Gordon Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 1 minute ago, Complete Homer said: This point doesn't hold for stadium capacity. Almost all teams have some sort of steep discount or occasional giveaways for youth players - it's how you draw in fans for life. You should be building capacity with those in mind And again, I know this point has been used for over a year, but we've never had any evidence that those tickets grossly warp the attendance numbers. I really doubt there's thousands of youth players at each game One of the authors of Soccernomics has stated that his MLS sources suggest that 30% of ALL tickets "sold" league wide actually generate no revenue (i.e. are give aways), so the numbers can be pretty large. But really, as you say, what does it matter? Whether the ticket is purchased, or given away, you still need a seat for the bum. http://www.soccernomics-agency.com/?p=692 Complete Homer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex D Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 28 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: The other problem with using Ottawa's announced numbers as being indicative of anything is that they are giving away free tickets through local youth clubs and other accompanying children and adults get in on a significant discount as part of a long term marketing strategy. http://www.rednationonline.ca/Articles2015/OttawaFuryreachouttoyouthwithfreetickets.aspx http://furyfanatics.com/fanatic-faqs/#1491846783596-c6860f16-06a2 FC Edmonton provides a better yardstick for what happens when people have to actually pay to get in and freebies are not being consistently used to generate inflated announced numbers. Being limited to a 5000 capacity has yet to be an issue there and it has taken many years for them to build to the point that crowds are in the 3500-4000 range. https://www.google.com/maps/@53.557171,-113.4783296,306m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en Tom Fath admitted he had no idea how to run a soccer team and made a lot of mistakes. After just over a year with someone knowledgeable in charge they're now selling out. Please stop using their troubles as the measuring stick for every other Canadian city. Complete Homer, SuperCanuck, Greatest Cockney Rip Off and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex D Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 (edited) 20 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: You seriously think that a K-W team that is currently struggling to break 500 in PDL is likely to have a problem any time soon because 5000 seats would be too small for them? Yes. 500 per game it's actually a pretty good number for PDL. My impression is that as a PDL club, KWU is not a huge priority for Barry. He has other business to attend to. The clubs front office currently is 2 people! They're great people doing the best they can but it is what it is. From the way Barry talks about CPL, I have no doubt this will be vastly different when they make the jump. They are building a SSS and it will need more than 5000 seats. There is a big market for pro soccer in KW, they just need something worthwhile to cheer for. Edited July 30, 2017 by Alex D ironcub14 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 (edited) BBTB believes that only USSF can exist in Canada. Anything else should be feeders to MLS clubs and his precious TFC. Not his fault, he grew thinking Canada can't do anything without the US Edited July 30, 2017 by Ansem MtlMario 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 (edited) No he doesn't. Now can we get back to the subject matter of the thread? That cemetery plot looks ideal to me in location terms and with suitable access (the main sticking point), there's no problem putting a pop-up in there on a Halifax sort of scale. If what Rollins claimed was accurate (his track record is mixed at best), I strongly suspect the location would be there rather than the parking lot at the intersection. Will be interesting to see what unfolds. Edited July 30, 2017 by BringBackTheBlizzard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 11 hours ago, shamrock said: But they have a fantastic stadium that guarantees you a prime experience. I'm willing to bet what (if ever) KW plans to built won't come anywhere near TD place. TD place is a nice CFL stadium but watching soccer in a mostly empty stadium isn't most people's ideal game day experience. grasshopper1917, DannyFromToronto23 and Greatest Cockney Rip Off 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 46 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: No he doesn't. Now can we get back to the subject matter of the thread? That cemetery plot looks ideal to me in location terms and with suitable access (the main sticking point), there's no problem putting a pop-up in there on a Halifax sort of scale. If what Rollins claimed was accurate (his track record is mixed at best), I strongly suspect the location would be there rather than the parking lot at the intersection. Will be interesting to see what unfolds. The cemetery plot doesn't have enough space, I don't see why you don't get that. Unnamed Trialist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 8 minutes ago, ReedOnTheGrand said: The cemetery plot doesn't have enough space, I don't see why you don't get that. It does if you hate trees lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 3 hours ago, Ansem said: It does if you hate trees lol That would bring up some disturbing the dead problems and still be way to tight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironcub14 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) 20 hours ago, ReedOnTheGrand said: TD place is a nice CFL stadium but watching soccer in a mostly empty stadium isn't most people's ideal game day experience. You ever watched a Fury game at TD Place? I'm gonna guess by the statement above that you never have. Most of the 4-7,000 fans that watch the game are confined/restricted to the lower half of the south side, and only since last year or so have they opened up a sliver of the lower half of the north side. The renovated TD Place/Lansdowne has been a godsend to Ottawa football, both codes of em. Try telling us about an ideal gameday experience in Ottawa after you've experienced it firsthand for once. To relate it to the rest of the thread, the CFL/CPL partnership is a massive boon to CPL, due in big part to the CFL stadiums available to the CPL clubs. The familiarity that fans have with the stadiums from following CFL and the amenities, this will all help massively in attracting the casual fans outside of this board. Edited July 31, 2017 by ironcub14 m-g-williams, Ivanovski94, Zem and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironcub14 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 On 2017-07-29 at 4:17 PM, Complete Homer said: Was the Ottaw Fury not averaging ~500 as a PDL team? Now averaging ~5500 just a few years into its professional history. KW isn't an identical market to Ottawa, but not completely unreasonable to think that they could outgrow 5000 well before the of a stadium's lifecycle On 2017-07-30 at 2:45 AM, shamrock said: But they have a fantastic stadium that guarantees you a prime experience. I'm willing to bet what (if ever) KW plans to built won't come anywhere near TD place. Both very good points. Any Fury fan in Ottawa can tell you that, if the 2017 Fury were still playing at Algonquin, where they played PDL, or at Carleton, where they played the first half of its NASL debut season, with its metal bleachers and zero amenities, the team wouldn't average 2,000 in attendance. Modular stadiums are nice, but don't knock the CFL stadiums or underestimate its importance in attracting casual sports fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 5 hours ago, ironcub14 said: You ever watched a Fury game at TD Place? I'm gonna guess by the statement above that you never have. Most of the 4-7,000 fans that watch the game are confined/restricted to the lower half of the south side, and only since last year or so have they opened up a sliver of the lower half of the north side. The renovated TD Place/Lansdowne has been a godsend to Ottawa football, both codes of em. Try telling us about an ideal gameday experience in Ottawa after you've experienced it firsthand for once. To relate it to the rest of the thread, the CFL/CPL partnership is a massive boon to CPL, due in big part to the CFL stadiums available to the CPL clubs. The familiarity that fans have with the stadiums from following CFL and the amenities, this will all help massively in attracting the casual fans outside of this board. Look I'm sure it's a fine venue, didn't mean to offend anyone. My best friend who goes to school at UOttawa said the stadium experience wasn't very good so I'm going off that. There's a reason people want nice intimate venues where all the fans are close to the pitch, having large stadiums largely empty is a turn off for a lot of people. 4 hours ago, ironcub14 said: Both very good points. Any Fury fan in Ottawa can tell you that, if the 2017 Fury were still playing at Algonquin, where they played PDL, or at Carleton, where they played the first half of its NASL debut season, with its metal bleachers and zero amenities, the team wouldn't average 2,000 in attendance. Modular stadiums are nice, but don't knock the CFL stadiums or underestimate its importance in attracting casual sports fans. Modular != pop-up. This is Modular, being built now, http://www.zja.nl/en/page/1562/stadium-fc-dordrechtAnd this is a pop-up ironcub14 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 17 hours ago, ironcub14 said: ...Modular stadiums are nice, but don't knock the CFL stadiums or underestimate its importance in attracting casual sports fans. ...and for the purposes of this thread bear in mind that K-W doesn't have access to one of those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisinOrleans Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 If the CanPL is to succeed, and fans willing, it will, it will need access to more than LCF stadiums. In my opinion, partnering with university or collège (or Cégep) stadiums makes the most sense in the short term – just like the Ottawa Fury did in their inaugural season. In Moncton, they would have to use the Université de Moncton stadium, which has hosted les jeux de la Francophonie before, and the FIFA Women’s World Cup. It seats 12,000. Likewise, Stade Telus at Université Laval in Québec only seats 12,000, but has hosted the Vanier Cup several times, and it is (reasonably) central to the city core. If a team comes to Trois-Rivières, Chicoutimi, Gatineau, Sudbury or Sherbrooke; they’ll find themselves in a similar situation, with the only stadiums available, with sufficient capacity, transit access and parking, being the ones at local universities. Of those 5 markets (of more than 200k people), there are already stadiums with 4k capacity at all those universities. coppercanuck 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 (edited) The problem is that most of those have permanent football gridiron markings on fieldturf and some didn't leave the extra space needed to provide the extra width needed for a pro level soccer field (as attitudes to soccer can still be quite hostile sometimes amongst the Canadian football fraternity). The way to potentially address that is with systems like Nexxturf tiles that can be installed on top of the football gridiron and even portions of adjacent running track (Rayo Oklahoma provide a recent example), but what is not clear is how viable that would be in parts of the year when the seasons overlap (this will include the end of the season when the champion is being decided and interest should be at its highest ) and it's worth bearing in mind that the stadium being kept off limits for pro soccer could also start to conflict with intramural sports. Edited August 1, 2017 by BringBackTheBlizzard ChrisinOrleans and CDNFootballer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisinOrleans Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 Is that more of a problem with university stadiums, or with LCF stadiums? Both have suffered from the issue of gridiron lines on the pitch. The only stadiums that are immune are soccer specific stadiums, of which only one exists in the entire country – Stade Saputo in Montréal. I mean, even BMO in Toronto shares the field with the Argos, and has been torn up before a soccer match due to football. I cannot see their being too much conflict with the intramurals, since all of those universities mentioned (except Université de Montréal, Collège Montmorency) have alternative fields right next door, or an indoor fieldhouse. Additionally, the university would benefit from the rents accrued from the CanPL, which might make a lot of administrators salivate at the prospect of increased revenue. That’s principally the reason why Université de Moncton has hosted Allouete’s and Argos games in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 4 hours ago, ChrisinOrleans said: If the CanPL is to succeed, and fans willing, it will, it will need access to more than LCF stadiums. In my opinion, partnering with university or collège (or Cégep) stadiums makes the most sense in the short term – just like the Ottawa Fury did in their inaugural season. In Moncton, they would have to use the Université de Moncton stadium, which has hosted les jeux de la Francophonie before, and the FIFA Women’s World Cup. It seats 12,000. Likewise, Stade Telus at Université Laval in Québec only seats 12,000, but has hosted the Vanier Cup several times, and it is (reasonably) central to the city core. If a team comes to Trois-Rivières, Chicoutimi, Gatineau, Sudbury or Sherbrooke; they’ll find themselves in a similar situation, with the only stadiums available, with sufficient capacity, transit access and parking, being the ones at local universities. Of those 5 markets (of more than 200k people), there are already stadiums with 4k capacity at all those universities. As long as they can cover the football marking for the games then it's fine. I think 12k is more than enough Capacity for CPL, and the league would be very stupid to not be looking for a Québec ownership group. (BTW like the Franco-Ontarian flag profile picture, makes me think of home) CDNFootballer, Ivanovski94 and ChrisinOrleans 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 Article on modular stadium (thanks to Kevin for tweeting it out) http://midfieldpress.com/2017/08/14/understanding-modular-stadiums-the-future-of-lower-division-soccer/ maccaliam, Complete Homer, NVsoccer and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rheo Posted August 20, 2017 Share Posted August 20, 2017 Belan from the Sask group tweeted this article out, interesting stuff and now of course we have something new to read too much into https://www.google.ca/amp/s/cartilagefreecaptain.sbnation.com/platform/amp/2015/10/9/9472553/tottenham-hotspur-northumberland-development-project-stadium-retractable-pitch-nfl matty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Since there's been no official movement but lots of argument here do you non KW people want me to give you a tour of the rumored downtown locations? I've got nothing to do so i figured I could show you guys the locations, with the amount of work done there recently google maps/earth doesn't show what it actually looks like. Levi Oakey, BradMack, Alex D and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 Alright, I made a bit of a different video than what I originally said, however I still plan to do what I said I would. Sadly the video quality isn't great but I'll work on that for the main video I planned(I think I'll do it friday or next week). Anyways it should be up tonight and I'll throw up a link, hope it's informative/interesting. Levi Oakey, Gopherbashi and BuzzAndSting 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 Alright, sorry for the poor quality and rants, hope it's a little informative. I've already figured out pretty quality when recording my screen so next time(if it happens) will be better. If I got anything wrong let me know. johnyb, ironcub14, harrycoyster and 5 others 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReedOnTheGrand Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 So I finally went out to the location and got some pictures (I'll post them later when I can compile things together) smaller location is owned by the schoolboard and was very recently re-done. Parking lot location is private owned(maybe privately run not owned but I presume the first). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad_Impact Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 (edited) Looks like an old English stadium Edited September 21, 2017 by Chad_Impact toontownman, ReedOnTheGrand, Ivanovski94 and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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