CPL General

[Rheo]

AL-Classico write up in regards to the CPL movement in Edmonton

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/edmonton-professional-soccer-canadian-premier-league-1.4643643

[mpg_29]

2 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

 

 

Interesting that there is a team in Niagara...as there is also one in NBLC...

Summer league though... My guess is basketball would be bigger competition for CPL than CFL in terms of newer generation Canadians. Hopefully at some point they merge with NBLC and stick with winter schedule..

[toontownman]

They will likely get a good portion of the rush crowd into those basketball games. Will be a very similar production/atmosphere and experience that has meant sell out games for the rush. 

Not sure where that places a CPL club in Saskatoon seeing as Lee was supposed to be a big part of that too. At best it's annoying they got the step up in announcing it first. 

[Complete Homer]

35 minutes ago, toontownman said:

At best it's annoying they got the step up in announcing it first. 

Can't speak to the Saskatoon market specifically, but after clicking around a but the reaction to this seems pretty muted, especially compared to the official CPL rollout. 

It's annoying that they are getting the first word out there in some markets, but I think CPL's buildup was much more effective. This seems a little rushed

[mpg_29]

But really though...what are the odds that a new pro basketball league is launching at very same time with similar season as the CPL...

I'm only slightly concerned in the sense that observing the NBLC this season the economics of pro basketball are just different for a couple of reasons. Meaning cheaper tickets.

ie family of 4 looks at $15 basketball tickets vs $25 soccer tickets...

[Kent]

OK, so the announcement was about basketball rather than soccer. Let's not start talking about how the CEBL is somehow going to kill CPL.

8 days, 2 hours, 16 minutes until the next CPL club announcement.

[mpg_29]

10 minutes ago, Kent said:

OK, so the announcement was about basketball rather than soccer. Let's not start talking about how the CEBL is somehow going to kill CPL.

8 days, 2 hours, 16 minutes until the next CPL club announcement.

Not saying it will kill it but they will be just be more competition for casuals/families in some markets. At least on weekends..

Why I always harp on here about importance of ticket prices.

Edited May 2, 2018 by mpg_29

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

25 minutes ago, mpg_29 said:

But really though...what are the odds that a new pro basketball league is launching at very same time with similar season as the CPL...

Days before the CSA AGM, which is the only time new members get accepted into membership. Seriously doubt that's a concidence given there is scope for there being both CEBL and CanPL teams in up to four of the six markets involved and the other two CEBL cities would be relatively easy driving distance from probable CanPL locations. The advantage basketball has in setting up quickly is that the arenas needed are in very much in place, so there aren't all the issues associated with getting municipalities to sign off on new pop-up stadium builds. The summer season format will probably be to avoid most of the conversion costs associated with sharing with junior hockey in the winter months.

[Gian-Luca]

I don't know if this is basketball league is making news in places like Guelph or Niagara but I've been deliberately searching for media coverage of this new league announcement and haven't found it yet on the national news outlets like CBC, TSN or Sportsnet. Basketball wise everything is swamped with Raptors coverage. If that ends up being typical of the media coverage they'll get, I suspect this league won't affect potential CPL attendance (at least the CPL's announcements have been getting mainstream media coverage).

[Complete Homer]

15 minutes ago, Gian-Luca said:

I don't know if this is basketball league is making news in places like Guelph or Niagara but I've been deliberately searching for media coverage of this new league announcement and haven't found it yet on the national news outlets like CBC, TSN or Sportsnet. Basketball wise everything is swamped with Raptors coverage. If that ends up being typical of the media coverage they'll get, I suspect this league won't affect potential CPL attendance (at least the CPL's announcements have been getting mainstream media coverage).

Looks like most franchises were announced in fall of 2017 and got local news coverage and one CBC article but mostly silent since. Didn't seem to get much traction but who knows

I know a lot of people don't like Larson but he's probably been a big part of CPL being much less fringe than it had potential to be. 

Edited May 2, 2018 by Complete Homer

[matty]

1 hour ago, mpg_29 said:

Not saying it will kill it but they will be just be more competition for casuals/families in some markets. At least on weekends..

Why I always harp on here about importance of ticket prices.

the other bball league is a fickle draw and Cpl ownership so far has a fuck ton of money hence why they've gotten better press and had a better launch (twice). in addition basketball, while more easily digestible than soccer, is a sport with a very high bar for being watchable, like you know when basketball is totally shitty, so i'm doubtful it has anywhere near the potential of the cpl.

[Complete Homer]

16 minutes ago, matty said:

the other bball league is a fickle draw and Cpl ownership so far has a fuck ton of money hence why they've gotten better press and had a better launch (twice). in addition basketball, while more easily digestible than soccer, is a sport with a very high bar for being watchable, like you know when basketball is totally shitty, so i'm doubtful it has anywhere near the potential of the cpl.

Potential is a key word though. Even if CEBL only attracts 1500 people to each game, how many would have considered going to a CPL game instead? 

Not being doom and gloom, but I don't think you can discount the competition 

[mpg_29]

11 minutes ago, matty said:

the other bball league is a fickle draw and Cpl ownership so far has a fuck ton of money hence why they've gotten better press and had a better launch (twice). in addition basketball, while more easily digestible than soccer, is a sport with a very high bar for being watchable, like you know when basketball is totally shitty, so i'm doubtful it has anywhere near the potential of the cpl.

I agree that CPL has shown more ambition to be "bigger" than either of these basketball leagues.

I think with regards to the NBLC it knows what it is. It's a scrappy upstart and them operating in 100K-500K pop markets and lack of expansion west is deliberate on their part so far. You don't have to build a certain perception through marketing if you are only targeting small markets that are just happy to have a pro sports team that you can watch for cheap.

Pro basketball has a lot of advantages though. Significantly lower costs and glut of American talent.

[matty]

22 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

Potential is a key word though. Even if CEBL only attracts 1500 people to each game, how many would have considered going to a CPL game instead? 

Not being doom and gloom, but I don't think you can discount the competition 

i'm not discounting at all but i'm saying the concern here is being overblown when you look at the way both projects are going and both sports as well.

15 minutes ago, mpg_29 said:

I agree that CPL has shown more ambition to be "bigger" than either of these basketball leagues.

I think with regards to the NBLC it knows what it is. It's a scrappy upstart and them operating in 100K-500K pop markets and lack of expansion west is deliberate on their part so far. You don't have to build a certain perception through marketing if you are only targeting small markets that are just happy to have a pro sports team that you can watch for cheap.

Pro basketball has a lot of advantages though. Significantly lower costs and glut of American talent.

It also has a smaller player pool to pull from for talent. Like I said bad basketball is easy to notice.

[DoyleG]

53 minutes ago, Complete Homer said:

Potential is a key word though. Even if CEBL only attracts 1500 people to each game, how many would have considered going to a CPL game instead? 

Not being doom and gloom, but I don't think you can discount the competition 

They just keep repeating the idea that basketball works in the summer in Canada.

It doesn't.

[toontownman]

The difference in presentation, production is leagues apart from until look. As mentioned it won't make much of a difference to the CPL imo.

[Jason]

4 hours ago, Complete Homer said:

Can't speak to the Saskatoon market specifically, but after clicking around a but the reaction to this seems pretty muted, especially compared to the official CPL rollout. 

It's annoying that they are getting the first word out there in some markets, but I think CPL's buildup was much more effective. This seems a little rushed

There is a history of summer pro basketball in Canada.  In the early 90's, the World Basketball League played and had some level of success in places like Saskatoon, Winnipeg, Calgary, and Halifax.  I remember attending the very first Saskatchewan Storm game in 1990.  It was a sellout of over 8000 at what was then called SaskPlace (they've since expanded the seating).   It was a weird league with a height restriction and was mostly bankrolled by a guy who ended up in prison for shady dealings in his non-sports businesses, which essentially ended the league.  Some of the teams tried to make a go of it in a Canadian only summer league, but I think it only lasted a couple of years.

But realistically, this was over 25 years ago.  These cities have all changed substantially in population and demographics.  So it's tough to say whether that history is relevant.  Just like decades old pro soccer failures in Canadian cities are not really indicative of those cities as they are now.

[LAK]

7 minutes ago, Jason said:

There is a history of summer pro basketball in Canada.  In the early 90's, the World Basketball League played and had some level of success in places like Saskatoon, Winnipeg, Calgary, and Halifax.  I remember attending the very first Saskatchewan Storm game in 1990.  It was a sellout of over 8000 at what was then called SaskPlace (they've since expanded the seating).   It was a weird league with a height restriction and was mostly bankrolled by a guy who ended up in prison for shady dealings in his non-sports businesses, which essentially ended the league.  Some of the teams tried to make a go of it in a Canadian only summer league, but I think it only lasted a couple of years.

But realistically, this was over 25 years ago.  These cities have all changed substantially in population and demographics.  So it's tough to say whether that history is relevant.  Just like decades old pro soccer failures in Canadian cities are not really indicative of those cities as they are now.

"Storm Warning!" I had season tickets for the Storm. I loved it. I was University student and worked lawn care in summer. It was a great summer with great memories. I loved watching guys like Chris Gatlin and Flying Bryan Pollard.

Trey Lyles who now plays for the Denver Nuggets of the NBA and was born in Saskatoon, is the son of Thomas Lyles a guy from Kentucky who played briefly for the Storm...he ended up staying cuz he met a girl (Trey's mom). 

[Jason]

39 minutes ago, LAK said:

"Storm Warning!" I had season tickets for the Storm. I loved it. I was University student and worked lawn care in summer. It was a great summer with great memories. I loved watching guys like Chris Gatlin and Flying Bryan Pollard.

Trey Lyles who now plays for the Denver Nuggets of the NBA and was born in Saskatoon, is the son of Thomas Lyles a guy from Kentucky who played briefly for the Storm...he ended up staying cuz he met a girl (Trey's mom). 

I was in university also and while I didn't have season tickets, I was regularly in attendance.  Those games were great fun and showed even back then there was a market for a summer spectator sport in Saskatoon.  With the exception of some very low level minor league baseball, nobody else has ever really tried since.  And the city has grown a lot in 25 years.

I liked Pollard but I was a bit more of a fan of Mario Donaldson, Jeffty Connelly, and Donald Petties.  Wow, those are some old names that I have not thought about in a long time...

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

4 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

I don't know if this is basketball league is making news in places like Guelph or Niagara but I've been deliberately searching for media coverage of this new league announcement and haven't found it yet on the national news outlets like CBC, TSN or Sportsnet....

It seems to be getting some coverage now despite the lack of a GTA or Montreal team:

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/basketball/nba/mike-morreale-canadian-elite-basketball-1.4645061

https://www.tsn.ca/football-s-mike-morreale-heads-up-new-canadian-elite-basketball-league-1.1074159

...Morreale said the CEBL will borrow from both the CFL and Major League Soccer.

"We settled on a structure that we believe can be strong in the short-term and the long-term, with a corporate model similar to the MLS when they started where the league will operate the six territories and really be completely funded," he said.

Under a corporate structure, Canadian Basketball Ventures, the league will foot the bill for everything from ticketing platforms, to national sponsorships, to marketing.

"It's a multimillion dollar investment, because that allows you to do this properly," Morreale said. "If we're going to do it, we're going to do it right . . . and really create a playbook for our local territories to thrive and be successful with the support from head office at every turn."...

https://www.tsn.ca/radio/hamilton-1150/morreale-we-are-bringing-professional-basketball-to-canada-in-a-big-way-1.1073979

[matty]

1 minute ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

It seems to be getting some coverage now despite the lack of a GTA or Montreal team:

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/basketball/nba/mike-morreale-canadian-elite-basketball-1.4645061

https://www.tsn.ca/football-s-mike-morreale-heads-up-new-canadian-elite-basketball-league-1.1074159

...Morreale said the CEBL will borrow from both the CFL and Major League Soccer.

"We settled on a structure that we believe can be strong in the short-term and the long-term, with a corporate model similar to the MLS when they started where the league will operate the six territories and really be completely funded," he said.

Under a corporate structure, Canadian Basketball Ventures, the league will foot the bill for everything from ticketing platforms, to national sponsorships, to marketing.

"It's a multimillion dollar investment, because that allows you to do this properly," Morreale said. "If we're going to do it, we're going to do it right . . . and really create a playbook for our local territories to thrive and be successful with the support from head office at every turn."...

https://www.tsn.ca/radio/hamilton-1150/morreale-we-are-bringing-professional-basketball-to-canada-in-a-big-way-1.1073979

I feel people over hype this style of press. it's not that hard to generate a hot one off news day (we've seen outlets like the Star, Post and Globe all cover start-up leagues that went no where or amounted to little) but it is hard to get regular coverage when you have very little the way the CPL was able to for several years. Let the basketball league have more details come forward before acting like it's the new threat (it isn't).

I would be more concerned about a pro rugby league starting up personally.

[LAK]

47 minutes ago, Jason said:

I was in university also and while I didn't have season tickets, I was regularly in attendance.  Those games were great fun and showed even back then there was a market for a summer spectator sport in Saskatoon.  With the exception of some very low level minor league baseball, nobody else has ever really tried since.  And the city has grown a lot in 25 years.

I liked Pollard but I was a bit more of a fan of Mario Donaldson, Jeffty Connelly, and Donald Petties.  Wow, those are some old names that I have not thought about in a long time...

I couldn't remember those names when I posted earlier...Mario Donaldson used to go to my church when he played there. Remember our Drake...what was his name?

Sorry, this is off topic a bit. Uhmm...yes, it was always a good market, it was always the leagues that they were in that were iffy. Saskatchewan supports professional sports if it's done right.

[Rheo]

Come on now Matty, there's no way ever that anyone would overreact or underreact in either a positive or negative direction based on one piece of information on this board  

[matty]

2 minutes ago, Rheo said:

Come on now Matty, there's no way ever that anyone would overreact or underreact in either a positive or negative direction based on one piece of information on this board  

ehhhhh most of the over reactions were based on 2 or more things

[DoyleG]

The only person that seems to be making a deal out of this is Dalla Costa, and his comments seem to do more with his disdain with rest of the NBL (except his beloved Lightening) than thinking with any clarity.