CPL General

[masster]

2 hours ago, C2SKI said:

Do people think that the players being signed could earn more in other leagues, or is this a realistic assessment of the market value of our domestic pool? I don’t think it makes sense to pay players more than they would earn elsewhere. I think wages should grow according to the level of talent and support

As of now, I would say no. A decent percentage of the players signed so far were not even playing pro soccer last year. So they will be getting more in 2019 than they were in 2018.

Edited December 13, 2018 by masster

[Gopherbashi]

7 hours ago, masster said:

Some nice tidbits of CPL info from the AJ Jakubec interview on TSN 1200 in Ottawa (starts at 21:20):
https://www.tsn.ca/radio/ottawa-1200-1.1225738

Bob Young is the money behind the HFX Wanderers as well as Forge FC. He will most likely be the money behind Kitchener/Waterloo as well for 2020.

CPL Salaries being offered are in the $30-35K range with no housing compared to the $60-70K with some housing that was the average in Ottawa last year.

CPL has been telling players and agents for a while not to sign in Ottawa because they would not be sanctioned.

My take: Which means if the CPL knew ahead of time, then Ottawa should have known ahead of time as well. This wasn't really a surprise for them. I can't blame the CPL for using this as a negotiating tactic with players either, because JDG has been telling Canadian players not to sign with the CPL because the playing level would be too low.

There were some high-priced players on loan from Montreal who were being paid by Montreal though, correct?  That could drag the "average" up quite substantially.

$65k x 22 players = $1.43m, for those keeping track.

[Macksam]

I guess the kits will be released next week or tomorrow?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVL6807f9h8

 

[Dub Narcotic]

14 hours ago, Initial B said:

I am furious that Montigliani would choose such a ham-fisted approach to dealing with one single team. Is the CPL is that dire straits that they can't survive without one team!? I'm positive that the Fury would be joining the league in either 2019 or 2020 when they get their share of the USL expansion fees. Monty didn't have to do this unless he feels the CPL won't survive for two years if the Fury aren't on board. This strikes me as punitive ego-salving of a suitor who is butt-hurt over their desired date turning them down for the dance to go to another one. The Canadian MLS clubs can't be too happy with this either as it will provide precedent to force them to move to the CPL. I'm sure that they will provide under-the-table backing to any legal challenge the Fury raise.

The Fury's response.

 

I generally agree with you, but it's the timing that's the issue. If CONCACAF was going to do this, which they are in their rights to do, give the Fury one year's notice to move, don't do it when both they and their respective leagues have starting preparing seriously for their respective seasons.

[rob.notenboom]

Interestingly, USSF just finalized their approval of sanctioning of the Fury over the last couple days as was reported in the Times-Colonist. And then it was to go to CONCACAF. That’s a pretty slow process. You’d think they’d want to move it along a little bit for all involved. 

[Complete Homer]

47 minutes ago, Dub Narcotic said:

I generally agree with you, but it's the timing that's the issue. If CONCACAF was going to do this, which they are in their rights to do, give the Fury one year's notice to move, don't do it when both they and their respective leagues have starting preparing seriously for their respective seasons.

Concacaf claims they told Canada Soccer months ago that they were not going to give the Fury another year of exceptional standing.

Which adds a whole other bizarre twist to this, especially when you remember that Pugh is on the CSA board. Was there a miscommunication between CONCACAF and the CSA? Did the CSA fail to pass along the warning to the Fury, despite Pugh's involvement? If so, was it incompetence or malice? Or did Goudie think CONCACAF was bluffing and is now trying to sell a different story to the media?

Hard to say. Sandor is saying he is getting opposite and contradictory stories from multiple sides, which to me either indicates gross incompetence at communication among all parties, or someone is getting creative with the truth

[Bison44]

13 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

Concacaf claims they told Canada Soccer months ago that they were not going to give the Fury another year of exceptional standing.

Which adds a whole other bizarre twist to this, especially when you remember that Pugh is on the CSA board. Was there a miscommunication between CONCACAF and the CSA? Did the CSA fail to pass along the warning to the Fury, despite Pugh's involvement? If so, was it incompetence or malice? Or did Goudie think CONCACAF was bluffing and is now trying to sell a different story to the media?

Hard to say. Sandor is saying he is getting opposite and contradictory stories from multiple sides, which to me either indicates gross incompetence at communication among all parties, or someone is getting creative with the truth

This is CONCACAF so nothing would surprise me.

[Gopherbashi]

47 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

This is CONCACAF so nothing would surprise me.

I think we all know that it's sitting in someone's junk mail folder somewhere.

[Bison44]

7 minutes ago, Gopherbashi said:

I think we all know that it's sitting in someone's junk mail folder somewhere.

 

THE MAIL STRIKE!!!  BLAME THE POST OFFICE!

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

1 hour ago, Bison44 said:

This is CONCACAF so nothing would surprise me.

Why say nothing back in September if that's really the case? Maybe they made clear that no new exceptions would be allowed, but the CSA assumed the existing pro teams would be grandfathered in given it's not clear why the emergence of CanPL as a D1 league in CSA sanctioning terms would only exclude the Fury. If it's only the Fury that now have an equivalent league then CONCACAF appear to be viewing CanPL as a D2 league, which may not please Bob Young and co unless of course this is also about to go thermonuclear where the MLS teams are concerned...

Edited December 14, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[Bison44]

I doubt CONCACAF will mess with MLS, ie) the other examples of exceptions/precedence (wales) match up better with the 3 CDN MLS teams situation.  Maybe if CPL grows in leaps and bounds over the next 10 years.  But who cares what the classification is called, D-1 vs D-2 etc??  CPL to USL appears to be close enough for CONCACAF to call it equivalent.   TFC2 dropping to USL2 (or whatever they call it) maybe saved them from being in the same boat as the fury, or maybe they look at "farm team" second squad clubs differently. 

Its  definitely a schmoooozle.  I cant imagine anyone is too happy about it.  CPL want Ottawa to come over on their own, and Ottawa dont want to be forced into anything.  Personally, seeing us Voyageurs tear each other up, Fury fans vs CPL and visa versa really kills my excitement about the way CDN soccer was heading.  I dont want the CPL to start under a cloud of legal problems, and I dont want Ottawa fans cursing the CPL.  

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Same old same old, basically. Thirty years ago it was the top existing NSL clubs that were being messed around when they failed to comply with the favoured masterplan from on high and a lot of hard core soccer people in southern Ontario were alienated by all the absurd squabbling over it.

It's crazy in optics terms to try to force a reluctant existing club into a league they clearly don't want to be in. Victor Montagliani needs to take a long hard look at whether this is all more of an ego trip rather than what's really best for soccer.

[Watchmen]

40 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

But who cares what the classification is called, D-1 vs D-2 etc?? 

I know you've got nearly 2000 posts, but you must be new to this board.  

[dyslexic nam]

7 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Why say nothing back in September if that's really the case? Maybe they made clear that no new exceptions would be allowed, but the CSA assumed the existing pro teams would be grandfathered in given it's not clear why the emergence of CanPL as a D1 league in CSA sanctioning terms would only exclude the Fury. If it's only the Fury that now have an equivalent league then CONCACAF appear to be viewing CanPL as a D2 league, which may not please Bob Young and co unless of course this is also about to go thermonuclear where the MLS teams are concerned...

Lol.  Anything to get in your narrative, right?  You can be such a dick.

 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Worth noting that Steven Sandor pointed out something very similar on the11.ca:

https://the11.ca/concacafs-attempt-to-clarify-the-fury-situation-only-serves-to-muddy-the-waters/

...And, then, with the Canadian Premier League being considered Division 1, does CONCACAF now need to explain why the three Canadian MLS teams do fit the “exceptional circumstance” criteria and the Fury does not?

And, if CONCACAF advised the CSA in the fall that it did not see the “exceptional circumstances” clause being met, why did Canada Soccer approve the Fury deal and then plan to kick it up to CONCACAF, anyway?

so it's more a case of stating the blindingly obvious. Are you going to direct infantile playground level abuse towards Steven Sandor as well?

Edited December 14, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[dyslexic nam]

Steve doesn't have a long history of being a dick.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Welcome to my ignore list. If you cannot behave like an adult you forfeit the right to be taken seriously. 

[dyslexic nam]

Lol.  You have been on mine for months.  It is just that I occasionally make the error of judgement to "show this post".  Turns out you are still a dick.

 

EDIT:  You are right, that is juvenile.  You are a penis.

Edited December 14, 2018 by dyslexic nam

[Unnamed Trialist]

26 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

Steve doesn't have a long history of being a dick.

If you feel that way you should just ignore instead of revealing yourself to be so logically incoherent: you are basically saying you disagree on the basis of who says what,  not what they say. Which means nobody can expect to be honest with you ever.

It's better to ignore on the board than having to behave so poorly. 

[dyslexic nam]

7 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

If you feel that way you should just ignore instead of revealing yourself to be so logically incoherent: you are basically saying you disagree on the basis of who says what,  not what they say. Which means nobody can expect to be honest with you ever.

It's better to ignore on the board than having to behave so poorly. 

Yeah, it is a good thing you have never insulted anyone on this board.

[Unnamed Trialist]

5 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

Yeah, it is a good thing you have never insulted anyone on this board.

I'm widely ignored as well. 

If you think me calling you logically incoherent in this particular case is insulting you can ignore me too.

What's surprising is that you post well and coherently most of the time and I agree with most. 

[dyslexic nam]

Yeah, won't bother taking it further.  I just need to actually ignore those I have on ignore.

Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

[juicy sushi]

On a completely unrelated note, does anyone know if the CPL have decided to contract with Opta or other data companies to get teams access to modern tools like tracking data and analytics to help develop the game as the league grows, or is this thing going fir stone age passhun and proper football men? 

[deschamp86]

32 minutes ago, juicy sushi said:

On a completely unrelated note, does anyone know if the CPL have decided to contract with Opta or other data companies to get teams access to modern tools like tracking data and analytics to help develop the game as the league grows, or is this thing going fir stone age passhun and proper football men? 

They had Kinduct performing testing for the Open Tryouts, so they appear to be pro-analytics. However I don't know if anything has been announced going forward

[zen]

On 12/11/2018 at 8:02 PM, Keegan said:

I'm sorry but you are misunderstanding me once again.  I've never been arguing that the level is "good", I'm saying that it isn't simply a level that you can write off as semi-pro and call it a day.  In fact, I said it was perhaps closer to lower USL level i.e. TFC II level and have never called it good - wafflecone90 did maybe you're confused.

There is no flaw in my logic to say that the teams have competed in the tournament while also saying that it's a cake walk to qualify?   Of course you can't use one year to show results but the fact is they have only lost by more than 1 goal twice in the past 7 years in all their matches in the CWC as far as I can tell (correct me if I'm wrong please).  Does that mean the league is "good"? No, and I never said that but it shows that the champions competed obviously and can't be simply written off, players move on from the league and players get called to the NZ national team.  So they may be on to something here.. 

 

Thank you for once again clarifying. Maybe it's my fault for not understanding your position, but perhaps you could be more clear going forward? 

I believe that the results have been 1 or 2 goals at most, which is as amazing achievement. The problem I have with looking at results alone is that they don't say much about the performance, no matter how consistent the results have been, after all as I said you can put 10 men behind the ball and make it very hard for the other team to play against you. I don't think that's the kind of performance any team should aspire to but clearly it can work.

Yeah absolutely they've found their niche and they're making it work for them. I think the CPL should do the same in that regard and I think they could be just as if not more successful.