General Discussion on CMNT

[Scorpion26]

7 hours ago, Kent said:

I'm not an expert, but I think it's a bit tough to come up with one easy to understand rule like more games or less games. It gets complicated with game dropping out of the last 12 months (so being devalued), or it could be dependent on your record in competitive games, etc.

But generally I would say it's better to have a better winning % than total wins in a year. Like if you play all your friendlies against team x, it's better to win 3 out of 4 games against team x than it is to win 4 out of 8 games. You would get y points for a win against that team, and you get a 0 for each loss, regardless of who you lose to. So the first scenario would get you 3y/4, and the second would get you 4y/8 (which is y/2).

Your example of playing one highly ranked team 1 time could do something like this. Let's say you get 500 points for that win. That would be your average for the last 12 months for a whole year. But then when it moves into the next period (13 to 24 months) it's weighting is halved, so you would now only get 250 points for that win. However, if you had a team that was getting, say, an average of 300 points every month, then that team would go from 300 points 450 points after 12 months (because of 150 points for their halved 13 to 24 month period, + 300 points for the most recent 12 months). So the team in the 1 game example would have a higher ranking for a year, but then would be much lower in the following year (at least until they get another single game win for their second year).

I hope I didn't make this even more confusing.

I get your point, but I'm thinking it best to play more games for the players not for the ranking system. More games together will increase chemistry and get them to be more at ease with the international games. Plus gives a chance for the coach to create more depth and competition for the players. Points on the FIFA ranking would be great, but playing more games overall will help to improve the ranking which isn't my main concern. Canada needs more game for players and finance reasons. 

Edited August 22, 2017 by Scorpion26

[Kent]

21 minutes ago, Scorpion26 said:

I get your point, but I'm thinking it best to play more games for the players not for the ranking system. More games together will increase chemistry and get them to be more at ease with the international games. Plus gives a chance for the coach to create more depth and competition for the players. Points on the FIFA ranking would be great, but playing more games overall will help to improve the ranking which isn't my main concern. Canada needs more game for players and finance reasons. 

Yeah, I wasn't disagreeing with you. In fact I agree, in particular about more home games to help grow the fan base. I was responding to Bison's comment about playing two games rather than one specifically for ranking points.

[Guest]

Might be an unpopular opinion with you guys but you care about the Fifa rankings way too much. The Fifa rankings give us a chance at getting an easier group. Look at all 3 groups last cycle. Group B was the group of death and did you guys honestly think we could beat out Guatamala when we can't win shit in Central America

Edited August 22, 2017 by Guest

[harrycoyster]

18 minutes ago, canta15 said:

Might be an unpopular opinion with you guys but you care about the Fifa rankings way too much. The Fifa rankings give us a chance at getting an easier group. Look at all 3 groups last cycle. Group B was the group of death and did you guys honestly think we could beat out Guatamala when we can't win shit in Central America

Definitely had the best chance in Group C, but I don't think we can complain about the group we got. There is a not insignificant difference between being 6th or 7th in CONCACAF when WWQ comes around, however.

Edited August 22, 2017 by harrycoyster

[SpecialK]

A higher FIFA ranking would give Canadian players more opportunities to play in Europe ie work permits in England. Also with higher FIFA ranking we would be more respected in the soccer world. With a higher ranking, it could help keep and  attract players and better teams to play. 

As fans we should care about where we are ranked. 

Edited August 22, 2017 by SpecialK

[harrycoyster]

19 minutes ago, SpecialK said:

A higher FIFA ranking would give Canadian players more opportunities to play in Europe ie work permits in England. Also with higher FIFA ranking we would be more respected in the soccer world. With a higher ranking, it could help keep and  attract players and better teams to play. 

As fans we should care about where we are ranked. 

Right, but these are mostly things that are more impacted by the team's actual performance. I don't think anybody is doubting that being ranked 50th in the world would be better than 90th. I think he was calling into question the following of the FIFA Ranking math and planning friendlies around what gives us the best chance to move up a few spots.

Edited August 22, 2017 by harrycoyster

[SpecialK]

9 minutes ago, harrycoyster said:

Right, but these are mostly things that are more impacted by the team's actual performance. I don't think anybody is doubting that being ranked 50th in the world would be better than 90th. I think he was calling into question the following of the FIFA Ranking math and planning friendlies around what gives us the best chance to move up a few spots.

But the math is key because what's the best/easiest way to get from 90 to 50. For me, I think it's interesting. I could be wrong it's ether top 70 or 50 for international players to get a work permit. I want to see more Canadian players playing in the EPL

[Blackdude]

42 minutes ago, SpecialK said:

But the math is key because what's the best/easiest way to get from 90 to 50. For me, I think it's interesting. I could be wrong it's ether top 70 or 50 for international players to get a work permit. I want to see more Canadian players playing in the EPL

The easiest way is to play 1 friendly in July against an overrated team and  win it and not play any other games and make the final of the next Gold Cup. 

Edited August 22, 2017 by Blackdude

[Blackjack15]

I think we can all agree that more friendlies during FIFA Dates is a positive thing for so many reasons and benefits this team that won't have an official competition until early 2019 

Hopefully the CSA mix in a Training Camp in January for North American Based Players so that Zambrano can know his best possible squad and starting XI for 2022 WCQ Campaign

After the QF at the Gold Cup I am more optimistic than ever 

[harrycoyster]

55 minutes ago, SpecialK said:

But the math is key because what's the best/easiest way to get from 90 to 50. For me, I think it's interesting. I could be wrong it's ether top 70 or 50 for international players to get a work permit. I want to see more Canadian players playing in the EPL

Again, I get it. But the point is that the best way to get to 50 is to actually play like the 50th best team in the world. What does being 50th mean if the team is still 90th on actual talent? EPL teams aren't going to suddenly sign our players because we played the FIFA rankings correctly if our players aren't any more talented. There are what, maybe 5 players from the big 3 CONCACAF nations in the EPL... and they all are consistently top 30 in FIFA rankings.  I think you are putting a bit to much stock into the "we need to be EPL work permit eligible" argument.

I think that playing the FIFA rankings has benefits, but who cares if it gets in the way of development? Where we are in the rankings is pretty low on my list of concerns and has, at best, a peripheral relationship with actual improvement in quality.

[dyslexic nam]

I have to admit that I don't get the FIFA ranking preoccupation.  I know it influences a few things but I have always had the (potentially simplistic) view that our team needs to simply be better and get better results against the teams on the field with us.  We didn't lose the Jamaica QF because of a shitty FIFA ranking.  And while we may have had a slightly easier group in WCQ,we didn't miss the hex because of our ranking.  We did both of those things because we simply haven't been good enough when it mattered.  A higher ranking is not going to make us play better.   

And while a higher ranking may allow slightly easier access to Europe, its not like Euro teams are beating down the door to sign Canadian players based on our awesome performances. 

[Scorpion26]

18 hours ago, SpecialK said:

But the math is key because what's the best/easiest way to get from 90 to 50. For me, I think it's interesting. I could be wrong it's ether top 70 or 50 for international players to get a work permit. I want to see more Canadian players playing in the EPL

EPL is great and all, but I rather see Canadian play in top two division of these countries first Germany, France, Dutch, and Italy would be my preference. I feel these leagues truly try to develop their young players. It would be great to see Canadians playing in EPL or La Liga that would be awesome, but players still developing go to those leagues first in my opinion. Overall I want to see our players play games and that can be any league, but not third tier or below. It has got to be top two league in certain countries and top tier league for some other countries. It's is tiring to see so many in third tier league and be on the bench. Which is why CPL starting is great for many of them and if not CPL at least MLS.... Mexico is a good league as well and some players should go to play. 

[Kent]

16 hours ago, Scorpion26 said:

EPL is great and all, but I rather see Canadian play in top two division of these countries first Germany, France, Dutch, and Italy would be my preference. I feel these leagues truly try to develop their young players. It would be great to see Canadians playing in EPL or La Liga that would be awesome, but players still developing go to those leagues first in my opinion. Overall I want to see our players play games and that can be any league, but not third tier or below. It has got to be top two league in certain countries and top tier league for some other countries. It's is tiring to see so many in third tier league and be on the bench. Which is why CPL starting is great for many of them and if not CPL at least MLS.... Mexico is a good league as well and some players should go to play. 

So if a third tier team is all a player can get on, they should retire from the game? Should we also eliminate our third tier leagues L1O and PLSQ? Samuel Piette should have retired long before he signed with the Montreal Impact?

[Blackjack15]

Camp starts this Sunday (August 27th)

[Scorpion26]

10 hours ago, Kent said:

So if a third tier team is all a player can get on, they should retire from the game? Should we also eliminate our third tier leagues L1O and PLSQ? Samuel Piette should have retired long before he signed with the Montreal Impact?

Why go to Europe in a third tier league and sit on the bench most games. I rather they play here in Canada help improve our league. Obviously with the CPL it will be great to have many come play in Canada. However never mentioned about anyone retiring, but mention that they should be pushing for top two tiers from the jump, but loans to lower leagues is fine they can't truly control those moves. In all I can't control where these players go, but I want them to be playing  some where and making strides to be part of the CMNT. 

[Kent]

On 22/08/2017 at 6:41 PM, Scorpion26 said:

Overall I want to see our players play games and that can be any league, but not third tier or below.

I know you didn't use the word retire, but when you say players shouldn't play in third tier or below, it logically follows that they should retire if that's all they can get.

[BuzzAndSting]

20 minutes ago, Kent said:

I know you didn't use the word retire, but when you say players shouldn't play in third tier or below, it logically follows that they should retire if that's all they can get.

Do you mean retire in general or retire from the NT?

[Kent]

8 minutes ago, BuzzAndSting said:

Do you mean retire in general or retire from the NT?

You'd have to ask Scorpion26 what his thoughts are. He didn't seem to be talking about players just not getting called up to the national team. He was saying they shouldn't play in the 3rd tier or lower at all. His latest post though clarifies that what he means is that if you can't get in above the third tier they should come back home to play (presumably after CPL starts up), not quit the game.

[BuzzAndSting]

3 minutes ago, Kent said:

You'd have to ask Scorpion26 what his thoughts are. He didn't seem to be talking about players just not getting called up to the national team. He was saying they shouldn't play in the 3rd tier or lower at all. His latest post though clarifies that what he means is that if you can't get in above the third tier they should come back home to play (presumably after CPL starts up), not quit the game.

Apologies, I didn't read through the previous posts thoroughly. 

[Scorpion26]

No one is retiring from any team @BuzzAndSting and @Kent....

Just was posting that players who leave Canada to third tier leagues to just sit on the bench is sort of pointless when they can stay here to play in the Canadian leagues to help improve those leagues and also can play in the USL, NASL, and MLS instead if possible. With the CPL they will have more opportunity a high level league well a league that will grow to higher level. Yes I know some players have to make the journey up the ladder, However how many have made the move up that ladder in Europe. Yes going to a European academy and being loaned out to a lower league is a different situation. Just want to see more players in the top two leagues throughout Europe. Again no players need to retire when they just need to find a place to play often and they can get that by staying in Canada/USA. Let's hope that CPL does in fact start next year after WC2018. 

Couple more weeks until game vs Jamaica.... Hope to see more out of Larin in this game.

[Blackjack15]

Any update on Camp so far? I know it's early but still would be good to know any news on Octavio Zambrano's men

I am really hoping it's sold out at BMO Field

[Keegan]

5 minutes ago, Blackjack15 said:

Any update on Camp so far? I know it's early but still would be good to know any news on Octavio Zambrano's men

I am really hoping it's sold out at BMO Field

We'll be lucky if it's half full.. it's a friendly v Jamaica.

[Bison44]

They have a couple short vids on the Can soccer twitter, they talk to Didic, Ozzie and Kaye.  Kaye himself admits he was surprised to be where is is already.  It sure helped his form/confidence in the USL though.  

 

 

[Blackjack15]

Million dollar question: Why does James Pantemis keep getting called up to the senior squad? 

[SpecialK]

1 hour ago, Blackjack15 said:

Million dollar question: Why does James Pantemis keep getting called up to the senior squad? 

I don't understand that either, there are so many other/better options like:

Julien Latendresse-Levesque

Tomer Chencinski

Sebastian Breza

Callum Irving

and more.

 Conspiracy theory : the CSA has to  maintain a MLS  Canadian team/ Academy quota hahaha or they are just too lazy or cheap or both to scout out other goalies.