Jump to content

Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, Ansem said:

That's why this league will be much better than people anticipated and at a faster rate. Untapped talent that was ignored by MLS academies and/or thrown aside.

CPL will capture the rest and they are more likely to find more gems than MLS Academies

 

 

 

It really goes to show you that the 3 Canadian MLS clubs have little incentive to use and develop Canadian players because the quota is too low and the league overall discriminates against Canadians (because they are internationals on US teams) 

They will probably actually do worse now that they have to compete with CPL clubs for talent. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One professional team in all of Western Canada simply wasn't enough. Cant put full blame on the Whitecaps when realistically only 1 or 2 kids a year had a shot of making the big league. That's why this league is so important to the whole country. we've increased professional opportunities by about 900% when you factor in going from 4 pro clubs to 11, and adding to the percentage is the ratio of Canadians on CPL and USL clubs is crazy high. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The talent funnel was always too big.  It was trying to drink from a firehouse getting 1 development team at U14 or 15 for that big of an area.  There are literally tens of thousands of kids playing competitive soccer at that level.  So many were destined to slip between the cracks and in fact more slipped through than made it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wait, werent the Eddies in western canada??  Rollins may be from the east but he knows the Eddies (and their academy) existed right??  Davies was with edmonton first.....Saiko, Edwards, Paul Hamilton, Porter, Smits, Cox, Farago, Boaki, Shome, etc etc all had time on the Eddies as youngsters.  Lets not get too crazy here.  Vancouver was not the only team and did not have exclusive rights to western canada the last 8 years.  Things are bad with the whitecaps, but lets not throw the baby out with the bathwater.  The fact that a Calgary with some Van acadmey kids that couldnt make MLS beat the big squad is HISTORIC....but you cant deny that those kids did spend alot of time with VAN, and they helped them along.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This serves to prove that Canadian players can play though, we should hopefully now see Moreno of them with our teams because they just proved that they belong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Ansem said:

That's why this league will be much better than people anticipated and at a faster rate. Untapped talent that was ignored by MLS academies and/or thrown aside.

CPL will capture the rest and they are more likely to find more gems than MLS Academies

 

 

 

This is total nonsense and someone using a bad situation to grand stand and kick sand at the Whitecaps. 

Show me a high percentage of any academy in the MLS thats turning out MLS talent. Clearly res players for the most part are used as cheap stop gaps or depth players with 4 or 5 high paid players carrying the water in the MLS. Once the res players get a certain age they're spat out and you roll the dice on the next wave

You want to rag on the Caps, dont stop there. Rag on TFC, rag on the Impacts. What's the difference? In fact, I would be surprised if there were many at all if any MLS academies who have produced more players than the Whitecaps who are currently pulling a pay cheque to play football.

Clearly certain people have a hard on for the Whitecaps so today is a good day to yank it out but it doesn't change anything. I think it's good, let the haters show themselves 

Edited by SpursFlu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

This is total nonsense and someone using a bad situation to grand stand and kick sand at the Whitecaps. 

Show me a high percentage of any academy in the MLS thats turning out MLS talent. Clearly res players for the most part are used as cheap stop gaps or depth players with 4 or 5 high paid players carrying the water in the MLS. Once the res players get a certain age they're spat out and you roll the dice on the next wave

You want to rag on the Caps, dont stop there. Rag on TFC, rag on the Impacts. What's the difference? In fact, I would be surprised if there were many at all if any MLS academies who have produced more players than the Whitecaps who are currently pulling a pay cheque to play football.

Clearly certain people have a hard on for the Whitecaps so today is a good day to yank it out but it doesn't change anything. I think it's good, let the haters show themselves 

Personally, I don't care about the specifics and yes, TFC and Impact belonged there too

I care about results and this status quo since 2011 got us NOWHERE!

I don't want the status quo anymore so pointing out today's flaw should guide us to tomorrow's solution.

I'm glad CPL is here as I hope they will have enough influence to push talented players from their area so they get the proper look they deserve.

Nothing against the Caps or you, I'm just a sick and tired fan who have no patient reading about defending the status quo and doubling down on doing more of the same and expecting a different result.

Acknowledging what went wrong is the first step at fixing things and we have to wake up everyone including Soccer Canada that we have to end this lie that putting all our eggs into MLS academies and adverting them as la crème de la crème isn't real and does us a disservice collectively.

I think that was the point of his venting, we need change.

I swear to god, if I see an MLS heavy roster for the U23 Olympic qualifier and we fail to go to Tokyo, I will be this close to give up supporting the national program. I won't care anymore 

Edited by Ansem

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes thats the point of the CPL but you can't put the cart before the horse. I remember Vic on the radio talking up CPL and he said we appreciate the MLS teams but if anything we put too much on them. So what is the statement here... solving yesterday's problems today?

My point is when the **** gets flung around it disproportionately gets thrown at the Whitecaps and I'm in no mood today

 

TFC spent 18 million on 3 players and were good for 3 years. We get it  great.. now pound sand. Who have you produced? Ever? Let me answer the question....... nobody

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

Yes thats the point of the CPL but you can't put the cart before the horse. I remember Vic on the radio talking up CPL and he said we appreciate the MLS teams but if anything we put too much on them. So what is the statement here... solving yesterday's problems today?

My point is when the **** gets flung around it disproportionately gets thrown at the Whitecaps and I'm in no mood today

 

TFC spent 18 million on 3 players and were good for 3 years. We get it  great.. now pound sand. Who have you produced? Ever? Let me answer the question....... nobody

It's when I read Liam Millar saying that he went to Europe because he was told by TFC that he was too "short to succeed in football soccer, *cough* Messi *cough*, than you have to wonder how many more talented guys just flat out gave up over the years.

Sure, they aren't expected to be perfect and deserve appreciation but not absolution and no way should they be above criticism regarding the way they choose to do business. Did they do their best? Sure, I'll take their word that Canadian Soccer ALWAYS came first before their interests if it pleases you but am I allow tell it like it is???

Their way, simply isn't/wasn't good enough!!!

I mean Dos Santos himself said so after the 1st leg against Cavalry. "Mistakes in player's evaluation were made" he said... ya think???? That's a good step if it helps change their methods, no?

Like his tweet said, lots of / myths /preconceived notions got exposed, and he isn't wrong. You got beat at home, on home & away series that is forgiving for stronger teams,  by a 3 months old team made of guys you rejected / badly evaluated ... and I'm supposed to ignore that?

Can we be real for 1 second?

 

Edited by Ansem

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Spurs, now your just doing to TFC what they have been doing to Whitecaps this morning..I'll just give you one name you should recognize, Doniel Henry. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Spurs, now your just doing to TFC what they have been doing to Whitecaps this morning..I'll just give you one name you should recognize, Doniel Henry. 

 

Montreal --> Maxime Crepeau, Louis Beland-Goyette and others

Edited by Ansem

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Spurs, now your just doing to TFC what they have been doing to Whitecaps this morning..I'll just give you one name you should recognize, Doniel Henry. 

 

You get what you give in life

My actual opinion is im very proud of all 3 MLS academies. I think things are just getting rolling. Whenever these academies tournaments come up I think our 3 academies always punch above our weight. And I think theyre trying to play the right way. Of course we need more outlets and the CPL will eventually provide that

Last night had nothing to do with academies or developing players. It had to do with 2 things

1) CPL and Cavalry are no joke

2) MDS, love him, but he turned over an entire team and he brought in some duds. It's that simple and he pretty much admitted it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let’s not bag on the Whitecaps too much here.  The truth is that the Cavalry is a very well organized and coached team, especially defensively.  They are just a good team.  

They have been chewing up and spitting out the CPL this year and the Whitecaps were just next in line.  Nobody should be surprised if they tear through Montreal next.  Montreal barely got through a 4-5-5 York9 team yesterday, they’re not exactly playing great.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I think of all the grading categories you could give the CPL so far.. the highest grade would be standard of play. Ironically a huge reason for that is the MLS Academies. Even if you analyze HFX v Ottawa. HFX (sorry guys) for me is the worse team in the CPL and they hung with what is a better USL team

So what I'm saying is.. thank you MLS Academies for developing these players and thank you CPL for giving them somewhere to play

Edited by SpursFlu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

I think off all the grading categories you could give the CPL so far.. the highest grade would be standard of play. Ironically a huge reason for that is the MLS Academies. Even if you analyze HFX v Ottawa. HFX (sorry guys) for me is the worse team in the CPL and they hung with what is a better USL team

So what I'm saying is.. thank you MLS Academies for developing these players and thank you CPL for giving them somewhere to play

This was my take when reading Duane's rant as well. How does pointing out that the Whitecaps developed a bunch of good players prove that they're not good at developing players? What sort of logic is that? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is a shame that such a great day for CPL turned into a punch up here on player development. Can we please just celebrate?

"Cupsets" happen all the time. They don't prove anything. But I think it is fair to say that these three VCup outcomes combined show that the level of play in CPL is a lot stronger than most anticipated.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Aird25 said:

This was my take when reading Duane's rant as well. How does pointing out that the Whitecaps developed a bunch of good players prove that they're not good at developing players? What sort of logic is that? 

I'm read it as an accusation of underachieving potential.  Perhaps trying to emphasize a lack of patience or insight in the players who are by their current play suggesting they should never have been discarded from the 'Caps development program?  Players who will now never, ever, really achieve what they might have because they've missed the most vital years of their development, again, because the 'Caps develpment programs didn't feel they where worth the investment and cast them aside for other development opportunities.  

And I also believe it's being asked who, exactly, were or are those other development opportunities.  

Because as it stands, those other development opportunities aren't anywhere near close enough to being able to bring the 'Caps into the next round of the Vs Cup in spite of the massive financial advantages of their organization.  It's not as they say, a good look.          

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, Cheeta said:

I'm read it as an accusation of underachieving potential.  Perhaps trying to emphasize a lack of patience or insight in the players who are by their current play suggesting they should never have been discarded from the 'Caps development program?  Players who will now never, ever, really achieve what they might have because they've missed the most vital years of their development, again, because the 'Caps develpment programs didn't feel they where worth the investment and cast them aside for other development opportunities.  

 And I also believe it's being asked who, exactly, were or are those other development opportunities.  

Because as it stands, those other development opportunities aren't anywhere near close enough to being able to bring the 'Caps into the next round of the Vs Cup in spite of the massive financial advantages of their organization.  It's not as they say, a good look.          

That's all a hell of a leap for me. Yes, the 'Caps are in the dumps right now, but getting beat by a solid team that has a few of your past academy players isn't enough to assume all of that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hell of a leap?

A three month old Cavalry with 10% of the 'Caps player budget is on to the next round of Vs Cup whilst a last place 10 year old MLS ' side's greatest claim to fame is a 16 year old player they picked up 2 years ago from Edmonton?

Oh, go on.  Tell us another.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
On 7/18/2019 at 11:43 PM, SpursFlu said:

I get TSN doesnt have to fall head over heels for CPL but acting as if it doesn't exist just proves the conspiracy theories or that there is unnecessary politics at play

 

Instead they play ridiculous American talking head sportatainment shows yammering on about anything but sport and perpetuating American political angst and demographic stereotypes thru professional sports. They should be ashamed of themselves 

 

Why not instead produce a simple 30 minute magazine style show featuring all things Canadian soccer covering MLS, CPL, Canadians abroad. Do the same for Basketball or other sports

Like others have pointed out, I wouldn’t put it in the realm of conspiracy when it comes to TSN not producing a show. However, I would think it’s a conspiracy theory if TSN didn’t include the Voyageurs Cup games that involved both CPL/MLS clubs during SportsCentre, so I ask, were there highlights Thursday morning? 

Edit: Just checked the website and looks like they did....but  I didn't like the guy's tone when he kept pronouncing "Cavalry" like it was the most awkward thing to say in his life....but it's something at the very least.

Edited by Macksam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it is a bit harsh to totally rag on VWC for their development structure, as developing players from their early teens into the pros is incredibly difficult in any sport. They have definitely made the effort and had Whitecaps II for a bit there. I think the issue comes on pulling the trigger on actually entrusting first team minutes.

I think that they and TFC both (do not pay any attention to the Impact to be able to comment) have a tendency to discard some of their academy developed or signed talent for fringe MLS talent players from the US or beyond. This is the frustrating part to me. Why did the soon to be released Terrance Boyd get minutes at all when TFC had Hamilton or other young Canadian attacking options? Why did VWC sign a mediocre over 30's defender from Switzerland (Scott Sutter) when I am sure their was a young Canadian who could play the role (Kadin Chung)? The argument is probably that they are proven players, but proven mediocre or worse does not justify not giving them minutes. This is the development gap and the CPL will hopefully close it, as many Canadians will now have proven pro minutes and game tape. 

The other aspect of the problem, which is general to all sports, are the clear issues in development and bias/socioeconomic factors. I am more familiar with hockey, as a player, coach, and scout, but certain points should apply to both. Hockey in Canada is incredibly inefficient at developing players. Firstly, early streaming leads young kids who have developed physically quicker (size bias) to get greater attention. The early streaming can also just leave kids, who have more talent behind, and they never catch up. The best player I grew up playing with/against, NHL star Jamie Benn, would never have been considered a top 10 player in his age bracket on the island until he was 17-18. This is primarily because he was small. Secondly, wealth is also a factor. The kids who can afford the fancy camps and academies are more likely. The kid who needs a high school job, not so much. Not easy issue to fix, but hopefully having the CPL and a league 1 BC will at least give more chances to be seen. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...