Is Anthony Totera be given us another CPL hint?

[Ansem]

Well hoping Totera is right 100%

The owners job is to put the money on the table and invest in the league and do their job to draw in fans. My job is to support it and I will be buying season tickets for the Toronto team and buy the streaming service/watch on TV. 

Surrey can still join in a D2 expansion if the above is accurate. I think that if the league is successful and Quebec City thrive, Montreal will attract investors for future rivalries with Quebec and Toronto.

[GuillermoDelQuarto]

7 hours ago, Ansem said:

 

Why MLS doesn't have 2 clubs in Chicago (North and South river) WITHIN the city is a mistake and miss opportunity of epic proportions.

this is somewhat off topic at this point but for what it's worth I'm willing to bet this will happen in our lifetime(assuming we're roughly the same age)

they started with LA and NY, the two most logical locations for two clubs, but I could see chicago coming at some point.

[Unnamed Trialist]

13 hours ago, zen said:

It's my opinion and I am allowed to state it on a messaging board. Doesn't make it right or wrong until we see what the outcome is does it?

You are 100% allowed to state it. But if you are going to state it, expect people to react. Because, you see, it is a message board. And the message here is: your concept of CPL prestige based on recognizeable city names is baseless and poorly argued. As I and many others see it.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

15 hours ago, Ansem said:

Well hoping Totera is right 100%....Surrey can still join in a D2 expansion if the above is accurate....

The best evidence we have of who is solidly on board is the group photo from the CSA AGM and recent mainstream media press reports with attributed quotes. That points to Halifax, Hamilton, K/W, Winnipeg, Saskatoon and Langley as being the starting point. We've been told until they reach 16 pro/rel isn't on the agenda and that the minimum market size is 200,000 so there is no reason to think a second tier is on their agenda any time soon.

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

The best evidence we have of who is solidly on board is the group photo from the CSA AGM and recent mainstream media press reports with attributed quotes. That points to Halifax, Hamilton, K/W, Winnipeg, Saskatoon and Langley as being the starting point. We've been told until they reach 16 pro/rel isn't on the agenda and that the minimum market size is 200,000 so there is no reason to think a second tier is on their agenda any time soon.

So are they going to run youth teams, how are they going to work on their academies and be able to draw from their own players? 

Asking because, quite clearly, you are going to see the MLS teams poaching, first team starters, no doubt, and then any younger guys who stand out. So you need some kind of independent structure to hold your own. And of course vice versa, the CPL teams are going to go after those guys on the fringe of MLS sides, not getting minutes and tired of it.

PDL is an option (are we going to start saying having the younger ones in a NA league is contradictory to CPL principles?), but that season is too short, it is only good for a part of the season. USL is, IMO, too expensive, and the level will not be that different.

Then, as MLS showed us, having your own youth league, where the 2nd side even travels with the first, does not work. 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Moving into speculation mode, I suspect academies with a full-time residency component on an MLS sort of scale are not likely due to the expense involved and can vaguely remember seeing quotes from Hamilton and Halifax in line with that. Suspect they would align themselves with the existing youth setups in their areas, which is easy enough to do in lower mainland BC and southern Ontario but more problematic for Saskatoon and Halifax in terms of having lots of potential pro level recruits to draw from locally. My guess is that their rosters would contain a lot of MLS academy and USL II cast offs and providing players like that with a second chance is very much a worthwhile exercise in the larger scheme of things as players often do develop and break through to a higher level again later in their career and the MLS pathway feeds into such a high standard that even CMNT players often struggle to nail down a starting position at that level. Some sort of viable second tier in eight or more Canadian cities is very much needed regardless of whether it is happening under CSA or USSF sanctioning.

[zen]

9 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

You are 100% allowed to state it. But if you are going to state it, expect people to react. Because, you see, it is a message board. And the message here is: your concept of CPL prestige based on recognizeable city names is baseless and poorly argued. As I and many others see it.

I don't think it was poorly argued or baseless. I weigh the criteria I discussed heavily, you may not weigh the criteria that I do as heavily or not at all, and that's fine. Like I said, time will tell which decisions the owners make are successful and which are not. Not that we know officially what is going to happen just yet lol.

[ironcub14]

On 2017-07-02 at 0:18 PM, grande said:

No one would take a league seriously if there's smaller cities in it. I mean, could you imagine if the Premier League allowed teams from places like Burnley, Hull, West Bromwich, Swansea, or Bournemouth? No one would give them the time of day!

I know we're only on the most hardcore of the footy forum in Canada, but soccer in Canada ain't football in England. A lot of things I read on this forum seems to conflate football in Canada with football in England or another country where it's the dominant spectator sport in the country.

Just to go back to the original point, I'm okay with Surrey somewhere near the SkyTrain or another accessible area, but I can't see anywhere else in the Fraser Valley being a possible location for CPL at all, including Langley. A place like Langley would be a huge risk, at best scenario, for a D1 footy league in Canada.

[ironcub14]

On 2017-07-03 at 1:42 AM, nolbertos said:

I agree with Zen that when people, the people I've talked to in Van.  Not one of them refer to Surrey as "Fraser Valley" its more Langley, Maple Ridge, Chilliwack and Abbotsford area. Surrey is its own "designation" nowadays.  I've lived in East Van and I've lived in Surrey and I can tell you Surrey peeps don't consider themselves as "Valley" folk.  Now in regards to Futbol, I honestly don't think a CPL franchise can make it work in Metrovan with the Caps as primary competition.  The Caps namebrand and history extends from Van to Surrey and abit beyond.  I honestly don't think Rob Friend is going to make much noise in the Valley, like others stated, transportation sucks and the corporate dollars in the Metrovan area.  I would've preferred he put all his time in a Victoria team or someplace.  But its his and his investor friends money.  If they think they can change lacklustre Valley support for futbol, give it another go.

I've been really impressed by the Mississauga folks; they've really taken the CPL initiative to a whole new level in the GTA and have definitely made a stronger case than guys like me that was hoping for a Toronto team first, and then Mississauga after.

I'm hoping we can see something like that pop up in Surrey or Victoria as well. However, I most definitely can't see something like this popping up in Langley or anywhere else in the Fraser Valley. It'd be like asking Milton or Stouffville to stand up and show yourselves, since you guys are the new fastest growing formerly-rural area in the GTA.

[Rheo]

27 minutes ago, ironcub14 said:

I know we're only on the most hardcore of the footy forum in Canada, but soccer in Canada ain't football in England. A lot of things I read on this forum seems to conflate football in Canada with football in England or another country where it's the dominant spectator sport in the country.

The differences in Canadian and English football culture are irrelevant.  We know what they are.  It's the general idea of automatically dismissing the CPL because they may or not have a franchise in an area that a person deems "bush league" is presumptuous.  Langley may work, it may not work.  We won't know for sure unless they try. 

Not trying to single out Zen.  He and everyone is entitled to their their opinion, god knows I have mine that don't match up often lol.  But it's just one example of way too many around here where people are predicting the league to doom and failure if they do or do not do something that the individual feels is vital to the league.  And often it's not a prediction, it's deemed as a certainty.  

The league isn't going to be perfect.  There's going to be things that people don't like and if that drives some away that's too bad.  But if you want it to succeed and further develop the game then you have to support it no matter what misgivings you might have about it.  Feel free to criticize and work to change those things but indifference is the worst possible thing.

Off my soap box and off to watch baseball.

[ironcub14]

1 minute ago, Rheo said:

The differences in Canadian and English football culture are irrelevant.  We know what they are.  It's the general idea of automatically dismissing the CPL because they may or not have a franchise in an area that a person deems "bush league" is presumptuous.  Langley may work, it may not work.  We won't know for sure unless they try. 

Not trying to single out Zen.  He and everyone is entitled to their their opinion, god knows I have mine that don't match up often lol.  But it's just one example of way too many around here where people are predicting the league to doom and failure if they do or do not do something that the individual feels is vital to the league.  And often it's not a prediction, it's deemed as a certainty.  

The league isn't going to be perfect.  There's going to be things that people don't like and if that drives some away that's too bad.  But if you want it to succeed and further develop the game then you have to support it no matter what misgivings you might have about it.  Feel free to criticize and work to change those things but indifference is the worst possible thing.

Off my soap box and off to watch baseball.

I think every single person who has commented in the Voyageurs CPL sub-forum will be supporting the league in one way or another when the time comes, no matter what the league ends up looking like

What I think a lot of people like myself or others have in mind when we make comments about what aspects we think may or may not contribute positively for the financial viability of the league is all the factors that we have seen, various combinations of it, that felled or nearly felled the original NASL, the original CSL, CSL 2.0, NASL 2.0 and a number of other football and other pro sports leagues in US/Canada. That's all.

But I think we can all agree that every single one of us commenting in this CPL sub-forum will be and already are supporting the league from day 1. It's the people outside of the Canadian soccer hive that we're trying to convince to do the same.

[Under The Cosh Blog]

On 7/2/2017 at 3:19 PM, grasshopper1917 said:

Paul Beirne has consistently stated the league will start with at least six teams up to a maximum of 7 or 8. Until Beirne says something different im sticking with that.

Probably advisable. So easy to get caught up/carried away with this.

[SpursFlu]

If there was a team in Langley called "Fraser Valley" I cant imagine that the huge amounts of people living in parts of Surrey which are literally a 5 minute drive from Langley wouldn't support the team just because its called Fraser Valley seems completely unrealistic. I cannot stress how fluid this area is. Imagine a soccer fan living in Morgan Creek, Cloverdale, Fleetwood, Clayton Heights(Surrey neighbourhoods) watching a CPL game on TV that is being played right up the street from his house but refusing to support because he doesn't consider Surrey the Fraser Valley. Something he has probably spent zero time thinking about in his life. I find this really hard to believe

[ironcub14]

32 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

If there was a team in Langley called "Fraser Valley" I cant imagine that the huge amounts of people living in parts of Surrey which are literally a 5 minute drive from Langley wouldn't support the team just because its called Fraser Valley seems completely unrealistic. I cannot stress how fluid this area is. Imagine a soccer fan living in Morgan Creek, Cloverdale, Fleetwood, Clayton Heights(Surrey neighbourhoods) watching a CPL game on TV that is being played right up the street from his house but refusing to support because he doesn't consider Surrey the Fraser Valley. Something he has probably spent zero time thinking about in his life. I find this really hard to believe

A team in Toronto such as TFC doesn't draw fans purely from the City of Toronto; it draws fans from all across the GTA. Same goes for Vancouver, Caps, and Greater Vancouver. The point of putting a team in Mississauga or Surrey is to capitalize on the civic pride that the two cities have, as two large distinct suburbs that wish to seek its own identity from its big brother. That said, if you put a CPL team in Sauga or Surrey, I doubt you will be getting many fans coming out from the eastern or northern part of GTA, like Pickering or Markham, or the northern, northeastern or southwestern part of Greater Vancouver, like North Van, Coquitlam or Richmond, though I think that the teams should play at a location where it's at least as easy as possible for fans in these other cities to attend by public transit or by car. 

But for the most part, the main point of putting a team in Surrey would be to draw on Surrey pride. Why one would negate that by putting it in Langley doesn't make sense to me. Not only that, Langley would be accessible purely by car, and would make it that more difficult for any CPL fan outside of Surrey/Fraser Valley to get to. It'd be like putting a team in Oakville, and asking Sauga fans to show love for the western part of GTA. Yeah it could work, and maybe it's only a 5 minute drive away for some neighbourhoods, but you're really further narrowing down the catchment area of fans.

[SpursFlu]

8 minutes ago, ironcub14 said:

A team in Toronto such as TFC doesn't draw fans purely from the City of Toronto; it draws fans from all across the GTA. Same goes for Vancouver, Caps, and Greater Vancouver.

The point of putting a team in Mississauga or Surrey is to capitalize on the civic pride that the two cities have, as two large distinct suburbs that wish to seek its own identity from its big brother. That said, if you put a CPL team in Sauga or Surrey, I doubt you will be getting many fans coming out from the eastern or northern part of GTA, like Pickering or Markham, or the northern, northeastern or southwestern part of Greater Vancouver, like North Van, Coquitlam or Richmond. Some CPL diehards, for sure, but definitely not mainstream fans.

The point of putting a team in Surrey would be to draw on Surrey pride. Why one would negate that by putting it in Langley, away from both Surrey and from any Skytrain access is beyond me. It'd be like putting a team in Oakville, and asking Sauga fans to show love for the western part of GTA. Yeah it could work, and maybe it's only a 5 minute drive away for some neighbourhoods, but you're really further narrowing down the catchment area of fans.

I agree with you . I'm just pointing out that if a team is in Langley it would draw from more people than some are assuming from probably just pulling some population numbers from Wikipedia. But for the record Langley wouldn't be my first choice 

[Alex D]

Is there any actual confirmation that Langley is where the team will be?

[Complete Homer]

17 minutes ago, Alex D said:

Is there any actual confirmation that Langley is where the team will be?

Nope

[Alex D]

6 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

Nope

Just checking. 

[Cheeta]

8 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

If there was a team in Langley called "Fraser Valley" I cant imagine that the huge amounts of people living in parts of Surrey which are literally a 5 minute drive from Langley wouldn't support the team just because its called Fraser Valley seems completely unrealistic. 

...

 

Echo that.  Geography matters.  I'm sure there are tonnes of footie fans, who are shall we say, more the motoring type than the SkyTrain type who would take in waaaay more football matches every season just because a venue is car friendly.

The point is made all the time.  As an example the Argos move to BMO.  Great venue, actually quite an excellent one for CFL gridiron I might add but maybe its location is a handicap, and a serious one at that. 

IGF in Winnipeg, not dissimilar.  A significant portion of Bomber's fans have traditionally been drawn from the North and East sides of the city and great venue or no, IGF isn't exactly car-friendly.   A real bitch compared to the old Maroons Road stadium and THAT venue was a bitch.  Hear it all the time. 

[Cheeta]

Also would say if Totera is making an open secret of a CPL launch that will include Langley, Edmonton, Calgary, Saskatoon, Ottawa & Halifax (in addition to Winnipeg & Hamilton) I'm going to wet my pants.  Have to believe that the Edmonton and Ottawa franchises will belong to the established parties and they are on board with the scheme.  They have to be, you know, for the obvious reason that if CPL launches and it has ANY resemblance of strength, of actually having a chance to make a go of things, that if you're not MLS you're as good as dead. 

And if franchises from Markham, Toronto proper, Quebec City and Regina are short listed to follow?  Ho-boy.  That's better than a pretty solid blend of locations, it's more importantly a critical mass of vetted owners who have the means to take on this long term investment.  Here's hoping!

Wow.  Wouldn't the V's Cup be fuuuuun? 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Doesn't Anthony Totera come from Markham? Its inclusion and the complete absence of K/W are the main red flags that this was a fantasy list rather than something driven by inside knowledge. The days away tweets a few months back when fan group people had been told by Paul Beirne that nothing would happen publicly until the CSA AGM were a strong indication that he isn't really in the loop to any significant extent. I think the next big thing we know about that could provide some insight on what will unfold is Soccer Nova Scotia's event in Halifax in September.

[Macksam]

On July 2, 2017 at 6:56 AM, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

When people were getting all excited on here about CFL owners launching something that would challenge and displace MLS, my impression was that what would ultimately happen if MLS B teams were not involved was a low budget league that is a bit of a step up from operations like the Victoria Highlanders and FC London in PDL that could draw into four figures sometimes with teams in smaller cities like Saskatoon, Langley, BC and Halifax. I suspect the next step on the path to that will be a further downsizing of some of the stated ambitions so that a combined university scale Canadian football athletics stadium like those in Langley, BC and at Wilfred Laurier University or a one-sided pop-up to keep Councillor Wayne Mason happy in Halifax will be seen as being OK to facilitate the launch of the league with crowd expectations also downsized in the smaller markets to about 3000 or so when break even budgets are put together. Paul Beirne has been setting the scene for that sort of thing with the markets of 200,000 and multiple teams in the major cities stuff and if the final outcome is something similar to the original CSL that actually stays afloat and helps develop the next Jason Devos or Geoff Aunger then there is absolutely nothing wrong with any of that.

I suspect you're going to continue your trend of being wrong about what this league is going to be. 

[Pat Carrasco]

Here are the latest tweets from Anthony Totera. As of today, he acknowledges that Regina, Saskatoon and Quebec City will be part of the CPL. He is also dead serious that what he's posting is no rumor and no joke. This is also going back to the last postings from last week. I now take this guy very serious.

 

[Ansem]

A Saskatchewan derby and rivalry with Manitoba will definitely be exciting to see if the info above is accurate.

[Pat Carrasco]

3 minutes ago, Ansem said:

A Saskatchewan derby and rivalry with Manitoba will definitely be exciting to see if the info above is accurate.

Ansem, at the very start I always thought that Totera was a huge joke. However, my opinion has certainly change. I now take his words to be 85% accurate. My gut now tells me that we are moving much closer to the Great Prairie Derby: Winnipeg/Regina/Saskatoon.