Robert Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 John van 't Schip is the current manager of PEC Zwolle. The 54-year old, Fort St. John, British Columbia born has his club currently sitting in 4th place of the Eredivisie. Taking into account his international pedigree as a soccer player and now as a club manager, and the fact that he was born in Canada, would he not be worthy of some consideration by the CSA for the position of manager of the Canadian Men's National Team if the Herdman experiment fails? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, Robert said: John van 't Schip is the current manager of PEC Zwolle. The 54-year old, Fort St. John, British Columbia born has his club currently sitting in 4th place of the Eredivisie. Taking into account his international pedigree as a soccer player and now as a club manager, and the fact that he was born in Canada, would he not be worthy of some consideration by the CSA for the position of manager of the Canadian Men's National Team if the Herdman experiment fails? Why not? If he's interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WheatsheafSK Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 26 minutes ago, Robert said: John van 't Schip is the current manager of PEC Zwolle. The 54-year old, Fort St. John, British Columbia born has his club currently sitting in 4th place of the Eredivisie. Taking into account his international pedigree as a soccer player and now as a club manager, and the fact that he was born in Canada, would he not be worthy of some consideration by the CSA for the position of manager of the Canadian Men's National Team if the Herdman experiment fails? One day he will be an excellent candidate. I always thought that he would have been a natural successor to Aron Winter at TFC - the Canada-Netherlands link who could continue with what TFC's stated vision was at the time and he had actual managerial experience (unlike Winter). I forget, but he may have even coached in Mexico before Winter's termination (although it could been shortly afterwards). Now he has just taken on his first Eredivisie managerial position. PEC Zwolle is a small-ish club and he has having success in his first year. He is often quoted on KNVB managerial issues. I suspect his current trajectory is to continue club soccer, eventually moving to bigger clubs (he is an Ajax alumni and they like to hire their own), and likely hopes to manage the Dutch national team. A lot can happen, and he may be a candidate for Canada one day, but that is likely ten years or more down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toontownman Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Why not put him in now, we don't need a justifiable reason to replace the head coach anymore do we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 19, 2018 Author Share Posted January 19, 2018 The following is a brief synopsis of John van 't Schip's coaching record: 2001–2002 Twente 2002–2004 Jong Ajax 2004–2008 Netherlands (Assistant) 2009 Ajax (Assistant and Interim) 2009 - 2012 - Melbourne Heart W - 17; D - 21; L - 20 2012–2013 Guadalajara W - 8; D - 6; L - 9 2013 - 2017 - Melbourne City W - 43; D - 22; L - 31 2017– PEC Zwolle W - 9; D - 6; L - 3 After retiring, Van 't Schip became a youth coach for Ajax and manager for FC Twente. From August 2004 he assisted Marco van Basten in coaching the Dutch national team, until Van Basten left the position of head coach following Euro 2008. Van 't Schip followed Van Basten to Ajax, becoming assistant coach with Rob Witschge, for the 2008–09 season. On 6 May 2009, after Marco van Basten's resignation, he was named as the interim head coach of Ajax and coached the club till the end of the season. Melbourne Heart He was signed by Australian A-League club Melbourne Heart on 12 October 2009, to be their inaugural coach for the 2010–11 season. On 1 February 2012, Van 't Schip announced that he would be leaving the Melbourne Heart at the end of the 2011–12 season, citing personal reasons for his decision. Van't Schip took Heart to their first finals appearance in their second season. Van 't Schip had a major role in the development of Melbourne Heart. Guadalajara On April 2012, Guadalajara announced, through its Twitter account, that Van 't Schip would be the new coach of the club. Van 't Schip was recommended by his fellow countryman Johan Cruyff, who was working at that moment in a project with the club. Van 't Schip's first competitive game was against Toluca, in which the Chivas lost 2–1. Van 't Schip was relieved of his duties as coach of Chivas a few days before the start of the Clausura 2013 Season. He was replaced by former Chivas coach Benjamin Galindo. Return to Melbourne City On 30 December 2013, following 17 winless games by Melbourne Heart and the early termination of John Aloisi's contract, Melbourne Heart appointed Van 't Schip as the coach until the end of the season. On 19 March 2014, after 11 matches coaching the club, including a seven-match unbeaten run, Van 't Schip signed a three-year contract with the club (who would be renamed Melbourne City FC in June 2014), through to the end of the 2016–17 season. On 3 January 2017, Van 't Schip resigned as Melbourne City manager to return to the Netherlands to help care for his terminally-ill father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 19, 2018 Author Share Posted January 19, 2018 18 hours ago, WheatsheafSK said: Now he has just taken on his first Eredivisie managerial position. PEC Zwolle is a small-ish club and he has having success in his first year. He is often quoted on KNVB managerial issues. I suspect his current trajectory is to continue club soccer, eventually moving to bigger clubs (he is an Ajax alumni and they like to hire their own), and likely hopes to manage the Dutch national team. A lot can happen, and he may be a candidate for Canada one day, but that is likely ten years or more down the road. PEC Zwolle is a very smallish club. It was founded June 12, 1910. Including the current season, PEC has played 17 seasons in the Eredivisie, which was formed in 1956. Their best finish was in the 2014-15 season, when they finished 6th overall. It is true that most Dutch managers aspire to go to Ajax, for who John played and coached as an assistant and on an interim level. It is also true that Ajax like to hire from within, which means they have a large pool of talent to choose from. Of those who made the managerial grade, if they are successful at Ajax, they usually wind up signing with a world-class team such as Barcelona (Michels, Cruijff, van Gaal, Koeman) rather than the Canadian Men's National Team. In my opinion, the only way that CSA will attract a world-class coach, other than one who is long over-the-hill, is by taking a chance on a diamond-in-the-rough. Now is the time to beat a club like Ajax to the punch, by making an offer to a manager like John van 't Ship worth 2 or 3 times whatever it is that PEC Zwolle is paying him. Once Ajax sign him at the end of the current season, the CSA might be lucky enough to sign him when John is in his mid-70s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WheatsheafSK Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Robert said: PEC Zwolle is a very smallish club. Now is the time to beat a club like Ajax to the punch, by making an offer to a manager like John van 't Ship worth 2 or 3 times whatever it is that PEC Zwolle is paying him. Once Ajax sign him at the end of the current season, the CSA might be lucky enough to sign him when John is in his mid-70s. LOL - as they say in the Netherlands - Big may be better, but Small is Beautiful. Zwolle may be small - but it is bigger than Sparta, Excelsior, VVV, Heracles (love the Greek names!) Zwolle is well supported and with a long history. They are no minnow. Ajax just cherry-picked Ten Hag from Utrecht. I think this gives us another year for Van Schip't to develop in Zwolle. I would love to see him coach CMNT. At the moment, I think he is being smart and developing his managerial credentials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpecialK Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Dwight Lodeweges is also his assistant coach and youth coach for PEC Zwolle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Have mixed feeling about van t ship just cause i don't know was his relationship is too Canada. While his cv is very sexy i question if he would actually be interested in the role or knows Canadian soccer all that well. Lodeweges actually feels like a better option to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 19, 2018 Author Share Posted January 19, 2018 1 hour ago, matty said: Have mixed feeling about van t ship just cause i don't know was his relationship is too Canada. While his cv is very sexy i question if he would actually be interested in the role or knows Canadian soccer all that well. I have no idea how van 't Ship feels about Canada either. I do not know the man personally. However, if I put myself in his shoes and didn't know much about Canada, would I be curious about the country that I had been born in, and would I want to check it out at some point in my life, especially if there was a good offer of employment to go with it? His track record shows that he is not adverse to coaching outside of Europe, having done so in Mexico and Australia. And I wonder how many European coaches really invest much of their time following Canadian soccer. I am inclined to think that the fact van 't Ship was born here would be a factor in helping attract his managerial experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xcalibre Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 I wrote something about him taking the job years ago and he retweeted it (CSA probably doesn't even know he exists tbf) Looks like some kind of Vancouver connection to this day, I think one or more of his kids might have went to school here too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrennanFan Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Why on earth would any coach with that level of club and international experience want to come work for the CSA? It sure as hell wouldnt be for the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 20, 2018 Author Share Posted January 20, 2018 52 minutes ago, BrennanFan said: Why on earth would any coach with that level of club and international experience want to come work for the CSA? It sure as hell wouldnt be for the money. It's not easy finding out how much Dutch managers earn. The only bit of information I've been able to find on John van 't Ship was regarding the buy-out of his Guardalajara contract, which was 5.3 Million Euros. I was unable to open the English translation page for the article below. Apparently, Chivas had hired Johan Cruijff in an advisory capacity to fill the club's coaching position, which resulted in Cruijff recommending Van 't Ship. Chivas owner Vergara conceded that the hiring was a mistake and both Cruijff and van 't Ship were let go by the Mexican club. Not knowing the length of van 't Ship's contract at Guardalajara, it is hard to place a per year evaluation on his services, but for arguement sake, let's say it was 3 years, so roughly 2 Million Euros per year. If that were true, what kind of money do you think the CSA is paying the manager of the CMNT? Or better yet, how much do you think they should be paying the manager of the CMNT? Maybe a base salary, with performance bonuses if he makes it to the Hex, or the World Cup Final? In other words, how poor/rich are we? http://www.voetbalzone.nl/doc.asp?uid=183340 'Van 't Schip ontving riante ontslagvergoeding van 5,3 miljoen euro' Maandag, 4 maart 2013 om 21:25 John van 't Schip heeft in januari een zeer riante ontslagvergoeding ontvangen van Chivas uit Guadalajara, zo schrijven diverse Mexicaanse media maandag. De coach zou door een clausule in zijn verbintenis een bedrag van liefst 5,3 miljoen euro hebben ontvangen. Chivas had een maand eerder ook al afscheid genomen van adviseur Johan Cruijff, die zijn landgenoot had aanbevolen als coach. Het bestuur van Chivas besloot na een evaluatie ook de oefenmeester uit de Ajax-school te bedanken voor de bewezen diensten. Van 't Schip, die drie jaar werkzaam was in Australië als trainer van Melbourne Heart, trad vorig jaar zomer in dienst en zat negentien wedstrijden bij de hoofdmacht van Chivas op de bank. Van 't Schip, die werd geassisteerd door Rob Meppelink en David Nascimento, won slechts zeven keer en verloor zes duels. Cruijff werd vorig jaar maart benaderd om Chivas te helpen. Eigenaar Jorge Vergara zag na verloop van tijd echter in dat hij een verkeerde beslissing had genomen en koos ervoor om alle Nederlandse invloeden te verwijderen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 With 15 Eredivisie games remaining in PEC's schedule, John van 't Ship has a 6-point lead over 6th-place FC Utrecht for the final Dutch spot in Europe next season. If he can accomplish such a feat with a team like PEC, just think of what he could do with Canada against countries like Honduras and Panama? The thing is, if John manages to qualify PEC for Europe it will be too late for the CSA to sign him up. Could both Robert and Johan be wrong about van 't Ship? I guess we will find out 15 weeks from now, or maybe even sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 3 hours ago, Robert said: With 15 Eredivisie games remaining in PEC's schedule, John van 't Ship has a 6-point lead over 6th-place FC Utrecht for the final Dutch spot in Europe next season. If he can accomplish such a feat with a team like PEC, just think of what he could do with Canada against countries like Honduras and Panama? The thing is, if John manages to qualify PEC for Europe it will be too late for the CSA to sign him up. Could both Robert and Johan be wrong about van 't Ship? I guess we will find out 15 weeks from now, or maybe even sooner. I don’t know anything about the eredivisie, but according to Wikipedia the teams that finish 4th to 7th compete in a playoff to see who goes to a Europa league second qualifying round. It doesn’t say the format of the playoff from what I can find, or how many of the 4 teams advance (I assume just 1). Do you have better information than that? Maybe finishing 4th or 5th gives them a home game in the playoff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 2 hours ago, Kent said: I don’t know anything about the eredivisie, but according to Wikipedia the teams that finish 4th to 7th compete in a playoff to see who goes to a Europa league second qualifying round. It doesn’t say the format of the playoff from what I can find, or how many of the 4 teams advance (I assume just 1). Do you have better information than that? Maybe finishing 4th or 5th gives them a home game in the playoff? You are absolutely right. I am living in the past and admit that I was wrong. If the following article is correct, then John van 't Ship and PEC will have to pull up their bootstraps and move up one more spot in the Eredivisie standings, or compete in the play-off that you outlined, or win the KNVB Cup competition, where they face third place AZ Alkmaar in the quarter-finals next Wednesday, January 31st. In both competitions PEC will have to beat AZ Alkmaar. In their first Eredivisie meeting back on December 12th, they played to a 1-1 draw. Thus, next week is a hugh match for John van 't Ship and PEC. https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/2888181/dutch-teams-will-have-to-qualify-for-champions-league-from-now-on-after-they-lose-their-automatic-spot/ THE winner of the Dutch top flight will have to qualify for the main draw of the Champions League next season. As a result of both Ajax and AZ Alkmaar failing to win in last night's Europa League games, the Eredivisie has lost its automatic qualification place for Europe's elite club competition. AZ Alkmaar were hammered 4-1 by Lyon to leave their Europa League hopes in tatters The Dutch league is now ranked 13th overall, and as a result of slipping outside the top 10, the top two teams will enter at the qualifying stage. Keep up to date with ALL the FOOTBALL news, gossip, transfers and goals on our club page plus fixtures, results and live match commentary The third placed team will enter the Europa League at the third round stage. Ajax will have it all to do at home when they take in a 0-0 draw from their first leg away at Legia Warsaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 26, 2018 Author Share Posted January 26, 2018 While we are on this tangent, does anyone know if there has been a Canadian-born manager of a club that has played at least one match in any of the following competitions: 1) AFC Champions League 2) CAF Champions League 3) CONCACAF Champions League 4) CONMEBOL Copa Liberadores 5) CONMEBOL Copa Sudamericana 6) OFC Champions League 7) UEFA Champions League 8) UEFA Europa League Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zem Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 2 hours ago, Robert said: While we are on this tangent, does anyone know if there has been a Canadian-born manager of a club that has played at least one match in any of the following competitions: 1) AFC Champions League 2) CAF Champions League 3) CONCACAF Champions League 4) CONMEBOL Copa Liberadores 5) CONMEBOL Copa Sudamericana 6) OFC Champions League 7) UEFA Champions League 8) UEFA Europa League Yep, Nick Dasovic managed TFC for a few CONCACAF Champions League matches at the end of 2010 after Preki was fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 19 minutes ago, Zem said: Yep, Nick Dasovic managed TFC for a few CONCACAF Champions League matches at the end of 2010 after Preki was fired. Biello (1 match) and Limniatis too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 27, 2018 Author Share Posted January 27, 2018 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffHT03rjqxU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 27, 2018 Author Share Posted January 27, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 27, 2018 Author Share Posted January 27, 2018 Experience Fooball Manager/Coach Company Name Resigned from Melbourne City FC 3jan 2017 Dates EmployedJan 2014 – Jan 2017 Employment Duration3 yrs 1 mo LocationAmsterdam en omgeving, Nederland Director Tecnico - Headcoach Company Name Chivas Guadalajara Dates EmployedJun 2012 – Jan 2013 LocationGuadalajara Area, MexicoEmployment Duration8 mos Headcoach Company Name Melbourne Heart FC Dates EmployedOct 2009 – Apr 2012 Employment Duration2 yrs 7 mos A-League Soccercoach on all levels (Youth teams to U20 and First Team) Company Name AFC Ajax Dates Employed1997 – 2009 Employment Duration12 yrs I have worked three periods as soccercoach at Ajax. First Period 1997-2001 ( Coach of U12-U16-U18 and Assistant coach 1st Team) Second Period 2002-2004 ( Headcoach U20 Team ) 3rd Period 2008-2009 ( Assistantcoach 1st Team) Interim Headcoach First Team 2009 Assistant Coach Dutch National Team Company Name KNVB Dates Employed2004 – 2008 Employment Duration4 yrs Fifa WorldCup 2006 Germany Euro 2008 Austria/Swiss Education KNVB Academy Degree NameUEFA Pro Licence Field Of StudySoccercoach/Manager Dates attended or expected graduation1996 – 1999 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted January 28, 2018 Share Posted January 28, 2018 On 25/01/2018 at 6:05 PM, Robert said: While we are on this tangent, does anyone know if there has been a Canadian-born manager of a club that has played at least one match in any of the following competitions: 1) AFC Champions League 2) CAF Champions League 3) CONCACAF Champions League 4) CONMEBOL Copa Liberadores 5) CONMEBOL Copa Sudamericana 6) OFC Champions League 7) UEFA Champions League 8) UEFA Europa League Alen Marcina, perhaps? Amongst about a dozen other clubs, he played at PAOK and also played in NZ for a short spell. He might have played a match or two in a qualifier for one of the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted January 28, 2018 Author Share Posted January 28, 2018 2 hours ago, nolando said: Alen Marcina, perhaps? Amongst about a dozen other clubs, he played at PAOK and also played in NZ for a short spell. He might have played a match or two in a qualifier for one of the above. According to Wikipedia: John Limniatis was born in Athens, Greece. Nick Dasovic was an assistant/interim manager for Toronto FC in 2010 for the 2 matches against the Puerto Rico Islanders. (0-1 and 0-0) Mauro Biello became the Montreal Impact's head coach August 30, 2015, which, of course, was after the April 29, 2015 loss to Mexico City's America in the CONCACAF Champions League final. América Montreal Impact 5 3 on aggregate First leg América Montreal Impact 1 1 Date April 22, 2015 Venue Estadio Azteca, Mexico City Referee Héctor Rodríguez (Honduras) Attendance 56,783 Second leg Montreal Impact América 2 4 Date April 29, 2015 Venue Olympic Stadium, Montreal Referee Henry Bejarano (Costa Rica) Attendance 61,004 Head coach records As of November 11, 2017 Coach Nation From To Record1 G W L T Win % Jesse Marsch United States October 1, 2011 November 3, 2012 36 12 17 7 33.33 Marco Schällibaum Switzerland January 7, 2013 December 18, 2013 43 17 17 9 39.53 Frank Klopas United States December 18, 2013 August 30, 2015 83 25 31 27 30.12 Mauro Biello Canada August 30, 2015 October 23, 2017 93 36 34 23 38.71 Rémi Garde France November 8, 2017 present 0 0 0 0 — Alen Marcina's managerial record is as follows: Teams managed 2012–2013 San Antonio Scorpions (assistant) 2013–2015 San Antonio Scorpions 2016 Rayo OKC No problem nolando. I saw your post while editing this one. All of which, thus far, adds up to 2 matches at an assistant/interim level for a Canadian-born manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted January 28, 2018 Share Posted January 28, 2018 9 minutes ago, Robert said: According to Wikipedia, Alen Marcina's managerial record is as follows: Teams managed 2012–2013 San Antonio Scorpions (assistant) 2013–2015 San Antonio Scorpions 2016 Rayo OKC I think I was interpreting your question as a having a different meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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