Ansem Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, zeelaw1555362314 said: I was told a similar to you guys. Early demand suggests the Club/Club Plus is going fast etc. York Region has cash and maybe the general public isn't so against at these prices. Maybe to everyone else here paying $200 per game for the odd Leafs ticket is normal and these look like a steal. I have to agree with the above. Unless that organization are ran by idiots, you don't price something until you do a market study. We have to assume that they are confident that they will draw what they are looking for at those prices. The price per game is reasonable and I think they still draw what they are looking for. In simple marketing terms, I told them on twitter to make it bigger that they had payment plans, not making that obvious is a mistake. Asking for 1000$ upfront for 2 tickets is a lot, but making it clear you can pay it in 3, 4 or 5 times lessen the blow significantly. 100$+ tax, 5 times makes more sense for me, that's where they should be putting more energy...FLEXIBILITY We won't know for sure until the ticket sales figure comes out but they could still adjust them down the road. People have to stop projecting their inability/unwillingness to spend on approx. 1.2M people. Some can and will pay the price, some will just buy game day tickets and some won't. Full disclosure, I put down 50$ down. Yes I found it expensive. That's 1000$ for 2. It's not even about the money that much but the stadium itself not having some type of roofing makes it hard to justify such a spending as I know I won't go in bad weather. I will go to games when there's no rain. I suspect that the overwhelming majority of those wanting to support the league will do as well. I think the league should really look at weather protection investment as a way to protect their revenues during bad weather. Empty stadiums during heavy rain doesn't help your bottom line... Edited November 1, 2018 by Ansem Bbeto 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 1 hour ago, zeelaw1555362314 said: I was told a similar to you guys. Early demand suggests the Club/Club Plus is going fast etc. York Region has cash and maybe the general public isn't so against at these prices. Maybe to everyone else here paying $200 per game for the odd Leafs ticket is normal and these look like a steal. The Leafs thing is a bit deceptive though (the lower bowl is mostly corporate purchases for a reason, as even at STH prices they are ridiculously priced and not owned by "individuals" as much as "corporate entities") --- but the upper bowl Greens are about $120 a seat and Purples are about $60 a seat at season ticket holder rates which covers almost 95%+ of the building in the 300 level (ie. it's almost all sold at those prices originally) --- people are buying at those prices because they clearly know they can sell off 30 of their 45 games or so at a profit and go to the other 15 or so games for "free" or at a minimal expense -- -almost everyone I know who has season tickets does this (I wish I had Leafs season tickets in the Purples! - I would love to pay $60 a ticket as opposed to what I've been paying - ha ha ha) --- if most Leafs STH were paying $120+ a seat and $220+ a seat for their purples and greens as their invoiced ST price (like you see on TM as the "face value"), a lot of people would eventually drop them as they could not get their money back on the secondary market ---- I would assume that most people by now know that MLSE and other professional teams have almost always listed a face value price on their seats well over what STH actually pay - they do this so that when seats are sold on the secondary market (or even to friends and family) for "face value", the STH can make a profit while still appearing to sell for "face" - it's a "dirty little secret" to some people who have been selling their tickets for "face value" to friends and family for years and profiting as a result (sometimes 2-3X what was paid originally) - I learned this the hard way over the years (!).....I have even been told by reps in the past to buy more STs (at these lower rates) as I could relist them on their own resale sites for more than I pay to offset my costs for the ones I would not be able to use, so clearly they know this is happening and are condoning/encouraging it in some cases to make sales (BTW - I didn't buy the extra seats even with that sales pitch - ha ha ha).....this stuff is out there however, and clearly affects a lot of sales for these products whether we agree with the practice or not.....having no secondary market demand to speak of for Y9 will affect their sales whether they like it or not, as most STH clearly offset their costs from the games they don't go to, to pay for the ones that they do.....and yes if it rains or is too hot many people simply won't go - putting a roof on BMO has caused me to go to way more game with my kids than I would have gone to in the past --- although I do miss my view of the downtown skyline from the upper west side.....ha ha ha...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 11 minutes ago, Ansem said: I have to agree with the above. Unless that organization are ran by idiots, you don't price something until you do a market study. We have to assume that they are confident that they will draw what they are looking for at those prices. The price per game is reasonable and I think they still draw what they are looking for. In simple marketing terms, I told them on twitter to make it bigger that they had payment plans, not making that obvious is a mistake. Asking for 1000$ upfront for 2 tickets is a lot, but making it clear you can pay it in 3, 4 or 5 times lessen the blow significantly. 100$+ tax, 5 times makes more sense for me, that's where they should be putting more energy...FLEXIBILITY We won't know for sure until the ticket sales figure comes out but they could still adjust them down the road. People have to stop projecting their inability/unwillingness to spend on approx. 1.2M people. Some can and will pay the price, some will just by game day tickets and some won't. Full disclosure, I put down 50$ down. Yes I found it expensive. That's 1000$ for 2. It's not even about the money that much but the stadium itself not having some type of roofing makes it hard to justify such a spending as I know I won't go in bad weather. I will go to games when there's no rain. I suspect that the overwhelming majority of those wanting to support the league will do as well. I think the league should really look at weather protection investment as a way to protect their revenues during bad weather. Empty stadiums during heavy rain doesn't help your bottom line... I am sure the Argos did market studies for many years as to what people would pay to watch CFL football at BMO (and the dome prior to that), and clearly they got it wrong repeatedly ----- they lowered the prices and price points at BMO between 2016 to 2018 despite being told repeatedly by "customers" (like myself) - who clearly don't know as much as they do with all of their research studies - that what they were doing was wrong --- guess what? the customers were right.....For example - the Argos had 5 (?!!) different price points in Section 220 in 2016 -- this was insane and made no sense whatsoever - some seats in the same row in the same section had a different price - every customer said it was nuts --- in 2018 the entire section all went down in price and had a single price point - wow it's like Joe Public was smarter than all of the studies.....sometimes the emperor has no clothes, and everyone in the office is afraid to say anything for fear of losing their jobs --- I know lots of organizations that have been run into the ground this way..... --- the Jays lost 900,000 in sales this year after RAISING their prices after a crappy 2017 (we knew the team was "bad" after 2017 - what made people think that raising prices would sell more tickets?) --- sometimes organizations get their numbers wrong and the market won't bear what they think it will.....to me Y9 looks like they are trying to offset their start-up costs on the backs of their ST sales at a rate that does not make sense in relation to the value of the product in the marketplace --- MLSE had to lose a lot of money on TFC at the beginning with $199 and $229 season tickets just to get people into the building to see an "unknown" product and try to grow it from there....without deep pockets this thing is not going to get through its first 3-5 years of growing pains....I'll believe that 10,000-15,000 stadium will be up and filled, when I see it with my own eyes....until then this is fantasy land..... Blindside16 and BringBackTheBlizzard 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Team Canada said: I am sure the Argos did market studies for many years as to what people would pay to watch CFL football at BMO (and the dome prior to that), and clearly they got it wrong repeatedly ----- they lowered the prices and price points at BMO between 2016 to 2018 despite being told repeatedly by "customers" (like myself) - who clearly don't know as much as they do with all of their research studies - that what they were doing was wrong --- guess what? the customers were right.....For example - the Argos had 5 (?!!) different price points in Section 220 in 2016 -- this was insane and made no sense whatsoever - some seats in the same row in the same section had a different price - every customer said it was nuts --- in 2018 the entire section all went down in price and had a single price point - wow it's like Joe Public was smarter than all of the studies.....sometimes the emperor has no clothes, and everyone in the office is afraid to say anything for fear of losing their jobs --- I know lots of organizations that have been run into the ground this way..... --- the Jays lost 900,000 in sales this year after RAISING their prices after a crappy 2017 (we knew the team was "bad" after 2017 - what made people think that raising prices would sell more tickets?) --- sometimes organizations get their numbers wrong and the market won't bear what they think it will.....to me Y9 looks like they are trying to offset their start-up costs on the backs of their ST sales at a rate that does not make sense in relation to the value of the product in the marketplace --- MLSE had to lose a lot of money on TFC at the beginning with $199 and $229 season tickets just to get people into the building to see an "unknown" product and try to grow it from there....without deep pockets this thing is not going to get through its first 3-5 years of growing pains....I'll believe that 10,000-15,000 stadium will be up and filled, when I see it with my own eyes....until then this is fantasy land..... You're saying the leads is deceptive and you use the Argos... It's apple and oranges in regards to York 9. Addressing your last points... I think they obviously have deep pockets willing and able to lose money and with what they are doing at York U, a ton of it. I don't agree with their pricing either but this community is a minuscule part of the bigger picture. They could have wrongfully assume that we're all supporters that would just be happy with the supporters section prices which most agree are right but not the other seats. If they think they can get casuals and soccer fans outside the vogayeurs to buy in, the more power to them. We'll see and if they are wrong, expect price adjustments. I just want us to stop projecting our views on the entire region because that's equally nuts and fantasy land Edited November 1, 2018 by Ansem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 ^ I am not saying that we on these boards are representative of everyone in the marketplace (you're right, that is crazy!) - but a lot of the people here are some of the most engaged fans in regards to this new league; and in my opinion the average sports fan in the GTA does not even know the CPL exists frankly (almost no marketing except for the cars driving around York region). The Canadian soccer supporters on these boards are way more likely to stick around as soccer fans over the long haul, when this thing does not have mainstream popularity, than others who are more likely to try it as the flavour of the month and then bolt when the next shiny object comes along or they can't get their money back for their unused tickets..... You even wrote "expect price adjustments" --- that's my whole point (!) the prices are not appropriate in all parts of that stadium (or even to their market with no offerings of significantly discounted Youth pricing to encourage families to come to games) and the fact that there is direct competition for the "soccer fan's dollar" in this marketplace means Y9 has a much harder road than other teams do in terms of creating value for their product as they have a tough battle taking money away from TFC fans (yes some Y9 fans are also going to be TFC fans - I don't think York people consider themselves as York first and Toronto second when it comes to supporting sports teams like Hamilton fans might).....so other teams might even be able to charge Y9's prices (Edmonton was fairly close) and get away with it easier than even Y9 could..... The Argos comparison is of course not exactly the same but frankly we are talking about a Canadian based league, with a long history and massive television exposure on TSN (CPL is even worse off in my opinion as they have no history (brand equity) to speak of///will the CPL even have that type of TV coverage?), in a market that perceives itself as "major league"; we have ownership groups trying to come up with appropriate price points to sell tickets and clearly they are getting it wrong repeatedly with the CFL in this market, as their sales did not match what they thought they could get --- I'm just saying "research is fallible" and does not always reflect the reality of the marketplace demand.....and I have seen lots of organizations (very large ones in fact - sporting and non-sporting alike), create sales targets based on numbers that are simply not realistic in order to meet some type of short term revenue goal (from an owner or supervisor) that is unsustainable in the long run....I was sold by many reps as to to some crazy price points from almost every team in this city at one point or another (I am a huge sports fan who goes to lots of games of various sports) and there is usually a massive turnover in those roles because someone finds that they can't meet their bosses insane sales demands for a product (tickets/cars/widgets) which they are told to sell at a crazy price, until the next person comes along and tells that boss what they want to hear (I can sell those tickets at the price you want (ie. because I need a job)), only to find out a year later that they too are out of a job (or go to the next team in a cycle of short term employment) because this is simply an unsustainable model.....frankly I have felt so bad for some of these folks contacting me, that I have offered to take their resumes (and received more than my fair share from many sales reps!) for when the venture failed (as it usually does), and tried to help them get other jobs as I knew (and they knew) the end was near based on the ridiculous demands being made of them.....maybe this will be Y9's story and maybe not, I guess we will see..... I hope that I am wrong and this will all be a roaring success at the price points they've posted --- I am simply dubious and will take my money elsewhere and watch from the sidelines to see how it all pans out --- the sad part is I wanted this league to succeed as I think most of the posters on this board do too, I'm simply doubtful that it will in this market...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 Just for funsies, I decided to look at what York9's potential revenue would be with these prices. Seats per section are based on the seating diagrams, so aren't accurate but should be a rough estimate. Obviously this is only if they fill every seat at season ticket prices, so this is a maximum potential revenue. Not including sponsorship, concessions, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Observer Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 2 hours ago, Team Canada said: I admit that the couple of hundred dollars won't change my life and I am fortunate in that regard - my issue with Y9 is that no one wants to feel like a "sucker" and customers are getting smarter in understanding the value of the tickets they are buying more than ever --- how many $6 stubhub seats (works out to about $13Canadian all in with fees) does one have to see online before one feels stupid about buying Jays tickets for $30 plus in the 500Level from the box office (I know I won't make that mistake again this year) - 900,000 less seats were sold last year to the Jays --- they will sell less this year too as they have not changed their pricing structure to reflect the lower demand for their product.....people are getting smarter about their spending habits in this regard because frankly while there are a lot of wealthy people in the GTA, the middle class is eroding and having a family and living in the suburbs is way more expensive than ever and that is Y9's target market - suburban families (houses have went up 3-4X on my street in the last decade --- incomes have not gone up at anywhere near the same rate unfortunately)........ I had Argos tickets the last few years (and have had in the past at various points) and frankly I felt that I was basically donating money to support Canadian Football (they should have sent me a tax receipt - ha ha ha) - the tickets had zero value and that was at $20 or so a seat (and that was a rolled back price in 2018 from even dumber prices in 2017) --- and once they started under-cutting ST prices through groupon and the like (I could buy a seat better than mine for $12-$15 through various promotions that the team themselves would email me?! how insane is that? why would I possibly buy seasons tickets again?) --- doesn't the CPL sound a little CFL like in that we should all just be spending our money (who cares about value) to "donate" to the idea of Canadian Soccer --- ummm, nice idea, but how has that model worked out for the Argos over the years.....if I know I can buy tickets for significantly less when the event occurs (and you will), and there is no built up demand for me to offset my costs for games I can't go to (most people aren't attending every game) - it's simply a poor investment, and no one I know likes to waste money, no matter whether they can afford it or not..... TFC rolling back prices was the smartest thing they ever did --- I know that I probably would have left as a STH had they not done so as my reserved tickets (light greys) would not have had the same value at twice the price (mine went down about 1/2)....the fact that even after winning a lot in 2016-2017 that my tickets only went up fractionally (from about $18 or so a ticket to about $21 or so a ticket in the last 3 years) means I will keep those seats as I feel that MLSE didn't gouge me when they clearly "could have" as the popularity and success and demand was there --- even if they went to about $25 I would stay even after this crappy year as they have built up my loyalty to the brand by respecting me as a customer over the years -- if they got closer to $30 I would probably seriously consider dropping them unless I saw a value in them at that time.....everything has a value price point for people --- I simply think in the GTA for minor league soccer and with an unreserved seat (?!) that their price points are ridiculous -- I've heard people were told derisively to "come early" to get a better seat; not everyone has hours to spend before the game to sit in an empty stadium so that they can get a better seat -- some people are elderly or have kids and that is simply not feasible..... I had four TFC season seats last year and was going to go down to two, to buy two Y9 season tickets to support that endeavour --- TFC has reached out to me asking what could they do to bring me back this week (bending over backwards trying to keep me) --- apparently all it took was Y9 fumbling their pitch to make me go back to TFC with my money.....I'm a big believer that you only have one chance to make a good first impression and Y9 in my opinion clearly has not made one in mine and a lot of other people's eyes..... I don’t have a dog I this fight but man have you heard of the word “brevity”. Blindside16, Greatest Cockney Rip Off, ted and 3 others 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 4 minutes ago, An Observer said: I don’t have a dog I this fight but man have you heard of the word “brevity”. Sadly no ? --- my apologies.....I am done with my long-winded rants..... Gopherbashi 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) I just got off the phone with Ben - about a half-hour call about stuff. In short: - Part of the higher cost is due to $1m in infrastructure upgrades at York. - Looking at multiple sites for the eventual permanent stadium. Markham and Richmond Hill were also mentioned. The Greenpark guy is dumping a bunch of personal money into it. - 3pm was mentioned as a game time, though I don't know if that's concrete. - There is a half-season pack; 8 tickets in club seats for $299 or in the grandstand for $224. Mix and match however you want (8 tickets at one, 1 ticket at eight, etc). - Parking is TBD with York U but likely $10. VIP season parking (about 100 spots) for ~$20/game. - $50 from family grandstand sales will be redirected back towards your pick of youth clubs (ie. $349 for York 9 and $50 for the local club). The $50 discount before Aug 31 took this $50 donation and removed it from your ticket price instead. He seemed open to honouring that discount for people who signed up at launch before it was announced. - They should start calling for season ticket orders this afternoon. Edited November 1, 2018 by Gopherbashi Kent, Ansem, Bbeto and 3 others 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob.notenboom Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 7 minutes ago, Team Canada said: Sadly no ? --- my apologies.....I am done with my long-winded rants..... Well this was brief. So clearly you’ve got it figured. ? Team Canada, deschamp86 and Greatest Cockney Rip Off 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Gopherbashi said: I just got off the phone with Ben - about a half-hour call about stuff. In short: - Part of the higher cost is due to $1m in infrastructure upgrades at York. - Looking at multiple sites for the eventual permanent stadium. Markham and Richmond Hill were also mentioned. The Greenpark guy is dumping a bunch of personal money into it. - 3pm was mentioned as a game time, though I don't know if that's concrete. - There is a half-season pack; 8 tickets in club seats for $299 or in the grandstand for $224. Mix and match however you want (8 tickets at one, 1 ticket at eight, etc). - Parking is TBD with York U but likely $10. VIP season parking (about 100 spots) for ~$20/game. - $50 from family grandstand sales will be redirected back towards your pick of youth clubs (ie. $349 for York 9 and $50 for the local club). The $50 discount before Aug 31 took this $50 donation and removed it from your ticket price instead. He seemed open to honouring that discount for people who signed up at launch before it was announced. - They should start calling for season ticket orders this afternoon. Thanks for the updates. Not sure it's wise to recoup the York U upgrades so fast but understandable as they are leaving a huge legacy infrastructure behind that they won't own...(Ripe for a D2 CPL North York team in the future?) Owner is wealthy and has spare cash to dump, only thing making York 9 viable at this time and in this market. I also doubt that CPL (Beirne and company) would allow an ownership group to have a club in TFC territory without very deep pockets. CPL staff aren't idiots, there's money behind that team...however, the team competency is open for debate lol I pointed out how I disliked their marketing approach. They need to push the half season option and payment plan option more. All we're seeing is $499... Push the $299 more which actually makes way more sense to me and if If need to see more games, I'll buy individual tickets. Also, since the seats are unassigned seats, just the section, no need to buy 2. I'd just buy 1 half season for myself and have guests I'm taking to the game to buy their tickets whenever... That's my take. Just need to have a tighter marketing strategy. Edited November 1, 2018 by Ansem Gopherbashi 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YTZ Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 My strategy would be to make the tickets as affordable as possible and get as many butt in the seats. Create an event. A loud, full stadium brings people in. Also, give out as many hats, jersey's, scarfs as you can so you develop a presence in the community. You need to create a demand for your product. Once you build a solid base, you can raise prices. My fear is that they will only get 1-2K people in the stands and tickets can be bought for 5 bucks on ticket resale sites which kills the value of season tickets. Team Canada, Blackjack15, ted and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 ^ That is the only strategy that make sense if you are building for the long-term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtlMario Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 10 hours ago, Team Canada said: minor league soccer I don't think it's fair to call it that at this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 7 minutes ago, MtlMario said: I don't think it's fair to call it that at this time. Ok - a level of pro soccer well beneath that which is played in MLS. I was using "minor league" as that is how I imagine others will see it in the marketplace (ie. not the highest level played in the area --- the Marlies (AHL) are "pro hockey", but most people see it as "minor league" in comparison to the Leafs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 4 hours ago, rob.notenboom said: Well this was brief. So clearly you’ve got it figured. ? Some levity for my brevity --- Thanks!! (ha ha ha)...... rob.notenboom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Team Canada said: Ok - a level of pro soccer well beneath that which is played in MLS. Who cares besides you and hardcore MLS fans? You think that stops the Scottish from loving the Scottish Premiership? 10 minutes ago, Team Canada said: I was using "minor league" as that is how I imagine others will see it in the marketplace (ie. not the highest level played in the area --- the Marlies (AHL) are "pro hockey", but most people see it as "minor league" in comparison to the Leafs). We should care about what others think why exactly? Yeah and the CFL is "Minor league"...Get out of here ? Edited November 1, 2018 by Ansem Bbeto 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) Sorry to offend --- these are pro athletes who are way better than any of us will ever be at their craft ( I have friends who have played in the league and the AHL too!) --- nonetheless in my experience I have found that sports fans tend to support the "highest" levels played of the sport in this area at a much greater rate and tend to "ignore" the lower levels of the sport played in this region - CFL athletes are awesome (Pinball is one of my favourite HUMANS I've ever had the pleasure of knowing)- but Toronto definitely has an "NFL is better complex" that hurts the sales of the CFL here in my opinion. Most young people that I know who follow football (for example) can identify more NFL players than CFL players....I come from the generation when CFL was a big deal in this market and the Argos really mattered - that simply is not the case for most football fans under 40.....just because I and a small niche audience (who skews older) love the CFL (which I do), doesn't mean it's going to sell to a wider audience who I think tend to "look down" on the league (or simply ignore it completely) in a city like Toronto.....so unfortunately, yes, I do think the wider public perception of the league does matter and will affect sales - we are a "trendy" town who tends to go all in and all out very quickly with things -- look at all of the Jays fans that came out of the woodwork when things were good in late 2015-2016, look at how quickly they all went into hiding (in terms of tickets sales and viewership last season) soon thereafter....unfortunately being seen as "cool" and "major league" matters in the GTA..... Edited November 1, 2018 by Team Canada Blindside16 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Team Canada said: nonetheless in my experience I have found that sports fans tend to support the "highest" levels played of the sport in this area at a much greater rate and tend to "ignore" the lower levels of the sport played in this region - We don't have 2 major league in the same sport in any region in Canada as of now... I have faith in the new generation. They can like both or one of them or whatever. There's enough bodies for both leagues 23 minutes ago, Team Canada said: I come from the generation when CFL was a big deal in this market and the Argos really mattered - that simply is not the case for most football fans under 40.....just because I and a small niche audience (who skews older) love the CFL (which I do), doesn't mean it's going to sell to a wider audience who I think tend to "look down" on the league (or simply ignore it completely) in a city like Toronto..... Respectfully... The Argos need to adjust. They need to play in a smaller venue closer to the suburb like York University post York 9 era, not BMO Field or downtown. MLSE just need to see reality...which they haven't. 10k stadium in York University close to the suburbs who would drive to it instead of hitting traffic on the Gardiner and DVP, close to highways and transit is what they need Edited November 1, 2018 by Ansem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 18 minutes ago, Ansem said: We don't have 2 major league in the same sport in any region in Canada as of now... I have faith in the new generation. They can like both or one of them or whatever. There's enough bodies for both leagues Respectfully... The Argos need to adjust. They need to play in a smaller venue closer to the suburb like York University post York 9 era, not BMO Field or downtown. MLSE just need to see reality...which they haven't. 10k stadium in York University close to the suburbs who would drive to it instead of hitting traffic on the Gardiner and DVP, close to highways and transit is what they need I agree with you that the Argos need to adjust - I wish they would have decided to play at York, it would have been way easier for me to attend the games.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C2SKI Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 1 hour ago, Team Canada said: the Marlies (AHL) are "pro hockey", but most people see it as "minor league" in comparison to the Leafs Of course they do. That's exactly what they are. They are a minor league affiliate of a major league club. CFL and CPL teams are not, and level of play has absolutely nothing to do with that distinction. Greatest Cockney Rip Off and Bbeto 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Canada Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, C2SKI said: Of course they do. That's exactly what they are. They are a minor league affiliate of a major league club. CFL and CPL teams are not, and level of play has absolutely nothing to do with that distinction. I think we are getting bogged down in semantics — people are focusing on the words pro or minor league - ok then, how about the idea that there is a “higher level of skill” pro league (MLS) and a “lower level of skill” pro league (CPL) - yes, the CFL is pro (but still viewed as less “talented/skilled” for the average roster player for the most part than the NFL average roster player - I am aware of the many exceptions like Warren Moon and such); and yes AHL is both “pro” (they get paid enough to make a living), and minor league, as it is affiliated with a “parent club”.....the point is the average level of skill is higher for one league/team than the other....however you classify it.... My point is the same - people in this city are less likely - in my opinion - to support a team if they have a competitor in the market playing the same sport at a higher level for a similar price.....I guess only time will tell if I am right or wrong in that regard....I am not intending to disparage the skill level of any of these athletes who are all better than I will ever be at any of these sports; I’m just saying that Toronto tends to want to pay for and watch the “best” level that is available to them, and unfortunately tends to ignore the other (very talented) athletes who compete at a lower level in the same local area...... Edited November 2, 2018 by Team Canada Club Linesman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C2SKI Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 41 minutes ago, Team Canada said: I think we are getting bogged down in semantics — people are focusing on the words pro or minor league - ok then, how about the idea that there is a “higher level of skill” pro league (MLS) and a “lower level of skill” pro league (CPL) - yes, the CFL is pro (but still viewed as less “talented/skilled” for the average roster player for the most part than the NFL average roster player - I am aware of the many exceptions like Warren Moon and such); and yes AHL is both “pro” (they get paid enough to make a living), and minor league, as it is affiliated with a “parent club”.....the point is the average level of skill is higher for one league/team than the other....however you classify it.... My point is the same - people in this city are less likely - in my opinion - to support a team if they have a competitor in the market playing the same sport at a higher level for a similar price.....I guess only time will tell if I am right or wrong in that regard....I am not intending to disparage the skill level of any of these athletes who are all better than I will ever be at any of these sports; I’m just saying that Toronto tends to want to pay for and watch the “best” level that is available to them, and unfortunately tends to ignore the other (very talented) athletes who compete at a lower level in the same local area...... It's clear many share that opinion. Who cares. The funny thing about the quality of any league, is that it's almost directly correlated with the revenue of that league. Support it, and it will improve. I always imagined that in the early years of this league, the majority of fans would be people who share the leagues vision and want to support it's growth. Not simply consumers of a product, but supporters of the process. The incredulity towards York's prices has surprised me. It seems people forget that the owners are going to be losing money on this next year. They're not trying to gouge you, or make a quick buck. This is simply the price that the leaders of the club have deemed necessary to survive. Support it, or don't. MtlMario and Bbeto 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 2 hours ago, C2SKI said: The incredulity towards York's prices has surprised me. Same for me. I wonder if York 9 announced first if the same reactions would have happened before other teams prices were known. Complaining about $30 per game, and I don’t think I have paid that little for a pro sporting event. The one possibility that I am not sure about is the nose bleeds for Jays games. I guess to be fair, I haven’t been to a pro sporting event without an assigned seat (well, outside of golf and maybe tennis). MtlMario 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler453 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Kent said: Same for me. I wonder if York 9 announced first if the same reactions would have happened before other teams prices were known. Complaining about $30 per game, and I don’t think I have paid that little for a pro sporting event. The one possibility that I am not sure about is the nose bleeds for Jays games. I guess to be fair, I haven’t been to a pro sporting event without an assigned seat (well, outside of golf and maybe tennis). 1 That's one of the biggest points IMO. I do not want to pay $399 + taxes and fees to a 15-time free for all for the best seat in the grandstand. What about if I get up to get concessions? Do I lose my spot and have to find a new one? It's a possibility because there's no way of controlling where people sit. All seems like a hassle for $399+. The most I want to pay for a GA seat in bleachers is 10-15 a game. It just seems crazy that a team in a tier one professional football league will have GA bleacher season seating in the first place. Edited November 2, 2018 by tyler453 Team Canada, zeelaw, Keegan and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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