Jonathan David

[Obinna]

2 hours ago, Corazon said:

At some point he's going to need to adapt.  The best players do and every team he's going to play for is going to be different.

Alphonso Davies was an attacker until he joined Bayern Munich.  In less than 2 years he's won almost every trophy possible in that span and become the worlds 2nd highest market value for defense.

This is no longer the Belgian league but I'm sure he will come around soon.

That is a very good point.

Davies got a break in that Alaba moved over to cover the CB spot and left the LB spot open. How Davies played that role suited Bayern to a tee. Neither Davies or Bayern would be where they are today without that fortune. It was a blessing in disguise.

On the other hand, Bayern get credit for seeing the fit and making the change. This is where I get concerned. It's stil early but I don't get the impression Galtier will change much. Nor should he with the club at (near) the top of the table. 

Davies adapted to the new role he was thrusted into and deserves all the credit in the world, but it's not obvious where else David would fit in what seems like a rigid system.

If Davies was going to make it at Bayern, it was either going to make it as a winger or a full back. With David it is starting to feel like he will either make it at the 9 spot, or he won't. For that reason comparing it to Davies feels like apples to oranges a bit, but I do agree overall with you.

David must find a way, no matter what, and he probably will. At least I hope.

[Macksam]

On 9/25/2020 at 4:24 PM, Obinna said:

I still think the system does not play to Jonathan David's strengths. I have watched every Lille match this season, at least in part. The way they play never changes. Galtier seems to be a very rigid coach. His job is to get results first and get the most from David second. Right now he's only accomplishing the former, but the results are what matter the most. 

I don't even know what system Lille utilize after watching all the games so far. There's no consistent pattern of play other than Bamba making a run that goes no where or the Chilean guy doing some nifty tricks on the other side of the flank that occasionally turns into something more productive. All there games so far have been chaotic messes. 

[SthMelbRed]

5 minutes ago, Macksam said:

I don't even know what system Lille utilize after watching all the games so far. There's no consistent pattern of play other than Bamba making a run that goes no where or the Chilean guy doing some nifty tricks on the other side of the flank that occasionally turns into something more productive. All there games so far have been chaotic messes. 

^This...

There are no cohesive attacking moves. They're tight at the back, but their attack is just 'let Bamba or Ikone or Araujo try to beat a bunch of guys and see what happens.'

[Unnamed Trialist]

13 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

^This...

There are no cohesive attacking moves. They're tight at the back, but their attack is just 'let Bamba or Ikone or Araujo try to beat a bunch of guys and see what happens.'

It's not the oddest plan. If your back is strong you can do it, they sign quality going forward and let them run. 

And with that they're a top team in Ligue 1.

[Macksam]

It's not going to work long-term. 

The moment they face PSG, Lyon or even a Nice side that is firing on all cylinders, their game plan will crash and burn. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

8 hours ago, Macksam said:

It's not going to work long-term. 

The moment they face PSG, Lyon or even a Nice side that is firing on all cylinders, their game plan will crash and burn. 

So your worst case scenario is that they'll finish 4th?

[Trois Reds]

Last year Lille scored a whopping 35 goals in 28 games, while allowing 27. After watching a few games this year, Lille seems to have an issue with midfielders continuously letting fly from 25-30 yards away, and barely playing into the box. Last year, their midfielders scored 4 goals, 3 by one player. It's almost the exact same midfield this year. The fact Lille has scored 6 goals this year is almost in spite of their midfield. Lille's best midfielder this year has been Bamba, who's technically a forward, and that says a lot.

To put it into perspective, Lille's defence outscored their mids last year 6-4. I worry for David that Lille doesn't really have a midfield player who has an idea what the centre forward/striker is there for. If the defence cracks, this team goes from 4th to 14th, and David may unfairly get the blame.

[Cheeta]

^  Liking Bamba. Bit confused as to how best use him though, but am a bit confused by Lille in general so...

Club looks still a work in progress.  2020 has been a very unique year (for everyone) and we're not yet into October.  Expect Lille may well be a very different team coming out of the New Year.  David is going to be paying his dues this season.  Same as he has every season before. 

[Obinna]

4 hours ago, Trois Reds said:

Last year Lille scored a whopping 35 goals in 28 games, while allowing 27. After watching a few games this year, Lille seems to have an issue with midfielders continuously letting fly from 25-30 yards away, and barely playing into the box. Last year, their midfielders scored 4 goals, 3 by one player. It's almost the exact same midfield this year. The fact Lille has scored 6 goals this year is almost in spite of their midfield. Lille's best midfielder this year has been Bamba, who's technically a forward, and that says a lot.

To put it into perspective, Lille's defence outscored their mids last year 6-4. I worry for David that Lille doesn't really have a midfield player who has an idea what the centre forward/striker is there for. If the defence cracks, this team goes from 4th to 14th, and David may unfairly get the blame.

This is exactly what concerns me as well. The attacking midfielder they so desperately need is already within their ranks. Play David behind Yilmaz and Bamba, or Weah, or buy Morales from Rangers. Just have David create. Hell play Araujo there if not David. They so desperately need someone to pull the strings in midfield. Maybe even play Renato Sanches closer to goal. 

The frustrating thing is that you cannot really argue with their spot in the table.

Do Lille fans approve of Galtier?

[Obinna]

Ikone is not going anywhere this window, supposedly. Feels he has a better chance of making the France Euro 2021 squad by staying put.

https://www.getfootballnewsfrance.com/2020/jonathan-ikone-not-leaving-lille-entourage/

[narduch]

Next match for Lille is this Sunday at 9am ET against bottom feeder Strasbourg. Its in OneSoccer as usual 

 

[Obinna]

Tough group for Lille in UEL, they are drawn with Milan, Celtic and Sparta Prague.

[Snowcrash]

On 9/28/2020 at 9:25 PM, Trois Reds said:

Last year Lille scored a whopping 35 goals in 28 games, while allowing 27. After watching a few games this year, Lille seems to have an issue with midfielders continuously letting fly from 25-30 yards away, and barely playing into the box. Last year, tllheir midfielders scored 4 goals, 3 by one player. It's almost the exact same midfield this year. The fact Lille has scored 6 goals this year is almost in spite of their midfield. Lille's best midfielder this year has been Bamba, who's technically a forward, and that says a lot.

To put it into perspective, Lille's defence outscored their mids last year 6-4. I worry for David that Lille doesn't really have a midfield player who has an idea what the centre forward/striker is there for. If the defence cracks, this team goes from 4th to 14th, and David may unfairly get the blame.

Lille is absolutely set at the back with veteran CB Fonte and newcomer Dutch CB Botman who'll likely be sold for maybe $35M euros in a few years.  They also have a top quality keeper in Maignan.  The fullbacks are solid so the backline is the least of their problems.  

Sanches might be able to grow into a more creative role but right now, his strength is still as a box-to-box mid and other mids like Xeca, Andre and Soumare are more holding types.  Ikone and Bamba are pretty well wingers but to their credit, they track back really well defensively.

Galtier is one of the best Ligue 1 managers and is unlikely to make any drastic changes with respect to team formation.  Notwithstanding the lack of creativity from Lille mids, the major reason for David's slow start is that he's still far from being game fit.  At Gent, he logged the most km's of all the players, game in and game out.  There was a video of David at Gent doing a lung busting 80m run from the opponent's penalty box to track down someone breaking away on a counter. Currently, he's good for maybe 60 minutes a game.

 

[Obinna]

3 hours ago, Snowcrash said:

Lille is absolutely set at the back with veteran CB Fonte and newcomer Dutch CB Botman who'll likely be sold for maybe $35M euros in a few years.  They also have a top quality keeper in Maignan.  The fullbacks are solid so the backline is the least of their problems.  

Sanches might be able to grow into a more creative role but right now, his strength is still as a box-to-box mid and other mids like Xeca, Andre and Soumare are more holding types.  Ikone and Bamba are pretty well wingers but to their credit, they track back really well defensively.

Galtier is one of the best Ligue 1 managers and is unlikely to make any drastic changes with respect to team formation.  Notwithstanding the lack of creativity from Lille mids, the major reason for David's slow start is that he's still far from being game fit.  At Gent, he logged the most km's of all the players, game in and game out.  There was a video of David at Gent doing a lung busting 80m run from the opponent's penalty box to track down someone breaking away on a counter. Currently, he's good for maybe 60 minutes a game.

 

How much longer will we talk about him being unfit as the reason for his slow start? Yeah at first that was part of the issue, and maybe it is still part of it, but the way the team plays does not suit David and that is the biggest issue I see. David hasn't adapted to it.

Did they do their due diligence on David? Maybe they backed themselves to transform him to a no. 9? I hope he succeeds and probably will, but I don't think it's his best position. He's much better as a second striker in my humble opinion. 

Like you say, Lille are set in many areas of the pitch. The one place they lack is creativity from midfield. Their biggest signing ever (David) so happens to excel as a second striker. Am I missing something here? Drop him back to attacking midfield for F-sake. 

I keep hearing that Galtier is a great coach, and I can't argue where they are in the table, but if David fails to succeed at Lille then someone or something must take the blame, and I don't think it will be David's work ethic or attitude. Maybe Galtier got a player he didn't ask for? I am sure he appreciates David is a great talent, but if this was the player Galtier wanted then surely he'd have more success putting him into his system at this stage?

I think Lille bought the wrong player to flip considering how the club plays. 

Edited October 2, 2020 by Obinna

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, Obinna said:

Like you say, Lille are set in many areas of the pitch. The one place they lack is creativity from midfield. Their biggest signing ever (David) so happens to excel as a second striker. Am I missing something here? Drop him back to attacking midfield for F-sake. 

[Kent]

Another thing is David has had a few chances. He needs to get back to his old ways of burying those. Like the own goal last game, normally he would finish that himself.

With regards to the fitness and the lack of finishing, I wonder if he had a particularly hard time during lockdown. Let’s not forget he was just a couple months removed from his mother passing away, then his biggest distraction (soccer) is taken away as well. That had to be a really trying time and maybe he is still digging himself out of it.

Hopefully he can get back to scoring goals and enjoying the game again soon!

[Ansem]

20 minutes ago, Kent said:

Another thing is David has had a few chances. He needs to get back to his old ways of burying those. Like the own goal last game, normally he would finish that himself.

With regards to the fitness and the lack of finishing, I wonder if he had a particularly hard time during lockdown. Let’s not forget he was just a couple months removed from his mother passing away, then his biggest distraction (soccer) is taken away as well. That had to be a really trying time and maybe he is still digging himself out of it.

Hopefully he can get back to scoring goals and enjoying the game again soon!

But Gent were more flexible with David and didn't let him slump. Some games he'd be an attacking midfielder (where he made a name for himself initially) and others as a striker. The man is both brilliant and deadly as an AM and even Canada should consider it in a 4-2-3-1 make up.

It's still early but Lille seems determined to make him work within their system.

[Unnamed Trialist]

I don't mind him being asked to play higher up, as he'll learn that way, he'll be stretched.

As for fitness, perhaps they figure he should carry more bulk to be up top, not sure, but it would be odd, those theories are old-fashioned. Get him to drop 2 kilos and put him on a fitness regime--or haven't they already?

Even though I agree he should be behind another striker, it is early enough for the coach to be trying out some different things. The whole team, as @Snowcrash has shown in his excellent post, is built from the back up, as if what is going on at striker position is the least of their worries so far.

If they win tomorrow they go top of the table again. though I imagine PSG will be well ahead in a few months, they are certainly one of the most consistent teams and as long as they are squeeking out results no one is going to panic.

[narduch]

David starts. Match is at 9am ET.

[Gian-Luca]

Genk leading 1-0 mid-1st half in Strasbourg. Goal scored by the right back after he picked up a bad pass for David that was several feet behind him. I don't think David's touched the ball other than the one time he stole it off an opponent (only for his teammate to give the ball away immediately).

[dyslexic nam]

1 minute ago, Gian-Luca said:

Genk leading 1-0 mid-1st half in Strasbourg. Goal scored by the right back after he picked up a bad pass for David that was several feet behind him. I don't think David's touched the ball other than the one time he stole it off an opponent (only for his teammate to give the ball away immediately).

*cough*

Lille

[TOcanadafan]

3 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

*cough*

Lille

Maybe we all wish he was still at Gent with the prospects of being sold to a club that would have been a better fit.

Edited October 4, 2020 by TOcanadafan

[dyslexic nam]

9 minutes ago, TOcanadafan said:

Maybe we all wish he was still at Genk with the prospects of being sold to a club that would have been a better fit.

He will come good.  He is playing in a better league that moves faster and has better defenders.  He is learning to play a role with people that don’t know him yet - and where he isn’t the golden boy.  This will be good for him.  Mark my words, David will be a success in France and Bith parties will ultimately be happy they made this move.  

[SpursFlu]

I know he's a poacher but I wish he would see more of the ball. If anything just for my own personal entertainment 

[Shway]

He’s keeping it simple, still trying to settle in with his teammates with a lot of one touch passes. 

It does seem like he’s still being looked off a lot. I just wish they would try to play him in behind the defenders.