of his career in Norway, Occean was more than just a Norwegian league player. He played 3 season in Germany at a time when he won the majority of his Canada caps, if I am not mistaken.

Just want to add that context to the discussion.

Like Friend, he scored tons of goals in the B2. He was actually the division's top scorer in 2011-12 with 17 goals. He did follow that up with a paltry 1 goal in 18 the following season in the Bundesliga, however. Then he only scored 3 the following season with FCK in the B2. 

There is also the fact that the game has changed.  Target-men in the mold of Alan Shearer and Christian Vieri are disappearing and becoming extinct.   Occean and Friend were players in that mold (Obviously NOT at the same level!) and even when they were on the MNT,  the game was evolving from the true #9 targetman to something different. 

 

PS.: In concacaf,  i don't ever recall the Americans or Mexican ever employing that type centre forward like Occean, Freind, or Corrazin.   And it may have been the same for everyone else that we would lose to in WCQ.

Edited May 13, 2022 by Free kick

[Obinna]

14 minutes ago, Kadenge said:

...and don't forget Simeon Jackson who down the stretch run, scored in buckets for Norwich to help win promotion to the EPL. He wasn't the same player for Canada. Occean was either tied for first or 2nd in B2 scoring when we played Honduras & Panama in 2014 Concacaf WCQ.  Occean missed a couple of sitters vs Honduras In Toronto (ended 0-0) which would have put us in the Hex 

Throwing Simeon in the Friend/Occean category, eh? To me that feels a little harsh.

Sure, he never had a great goal scoring record for Canada either, but he did win 49 caps for us. I feel like there was a little more meat to his CMNT service. He also played a lot of minutes on the wing, whereas at Norwich he exclusively played in a 2 man strike force, often partnering the legendary Grant Holt.

Or we can just focus on the fact he scored the same number of Canada goals in nearly double the games as Occean. I am okay with that, I suppose. He did play at forward enough for us to have scored more than he did, even with the wing play.

Ricketts played on the wing for us too and scored a lot more goals (and won a lot more caps too).

[Obinna]

3 minutes ago, The Real Marc said:

None of our strikers were consistent at the club level. Everyone had their above-average season or two (Ocean had maybe 3) and then petered out. Which is pretty par for the course.

This is true on the surface, but if we look under the hood we can see that Occean had 3 seasons in the Norwegian top flight where he scored double digits, then another two where he scored 7 and 8 goals respectively. That's pretty consistent if we can excuse the fact Norway was a relatively low level (still is).

Friend scored 14 in 40 during his time in top flight Norway, which was respectable. Then he scored 8 goals in 31 Eredivise games, which again is pretty decent.

You're right though, because after he exploded for 18 goals for Monchengladbach's promotion season, and after he scored another 7 in the Bundesliga, he sort of fell off a cliff. It was similar with Occean.

[VinceA]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

Throwing Simeon in the Friend/Occean category, eh? To me that feels a little harsh.

Sure, he never had a great goal scoring record for Canada either, but he did win 49 caps for us. I feel like there was a little more meat to his CMNT service. He also played a lot of minutes on the wing, whereas at Norwich he exclusively played in a 2 man strike force, often partnering the legendary Grant Holt.

Or we can just focus on the fact he scored the same number of Canada goals in nearly double the games as Occean. I am okay with that, I suppose. He did play at forward enough for us to have scored more than he did, even with the wing play.

Ricketts played on the wing for us too and scored a lot more goals (and won a lot more caps too).

Post Norwich for whatever reason Simeon Jackson fell off a cliff.

[The Real Marc]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

This is true on the surface, but if we look under the hood we can see that Occean had 3 seasons in the Norwegian top flight where he scored double digits, then another two where he scored 7 and 8 goals respectively. That's pretty consistent if we can excuse the fact Norway was a relatively low level (still is).

Friend scored 14 in 40 during his time in top flight Norway, which was respectable. Then he scored 8 goals in 31 Eredivise games, which again is pretty decent.

You're right though, because after he exploded for 18 goals for Monchengladbach's promotion season, and after he scored another 7 in the Bundesliga, he sort of fell off a cliff. It was similar with Occean.

That's true. I was setting the bar a bit higher than that - if we're looking at seasons < 10 goals a bunch of them may be penalties. But you are right, I wrote consistent - but in my mind I meant consistently good, rather than average.

Not detracting from him at all - I think Occéan had a good career, his stats plumped by two outstanding seasons and deflated by the two at Lillestrom and later one at Odd where he struggled with injuries. I just think that those types of results were impressive for the time for us but really not all that special when considered more broadly.

Over thirty years we had Bunbury and Radz. De Rosario. Corazzin too although his was a low level. (Olivier probably compares to him.) Beyond that? Berdusco, Thompson, Cav, Ricketts, Gerba, Haber, Kusch, Jackson, Hume, etc., etc. even Pesch, for all the money and the moves didn't score that often.

Certainly, our lack of league held us back but how many other nations didn't have one or two strikers in their caddy that were above-average goal scorers at club level?

Ten years ago we'd be losing our mind over Brym. Today, we're debating whether he's done enough. It feels weird but nice, eh?

Edited May 14, 2022 by The Real Marc

[Shway]

It’s the versatility that’s gets you into the squad.

Bryms ability to play anywhere on the front three will be tick in his advantage over someone like Corbeanu who’s more of just a winger.

Tbh, even before Brym, Akinola, Corbeanu, or Nelson….I want to see Ennin. 

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

It’s the versatility that’s gets you into the squad.

Bryms ability to play anywhere on the front three will be tick in his advantage over someone like Corbeanu who’s more of just a winger.

Tbh, even before Brym, Akinola, Corbeanu, or Nelson….I want to see Ennin. 

That's a name I thought about but forgot to mention. He's arguably deserving over all of those players. I don't see Ghana calling him, so perhaps no risk there, but he's just about at the level where we'd better be safe than sorry and call him in. If we don't do it now, then when? Seems like the perfect time, really.

Maybe our boy @TGAA_Star can share his opinion on whether Ennin is or should be on Ghana's radar...

[InglewoodJack]

I think there are more deserving guys than Ennin, but there’s no way Canada calls a player up who is playing in Russia.

[SoCalTransport]

44 minutes ago, InglewoodJack said:

I think there are more deserving guys than Ennin, but there’s no way Canada calls a player up who is playing in Russia.

Yeah but they’ll play Iran in a friendly, seem hypocritical to me 😇

[InglewoodJack]

5 minutes ago, SoCalTransport said:

Yeah but they’ll play Iran in a friendly, seem hypocritical to me 😇

I missed the thing about Iran invading another country!

[SoCalTransport]

Just now, InglewoodJack said:

I missed the thing about Iran invading another country!

This is a soccer forum so I won’t get into a history lesson about Iran, but the human rights violations and the fact that they shot down a plane that had Canadians on it, should be enough to play another team.

I guess Canada isn’t much better these days, you disagree or question the government and they seize your assets.

[SpecialK]

4 hours ago, Shway said:

It’s the versatility that’s gets you into the squad.

Bryms ability to play anywhere on the front three will be tick in his advantage over someone like Corbeanu who’s more of just a winger.

Tbh, even before Brym, Akinola, Corbeanu, or Nelson….I want to see Ennin. 

I want to see all in nations league. 

Edited May 14, 2022 by SpecialK

[SpecialK]

9 minutes ago, SoCalTransport said:

This is a soccer forum so I won’t get into a history lesson about Iran, but the human rights violations and the fact that they shot down a plane that had Canadians on it, should be enough to play another team.

I guess Canada isn’t much better these days, you disagree or question the government and they seize your assets.

The government  seized  those assets because of a bunch of idiots tried to take over a city by shutting it down with those assets. I’m sorry I am from Ottawa and those idiots can fuck off and those assets can be bought back at auction. 
 

Now back to football. 

Edited May 14, 2022 by SpecialK

[SpecialK]

Brym has played amazing !!! And has looked good on the right side. 

[InglewoodJack]

18 minutes ago, SoCalTransport said:

This is a soccer forum so I won’t get into a history lesson about Iran, but the human rights violations and the fact that they shot down a plane that had Canadians on it, should be enough to play another team.

I guess Canada isn’t much better these days, you disagree or question the government and they seize your assets.

Man none of this makes sense. Let’s get back to the topic.

[SoCalTransport]

16 minutes ago, SpecialK said:

The government  seized  those assets because of a bunch of idiots tried to take over a city by shutting it down with those assets. I’m sorry I am from Ottawa and those idiots can fuck off and those assets can be bought back at auction. 
 

Now back to football. 

It’s a dangerous precedent, no matter what the issue is, and it scares me that anyone thinks it’s ok for the government to have these powers. I know this is not the forum for this.

The point I was making there seems to be a double standard, we can’t call a player who plays in Russia, but we can play Iran in a friendly. I believe Ennin deserves a look.

[toontownman]

45 minutes ago, SpecialK said:

I want to see all in nations league. 

Definitely.

Really hoping we have an extended squad of 26 to 30 or so and rotate for the friendly using our strongest side for the Iran game and cap tie a few in the nations league. Could also see David and Larin being left out if they are working on moves, I'd be OK with it too. 

[SpecialK]

1 hour ago, SoCalTransport said:

It’s a dangerous precedent, no matter what the issue is, and it scares me that anyone thinks it’s ok for the government to have these powers. I know this is not the forum for this.

The point I was making there seems to be a double standard, we can’t call a player who plays in Russia, but we can play Iran in a friendly. I believe Ennin deserves a look.

I don’t understand why we can’t call him up ? Also Ennin’s loan will be finished in June. Though it’s played 19 games and only 1 goal. Honestly we should be seeing a bunch of new players. For me as a fan I don’t want to see Larin or much of big guns we have for nations league. We are against Honduras and  Curaçao we should be able to beat them with our B squad. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

5 hours ago, InglewoodJack said:

I think there are more deserving guys than Ennin, but there’s no way Canada calls a player up who is playing in Russia.

Why not? His contract is with a team from a Latvian club, he's on loan, and officially goes back in 6 weeks. 

Has played u17 for Canada. A Brampton kid. Not going to call him up? 

[Unnamed Trialist]

So if anyone has figured out the promotion system from Dutch 2nd to 1st, could you let us know? I see two teams go up directly. Two drop directly from the 1st tier. Then a third team in Eredivisie goes into a playoff, and that team is not decided yet.

But how does the promotion playoff work?

 

[TGAA_Star]

8 hours ago, Obinna said:

That's a name I thought about but forgot to mention. He's arguably deserving over all of those players. I don't see Ghana calling him, so perhaps no risk there, but he's just about at the level where we'd better be safe than sorry and call him in. If we don't do it now, then when? Seems like the perfect time, really.

Maybe our boy @TGAA_Star can share his opinion on whether Ennin is or should be on Ghana's radar...

He should be on Ghana's radar but we are also trying to load up too by getting other players to switch nationality to play for us like Hudson Odoi, Nketiah, Inaki & Nico Williams, Lamptey but Ennin hasn't been on our radar