CPL new teams speculation

[itsinmyhead]

4 hours ago, Impactsupporter said:

Or maybe Seaway Park near Metro Longueuil (near CEGEP Champlain) About a 15 minute walk from the Metro.  Could add seats all around.  

I don't think Seaway Park would be realistic. I used to live in St-Lambert and there's absolutely no way the municipal government agrees to anything that involves people and noise. 

They really place a huge emphasis on having beautiful parks and keeping the city calm and quiet.

[Blackjack15]

Laval or Brossard is the way to go, because if you put a team in MTL proper and call it Montreal _______ (whatever) then people will be confused and the Impact will not be happy not that it matters but if they what York do then they can be more successful I think

[Kent]

9 hours ago, Blackjack15 said:

Laval or Brossard is the way to go, because if you put a team in MTL proper and call it Montreal _______ (whatever) then people will be confused and the Impact will not be happy not that it matters but if they what York do then they can be more successful I think

York 9 going from a hot mess to an example franchise in one month on this board

[Ansem]

10 hours ago, Blackjack15 said:

Laval or Brossard is the way to go, because if you put a team in MTL proper and call it Montreal _______ (whatever) then people will be confused and the Impact will not be happy not that it matters but if they what York do then they can be more successful I think

Got to give people more credit than that ?

[Admin]

10 hours ago, Blackjack15 said:

Laval or Brossard is the way to go, because if you put a team in MTL proper and call it Montreal _______ (whatever) then people will be confused and the Impact will not be happy not that it matters but if they what York do then they can be more successful I think

Which might in part be some of the impetus behind not using the city names in team names. 

[El Diego]

What information do we have to believe that a CPL would be successful in Montreal? I find it hard to believe that a resident would be interested in a completely new CPL team when they have the Impact there, but I'm not overly familiar with the soccer in community in Montreal so I'm open to having my mind changed.

[Impactsupporter]

maybe a Montreal area team could be called "FC des Rapides"

Just a thought.

 

 

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, El Diego said:

What information do we have to believe that a CPL would be successful in Montreal? I find it hard to believe that a resident would be interested in a completely new CPL team when they have the Impact there, but I'm not overly familiar with the soccer in community in Montreal so I'm open to having my mind changed.

The Montreal Metro area has over 4M people. Many on twitter including journalists said that a team in Laval would hurt Montreal Impact. My rebuttal to that is :

• If Montreal Impact can't fill their stadiums without Laval and Longueuil, they seriously need to review their marketing.

 

1. They favour an American keeper over a local. Sure Bush put better numbers but I remember when he was mediocre... who had the tighter leash? Crepeau or Bush? Crepeau was never given the same amount of opportunities and chances after a bad game that Bush had. Journalists noted that too, no wonder he wants out. Is Bush remotely on the USMNT radar??? Nope but somehow, he's leagues above Crepeau...ummm no.
2. excuse my language but... F***, they even kept CAPTAIN FREAKIN BERNIER on a short leash... They never made him the central focus of their marketing preferring foreigners that came and moved on. Saputo used to defend Klopas benching Bernier  over others that ended up not being impactful.
3. Never capitalized on Anthony Jackson Hamel when he was hotter than Mancosu. A Quebec City kid, francophone...but nothing...
4. Benched Tabla most of the time but gave plenty of opportunities to Americans and foreigners. Hell, the league was praising Tabla's potential and in Montreal...nothing.

This sense of entitlement got them where they are. They act like they are the "Habs" but are far from it. They don't get the audience, hence can't draw WAY MORE than they should. They deserve where they are.

Talented Francophones and most Canadians on other Canadian clubs are usually kept on a very tight leash, even of similar talents than Americans and foreigners. That's a huge source of my frustration with those 3.

Well, Saputo always had a hard on for Italian talent over locals anyways. The team might be based in Montreal, but its owner doesn't understand its audience and I doubt he identifies with the more nationalistic nature of Quebecers. Its really obvious here.

A CPL Laval or Montreal would likely do the opposite of this with local owners that relates to locals. I applaud CPL to understand as much and emphasize on owners being as locals as possible. In the most nationalistic province in the country, a CPL team in the province should make the top talent AND top francophone talent AND top next up and coming francophone the centre of their marketing. Then they should work harder to draw from suburban areas since Montreal Impact has done NOTHING outside the island.

Don't believe me? When the Nordiques were around, the whole province favoured them over the Habs. French talent was central and they understood the identity of the province and wrapped themselves in it. I remember that whenever the Habs went to Quebec, they were booed out of the building. When the Nordiques went to the Forum, HALF the building cheered the Nordiques. It forced the Habs to be better identity-wise and forced them to be a winning team. Who can argue they've been crap and could care less about francophone talent ever since Quebec Nordiques left the league? So if they aren't winning, they get empty seats like last year and a significant drop in TV ratings. Why corner yourself in a situation where if you don't win, you're deserted by your fans? How many teams around the world still sellout despite being average or bad or flirting with relegation zones? The league not resonating with Canadians does play a part too.

Also, outside of Toronto, what rivalry does the Impact have? In CPL they could revive the hated Quebec vs Montreal rivalry, still have a rivalry with York 9 and Ottawa. The league have to find a way to make them care, and I tell CPL all the time "PUSH FRENCH CONTENT", have a french spokesperson etc... It will pay off in French communities outside of Quebec as well.

No one will ever make me buy that this Metro area can't support more than 1 club. No way...

end of rant...

sorry for the language

 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Ansem

[Complete Homer]

2 hours ago, El Diego said:

What information do we have to believe that a CPL would be successful in Montreal? I find it hard to believe that a resident would be interested in a completely new CPL team when they have the Impact there, but I'm not overly familiar with the soccer in community in Montreal so I'm open to having my mind changed.

While definitely a gamble, there's a trend of teams launched in the 90s/early 2000s getting eclipsed by newcomers with better stadium location in the same market 

The odds that CPL ends with anything downtown seems like a big stretch, but if they got a big family on board I could see them being successful. Obviously a huge if

Edited November 9, 2018 by Complete Homer

[ted]

1 hour ago, Ansem said:

The Montreal Metro area has over 4M people. 

You had me at, "4M people".

Seriously, that sort of population should easily support two teams. 
 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Ansem said:

The Montreal Metro area has over 4M people. Many on twitter including journalists said that a team in Laval would hurt Montreal Impact. My rebuttal to that is :

...

end of rant...

sorry for the language

 

Great rant Ansem! I aways enjoy reading a good rant even if I don't agree with everything that is said. And no need to apologize for the language: given the depth of feeling that was obviously involved, I thought only one asterisked f-bomb showed remarkable restraint!

I know I am in a small minority on this (on here) but here it is anyway: I think the league is responsible for setting the rules and the club is responsible for putting out the best possible team under those rules. So, if you want to mandate minimum Canadian content (as the CPL will do), that is the responsibility of the league, not the club. I do not think MLS clubs located in Canada have any moral responsibility to develop Canadian talent above what will help them to succeed in MLS. MLS is an American league. Canadian fans need to understand this. And this is precisely why the CPL, a Canadian league, is so desperately needed.

With that said, I agree with your point that Impact marketing has probably missed a trick by not making better use of French Canadian talent. I too have the perception that in that part of Canada in particular, fans would be very partial to home grown talent. 

Edited November 10, 2018 by dsqpr

[Winnipeg Fury]

 "I do not think MLS clubs located in Canada have any moral responsibility to develop Canadian talent above what will help them to succeed in MLS. MLS is an American league. Canadian fans need to understand this. And this is precisely why the CPL, a Canadian league, is so desperately needed."

 

Hear, hear !

 

[rob.notenboom]

2 hours ago, Winnipeg Fury said:

 "I do not think MLS clubs located in Canada have any moral responsibility to develop Canadian talent above what will help them to succeed in MLS. MLS is an American league. Canadian fans need to understand this. And this is precisely why the CPL, a Canadian league, is so desperately needed."

 

Hear, hear !

 

Not that I’m disagreeing necessarily, but MLS/Garber and the Canadian MLS teams have repeatedly stated that that’s what they’ll do ... develop more Canadian players and improve the player pool en route to getting Canada back to a World Cup. So one could be excused for believing that it is part of their mandate. 

[RS]

7 minutes ago, rob.notenboom said:

Not that I’m disagreeing necessarily, but MLS/Garber and the Canadian MLS teams have repeatedly stated that that’s what they’ll do ... develop more Canadian players and improve the player pool en route to getting Canada back to a World Cup. So one could be excused for believing that it is part of their mandate. 

Because it is part of their mandate. It's why the CSA originally sanctioned MLS in Canada (and continues to do so).

How big a part is the question. But the MLS teams will have the most fleshed-out development pathways in Canada for the foreseeable future, and thus will play a big part in growing and improving the player pool.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, rob.notenboom said:

Not that I’m disagreeing necessarily, but MLS/Garber and the Canadian MLS teams have repeatedly stated that that’s what they’ll do ... develop more Canadian players and improve the player pool en route to getting Canada back to a World Cup. So one could be excused for believing that it is part of their mandate. 

That is a good point Rob. I do not pay much attention to MLS but I have certainly heard griping that the MLS franchises based in Canada do not play enough Canadians -- including complaints about limited playing time for Alphonso Davies. But if these MLS franchises have said they will develop Canadian talent (although that is hard to quantify) then they certainly deserve criticism if people percieve that they are not doing it. Of course if there are no Canadians in the first team, they can always simply claim that their Canadian players are not good enough right now.

[rob.notenboom]

7 minutes ago, dsqpr said:

That is a good point Rob. I do not pay much attention to MLS but I have certainly heard griping that the MLS franchises based in Canada do not play enough Canadians -- including complaints about limited playing time for Alphonso Davies. But if these MLS franchises have said they will develop Canadian talent (although that is hard to quantify) then they certainly deserve criticism if people percieve that they are not doing it. Of course if there are no Canadians in the first team, they can always simply claim that their Canadian players are not good enough right now.

It has been a regular answer from many MLS parties when asked, whether that be Garber, Lenarduzzi, Leiweke, etc. 

I would rather not wade into the ‘does MLS do enough for Canadian player development’ debate. There are good points on both sides and they’ve been beaten to death. But I have trouble subscribing to the notion that MLS is an American League and we shouldn’t expect them to purposefully do anything for Canadian player development, when they explicitly state that it is a goal of theirs. 

https://www.wakingthered.com/2015/12/6/9855210/garber-talks-canadian-expansion-player-rules-and-the-state-of-mls-in-canada

Edited November 10, 2018 by rob.notenboom

[Admin]

Have the rules for "parity" Canadians down south come into effect yet?

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, rob.notenboom said:

It has been a regular answer from many MLS parties when asked, whether that be Garber, Lenarduzzi, Leiweke, etc. 

I would rather not wade into the ‘does MLS do enough for Canadian player development’ debate. There are good points on both sides and they’ve been beaten to death. But I have trouble subscribing to the notion that MLS is an American League and we shouldn’t expect them to purposefully do anything for Canadian player development, when they explicitly state that it is a goal of theirs. 

https://www.wakingthered.com/2015/12/6/9855210/garber-talks-canadian-expansion-player-rules-and-the-state-of-mls-in-canada

Fair enough Rob, I do know that I hold the minority view on here. However, I take your point: if they have said they will do it then I agree they should follow through: the obvious problem being that, unless there are rules that are verifiable, such as number of Canadians in the matchday squad, they can claim they are doing it whilst others claim they are not. And who is to say where the truth lies? The conclusion being that their "mandate" to develop Canadian talent is virtually worthless unless it is quantifiable.

[1996]

Plenty of young Canadians 21 and under have played and played this past season in the USL for TFC 2 , on most nights TFC2 played an almost entire squad of Canadian s in a league that might still be a level above the new CPL , so it’s not like TFC has not been spending money to develop Canadian players, moreover this past season TFC played a number of Canadians on their MLS team in many games. If a Canadian player is good enough he will get playing time in the MLS for TFC if not he will play in the USL for TFC 2 . Let’s also keep in mind that some players are just not good enough no matter how much playing time they get be it in MLS, USL or the new CPL .

Edited November 10, 2018 by 1996

[RS]

17 minutes ago, admin said:

Have the rules for "parity" Canadians down south come into effect yet?

Have been for a while.

[Admin]

1 minute ago, RS said:

Have been for a while.

Anyone jumped on that train yet that wouldn't be playing otherwise?

[RS]

4 minutes ago, admin said:

Anyone jumped on that train yet that wouldn't be playing otherwise?

Off the top of my head: Adonijah Reid, Kwame Awuah and Quillan Roberts are all considered domestics on U.S. MLS teams. Only Awuah got any playing time this season.

[Ansem]

1 hour ago, 1996 said:

Plenty of young Canadians 21 and under have played and played this past season in the USL for TFC 2 , on most nights TFC2 played an almost entire squad of Canadian s in a league that might still be a level above the new CPL , so it’s not like TFC has not been spending money to develop Canadian players, moreover this past season TFC played a number of Canadians on their MLS team in many games.

The point is that it's not good enough and they can't do it on their own. 

1 hour ago, 1996 said:

If a Canadian player is good enough he will get playing time in the MLS for TFC if not he will play in the USL for TFC 2 . Let’s also keep in mind that some players are just not good enough no matter how much playing time they get be it in MLS, USL or the new CPL .

The other CONCACAF nations have domestic leagues for those who can't make MLS, we don't and that is a massive handicap that goes beyond than "well our guys aren't good enough to make MLS" and "TFC does their best". 

Most Central American D1 leagues (if not all of them) are better than USL with far less resources than USL. I have no doubt CPL will be a better league and a step up for our players, that's all that matters right now. The roster rules so far provides the environment needed to get more players to integrate our pool by providing them the opportunity. 

Panama, Honduras, Costa Rica have lesser leagues than MLS, yet they surpassed the US in the last WCQ, even T&T B team beat them soundly. I don't care about CPL not being a better league than MLS... just like the French don't care that Ligue 1 isn't better than La Liga and EPL, they care that their NT can slap both England and Spain whenever they're please. Just give me a good league with good football that allows our guys to get to the next level and we'll collectively be happy for it. 

That's the end game, that's what matters. MLS, USL... nice to have... They provide help from time to time, good...thank you..we'll take it. But I've moved on from relying on that system. 

[shamrock]

11 hours ago, Ansem said:

Most Central American D1 leagues (if not all of them) are better than USL with far less resources than USL.

You base this on what? I honestly don't think the Panamanian or Guatemalan leagues are better than USL...

[Rheo]

Howdy all. Sticking my head out to say that there’s a Windsor supporter group started. Early days but we’ve got to start somewhere. On twitter if anyone wants to keep up its https://twitter.com/windsorcanpl