Jonathan David

[Kadenge]

Araujo, Ikone and Bamba all play with their heads down. They have skill but are predictable,giving up possession when they run into 2/3 players. Yilmaz lost it with Araujo ..he was wide open twice and Araujo went for his curler. Lille do not have a midfield with vision/soccer IQ or the ability to make accurate passes. Once again the strikers were starved for service

Edited November 30, 2020 by Kadenge

[Cheeta]

This can be a difficult "team" to watch.  It must be a difficult team to coach.  It feels like half the team can't recognize a movement three passes into the future and don't look as though they really care about it either.  And Galtier has a real problem, a growing problem I'm sure he's recognizes by now, and it isn't that he's paid 30 millions for David.   Frustration is growing amongst the ranks me-thinks, along with the other negative energies that travel with it.  That can't happen because it's hard work turning that around once it sets in.   

[VinceA]

Everyone talks about this team like they're in the relegation zone. They're fighting for the title this season.

Also fans have been ecstatic about Bamba and Ikone. This idea that its all doom and gloom is purely a Canadian perspective.

I told a Lille fan that Bamba and Ikone were selfish players and they laughed. Bamba has the most assists this season for the club.

[Floortom]

29 minutes ago, VinceA said:

Everyone talks about this team like they're in the relegation zone. They're fighting for the title this season.

Also fans have been ecstatic about Bamba and Ikone. This idea that its all doom and gloom is purely a Canadian perspective.

I told a Lille fan that Bamba and Ikone were selfish players and they laughed. Bamba has the most assists this season for the club.

I’ve been much more impressed with Bamba than Ikone tbh. Is Bamba sometimes “selfish”? Maybe, but you need some of that on occasion. His passing and crossing have been quite good based on what I’ve seen. He doesn’t hold onto the ball aimlessly like Ikone tends to. I have not seen much positive from Ikone outside of flashy dribbling that tends to go nowhere.

[dyslexic nam]

18 minutes ago, Floortom said:

I’ve been much more impressed with Bamba than Ikone tbh. Is Bamba sometimes “selfish”? Maybe, but you need some of that on occasion. His passing and crossing have been quite good based on what I’ve seen. He doesn’t hold onto the ball aimlessly like Ikone tends to. I have not seen much positive from Ikone outside of flashy dribbling that tends to go nowhere.

Same 

[Cheeta]

Echo that.  Liking Bamba, you take the good with the bad.  You can have Ikone.  Please. 

Overall impression remains the same.  So far as I'm concerned the success they've enjoyed this far is wallpapering over cracks.  Or is good enough for Ligue 1, not to sound harsh.

[narduch]

They feel like one of those teams that starts hot by luck and fades as the season progresses.

[Aird25]

1 hour ago, Cheeta said:

Or is good enough for Ligue 1, not to sound harsh.

How about their convincing win and a draw against top of Serie A, Milan, as well as leading their group

I’ve been frustrated watching David because it seems like his teammates fail to pick out his runs and he rarely receives a pass in dangerous areas, but overall I think the team must be happy with the season so far. The results have been good. I just don’t know whether there’s a lack of trust with David, or if they’re just not clicking yet. He’s been more involved in recent games though, yesterday not included 

Edited November 30, 2020 by Aird25

[archer21]

26 minutes ago, Aird25 said:

How about their convincing win and a draw against top of Serie A, Milan, as well as leading their group

I’ve been frustrated watching David because it seems like his teammates fail to pick out his runs and he rarely receives a pass in dangerous areas, but overall I think the team must be happy with the season so far. The results have been good. I just don’t know whether there’s a lack of trust with David, or if they’re just not clicking yet. He’s been more involved in recent games though, yesterday not included 

It seems like since Yazici has started to play a more prominent attacking role with David, things have been better. Hopefully that will continue and the team will be less frustrating to watch. 

[Cheeta]

1 hour ago, Aird25 said:

How about their convincing win and a draw against top of Serie A, Milan, as well as leading their group

...

And drew bottom of group, Celtic 2-2.  LOL, of course David wears a big part of that one.

Still have another go at the Bhoys so maybe they can be a little more convincing.  I actually hope so.

[Kadenge]

4 hours ago, VinceA said:

Everyone talks about this team like they're in the relegation zone. They're fighting for the title this season.

Also fans have been ecstatic about Bamba and Ikone. This idea that its all doom and gloom is purely a Canadian perspective.

I told a Lille fan that Bamba and Ikone were selfish players and they laughed. Bamba has the most assists this season for the club.

watched the entire game yesterday despite David not starting as I wanted to see if my Canadian bias was clouding my perspective. Their midfield lacks vision or the ability to pass the ball around with any accuracy and consequently  are unable to maintain possession for extended periods. I have not seen the player stats  so my comments are based on a qualitative assessment. Bamba, Araujo and Ikone are skilled but have the same style. You can get away with one selfish player but not two or three. Yilmaz was starved for service and ironically so was Ikone until he was set up by Yilmaz. Lille were being dominated by Saint Etienne before they made the 2nd half subs. If Lille are challenging PSG for the lead towards the end of the season I will be surprised. Curious to know if they deployed the same midfield last season.

[Unnamed Trialist]

5 hours ago, Cheeta said:

Echo that.  Liking Bamba, you take the good with the bad.  You can have Ikone.  Please. 

Overall impression remains the same.  So far as I'm concerned the success they've enjoyed this far is wallpapering over cracks.  Or is good enough for Ligue 1, not to sound harsh.

This.

I don't agree that resting him was an error though, as they are not out of their Europa group yet, if they lose this week they could be third with the final match pending to sort things out. This week has to be a draw at least, and remember that in their first match vs. Prague they got lucky, they had major reffing breaks and then ran away with it. But Sparta is a good rival.

Frankly, I enjoy some Spanish 2nd tier matchs more than Lille, except for the odd match this season I really don't find them pleasant to watch.

[lenny]

 

 

On 11/30/2020 at 10:45 AM, Kadenge said:

Bamba, Araujo and Ikone are skilled but have the same style. You can get away with one selfish player but not two or three. 

Bamba currently tied for league lead in assists.

[Snowcrash]

9 minutes ago, lenny said:

 

 

Bamba currently tied for league lead in assists.

Bamba is a very good Ligue 1 player.  Probably top 15 for his position.  He is not reluctant to give up the ball but it has to be an obvious pass to a player who is clearly open, like the one to Yazici where he scored after VAR showed that he was onside.

That said, Bamba doesn't see plays developing and doesn't make anticipatory passes especially when he is in full run with the ball.

Also, when he's receiving a pass with his back to the goal with a defender on him, 90% of the time he takes two or three touches before he lays it back to a mid or one of the CB's.  It's almost like a one-touch pass isn't part of his game.  If he does this in rondos, he'd be in the middle for the entirety of the drill.

[El Diego]

I don't have a huge problem with Bamba and Araujo. I think they are also coached to do the things they are doing i.e. cutting inside, taking touches, trying to be the one to make something happen 1v1. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I'm guessing it's not just coincidence. Someone mentioned the play last match where Burak made a run and Araujo took it inside and shot and Burak got mad. I actually liked what Araujo did there, even if he was too far out to reasonably take a shot. Burak's run opened up space, but Burak himself was in a bad position; even if Araujo made a perfect pass then Burak is isolated with a bad angle. When Burak remonstrated (as he often does), Araujo pointed towards to net as if to say, I had the middle open why not take it? This is of course from memory, so I could easily be off.

Ikone, I do have issues with. I don't exactly think he's selfish, but he seems slow to process. I don't quite get him. He may be useful somehow but I haven't figured it out. Contrary to a previous post, I saw fans on the Lille messageboard getting frustrated with him. Of course, different fans will have different opinions, but it's not all roses with him.

I really enjoy watching Yazici. Clever, brave, can set up or finish. Can play in transition or versus a low line. He should be starting for Lille as much as possible,

[Snowcrash]

12 minutes ago, El Diego said:

I don't have a huge problem with Bamba and Araujo. I think they are also coached to do the things they are doing i.e. cutting inside, taking touches, trying to be the one to make something happen 1v1. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I'm guessing it's not just coincidence. Someone mentioned the play last match where Burak made a run and Araujo took it inside and shot and Burak got mad. I actually liked what Araujo did there, even if he was too far out to reasonably take a shot. Burak's run opened up space, but Burak himself was in a bad position; even if Araujo made a perfect pass then Burak is isolated with a bad angle. When Burak remonstrated (as he often does), Araujo pointed towards to net as if to say, I had the middle open why not take it? This is of course from memory, so I could easily be off.

Ikone, I do have issues with. I don't exactly think he's selfish, but he seems slow to process. I don't quite get him. He may be useful somehow but I haven't figured it out. Contrary to a previous post, I saw fans on the Lille messageboard getting frustrated with him. Of course, different fans will have different opinions, but it's not all roses with him.

I really enjoy watching Yazici. Clever, brave, can set up or finish. Can play in transition or versus a low line. He should be starting for Lille as much as possible,

Lille fans are definitely down on Ikone.  Hard to believe but he was ranked ahead of Bamba by quite a bit a few years back, when Pepe was still on the team.  After Ikone got a call up with France, people were talking about get Pepe money for him.

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, El Diego said:

I don't have a huge problem with Bamba and Araujo. I think they are also coached to do the things they are doing i.e. cutting inside, taking touches, trying to be the one to make something happen 1v1. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I'm guessing it's not just coincidence. Someone mentioned the play last match where Burak made a run and Araujo took it inside and shot and Burak got mad. I actually liked what Araujo did there, even if he was too far out to reasonably take a shot. Burak's run opened up space, but Burak himself was in a bad position; even if Araujo made a perfect pass then Burak is isolated with a bad angle. When Burak remonstrated (as he often does), Araujo pointed towards to net as if to say, I had the middle open why not take it? This is of course from memory, so I could easily be off.

Ikone, I do have issues with. I don't exactly think he's selfish, but he seems slow to process. I don't quite get him. He may be useful somehow but I haven't figured it out. Contrary to a previous post, I saw fans on the Lille messageboard getting frustrated with him. Of course, different fans will have different opinions, but it's not all roses with him.

I really enjoy watching Yazici. Clever, brave, can set up or finish. Can play in transition or versus a low line. He should be starting for Lille as much as possible,

Agreed. Ikone has fantastic dribbling and technical ability, deserving of a top club in Europe, but he is not very cerebral. If he develops that part of his game he can be a fantastic player. He really reminds me of Tabla, who I find has a habit of not making the right pass at the right time. He was not bad for this at Barcelona B at all, but there were a few times with Canada and Montreal where he tried to do too much.  

Conversely, Yazici is far more cerebral and that is why him and David link up better. I agree he should be starting more. It gives Lille more balance. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

I don't think I've ever seen this board analyse the team of a CNT member as much as this, it is actually quite fascinating. I never looked at Radzinski's Anderlecht this way. Maybe some here really knew Stalteri's Spurs. Bayern is different because with the premium teams you tend to know a lot of the line-up anyways, often before a Canuck gets there. 

Or maybe we understand with David we have something special. 

BTW, realized today that Barça paid 30 million euros for Trincao, the Portuguese striker, who is as young as David (month older), and he has not scored yet. And no one is really worried either, he plays, has quality, and will catch on soon enough.

[narduch]

Having the matches available on One Soccer has to help too.

Anyways Lille take on Sparta Prague at 12:55pm ET in Europe League today. I believe a tie is enough to see them through to the knock out stages.

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, narduch said:

Having the matches available on One Soccer has to help too.

Anyways Lille take on Sparta Prague at 12:55pm ET in Europe League today. I believe a tie is enough to see them through to the knock out stages.

They are on 8 points, Sparta has 6, with this and a last match to go. A win puts them through. A draw means they will have to get at least a draw next week at Celtic Park, as if they are tied on points with Sparta they go through on direct results.

[El Diego]

Sparta really impressed me when they played Lille, and I remember thinking they were the better side before the red card. They're certainly no joke. I expect David to start after barely playing against St. Etienne.

Regarding the above discussion, it is kind of weird/funny that OneSoccer is showing one team's matches from a league, and so we are all (sort of) becoming fans of that team. I mean, it's obvious why they are showing the matches but still. I wish they would have showed Gent's matches when David was there. Now that was a fun team to watch.

[narduch]

10 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

They are on 8 points, Sparta has 6, with this and a last match to go. A win puts them through. A draw means they will have to get at least a draw next week at Celtic Park, as if they are tied on points with Sparta they go through on direct results.

Looking at it more closely, they can only advance today with a tie if Milan loses today.

Edited December 3, 2020 by narduch

[narduch]

David is starting up front with Yazici.

[BradMack]

5 minutes ago, narduch said:

I think a draw today put them through because Milan and Sparta will drop point against each other the following game 

depends on the Celtic - Milan game today. If Milan dont win today, a draw will see Lille through. 

[bfque8]

progression permutations for Lille work out to:

Lille W

• guaranteed group stages, regardless of the Milan result today on MD5

Lille D

• Milan W v Celtic: goes to the final matchday (would require either a Lille W/D OR Lille L + Sparta D/L on MD6 to progress)
• Milan D v Celtic: guaranteed to progress (seeding TBD pending MD6 results)
• Milan L v Celtic: guaranteed to progress (seeding TBD pending MD6 results) 

Lille L

• Milan W v Celtic: goes to the final matchday (would require either a Lille W OR Lille D + Sparta L on MD6 to progress)
• Milan D v Celtic: goes to the final matchday (would require either a Lille W/D OR Lille L + Milan L on MD6 to progress)
• Milan L v Celtic: goes to the final matchday (would require either a Lille W/D OR Lille L + Milan D/L on MD6 to progress)

 

on H2H:

• Lille hold H2H over Milan (4-1agg)
• Lille will hold H2H over Sparta,
  • if they maintain within a margin of 3 goals to Sparta
  • if Sparta do not score more than 3 goals (H2H away goals)
• Lille will hold H2H over Celtic,
  • if they beat Celtic at Celtic Park, or
  • if they draw and score more than 2 goals (H2H away goals)

Edited December 3, 2020 by bfque8