mpg_29 Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Setting up CPL with a 2 tier right away might make some sense even if it doesn't include pro/rel right away. If only to create clarity in the pyramid organizational/structure. Which I think has been one of the big problems in Canada/USA soccer...lack of clarity in the pyramid. I'm not sure what a 2 tier would be but it could admit smaller markets that wouldn't otherwise make it (at least initally) in CPL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironcub14 Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 What makes most sense for me is to implement pro/rel if CPL hit 20 teams, AND there was still demand for more CPL teams from across country. Add 4 teams, and split them up into 12 and 12. Then, grow both CPL1 and CPL2 organically. My guess is hopefully around 2050. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpg_29 Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Yeah...I just want to see clear functioning hierarchical pyramid. Just adding a pro tier 1 without thought of lower tiers won't fix that. Tier 1 to tier 3 is very important to funnel talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted June 2, 2017 Author Share Posted June 2, 2017 Million dollar question Will CPL allow MLS B teams in CPL 2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted June 2, 2017 Author Share Posted June 2, 2017 Other observation... CPL 2 needs to adopt the CHL model to be viable in my opinion. It slashes travel costs while adopting a proven model that works with a Memorial Cup tournament that always draws lots of attention in Canada. Memorial Cup's participants that are the champions of their respective leagues, starts V Cup at the same round as CPL and MLS teams Memorial Cup Champion face off with the last place team in CPL for a spot in next season CPL. Pro/Rel CHL format makes it more accessible for potential owners Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowsweatygorilla Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 On 5/17/2017 at 5:06 PM, Bison44 said: Plus I dont think the CPL teams will have money for academies. http://www.thespec.com/news-story/7348323-city-ticats-clash-over-pro-soccer-rights-at-tim-hortons-field/ We got our answer to that: "He emphasized the proposed team is expected to include a Ticat-run soccer academy at the stadium and pave the way to hold international soccer events at Tim Hortons Field." I would hope we go the MLS model here, with both team-run academies and opportunities for players coming out of the CIS - whether through draft or free agency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 43 minutes ago, mpg_29 said: Yeah...I just want to see clear functioning heirachal pyramid... They'll be doing very well to get six investor groups with viable stadium options that will underwrite low end seven figure budgets and hang in there until their league starts to gain some traction financially. Talk of additional tiers is pure fantasy at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuillermoDelQuarto Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 On 6/2/2017 at 7:39 AM, mpg_29 said: Setting up CPL with a 2 tier right away might make some sense even if it doesn't include pro/rel right away. If only to create clarity in the pyramid organizational/structure. Which I think has been one of the big problems in Canada/USA soccer...lack of clarity in the pyramid. I'm not sure what a 2 tier would be but it could admit smaller markets that wouldn't otherwise make it (at least initally) in CPL. I'd love to see L1O and PLSQ essentially set up/marketed as CPL2, even if there is no pro/rel out of the gate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuillermoDelQuarto Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 On 6/2/2017 at 9:49 AM, Ansem said: Million dollar question Will CPL allow MLS B teams in CPL 2? wouldn't be the end of the world, as long as, in our hypothetical universe that includes pro/rel, that they can't be promoted to CPL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryUnderscore Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 On 2017-06-02 at 0:49 PM, Ansem said: Million dollar question Will CPL allow MLS B teams in CPL 2? I can't see that happening. You can't have a strict "No B teams" policy in the CPL and then allow them in a CPL2 which promoted the winners. Suddenly you could have B teams for all three MLS teams in the CPL1 despite your rule. Keep MLS and CPL separate. If TFC or IMFC want to loan a few players out to CPL teams for development, that's fine. But it's a loan system just like in any other leagues around the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryUnderscore Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 On 2017-06-01 at 10:37 PM, Kent said: I think I said this in the mammoth CPL thread but I would like to reiterate that if we do someday end up with 2 tiers I hope they do NOT call it the Championship like they do in England. That will never make sense to me. CPL2 would be acceptable, CDL (D for deuxieme) would be optimal. I would hope they don't call it the Canadian Championship League. In England those names came up organically as they continued to create higher tiered leagues. In the same way, I would hope the CPL simply continues to expand. And then, a day might come when we notice a large disparity between the top 6-8 teams and the rest of the league. In which case, those 6-8 teams can create a new top tier league, effectively bumping the CPL down into tier two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 13 minutes ago, JerryUnderscore said: I would hope they don't call it the Canadian Championship League. In England those names came up organically as they continued to create higher tiered leagues. In the same way, I would hope the CPL simply continues to expand. And then, a day might come when we notice a large disparity between the top 6-8 teams and the rest of the league. In which case, those 6-8 teams can create a new top tier league, effectively bumping the CPL down into tier two. That's not what happened in England. They rebranded existing leagues. I'm not an expert, but if I remember correctly it used to be First Division, Second Division, etc. Then they rebranded and renamed First Division to Premier League. Second division became First Division, etc. Then they rebranded again to change First Division to Championship, and Second Division became League One. I never understood it. It's like they are trying to fool naive fans (and they fool nobody) by giving every league a name that makes it sound like it's the top league in the country (except for the 4h tier League Two. I am half expecting them to rename that one to English A League soon). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyFromToronto23 Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 They should set it up the 2nd tier for CanPL like the German 4th division ( with regional leagues aka Regionalliga) for example Regionalliga Nord Regionalliga West Regionalliga Berlin Regionalliga Südwest Regionalliga Süd they should do this since Canada is really big Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowsweatygorilla Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Kent said: That's not what happened in England. They rebranded existing leagues. I'm not an expert, but if I remember correctly it used to be First Division, Second Division, etc. Then they rebranded and renamed First Division to Premier League. Second division became First Division, etc. Then they rebranded again to change First Division to Championship, and Second Division became League One. I never understood it. It's like they are trying to fool naive fans (and they fool nobody) by giving every league a name that makes it sound like it's the top league in the country (except for the 4h tier League Two. I am half expecting them to rename that one to English A League soon). To clarify though, the Premier League was not a rebranding. Instead, the top flight teams decided they wanted financial independence (or more of the pie really..) and autonomy from the football league. They broke away as the Premier League. So, for the Football League, the Second Division became the First, and so forth. Finally, First division was rebranded Championship more recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grasshopper1917 Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 On 6/2/2017 at 1:25 PM, BringBackTheBlizzard said: They'll be doing very well to get six investor groups with viable stadium options that will underwrite low end seven figure budgets and hang in there until their league starts to gain some traction financially. Talk of additional tiers is pure fantasy at this point. I think what he is saying is we are putting the apple cart in front of the horse. I hate to say this but I think BBTB is right it is going to be a challenge to get this league off the ground and have owners willing to sustain it while it stabilizes. Realistically it will likely be at least 10-15 years before the business model is worked out and we have stable teams. I will be happy if they get one division with ultimately 10 teams running. Division 2 is not even a concept I think I could imagine at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryUnderscore Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 23 hours ago, Kent said: That's not what happened in England. They rebranded existing leagues. I'm not an expert, but if I remember correctly it used to be First Division, Second Division, etc. Then they rebranded and renamed First Division to Premier League. Second division became First Division, etc. Then they rebranded again to change First Division to Championship, and Second Division became League One. I never understood it. It's like they are trying to fool naive fans (and they fool nobody) by giving every league a name that makes it sound like it's the top league in the country (except for the 4h tier League Two. I am half expecting them to rename that one to English A League soon). Yeah, I stand corrected. I knew the Premier League was founded in '92, but I thought it was a result of the superior teams not wanting to play inferior teams as often. You're right that it was essentially the first division that simply broke away and started their own thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryUnderscore Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 14 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said: I think what he is saying is we are putting the apple cart in front of the horse. I hate to say this but I think BBTB is right it is going to be a challenge to get this league off the ground and have owners willing to sustain it while it stabilizes. Realistically it will likely be at least 10-15 years before the business model is worked out and we have stable teams. I will be happy if they get one division with ultimately 10 teams running. Division 2 is not even a concept I think I could imagine at this point. I don't know about other people, but I'm not expecting the 2nd division to happen any time soon. Realistically it could 20years before the CPL has 16 teams. Bernier has mentioned wanting to start with six teams and by the 2019 season expand up to eight, but beyond that there hasn't been any specific talk about how quickly expansion would happen. However, the fact that they're thinking long-term enough to build in the possibility of pro/rel at a future point is encouraging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison44 Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 I will be elated if we have games next summer, and maybe more than 6 teams. Getting to 10 teams with the 3 big market MLS teams still in place will be hard enough, talk of more (enough for a second division) is a generation or two away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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