CPL General

[SkuseisLoose]

I don’t know that much about how these tv deals work and all that. But I’m guessing it will be on some sort of local tv for example Shaw users in Vancouver have this channel where it shows local sports such as the Vancouver Canadians and local high schools sports for their sports part but generallly shows random news from different countries. It’s definitely not amazing but it might be a place to start.

[matty]

13 hours ago, mpg_29 said:

It's personal preference whether to stream or watch on TV. But ultimately it comes down to the general production quality. If its good you can watch it on any device, if it sucks then it won't matter what you watch it on.

For instance one issue I can see is some of the smaller stadiums resulting in a poor(low) camera angle. It might not seem like a big deal but try watching full games when you are nearly eye-level with the field. 

Simple stuff like this impacts how watchable it is. And ultimately a lot hinges on how watchable this will be from home.

It'll likely be lowish quality to start if they're paying for production. A cheap broadcast will run at least $25k so I suspect they're paying between $40-75k a game which is OK but not great. I'd say similar to USL broadcast quality whether on TV or online.

[matty]

6 hours ago, admin said:

Would I want CanPL on prime time TV on CBC? TSN?  Ect... of course I would. 

But you have to buy that time, and that will cost too much money. 

You can say it's the best of both worlds ect.... but that's not the reality

 

What about TLN? Included in most basic packages and in 5 million homes and they're, to my knowledge, still looking for programs that fit their recent rebrand and also soccer friendly.

Don't forget local channels like CHCH and CHEK who somehow have a lot of reach.

I see those guys doing a free TV deal where the CPL only has to cover production.

Would you want those guys?

I know I've gone over this dozens of times but streaming still has a long way to go to be worth it. Unless you're eSports or pro wrestling, it can't be your only platform at the current time.

Edited April 11, 2018 by matty

[Guest]

4 hours ago, CDNFootballer said:

CPL won't have those $ initially from expansion fees so they are best to set minimum requirements for CPL clubs and seek out a national TV or streaming deal.

Expansion fees => franchises = barrier to entry = BAD!

They had better not have expansion fees. That would be a fatal mistake. Instead, they need to be welcoming every potential team with open arms.

[matty]

11 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

Expansion fees => franchises = barrier to entry = BAD!

They had better not have expansion fees. That would be a fatal mistake. Instead, they need to be welcoming every potential team with open arms.

Said fees may very well be needed to keep the league going.

[Gopherbashi]

2 minutes ago, matty said:

Said fees may very well be needed to keep the league going.

I don't think the league will be in a position to turn down any sources of revenue.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, matty said:

Said fees may very well be needed to keep the league going.

If the business model is a pyramid scheme then that will be a problem! New teams cannot be asked to fund the losses of existing teams. That will never work and I cannot believe that is the plan.

[matty]

Just now, Gopherbashi said:

I don't think the league will be in a position to turn down any sources of revenue.

I agree which makes the anti fee stance weird to me. Those fees could very well be the best thing for the league while it stabilises 

[matty]

4 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

If the business model is a pyramid scheme then that will be a problem! New teams cannot be asked to fund the losses of existing teams. That will never work and I cannot believe that is the plan.

i agree it's possibly a scheme but sadly we might be in a culture where you need to do that for it to work out. it's also a bet on soccer being a major hit which could be a risk (both are like MLS)

Edited April 11, 2018 by matty

[Tigers]

You wouldn't expect equity in a business without buying in. Expansion fees go towards those that took the risk and put in the time and work to get it going. 

[Bison44]

10 hours ago, matty said:

Said fees may very well be needed to keep the league going.

Long time no see Matty!!  I would hate to see a FEE keeping potential investors/owners from getting involved.  It seems like they are having enough problems already.  If its low enough not to spook a team will it be enough to make a difference to the other clubs??  And after the initial 6-8 clubs for next year, are there going to be many more deep pocket, big market soccer hotspots that are not already in the league??  I just cant see places like KW, Moncton or Fraser Valley etc (potential second wave teams) buying in for year two for a couple million dollars.  

MLS has boomed and there is a high demand to get into the league from all parts of the US.  And the fees have gone up exponentially.  TFC got into MLS for 10 million (double what the initial buy in in 90's), VWC was 35 just a few years later and NYC got hosed for 100mil.  I cant see that happening up here.  

[Shortdutchcanuck]

Expansion fees are an important source of revenue and sign of commitment for any league.  CPL will have to vet potential owners/expansion bids very carefully.  A solid base of stable teams is more important than numbers.  You don't want a constantly reshaped league with an annual carousel of new teams joining and others folding.  Expansion should be slow, careful, and new owners should be required to make a significant financial commitment.  

I think A League in Australia is our closest comparison and they started with 8 and now have 10.  That seems to be their sustainable # (although 1 is in New Zealand).  We already have 3 MLS teams so expecting to be able to support 20 or so more CPL teams seems overly ambitious to me in the near future.  We have a bigger population base than Australia but not by that much.

I'd rather have 8 to 12 longterm franchises where most draw 8000-15000 and can afford to steadily improve the quality of the league than 16-20 where teams fold every year and half of them draw a couple thousand.

I would also note that Australia's Tier 2 is a bunch of semi-pro regional leagues rather than a national Division 2.  Also no promotion/relegation.  As optimistic as I am for the CPL as a national league, I can't imagine a CPL Division 2 ever working on a national level.  The travel expenses would be too much for a Division 2 team in Ontario to take road trips out west.  A Division 2 team in Kelowna can't afford to fly its players to the Maritimes for an away game.  

I think eventually you'll see four or so leagues similar to L1O effectively becoming our D2.  But the top end of those leagues will eventually be fully professional and the bottom semi-pro.  Similar to Regionalliga in Germany. Possibly you could still have pro/rel where bottom in CPL drops down to its closest D2 league and through a playoff the best D2 team in Canada moves up.  But I doubt that owners will be as willing to invest in CPL teams with that relegation possibility so I have my doubts.

[Kent]

Yeah, I'm going to have to side with the pro expansion fee crowd. If you can't afford the expansion fee, the league probably doesn't want you as an owner anyways.

[Kent]

19 hours ago, admin said:

Mildly hyperbolic sure, but disingenuous ?   No feature I am suggesting is even remotely out of the scope of any app today. 

You guys want TV. TV doesn't want us. 

If what they are doing hinges on TV, then that is a really bad sign.  Pretty sure it doesn't. 

 

 

Seriously? Can I get examples of live sports streaming that does these things you mentioned? "immediate user controlled replays from multiple angles, coaching annotations for education, gamify all sorts of things". I'm not trying to be a jerk, I am genuinely interested if things like this exist already.

[matty]

1 hour ago, Bison44 said:

Long time no see Matty!!  I would hate to see a FEE keeping potential investors/owners from getting involved.  It seems like they are having enough problems already.  If its low enough not to spook a team will it be enough to make a difference to the other clubs??  And after the initial 6-8 clubs for next year, are there going to be many more deep pocket, big market soccer hotspots that are not already in the league??  I just cant see places like KW, Moncton or Fraser Valley etc (potential second wave teams) buying in for year two for a couple million dollars.  

MLS has boomed and there is a high demand to get into the league from all parts of the US.  And the fees have gone up exponentially.  TFC got into MLS for 10 million (double what the initial buy in in 90's), VWC was 35 just a few years later and NYC got hosed for 100mil.  I cant see that happening up here.  

I agree with pretty much everything you've said (smaller fees make sense for smaller markets and we'll never have MLS level fees) but when you look at the money potential that's there right now for the league (not counting TV) against the rumoured cap and other costs (stadia building, staff, travel, broadcasting) it's difficult to see anything working money wise without possibly having teams gaining an extra $2-500k every few years when someone new joins in the early years.

Also not back fully just had a post splurge last night lol. Still dealing with stuff but wanted to chat a bit. Had some criticism but wasn't posting so whatever lol

Edited April 11, 2018 by matty

[Rheo]

June 23, Canada vs US rugby friendly on the refurbished Wanderers Grounds aka future CPL stadium

https://www.seatlantic.ca/

Edited April 11, 2018 by Rheo

[HfxCeltic]

1 hour ago, Rheo said:

June 23, Canada vs US rugby friendly on the refurbished Wanderers Grounds aka future CPL stadium

https://www.seatlantic.ca/

There's an official announcement video on the SEA facebook page that I was only able to watch a little bit of as I don't want to kill my data and facebook is blocked at work. It's 26 mins, but I think they actually release the anticipated stadium design in their presentation.

https://rugby.ca/en/news/2018/06/wanderers-grounds-to-host-canada-vs-usa

Test match is part of a larger Festival of Rugby hosted by SEA and Rugby Nova Scotia from June 22-24, 2018.

Edited April 11, 2018 by HfxCeltic

[HfxCeltic]

On ‎09‎/‎04‎/‎2018 at 4:44 PM, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Could see a pop-up with 6500 temporary seats being installed for Canada vs USA at men's rugby, but that's probably a bit of a stretch for a U20 women's game in terms of the likely spectator interest level? The rumoured June 23rd game against the United States still rates a mention on wikipedia for what it's worth and even has the name of an assigned referee listed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_mid-year_rugby_union_internationals#Week_5

 

https://rugby.ca/en/news/2018/06/wanderers-grounds-to-host-canada-vs-usa

"S|E|A also announced today that the third test match in the Canada vs England Women’s U20 test series announced earlier this week will also take place at the Wanderers Grounds on Saturday, August 18th."

[Rheo]

1 minute ago, HfxCeltic said:

https://rugby.ca/en/news/2018/06/wanderers-grounds-to-host-canada-vs-usa

"S|E|A also announced today that the third test match in the Canada vs England Women’s U20 test series announced earlier this week will also take place at the Wanderers Grounds on Saturday, August 18th."

Also says seating for 6000

[ChrisinOrleans]

1 minute ago, Rheo said:

Also says seating for 6000

6,000 is not awful for a city of 350,000. As long as it looks enticing to fans, I couldn't care less if I am in front of 150,000 people, I just want to take my kids out for an afternoon. 

[nolbertos]

So I'll quote a Southsider, who seems to have some CPL info.  See below

So I'll let BBTB and other discuss.

[Rheo]

7 minutes ago, nolbertos said:

So I'll quote a Southsider, who seems to have some CPL info.  See below

So I'll let BBTB and other discuss.

So just for my own clarification, this is from a Whitecap supporter that talked to Nash saying this?  Thanks

[nolbertos]

3 minutes ago, Rheo said:

So just for my own clarification, this is from a Whitecap supporter that talked to Nash saying this?  Thanks

Yes.  We have a CPL thread in the Southsider forum too, but not as active as this one.

edit:  I never met chauchi09 directly BTW, but some supporters still talk to ex Nats and Caps where they can.  I’m sure Marty Nash is a wealth of information too.

Edited April 11, 2018 by nolbertos

[Rheo]

1 minute ago, nolbertos said:

Yes.  We have a CPL thread in the Southsider forum too, but not as active as this one.

Cool thanks, just curious for perspective.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

30 minutes ago, nolbertos said:

So I'll quote a Southsider, who seems to have some CPL info.  See below

So I'll let BBTB and other discuss.

I'm a lot more interested/worried about whether WW3 is about to start in the Syrian desert at the moment given Donald Trump's crazy tweet, but assuming we are not on the brink of a nuclear Armageddon the salary cap bit is interesting given it implies that it's at the lower end of the anticipated range. Ham+Hal+Win+Cal has been looking probable for a while, so looks like they need Edm+Ott to be able to launch next summer, if things don't fall neatly into place in stadium terms elsewhere.