baulderdash77 1,779 Posted May 30 Yes GVA is somewhere in the greater Vancouver area. A couple names get bandied about and I’m not sure if Surrey is the current target. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Initial B 85 Posted May 30 (edited) I've been doing some thinking about how to implement a regional 2nd division in CPL and the problem I come across is that I don't think there are enough teams out west to do it. They can't even get a regional 3 division off the ground in BC or Alberta, they have to join USL2. Ontario and Quebec seem to have the majority of the I'm wondering if the plan is to build the footprint of soccer clubs out west (say 7 teams) in a 16-club CPL. The remaining teams will be in Ontario and parts east. I could see a second division solely comprised of eastern teams. If they institute pro-rel, only the eastern teams would be considered for relegation because if a western team was relegated, that would be a death sentence due to the loss of media revenue and ballooning travel costs. This asymmetrical format would have to continue until they get enough western teams to make it's own regional Div2, which might take 2 decades. Edited May 30 by Initial B Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ansem 6,174 Posted May 30 40 minutes ago, Initial B said: I've been doing some thinking about how to implement a regional 2nd division in CPL and the problem I come across is that I don't think there are enough teams out west to do it. They can't even get a regional 3 division off the ground in BC or Alberta, they have to join USL2. Ontario and Quebec seem to have the majority of the I'm wondering if the plan is to build the footprint of soccer clubs out west (say 7 teams) in a 16-club CPL. The remaining teams will be in Ontario and parts east. I could see a second division solely comprised of eastern teams. If they institute pro-rel, only the eastern teams would be considered for relegation because if a western team was relegated, that would be a death sentence due to the loss of media revenue and ballooning travel costs. This asymmetrical format would have to continue until they get enough western teams to make it's own regional Div2, which might take 2 decades. Pretty sure D2 is expected to be national 1 Bbeto reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kent 4,023 Posted May 31 19 hours ago, Initial B said: I've been doing some thinking about how to implement a regional 2nd division in CPL and the problem I come across is that I don't think there are enough teams out west to do it. They can't even get a regional 3 division off the ground in BC or Alberta, they have to join USL2. Ontario and Quebec seem to have the majority of the I'm wondering if the plan is to build the footprint of soccer clubs out west (say 7 teams) in a 16-club CPL. The remaining teams will be in Ontario and parts east. I could see a second division solely comprised of eastern teams. If they institute pro-rel, only the eastern teams would be considered for relegation because if a western team was relegated, that would be a death sentence due to the loss of media revenue and ballooning travel costs. This asymmetrical format would have to continue until they get enough western teams to make it's own regional Div2, which might take 2 decades. I understand all the concerns you raised, but you can't have pro/rel where some teams are immune to relegation because of geography. That wouldn't work. Although I am half expecting for Forge, Valour, and FC Edmonton to be immune from relegation if pro/rel ever does become a reality. 1 Sébastien reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IAmPappy 47 Posted June 1 I haven’t been following too closely, but I’m curious where things stand on new clubs? Which three-ish markets are front runners for the near-term, say 2020-2021? I’ve heard Laval, SK, and QC. What about in the mid-term, say 2021-2023? I’ve heard Moncton, Ottawa, GTA, and GVA. Is that about right? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CDNFootballer 785 Posted June 1 1 hour ago, IAmPappy said: I haven’t been following too closely, but I’m curious where things stand on new clubs? Which three-ish markets are front runners for the near-term, say 2020-2021? I’ve heard Laval, SK, and QC. What about in the mid-term, say 2021-2023? I’ve heard Moncton, Ottawa, GTA, and GVA. Is that about right? For 2020 I'd lean towards Laval and Greater Vancouver expansion clubs joining bringing the league to 9 teams. 1 1 deschamp86 and IAmPappy reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IAmPappy 47 Posted June 2 1 hour ago, CDNFootballer said: For 2020 I'd lean towards Laval and Greater Vancouver expansion clubs joining bringing the league to 9 teams. Thanks. So, this seems like a no brainer to me: The Roughriders could easily replica the Winnipeg and Hamilton models and put a team in Regina. What am I missing? 1 SpecialK reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
baulderdash77 1,779 Posted June 2 I think the ownership group in Saskatchewan is more focused on Saskatoon than Regina right now but I’m not an good source on that market. 1 IAmPappy reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpecialK 901 Posted June 2 (edited) Ottawa , Quebec City , Moncton and Regina all have Stadiums ready to go. Those cities should be the focus ! Edited June 2 by SpecialK Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 2 Those are only ready to go, if the owners are willing to rent at a reasonable price and either install unmarked fielturf or natural grass as is the case in Ottawa and Moncton. It's not acceptable to have permanent CFL markings visible during a CanPL game, so Regina and Quebec City are problematic as things stand right now. There are solutions like paint and tiles but that might not be so easy to do when the season overlaps with the CFL and U-sports. Halifax have shown that popups can be successfully installed and used for pro soccer so the lack of a suitable existing stadium isn't necessarily a problem if a municipality is willing to provide suitable land. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CDNFootballer 785 Posted June 2 In addition to stadiums potential markets also have to have well vetted ownership groups with sound business plans for their clubs, etc. Stadium alone is not enough, a sound group that checks all the boxes re vetting but plans a 6K popup may end up the better expansion candidate in the end. 1 Bbeto reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 2 (edited) 13 hours ago, IAmPappy said: I haven’t been following too closely, but I’m curious where things stand on new clubs? Which three-ish markets are front runners for the near-term, say 2020-2021? I’ve heard Laval, SK, and QC. What about in the mid-term, say 2021-2023? I’ve heard Moncton, Ottawa, GTA, and GVA. Is that about right? Durham Region has been floated as a possibility in blogs and podcasts complete with a named lead investor and preferred stadium location, which adds credibility. Suspect the experience with York 9 might cool things a bit on large metro suburban markets such as Durham, Laval and Fraser valley unless more fans start showing up in terms of actual as opposed to announced attendance and Quebec City might become the top expansion target in Quebec for that reason. It's now getting equal billing with Laval from Alex Bunbury. There are groups known to have been potentially interested in St John's and Kitchener/Waterloo, and Saint John also got mentioned on blogs and podcasts after Moosehead became a league sponsor. In total the league has claimed to be in contact with 22 groups and 18 markets, but some of those were probably highly preliminary. Kelowna, Windsor, London, Niagara, Mississauga and Barrie were also mentioned by Paul Beirne in a podcast earlier this year along with the possibility of regional intensification on franchise numbers to boost local rivalries in southern Ontario and Lower Mainland BC. Sherbrooke gets mentioned sometimes as the third possible Quebec market. Edited June 2 by Ozzie_the_parrot 1 1 Gopherbashi and BuzzAndSting reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Impactsupporter 39 Posted June 2 (edited) 6 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said: Durham Region has been floated as a possibility in blogs and podcasts complete with a named lead investor and preferred stadium location, which adds credibility. Suspect the experience with York 9 might cool things a bit on large metro suburban markets such as Durham, Laval and Fraser valley unless more fans start showing up in terms of actual as opposed to announced attendance and Quebec City might become the top expansion target in Quebec for that reason. It's now getting equal billing with Laval from Alex Bunbury. There are groups known to have been potentially interested in St John's and Kitchener/Waterloo, and Saint John also got mentioned on blogs and podcasts after Moosehead became a league sponsor. In total the league has claimed to be in contact with 22 groups and 18 markets, but some of those were probably highly preliminary. Kelowna, Windsor, London, Niagara, Mississauga and Barrie were also mentioned by Paul Beirne in a podcast earlier this year along with the possibility of regional intensification on franchise numbers to boost local rivalries in southern Ontario and Lower Mainland BC. Sherbrooke gets mentioned sometimes as the third possible Quebec market. With all that in mind, I decided to show the various markets and groups the CPL has been in contact with broken up into various "regions" Eastern Canada St-John's, NFLD HFX Wanderers New Brunswick (St-John or Moncton) Quebec City Sherbrooke Montreal/Laval Gatineau Ottawa Eastern Ontario Durham Region (Ajax, Oshawa, Pickering) York 9 Mississauga Brampton Oakville Toronto (Varsity or Lamport Stadium) Barrie Western Ontario Forge FC(Hamilton) Grand River(Kitchener-Waterloo) London Windsor Niagara Sudbury Western Canada Valour FC(Winnipeg) Regina Saskatoon Cavalry FC(Calgary) FC Edmonton Kelowna Lower Mainland BC(Surrey or Langley) Vancouver (Richmond, Flight FC) Pacific FC(Victoria) Let me know if I have missed any places. Edited June 2 by Impactsupporter was not finished hit button too soon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 2 Looks good. Think Gatineau and Sudbury are more online speculation than anything that has come from CanPL execs or any credible local source. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Impactsupporter 39 Posted June 2 13 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said: Looks good. Think Gatineau and Sudbury are more online speculation than anything that has come from CanPL execs or any credible local source. https://sudburycpl.wordpress.com/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vancanman 71 Posted June 3 13 hours ago, Impactsupporter said: With all that in mind, I decided to show the various markets and groups the CPL has been in contact with broken up into various "regions" Eastern Canada St-John's, NFLD HFX Wanderers New Brunswick (St-John or Moncton) Quebec City Sherbrooke Montreal/Laval Gatineau Ottawa Eastern Ontario Durham Region (Ajax, Oshawa, Pickering) York 9 Mississauga Brampton Oakville Toronto (Varsity or Lamport Stadium) Barrie Western Ontario Forge FC(Hamilton) Grand River(Kitchener-Waterloo) London Windsor Niagara Sudbury Western Canada Valour FC(Winnipeg) Regina Saskatoon Cavalry FC(Calgary) FC Edmonton Kelowna Lower Mainland BC(Surrey or Langley) Vancouver (Richmond, Flight FC) Pacific FC(Victoria) Let me know if I have missed any places. I can't think of any you've left out, but what is Flight FC in Vancouver? I haven't seen that mentioned before. NB: St. John's, Newfoundland and Labrador. Saint John, New Brunswick Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 3 (edited) Edited June 3 by Ozzie_the_parrot Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Impactsupporter 39 Posted June 3 7 hours ago, vancanman said: I can't think of any you've left out, but what is Flight FC in Vancouver? I haven't seen that mentioned before. https://twitter.com/FcFlight Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 3 Looks like a personal twitter account, so isn't that much the same as the CanPL for Goderich stuff? Think there needs to be a bit more than that for it to be viewed as a credible bid. 1 The Real Marc reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Impactsupporter 39 Posted June 3 https://www.ffa.com.au/sites/ffa/files/2019-05/Whole_of_Football_Plan.pdf goto page 84 and the composition of the A-League. One interesting area: Every major Australian center with a population over 500 000 has the market size to host and A-League club and no pro-rel between A-League and National Premier Leagues (Yet Paul Beirne wanted Canadian centers with populations of 200 000 to host CPL a club. Just a thought. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 3 (edited) The A League spends significantly more on players than CanPL does and would not be comfortable using 6,000 seat popups, so the smaller scale of operations means that we can more easily aspire to having a Morwell Falcons on board some day: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gippsland_Falcons_SC https://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/when-the-falcons-took-flight-a-region-soared-with-them--but-crash-was-coming-20111201-1o9a0.html Edited June 3 by Ozzie_the_parrot Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kent 4,023 Posted June 3 22 minutes ago, Impactsupporter said: https://www.ffa.com.au/sites/ffa/files/2019-05/Whole_of_Football_Plan.pdf goto page 84 and the composition of the A-League. One interesting area: Every major Australian center with a population over 500 000 has the market size to host and A-League club and no pro-rel between A-League and National Premier Leagues (Yet Paul Beirne wanted Canadian centers with populations of 200 000 to host CPL a club. Just a thought. Perhaps the thinking is that a Canadian league may have more sponsorship money potential than an Australian league. While most people think of Australia as having a similar population to Canada, Canada's is actually about 50% higher than Australia (25 million to 37 million). Of course for that to pan out the CPL would need viewership of the league to go up in areas that don't have teams. I can't draw any conclusions from this next data point, but I was curious how many more markets it would open up if Australia used the 200k benchmark instead of 500k. Cities with more than 500k population: Australia - 6, Canada - 10 Cities with between 200k and 500k: Australia - 6, Canada - 10 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dyslexic nam 6,889 Posted June 3 Australia also doesn't have to deal with its 3 biggest markets being home to a competing league with deep pockets and a longer history. Ignoring that is silly. 4 The Real Marc, vancanman, Bbeto and 1 other reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rintaran 348 Posted June 3 23 hours ago, Impactsupporter said: Eastern Ontario Durham Region (Ajax, Oshawa, Pickering) York 9 Mississauga Brampton Oakville Toronto (Varsity or Lamport Stadium) Barrie Western Ontario Forge FC(Hamilton) Grand River(Kitchener-Waterloo) London Windsor Niagara Sudbury Placing Sudbury in Western Ontario is hilarious. Also I don't think its happening. 21 hours ago, Impactsupporter said: https://sudburycpl.wordpress.com/ I admit, I forgot about this site. I guess I should either update it or shut it down, eh? There aren't very many who have stepped forward to be involved with this "group" (like 3, including myself and a guy in North Bay). There are zero credible rumours concerning a team in Northern Ontario. The most likely owner, Dario Zulich, is currently tied up fighting to get his Kingsway Entertainment District through the LPAT system. Until that's resolved, he's unlikely to explore the idea of expanding his sports holdings beyond the Sudbury Wolves (hockey), Sudbury Five (pro basketball), and Sudbury Spartans (football). In some of the early proposals, there was talk of an outdoor stadium "potentially" being added to the KED, but it hasn't been brought up since the very early stages. Additionally, although both indoor soccer domes are moving forward, the "public" one has downsized as a result of Ford's cutting their announced funding. Both are still slated to open sometime in "Fall 2019," but there's no word on any connections between the two facilities and pro or semi-pro ambitions. Furthermore, the changed requirements in L1O, which will require an L1O Reserve squad to launch simultaneously, eliminates Sudbury (and all of Northern Ontario) from obtaining any presence in that league. The availability (or lack thereof) of the coach & referee training in the North has resulted in no club or group coming even close to the standards needed to launch an OPDL team in Sudbury, let alone L1O & L1O reserves. Short of me personally winning the big prizes on both Lotto 649 and Lotto Max, I think we can count Sudbury out of the running for the near-to-medium-term. I'm still dreaming it could happen, but as for Pro or Semi-Pro Soccer in Sudbury, there's nothing but crickets and craters. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ozzie_the_parrot 724 Posted June 3 You have had semi-pro soccer in the past for what it's worth. http://www.sudburymuseums.ca/index.cfm?app=w_vmuseum&lang=en&currID=1679 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites