mrstepp817 Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 The US will make wholesale changes I imagine if they get through......all their best backline guys are in Europe so not sure they'll be brought in lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 That game must've been terrifying as a US fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yohan Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 5 minutes ago, Gopherbashi said: That game must've been terrifying as a US fan. Why? It was the B team. Arena basically using group stage as scrimmage. US's best players will show up for knockout stage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 4 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said: So the question is whether the result, which is traditionally given as a 3-0, should also means goals scored, when they weren't. No way an administrative result should be used to affect a group standing based on goal difference. Though I don't understand where we got this 3-0 as a default result for ineligibility and the like, it makes no sense for those to be tallied for tie breaking purposes. And Canada should fight like hell to make sure it does not happen. The default used to be 1-0. They changed it to 3-0 (I believe in the 90's) specifically for tie breakers. To the best of my memory 1-0 just wasn't a bad enough result for the offending team, and it was such a slim victory that it was a very real possibility that the team on the receiving end of the win was often hampered by not being able to play and get a multiple goal win. My memory is based on how I interpreted it as a youth soccer player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 US win means that a Panama win over Martinique would qualify us for the next round no matter what we do in our last game. If the US was going to win I would've preferred a lopsided victory though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 25 minutes ago, Kent said: The default used to be 1-0. They changed it to 3-0 (I believe in the 90's) specifically for tie breakers. To the best of my memory 1-0 just wasn't a bad enough result for the offending team, and it was such a slim victory that it was a very real possibility that the team on the receiving end of the win was often hampered by not being able to play and get a multiple goal win. My memory is based on how I interpreted it as a youth soccer player. Have it in my head along the same lines. The 1-nil result wasn't enough of a disincentive, the 3-nil kick felt like it was brought in to punish the offender, not reward or punish the offender's opponents. How you can divorce the one from the other I have no idea but there it is. One of those FIFA practices which maybe isn't thought out as well as it should be and results in a world of unintended consequences. But like I wrote, it's a tricky bit of business. Yeah, you can clobber FG for playing around with all this nonsense in the future, you know to set an example, but in the here and now of the tourney its hard to find a fair answer for all the innocent teams effected, ie Canada, Honduras & Costa Rica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian B. Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 50 minutes ago, Gian-Luca said: US win means that a Panama win over Martinique would qualify us for the next round no matter what we do in our last game. If the US was going to win I would've preferred a lopsided victory though Well I see your point but if the nil-nil result stands between FG and Honduras I believe that mathematically we could still finish last in our group and be eliminated. No? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maplebanana Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 14 minutes ago, Christian B. said: Well I see your point but if the nil-nil result stands between FG and Honduras I believe that mathematically we could still finish last in our group and be eliminated. No? Yes, but it's tricky. If Honduras beats us, and FG beats CRC we're all at 4 pts. But for us to be last it'd come down to GD. FG is sitting at -2 and CRC is at +1, so a 1-0 FG win makes them -1, CRC at +/-0. So we'd have to lose at least 3-0 to bring us down to -1. But in that situation, we'd be tied with FG and get 3rd on goals scored. But, a 4-0 Honduras win + 1-0 FG win makes us drop to -2 and we're eliminated. Almost anything else, including too lopsided of a FG win, and we're at least 3rd. But, since this is Gold Cup and we're Canada fans: FG 5, CRC 3 + HON 3, CAN 0 would be a coin flip between CRC and CAN. Because it'd be FG +0, HON +2, CRC -1, CAN -1 with CRC and CAN both scoring 5 and a draw in their game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addona Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 5 hours ago, maplebanana said: Yes, but it's tricky. If Honduras beats us, and FG beats CRC we're all at 4 pts. But for us to be last it'd come down to GD. FG is sitting at -2 and CRC is at +1, so a 1-0 FG win makes them -1, CRC at +/-0. So we'd have to lose at least 3-0 to bring us down to -1. But in that situation, we'd be tied with FG and get 3rd on goals scored. But, a 4-0 Honduras win + 1-0 FG win makes us drop to -2 and we're eliminated. Almost anything else, including too lopsided of a FG win, and we're at least 3rd. But, since this is Gold Cup and we're Canada fans: FG 5, CRC 3 + HON 3, CAN 0 would be a coin flip between CRC and CAN. Because it'd be FG +0, HON +2, CRC -1, CAN -1 with CRC and CAN both scoring 5 and a draw in their game. This is why, as much as I hate Honduras, I actually want a forfeit decision! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 6 hours ago, maplebanana said: Yes, but it's tricky. If Honduras beats us, and FG beats CRC we're all at 4 pts. But for us to be last it'd come down to GD. FG is sitting at -2 and CRC is at +1, so a 1-0 FG win makes them -1, CRC at +/-0. So we'd have to lose at least 3-0 to bring us down to -1. But in that situation, we'd be tied with FG and get 3rd on goals scored. But, a 4-0 Honduras win + 1-0 FG win makes us drop to -2 and we're eliminated. Almost anything else, including too lopsided of a FG win, and we're at least 3rd. But, since this is Gold Cup and we're Canada fans: FG 5, CRC 3 + HON 3, CAN 0 would be a coin flip between CRC and CAN. Because it'd be FG +0, HON +2, CRC -1, CAN -1 with CRC and CAN both scoring 5 and a draw in their game. Yeah, but if we excel at one aspect of this game, it is Gold Cup coin flips. We are a lock for the next round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theaub Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 If we lose 3-0 to this Honduras team we deserve to go home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 16 minutes ago, theaub said: If we lose 3-0 to this Honduras team we deserve to go home. I felt the same way about our WCQ results. Bottom line there was that if you aren't good enough to get top-6 results in the CONCACAF hex process, you have no business in the big show. Same argument applies here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 7 hours ago, Cheeta said: Have it in my head along the same lines. The 1-nil result wasn't enough of a disincentive, the 3-nil kick felt like it was brought in to punish the offender, not reward or punish the offender's opponents. How you can divorce the one from the other I have no idea but there it is. One of those FIFA practices which maybe isn't thought out as well as it should be and results in a world of unintended consequences. But like I wrote, it's a tricky bit of business. Yeah, you can clobber FG for playing around with all this nonsense in the future, you know to set an example, but in the here and now of the tourney its hard to find a fair answer for all the innocent teams effected, ie Canada, Honduras & Costa Rica. I've always thought that a 2-0 forfeit score + an additional 1 point penalty for the offender seemed like a better way to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 12 hours ago, Christian B. said: Well I see your point but if the nil-nil result stands between FG and Honduras I believe that mathematically we could still finish last in our group and be eliminated. No? Good point - I'd forgotten that was, at the time of typing, still mathematically possible. Although I believe maplebanana's math is correct that the most "likely" scenario for us to finish last is a 1-0 FG win over Costa Rica and then, with us entering the Honduras game knowing we just need a draw to win the group, somehow conspiring to lose 4-0. Even a 3-0 loss wouldn't do it in that scenario (although it would make our chance of a 3rd place qualification a lot more dicey). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 10 hours ago, Cheeta said: Yeah, you can clobber FG for playing around with all this nonsense in the future, you know to set an example, but in the here and now of the tourney its hard to find a fair answer for all the innocent teams effected, ie Canada, Honduras & Costa Rica, 3rd place finisher in Group B, 3rd place finisher in Group C. FYP, although it wasn't as substantial as I thought it would be. I was going to put in all the Caribbean nations that were eliminated against French Guiana + Malouda, but apparently he didn't actually play in Gold Cup qualifying. I've never followed the Caribbean cup before, but I went looking through the results, and apparently there is a giant qualifying, with 3 rounds, that determines the top 4 teams. Those 4 teams then play in the Caribbean Cup proper, and all 4 of those teams advance to the Gold Cup. Malouda played in the Caribbean Cup proper, not in qualifying, so I guess no teams were wronged in Gold Cup qualifying even if in fact he is an ineligible player. I guess Martinique could make the list though as an innocent team affected by this whole thing, because they lost to French Guiana + Malouda in the 3rd place game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 In tournaments like this you need to get stronger from match to match.. we need to continue that and we'll be fine. If we fall asleep we could be home and deservedly so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 I think tonight we should be cheering for a Curacao win against El Salvador. That would leave El Salvador with 0 points with one game remaining, which means they can't get to 4 points and knock us out of a potential 3rd place spot, and it would leave Curacao with 3 points with their game against Mexico remaining, which of course would be difficult for them to get a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 Gavin Day tweeted 15 minutes ago that a decision on Malouda-gate is expected a few hours from now as the disciplinary committee are currently meeting to discuss. The way the pundits were talking, I was expecting a decision within 30 minutes of the game concluding on Tuesday night. If they are taking a few hours to discuss and/or drafting really long reasons for their decision, it still suggests it will not be quite so open and shut. Although perhaps I should not be expecting efficiency on this front given the organization involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apbsmith Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Interesting headline and article..... "forges ahead". Article released only 2 hours ago. Still no official statement. http://www.goldcup.org/en/article/honduras-forges-ahead-at-gold-cup Beginning to think because of "the integrity of the tournament" lol, and no player eligibility protest 48 hours before the tourny, and Malouda not being removed from the roster. They will just leave everything the same, full "evaluation" after the tourny. Only for Fifa to rule Malouda eligible for FG, haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addona Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 3 hours ago, Kent said: I think tonight we should be cheering for a Curacao win against El Salvador. That would leave El Salvador with 0 points with one game remaining, which means they can't get to 4 points and knock us out of a potential 3rd place spot, and it would leave Curacao with 3 points with their game against Mexico remaining, which of course would be difficult for them to get a result. Even a tie would be good, since then for ES to get to 4 pts, they would need to beat Jamaica, and I suspect Jamaica will lose tonight as well, leaving them with 3 pts in that scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One American Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Sorry, I kind of enjoy the CONCACAF-ness of it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted July 14, 2017 Author Share Posted July 14, 2017 El Salvador up 2-0 at the half on Curacao, who missed a penalty late in the half after a Simone Zaza-like run-up (because it worked so well for him at the Euros). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Still no ruling on Malouda? Jesus. Seems like the legal argument at least made them think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince193 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 2 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said: Still no ruling on Malouda? Jesus. Seems like the legal argument at least made them think about it. Maybe Vic is like: "we will rule on it after the Gold Cup, and then is like we have concluded it was wrong and we will look into how to reprimand French Guiana at a later date." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopherbashi Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 6 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said: Still no ruling on Malouda? Jesus. Seems like the legal argument at least made them think about it. "in due time" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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