TFC 2018

[Gian-Luca]

5 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Actually commenting absurd and contradictory comments is the exact opposite of trolling. 

No it isn't - the exact opposite would be to post something insightful, useful, interesting or informative - which we all know that you often do. However that previous post of yours attempting to ridicule people in the thread - and in my case on misinterpreted grounds - isn't one that I think meets the aforementioned criteria. 

I root for all three Canadian MLS teams to do well (not in the V-Cup of course), not just TFC - provided they play Canadian players. The more big games our Canadian players play the better it is for the national team program. I encourage all posters to do the same though of course if they don't that's up to them. If that is a "parochial" attitude then so be it. 

[Free kick]

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018/08/17/report-serie-ligue-1-clubs-eyeing-move-toronto-fcs-jozy-altidore

if this happens, they will have given up on making the playoffs IMO. 

[Bison44]

Isnt this is usual silly season baloney??  Especially with MLS....I swear the league jumps on these stories no matter where they come from to hype up anyone in MLS.  He has got another 2 seasons on his current contract??  Is anyone going to pay him 5-6million??  Smells fishy.  

[jpg75]

The only way he goes is if TFC have a contingency plan to replace him. The transfer fee for Altidore would not be significant and any decent replacement would cost more probably. The salary the club could offer could entice someone available on a free but there's no one good remaining at this point. It would just be a giant headache, it ain't happening.

[Bdog]

Would be stupid to sell him at this point when we still have a chance to make the playoffs.

Anyways, tomorrow is a must win at this point. I know we've lost a few of our previous "must wins" but this is one game we should be winning. Even without Mavinga and Altidore, there should be no excuse for losing to the worst team in the league. The only concerning thing is having to go the west coast and back twice in the next few weeks.

[Free kick]

11 hours ago, Bison44 said:

Isnt this is usual silly season baloney??  Especially with MLS....I swear the league jumps on these stories no matter where they come from to hype up anyone in MLS.  He has got another 2 seasons on his current contract??  Is anyone going to pay him 5-6million??  Smells fishy.  

I dont disgree.  You are probably right.   I posted it because it was there on the mls site and it was topical as far this thread.

mls folks know that a key to growing the league is to get people talking about the league.   People like to talk rumours.  It is one thing that other big four sports have over MLS in that they have a whole industry of talk and discussions built on speculation and rumours.  In europe, the chat over player movements generates probably more interest and discussion than the games themselves. 

So that piece on the mls site is an example of MLS trying to grease this speculation and rumour industry along. And, you are right, they are not doing a good job of it when they dont get specific by stating which clubs they talking about.  It is baloney.  

[BearcatSA]

4 hours ago, Free kick said:

And, you are right, they are not doing a good job of it when they dont get specific by stating which clubs they talking about.  It is baloney.  

This may or may not have legs.  The criteria for legitimacy for me isn't that specific clubs are named but that multiple and reliable media sources are corroborating the interest. 

[Gian-Luca]

4 Canucks to start for TFC tonight against SJ  - Morgan, Osorio, Chapman, Hamilton with Ricketts and Telfer on the bench. More surprisingly is that Hernandez starts at the back with Moor and Van Der Wiel (who both didn't play midweek) on the bench while Giovinco also doesn't start - the new signing Janson starts up top with Hamilton instead. Not the playoff-chasing line-up one would have expected. No Mavinga or Altidore (suspended of course) and no Vazquez (presumably out injured with the sore knee).

[Big_M]

Would look bad if it wasn't against San Jose..they can still beat them with this line..weakest team in the league and one of the weakest starting keepers

[Bison44]

Hernandez?? OH NO!!  Vanney has to rest some guys some time eh?  Maybe he thinks against San Jose he can get away with it.  It would be nice for hamilton and Chapman to have a strong showing.  

[Club Linesman]

Hope Vanney knows what the hell he is doing.  This game is pretty well must win and he starts Hernandez.  A tie isn’t good enough in this game.

[Bdog]

We're so lucky it's still 0-0 at half, this back line is about to give me a heart attack. Vanney better take out Hernandez for Moor or VDW. 

[Obinna]

Alex Bono with another bonehead mistake.

[Bdog]

Our season is done. 

Hernandez isn't even usl quality anymore. Delgado has decided to suck this year. Bono will come up with some big saves yet seems to be giving up an easy goal weekly now. Chapman doesn't seem to contribute anything and should probably head to the CPL next year. Hamilton hasn't really improved much in the last few years and hasn't scored any big goals for us. Hagglund and Zavaleta are getting exposed when they don't have Mavinga to cover for them. 

So frustrating to watch this shit. 

[Free kick]

San Jose was a terrible team.  This game was there to be had.  The interesting part is how the game changed instantly when Giovinco came on.  It took only a few minutes for a goal to be scored.  

I clicked a like to Bdog's post but i did so reluctantly because i agreed with much of what you said but i didnt agreed with any blame being attributed to the backline and goal keeping. When you give up only one goal in an away game, you have done pretty good as far as defending.   And i thought Henandez had a decent game.  But until Giovinco came on, there was noticable lack of quality in the final third.  Some players have that quality but a few others just don not have it. 

Quality in a player is tough to define but you can see it when its missing. Its bad decisions and lacking in creative ideas though not necessary lacking in skill.  

[Gian-Luca]

I disagree, I thnk the problem last night was largely (but not exclusively) defense and goalkeeping but not some of the players who have been mentioned. It was 0-0 when Giovinco came on the field and then finished 1-1 so there wasn't much change in the end. Obviously he's an upgrade over Hamilton but Hamilton was playing well overall. I his overall game continues to improve - holding the ball up, passing, keeping his team in possession defensive work. What was missing was any cohesion up front and a lot of poor decision making leading to an overall lack of service to the strikers, and I'd say most of the poor decision making was by our two wingbacks (Morgan & Morrow both had bad games IMO), as well as Bradley & Delgado who had sub-par games (although to be fair to them, they were two players who were not rotated, having both played 90 minutes on Wednesday - why isn't Fraser spelling these guys off already?). The team was being badly outplayed on both wings and centrally in midfield in the first half. I agree that Hernandez was fine in fact and I'm not sure why he is getting criticized so much for this game and Bono had a good first half, it was Hagglund that ended up having a rotten game, beaten on another ball over the top in the first half that sprung another breakaway that should have ended up in a goal against and it was his giveaway (his passing was once again terrible) that led to SJ's equalizing & him being caught out of position making it a double-whammy (though Bono once again has to do better on the play - 2 games in this stadium & 2 gaffes for him). They might want to consider trying Irwin the rest of the year as they can't afford to give up one goal against per game from poor goalkeeping which is what Bono is giving them unfortunately in 3 of the last 4 games. Overall though, it's Hagglund who gets the Goat of the Game award unfortunately.

It was a shame Janson continued the TFC injury bug shortly after he scored in his first game, but it was a gamble by Vanney that didn't pay off to replace him with Moor. The team got scored on anyway and then couldn't create much offensively as they had already taken Hamilton off and left Ricketts on the bench as a target man. Granted, Ricketts doesn't hold up the ball as well as Hamilton does, but would have given them something else to think about. 

I thought Chapman also played well and what he contributed was not in fact "nothing" but he kept his team in possession well, saved a sure goal and also made a great pass to Osorio who was unlucky to hit the inside of the post and would have finished the game off.

Overall though a depressing result, another 2 points needlessly dropped.

 

[Gian-Luca]

Vanney's comments are quite telling here in terms of the blame game:

"Probably in most seasons and most nights I would be OK with it. It's our fifth game in 15 days and we traveled all the way from Toronto here on a short rest — the guys put a lot of effort into it no doubt," said Vanney.

"But having gone up 1-0 and in pretty good control of the situation, to lose a ball that in one pass turns into the goal, really just off of mistakes, just shooting ourselves in the foot at that point, then it's extremely disappointing.

https://www.tsn.ca/wondolowski-s-goal-helps-earthquakes-to-draw-with-tfc-1.1159779

[Dub Narcotic]

This game wasn't the issue, Vanney is right about the tough circumstances, it was all the points dropped earlier in the year and the failure to sign a CB in the off-season. I actually think Bono was decent last night, he made a lot of great saves apart from the one mistake. This TFC is one of the greatest teams MLS has ever seen but the league's parity plus long cup and playoff runs means a really thin margin for error and they have do it all again next year with a lot of key players on the wrong side of the aging curve (Moor, Morrow, Bradley, Giovinco) or perpetually injured or suspended (Altidore, Mavinga).

I was thinking last night that Jordan Hamilton reminds me of Jack McInerney; tends to be invisible for a lot of the game but pops up occasionally with a nice finish. He really hasn't taken his chance this year and I'm not sure he'll get a better opportunity.

[Free kick]

In basketball, nobody can specifically identify what makes a good rebounder.  There are a few givens like height and being able to box out.  But at a certain level there will be lots of tall physical players and everybody will know how to box out by then.  So why is it that there are a select few that excell more than others (at pulling down a rebound) at what is looks like very much a random occurance.  The only explainable way is that these players have that intagible/intuitive sence of knowing where to be, reading the play,  making the right decsions, agressiveness, strong determination, be creative etc etc..  In other words its all between the ears.  Most great rebounders are actually terrible shooters and/or are weak in other basic skills.

In soccer, play in the final third is alot like that.  Especially when it comes to the type of centre forwards who are not nimble and agile; the so called target men.  They have to have that inate sence of knowing where to be given a particular situation.  They need to make themselves available to receive passes, they need to know how to draw attention in a way to create space for others, they need that selfish assassins instinct..etc.. And finally,. Regardless of the type of attacking player you are, you need to be able make the right decisions and you need your movement and decision you make to be as such that it improves the attacking side of the team and collectively makes each player better.  You need to be able to create chemistry with others.

There was a play in the first half that i thought told me a lot.  There was a play created or ball sprung loose  wherby Hamilton found himself in an on side situation level with one defender but at clear sight and oportunity at goal.  And there was another attacker on the left flank level with Hamilton and the defender.  So it was a clear 2 on 1.   At this point i got out of my seat, heres a chance!    Anyways, He carried it forward to a spot with clear sight on goal where it was only him and the keeper.  Not a perfect angle, and the defender was positioned directly between him and the other attacker.   So, it not a easy play to score and its even harder to get it to the other attacker for an relatively easy tap in.  But, if you have all the attributes i mentioned earlier you defitely dont make the decsion he ultimately made.  He somewhat stopped, i believe, held up, waited and ultimately squared the ball back to a player who was in a far lesser position to score thus allowing other d-men to get back into position. He made a decesion to turned a something like a 50percent scoring chance into a 2-5 percent scoring chance.  Good goal scorers never do that, they are selfish and they might find an inventive way to get accross to the other forward (not an easy play) or most likely,. They will have a go at goal with a solid strike.  If its parried by the keeper, then so be it, i would never fault someone for that.  Good goal scorers and smart players instictively know what is a high percentage chance versus a lower percentage play.  

Good quality is not just skill but its also between the ears.  Its also about indiviually making the the collective better.  There was a telling stat at half time that spoke to this.  It said possession was roughly 50-50 between the two teams but, TFC had only 1 shot  and San jose had 7.  This very much speaks of wasted possesion and lack of quality but NOT lack of skill. There is probably nothing to distinguish between Hamilton and Altidore skillwise.  But you can clearly see that the team is better with Altidore in there and you can see the chemistry with Giovinco works better with altidore and is poor with Hamilton. Altidore has those skills (ie.: ability to read plays and moevement etc).  As for Hamilton, you overlook these things when they are rookies or second year players,  but you have to eventaully show you have it.  

[BearcatSA]

Right now, they are too shaky in defence to make the playoffs.

 

[Bison44]

I dont see if Moor, Mavinga, ZAv and Hagglund are all healthy...why do you start Hernandez??  He just stood there watching as Wondo ran past him and picked up the bad rebound from Bono.  And Bono is doing his best to try and cancel out all his good saves with bad ones.  Alot of guys are quick to dump on Henry for his gaffs...Bono's not a rookie anymore, he should be having less of these kinds of mistakes not more.  

As for Free Kicks's post, alot of what Altidore has that hamilton doesnt is confidence, an aggressive attitude.  You dont see Altidore pass up a chance for a shot, or defer to other players.  When you cant seem to get much playing time, have little confidence etc its harder to take those chances you might get.  Hamilton, Chapman even Osorio used to do this alot previously, especially with Giovinco.  

[Free kick]

45 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

Right now, they are too shaky in defence to make the playoffs.

 

The playoff are a real long shot now regardless of defence or not.  I didnt realise it until i saw someone mention it in the Montreal Impact thread.  DCU are level with TFC but have three games in hand. But more importantly, they have played only seven home games all year.  So the rest of the sched is heavily stacked with home games. All due to the new stadium openning.

Seattle is making a serious push. And it looks like they are going to make it.  Thats the  part that stings for TFC because they too had very short off season coupled with tough schedule and many injuries.   They just played two fewer CCL fixtures than TFC did. 

Right now, it doesnt look good for any of teh Canadian teams 

[mpg_29]

Lowest amount of points needed to get a playoff spot in Eastern Conference:

2012: 53

2013: 49

2014: 49

2015: 49

2016: 42

2017: 50

So outside of 2016 it's usually around 49/50 points at least to make it. Toronto is currently at 24 points with 10 games left. They have to win every game left just to get to 54 points. Win 9 out of 10 to get 51pts.

So basically they have to win 9 out of their next 10 games. Very unlikely.

[BearcatSA]

28 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

I dont see if Moor, Mavinga, ZAv and Hagglund are all healthy...why do you start Hernandez??  He just stood there watching as Wondo ran past him and picked up the bad rebound from Bono.  And Bono is doing his best to try and cancel out all his good saves with bad ones.  Alot of guys are quick to dump on Henry for his gaffs...Bono's not a rookie anymore, he should be having less of these kinds of mistakes not more. 

Watching the dvr I wasn't as positive about Hernandez out there.  He seems to have to make desperation plays too often because he has zero pace.  Bono this year reminds me of what Greg Sutton was like:  makes some big time saves but spills a few at too many key times and then gets punished for it.  He should have done way better on the tying goal.

[Blackdude]

2 minutes ago, mpg_29 said:

Lowest amount of points needed to get a playoff spot in Eastern Conference:

2012: 53

2013: 49

2014: 49

2015: 49

2016: 42

2017: 50

So outside of 2016 it's usually around 49/50 points at least to make it. Toronto is currently at 24 points with 10 games left. They have to win every game left just to get to 54 points. Win 9 out of 10 to get 51pts.

 So basically they have to win 9 out of their next 10 games. Very unlikely.

It's not going to take 49 points to get in. I think it's around 44-46. Main reason is because there are 2 playoff spots to grab I think barring a massive Columbus collapse and there isn't a lot separating them. Also, I think right now if you're TFC, you just have to beat the right teams. TFC has 4 matches against direct competitors and they probably need to get 10 points from those matches, but I think that they will need to beat New England though. (Montreal twice, DCU and New England).