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WCQ Canada-Mexico 25 March Postgame


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9 hours ago, Canada1 said:

 

The Beaver

We have players playing at high enough levels that should not experience a loss like this. This is not good enough. 

I'm. sorry but I blame it on the coach. Not good enough. 

I wish it was true, that we have many players playing at high levels, but it simply isn't true. Not compared to Mexico, at least. I am disappointed in the performance, yes, but to think we could have fielded a better team is naive. We still would have lost. Our best guys had poor games. We don't have any better players. Not yet at least. Until we have 18 players of Hutch's caliber, we cannot reasonably expect to compete with teams like Mexico

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ok I have no voice from yelling and have a headache to go with that. 

I don't think it comes to anyone's surprise I'm not a fan of El Sr Floro, never been and never will: his tactics, his player selection, his post game comments of no belief. 

i was surprised Canada did have its chances not surprised by the lack of finish. I can't blame Floro for Larin and Hoillett missing those shots. Shocked Benito didn't employ the T.T.T.  Turtle Turtle Tactic but then again crowd of 55,000 you don't want to look like a coward snooze fest. 

Does he call the shots or what? Why choose old players that have no gas or players out of position ? And what's his love affair with some other ones that just can't produce? Is someone else telling him who to play? CSA illuminati?

4 games and only 1 goal (off a back!) all I have to say is "turtles turtles rah rah rah hmm I love turtles"

note- we played better vs Mex in Edmonton in 2008 with less talent. I believe this team can perform better under a different philosophy and someone who actually is not afraid to put guys on that can make a difference  no bs crap of guys on unattached FC or players who already had their shot and are past their prime  if we played attack we'd have 6pts by now no doubt  

 

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2 hours ago, Yohan said:

Mexican FA is very quick to pull the trigger on firing managers at even hint of bad form or controversy. After WC 2014 cycle, relying on the Yanks to bail them out, Mexico can't afford any slip ups that might hurt their confidence.

Agree. They even turfed Sven Goren Erickson when he was shitting the bed in 09.  Although in Mexico they live breathe die football. They analyze everything to death and under a big microscope and expose anything with several broadcasters and talking heads. Here the CSA is lucky that the population doesn't think twice they just walk away or tune off the tv and it's an after thought. Even with our analysts and broadcasters: they don't give enough attention or they're in the CSA click media is just smoke fake butt kissing that shy away from asking the real questions that hurt. That's tabboo. The only people here that criticize is us on this board. 

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8 hours ago, BuzzAndSting said:

I think I'm missing something, who should have been cap tied?

Is Vitoria Cap-tied yet? Not from what I saw as he sat on the bench the whole match. I don't remember him playing an International match that would have had him cap tied to Canada. Arfield on the other hand was not Cap-tied until the start of the second half. In my opinion and I am sure there are many on here that would agree that Arfield should have started over Ricketsss and Vitoria should have started over Straith or Jakovich.

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Moldy9 said:

ok I have no voice from yelling and have a headache to go with that. 

I don't think it comes to anyone's surprise I'm not a fan of El Sr Floro, never been and never will: his tactics, his player selection, his post game comments of no belief. 

i was surprised Canada did have its chances not surprised by the lack of finish. I can't blame Floro for Larin and Hoillett missing those shots. Shocked Benito didn't employ the T.T.T.  Turtle Turtle Tactic but then again crowd of 55,000 you don't want to look like a coward snooze fest. 

Does he call the shots or what? Why choose old players that have no gas or players out of position ? And what's his love affair with some other ones that just can't produce? Is someone else telling him who to play? CSA illuminati?

4 games and only 1 goal (off a back!) all I have to say is "turtles turtles rah rah rah hmm I love turtles"

note- we played better vs Mex in Edmonton in 2008 with less talent. I believe this team can perform better under a different philosophy and someone who actually is not afraid to put guys on that can make a difference  no bs crap of guys on unattached FC or players who already had their shot and are past their prime  if we played attack we'd have 6pts by now no doubt  

 

image.jpeg

I agree. How does Ricketts get a start over Arfield? That does not make any sense especially in a high profile match against Mexico.  

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13 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

Yeah, losing to Mexico is not a shocker.  But losing by 3, at home, in that way, in fron of that crowd, under a coach that named that starting 11, with glaring misses by what were supposed to be our shiny new talents - that fucking sucks.

I think this sums up my thoughts on last night's game. The loss, in isolation, is not the end of the world. But THAT loss, leaves a pretty bad taste in my mouth. So, having said that, the positives of yesterday for me are:

1. The crowd. Big and pro-Canadian. Thumbs up from me on that.

2. Borjan looked great in goal.

3. Vitoria didn't play. 

4. We got the biggest crowd to the Calgary watch party that we've ever had.

In my opinion last night's game can also be a positive in that it kicks Canadian soccer, and their supporters, in the ass and points out that "things are still not okay". After thinking about the match for most of the morning, I believe it was a stark reminder of just how far Canada has to go before we can hang on the big stage with some of the world's finest. Really, all that Canada has achieved to date is finding a way to get pummelled in front of more pro-Canadian eyes with new players in the mix.

Remember that we still only have 5 professional domestic clubs developing Canadian talent, and even then hardly any developed talent is actually playing game in and game out on those clubs. Perhaps last night's game opens up more eyes to the fact that we need to continue to make improvements to the development of Canadian talent so that we can produce players that can compete when it matters, like last night. Because right now we are still failing to do so.

Edited by shermanator
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What the fuck do you people want, it turns out we still can't finish but aside from that, the chances were there. We lost against a consistent round of 16 finisher in the World Cup when we haven't even qualified for the World Cup since before I was born. Jakovic fucked up on the first goal more so than Henry and definitely more so than Straith so get off his back. No CB we have except maybe Henry is keeping up with Lozano after that turn over for the second goal. Losing both of these games changes nothing. It was always unlikely that we would get a point against Mexico.

Stay the course and play the Floro way against El Salvador and Honduras and maybe we get into the Hex. So far, so good on that front.

Also for the love of everything don't play Arfield or Hoilett against Mexico on Tuesday, hell I'd prefer if the results go reasonably well that we don't play them against Honduras either.

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I probably won't make any friends with this post but it's never stopped me before :)

The Vs have always found a convenient whipping boy to scapegoat and now it happens to be Ricketts.  As far as I know last night he didn't miss any obvious sitters that could have changed the course of the game; which leads me to my second point.

We've had players in the past who were severely criticized and scapegoated because they didn't fit the mold, they "looked" fat and out of shape ie Gerba and Corrazin except for one little problem.  Unlike the present, they had only one job to do and they did it, if they had a chance they were able to finish. 

If a guy like Gerba's only job is to finish his one and only chance and just score one goal and do absolutely nothing else (track back etc) he has done his job.  Had we had somebody capable of doing that last night the whole complexion of the game and how it is played and the strategy employed changes.

Even "Chicarito" or whatever the hell his name is finished his chance when we was ruled offside.  I don't care if we have to dig Fatty Foulke from the grave, give him citizenship, and make him a forward, the guy with this skill needs to be playing.

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1 hour ago, Coramoor said:

Also for the love of everything don't play Arfield or Hoilett against Mexico on Tuesday, hell I'd prefer if the results go reasonably well that we don't play them against Honduras either.

It won't go reasonably well if they aren't playing.

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7 minutes ago, canta15 said:

It won't go reasonably well if they aren't playing.

I think he's talking about the results between honduras and el salvador on tuesday. ie. if honduras ties or loses we probably dont even need to get a result in honduras and its for all the marbles against el salvador

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6 minutes ago, Keegan said:

We need to play our best team every match from here on out, we can't worry about cards.  How stupid would we look if we sat out Hoilett/Arfield Tuesday and then they are injured in September anyway?  

 

ya. completely disagree. 

we need to man manage to make the hex. this isn't a sprint. we don't have the depth. 

we can't control if they're injured. even if they're playing in mexico we still lose. 

arfield is injured anyways.

I can spin your argument. what if we play Arfield and Hoilett in Mexico and we lose 5-0 and they both picked up yellows and both miss Honduras in September but are in top form and heathly to start the english season. we then go down to honduras without our 2 best playmakers and get slaughtered....... how stupid would we look.... but they played in mexico!!

we need to get a result against Honduras and el salvador to make the hex. what we do against mexico won't make or break our chances. if we lost in honduras or at home to el savlador it would break our chances.

we need to put ourselves in the best position to get a result against honduras and el salvador. risking our best players to keep it close against mexico meaning they dont play the crucial matches is just ridiculous

Edited by king1010
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I'm ouzzled why Floro doesn't use more youths?? We played the JDH, DeJong, Henry's, etc from the last WCQ withouy success.  Since the Mexico game will be awash, as I honestly don't see us getting a tie, even with parkin the bus, so we play a no pressure game and give the youth a chance to play like Bustos, Froese, adekugbe.  If the scoreline is held respectable like 1 or 2-0 then put in defenders in the 2nd half and keep that score.   Unfortunately Canada isn't the Impact and get a tie outta this.  We have no Piatti like player to keep the Mexicans on their toes.  Lets put all our eggs on Honduras as we got legs to maybe squeeze a tie.  The El Salvador game should be a win or bust.  We'll need I believe 4 points to make it to the Hex the final 2 matches.  Anything less and Canada doesn't deserve to go like usual anf its bye bye Floro anf back to the drawing board.

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10 minutes ago, nolbertos said:

I'm ouzzled why Floro doesn't use more youths?? We played the JDH, DeJong, Henry's, etc from the last WCQ withouy success.  Since the Mexico game will be awash, as I honestly don't see us getting a tie, even with parkin the bus, so we play a no pressure game and give the youth a chance to play like Bustos, Froese, adekugbe.  If the scoreline is held respectable like 1 or 2-0 then put in defenders in the 2nd half and keep that score.   Unfortunately Canada isn't the Impact and get a tie outta this.  We have no Piatti like player to keep the Mexicans on their toes.  Lets put all our eggs on Honduras as we got legs to maybe squeeze a tie.  The El Salvador game should be a win or bust.  We'll need I believe 4 points to make it to the Hex the final 2 matches.  Anything less and Canada doesn't deserve to go like usual anf its bye bye Floro anf back to the drawing board.

Actually that was Henry's first WCQ. Which makes it even more baffling that he started at RB last night.

 

I'm glad our players know they have to push for 3 points every game.  To think that we should just lay down in Mexico and hope for 4 points against Honduras/ES is unrealistic.  

As if that would be any easier.  Honduras away is a tough, tough place as we know and never count on Canada at home when they need a win.  

This is WCQ, I think we have just as good a shot at drawing Mexico away as we do Honduras away.  I think the mistake we made going into Friday was having our players and media talking a big game.. it gave Mexico something to play for and motivated them IMO.  I think now that Mexico has qualified and they'll be at home after a big away win they're going to be naturally a little cocky now, I think we can hang on for a point.  We'll need a lot of luck and some good performances but it can be done.

Edited by Keegan
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Okay, I started this thread and went to bed. Got up went to the Tarragona countryside to cycle through the almond trees blooming, had a paella at the beach, saw Miró's famous farmhouse, drove back and read this thread. Here's my 2 bits.

Our problem was not essentially the back line, so don't understand why people are going on about it. Even the first goal: did you see the time they had for that cross? Our midfield of JDG, Johnson and Hutch was absolutely terrible, they did not work together, pass together, give anyone options forwards or support well at the back, and played way below their pedigree. That was probably Atiba's worst match for Canada, I can't believe you are forgiving him, he played like he was an u-21. He missed about 5 dumb passes, one giveaway leading to a goal and did not lead on the pitch. Those guys have to do way more, can't lose the ball so dumbly, have to get free and give options to their teammates, and have to support the back line. They did none of that. 

Piette was better than JDG, if you did not see that  you are being biased. He has rhythm playing out, more than any other mid for Canada right now. 

We did not finish, but hey, even great players can miss. It pissed me off, esp seeing Larin had no left foot but went to his left (there was a long cross he did with his right, horrible to see). But I sort of forgive it, poor teams can't finish and good teams can, that is a difference you see all the time and it explains why stronger teams and clubs succeed.

One essential difference between Canada and Mexico. Their mids receive facing up field, in movement, ours coming back facing our goal, compromised. That is poor positional play and Floro does not know how to fix it, I appreciate the guy but he is very limited tactically. Any coach from Spain with a bit of top flight experience and 20 years younger would do better with Canada than he does. I could name about  a dozen.

One thing that irks me about Floro: many great coaches have a good second, with tactical ideas. Benito prefers yes-men and you can see that, guys who are afraid to say boo to him. That is very old-fashioned and I think it does not benefit him at all. 

 

Edited by Unnamed Trialist
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19 minutes ago, Keegan said:

Actually that was Henry's first WCQ. Which makes it even more baffling that he started at RB last night.

 

I'm glad our players know they have to push for 3 points every game.  To think that we should just lay down in Mexico and hope for 4 points against Honduras/ES is unrealistic.  

As if that would be any easier.  Honduras away is a tough, tough place as we know and never count on Canada at home when they need a win.  

This is WCQ, I think we have just as good a shot at drawing Mexico away as we do Honduras away.  I think the mistake we made going into Friday was having our players and media talking a big game.. it gave Mexico something to play for and motivated them IMO.  I think now that Mexico has qualified and they'll be at home after a big away win they're going to be naturally a little cocky now, I think we can hang on for a point.  We'll need a lot of luck and some good performances but it can be done.

I just don't see those two bolded points being the case as much as I'd love to believe them. 

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33 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

 Even the first goal: did you see the time they had for that cross? Our midfield of JDG, Johnson and Hutch was absolutely terrible.

 

I think the problem was the centre-mid's pressing so high up the field. Often it was one of the centre mid's pressuring the Mexico centre back, then when the ball was moved, one of them would push out to the wing leaving an immense amount of space in the middle of the park for Mexico. I think this is tactical and I think it was a huge mistake from Floro. I put that on him. 

I also think Hutch had to push up to provide some service for the strikers which vacated the midfield.

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4 minutes ago, Califax said:

We lost and ill take it... But how the two footer on dejong 5 mins in and bringing down atiba in the box werent cards, ill never know.

The ref was a coward.

honestly you have to look at it both ways. the ref was good. he was consistent. 

that 2 footed studs up tackle by hoilett couldve been a straight red. that trip up by straith in the box coudlve easily been a pk. 

the ref was consistent and called the game the same both ways. thats all you can ask for. don't think he was a coward.

Edited by king1010
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