Andreas Vaikla

[BuzzAndSting]

17 minutes ago, Ottawafan74 said:

You meant to say where the OSA/CSA didn't feel like going to scout Twardek. 

Just read your post history. Obviously you're connected to Twardek somehow and this topic has been discussed at length here already so I won't get into it again.

[hamiltonfan]

He is open to doing an interview with any of our media/blog guys...just reach out.

[Olympique_de_Marseille]

So back during the October 2015 window (the 8th, 10th & 13th) he played 90+minutes in all 3 of Estonia's UEFA U-19 qualifying games. They failed to make the next round and he ages out before the next U-19s so that was it for him at that level:

http://www.uefa.com/under19/season=2016/matches/round=2000601/match=2015982/postmatch/lineups/index.html
http://www.uefa.com/under19/season=2016/matches/round=2000601/match=2016007/postmatch/lineups/index.html
http://www.uefa.com/under19/season=2016/matches/round=2000601/match=2016034/postmatch/lineups/index.html

 

Now just last week at the end of March he was called into camp with the senior team but only for the first game against Norway (March 24th). (He was on the bench).  http://www.espn.co.uk/football/lineups?gameId=441667

Then, because Estonia are also out of the UEFA U-21's but with qualifying games left to play and he will still be young enough for the next round of U-21's  (that end in 2019), and because the coaches see potential in him (and possibly because Estonia's current U-21 keepers suck or will age out before 2019 ) they shifted Vaikla over to the the starting role for the U-21s against Croatia on March 28th (played all 90+). 

http://www.uefa.com/under21/season=2017/matches/round=2000649/match=2016251/postmatch/lineups/index.html

Estonia still has 1 game left in September & 2 games in October (all meaningless) but it'll be a chance for Vaikla to prove himself for the next cycle. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_UEFA_European_Under-21_Championship_qualification_Group_6

This is somewhat good news for us because if he's with the U-21s we won't risk him getting cap-tied with the senior camp during WCQs in September & October.

Edited April 3, 2016 by Olympique_de_Marseille

[Ottawafan74]

18 hours ago, BuzzAndSting said:

Just read your post history. Obviously you're connected to Twardek somehow and this topic has been discussed at length here already so I won't get into it again.

Never met him and saw him play once. Just don't like when people misconstrue the facts to further their ignorant argument.  OSA and CSA do a poor job identifying talent and we as fans should be extremely concerned the mistakes of the past continue. 

[BuzzAndSting]

5 hours ago, Ottawafan74 said:

Never met him and saw him play once. Just don't like when people misconstrue the facts to further their ignorant argument.  OSA and CSA do a poor job identifying talent and we as fans should be extremely concerned the mistakes of the past continue. 

So if you've never met him and you've only seen him play once then how are you so sure you know the facts?

[El Hombre]

5 hours ago, Ottawafan74 said:

Never met him and saw him play once. Just don't like when people misconstrue the facts to further their ignorant argument.  OSA and CSA do a poor job identifying talent and we as fans should be extremely concerned the mistakes of the past continue. 

The ironing of this post is delicious.

[Ottawafan74]

2 hours ago, BuzzAndSting said:

So if you've never met him and you've only seen him play once then how are you so sure you know the facts?

I've coached for 20 years and have had numerous kids deal with provincials/nationals. I know people in the club and know people who know him personally; watched as they went thru the frustration of dealing with our soccer governing bodies and their lack of interest in the 97 boys team. 

Again don't attack the kid in this instance. Both he and the club went above and beyond to attract the attention of OSA/CSA. Yet they refused to give him a chance. Funny how Milwall gave him that shot as did the Czechs. Two others from the 97 squad eventually found their way into nat programs. 

[Ottawafan74]

2 hours ago, El Hombre said:

The ironing of this post is delicious.

Would be interested in hearing your take on Twardeks situation. 

[BuzzAndSting]

2 minutes ago, Ottawafan74 said:

I've coached for 20 years and have had numerous kids deal with provincials/nationals. I know people in the club and know people who know him personally; watched as they went thru the frustration of dealing with our soccer governing bodies and their lack of interest in the 97 boys team. 

Again don't attack the kid in this instance. Both he and the club went above and beyond to attract the attention of OSA/CSA. Yet they refused to give him a chance. Funny how Milwall gave him that shot as did the Czechs. Two others from the 97 squad eventually found their way into nat programs. 

Sounds like bias and hersay to me. 

I don't profess to know the situation but I do fault Twardek and his family for giving up on playing for Canada at age 16. If playing for Canada was his first choice than he wouldn't have jumped ship at the first opportunity. If he had been continually ignored into his later teens I may agree with you but missing out at one age group is not an excuse for actively pursuing a spot with another national team. 

[Ottawafan74]

13 minutes ago, BuzzAndSting said:

Sounds like bias and hersay to me. 

I don't profess to know the situation but I do fault Twardek and his family for giving up on playing for Canada at age 16. If playing for Canada was his first choice than he wouldn't have jumped ship at the first opportunity. If he had been continually ignored into his later teens I may agree with you but missing out at one age group is not an excuse for actively pursuing a spot with another national team. 

Sounds like pure ignorance on your part. You don't know the situation but you have no problems formulating an uneducated opinion on the matter.

 

[BuzzAndSting]

1 minute ago, Ottawafan74 said:

Sounds like pure ignorance on your part. You don't know the situation but you have no problems formulating an uneducated opinion on the matter.

 

My opinion is based on the fact that he made his first appearance for the Czechs at the age of 16. I don't need anything else. Even if he was so agregiously ignored at the age of 14 or 15 by the OSA or the CSA, which still has not been established, I would expect him to continue to pursue a career with Canada, if that's what he ultimately wanted. 

Seeing as you know people who know people maybe you can explain to us ignorant and uneducated folk how the Czech FA came to know of Twardek? Do they reguarly scout youth leagues in Arnprior and Ottawa? Or do they follow the tours of Canadian youth league teams in England?

[Ottawafan74]

If a kid is good enough for the Czech Republic to scoop him up chances are he should have been good enough to warrant at least a try out with our national team. CSA is right down town. And it wouldn't have taken much for the CSA coaches to head over to an OYSL game to see them play. 

Funny thing is OSU even called up the CSA after Twardek had been invited to play with the Czechs to see if they'd reconsider giving him a shot. They passed again. 

 

Edited April 4, 2016 by Ottawafan74

[BuzzAndSting]

Just now, Ottawafan74 said:

If a kid is good enough for the Czech Republic to scoop him up chances are he should have been good enough to warrant a try out with our national team. CSA is right down town. And it wouldn't have taken much for the CSA coaches to head over to an OYSL game to see them play. 

Funny thing is OSU even called up the CSA after Twardek had been invited to play with the Czechs to see if they'd reconsider giving him a shot. They passed again. 

 

CSA coaches are working out of the Metcalfe offices? I thought all technical staff was based in Toronto.

So you don't know how the Czech FA came to know of Twardek?

Seeing as you've coached for 20 years, when you cut a player do you tell them to give up trying out for your club, quit and then go try another club?

[Ottawafan74]

1 minute ago, BuzzAndSting said:

CSA coaches are working out of the Metcalfe offices? I thought all technical staff was based in Toronto.

So you don't know how the Czech FA came to know of Twardek?

Seeing as you've coached for 20 years, when you cut a player do you tell them to give up trying out for your club, quit and then go try another club?

Coaches come to town and they can also see them in Toronto during the OYSL games. 

I'm guessing once he got to Milwall he got on the radar of the Czechs. Probably the club there or someone he knew contacted the Czechs. Who seemingly were more than pleased to give him an opportunity. Again you keep avoiding the underlying issue here...why didn't Canadian coaches give him a shot when others, at higher levels, were more than pleased to?

And if I coached a crappy team and cut a kid who I never even let try out and he had a chance to make one of the top teams in the league I'd be happy for him but more importantly I'd question my talent evaluation. 

 

[BuzzAndSting]

8 minutes ago, Ottawafan74 said:

Coaches come to town and they can also see them in Toronto during the OYSL games. 

I'm guessing once he got to Milwall he got on the radar of the Czechs. Probably the club there or someone he knew contacted the Czechs. Who seemingly were more than pleased to give him an opportunity. Again you keep avoiding the underlying issue here...why didn't Canadian coaches give him a shot when others, at higher levels, were more than pleased to?

And if I coached a crappy team and cut a kid who I never even let try out and he had a chance to make one of the top teams in the league I'd be happy for him but more importantly I'd question my talent evaluation. 

 

Why didn't the Canada coaches give him a shot at the age 14 or 15? I have no idea. There's a multitude of answers, maybe he didn't fit in with the teams plans, maybe there were players better than him, maybe they didn't rate him when he was evaluated? Even if one set of coaches ignored him at such a young age I wouldn't advocate giving up.

The point is the Twardek's have admitted that they sent highlights packs of Kris' games while playing in England to the Czech FA. Kris himself has admitted it was his dream to play for the Czech Republic. This is not a case of a player being agregiously snubbed by the CSA, this is a case of kid and his family who wanted to play for another nation and they did everything in there power to make that happen. 

I don't fault Kris or his family for their decision, it is what is in world football. Besides the chance of him ever becoming a player of sognificance is slim. What I do fault is apologist like you who ignore the facts and blame everything on the CSA. 

[Ottawafan74]

If the CSA coaches couldn't take the time to evaluate him, bring him to a try out or even scout his games how can they determine he isn't quality enough to be part of the program?  Too many kids are falling through the cracks yet we want to put the blame on a kid wishes to strive to higher level. In this case the CSA f'ed up. 

Bigger issue is they have not learned from their mistakes and are continuing to inproperly evaluate talent. In fact it's getting worse; basically the CSA won't look at a kid unless they are in one of the five pro youth programs ( possibly four soon ) or are provincial. 

I'm not anti CSA. Just calling a spade a spade. 

[SthMelbRed]

Am I to understand that this Twardek kid 'has always felt Czech' in the manner that Whoregraves 'always felt English' yet would never dream of giving up all the comforts and privileges that Canadian citizenship provides them and their families in order to live out their days amongst their spiritual brethren?

[BuzzAndSting]

14 minutes ago, SthMelbRed said:

Am I to understand that this Twardek kid 'has always felt Czech' in the manner that Whoregraves 'always felt English' yet would never dream of giving up all the comforts and privileges that Canadian citizenship provides them and their families in order to live out their days amongst their spiritual brethren?

Seems like it. And I wouldn't necessarily be overly upset if he did, that's his choice. But to those who blame this on the CSA when he obviously had one goal in mind is ridiculous.

[Ottawafan74]

It's not those. It's me. 

The CSA dropped the ball on this one. They chose not to look at him and when given a chance to scoop him from the Czechs they blew him off. Again. They can't complain about him going in another direction. 

Not sure why you can't seem to allow that to sink in. Guess it's easier to rip the kid instead. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

Having read the thread I think the arguments in favour of calling out the CSA on this are better, more balanced and more convincing than those defending the CSA, which I think you are doing irrationally.

Obviously they screwed up, clearly they do not do the job right, and no--if you feel snubbed and are ambitious you have to move forwards if you find you have the chance. In football, as I suppose the boy's parents or some coach understood, 16 is not young. Waiting around to be ignored or trying again is what you do if you have no other option, trying for a chance somewhere else is what you do when you have that other option. 

In any case, the Estonia mix is not superior to the Canadian mix, there is no evidence we are really missing out in a big way, after all.

[SthMelbRed]

Honestly, I have no problem with Begovic wanting to play for Bosnia, even if him playing the lying dickhead on Vancouver radio when he'd already signed the switch papers rankles a bit. I don't doubt that he'll stay in Europe after he finishes playing, maybe even in Bosnia. 

However, I have no respect for the 'always X nationality' bastards like Hargreaves and JDG2 who revert back to being Canadian as soon as the final ball is kicked. Hargreaves and his fake Manc accent were back in Canada even before he'd officially retired. I'm willing to bet any amount of money that Jonothan De Guzman will be living permanently in the GTO area within months of finishing up the European portion of his playing career ending. All those Dutch feelings won't mean much then, will they?

Will this Twardek character be any different? 

[BuzzAndSting]

3 minutes ago, Ottawafan74 said:

It's not those. It's me. 

The CSA dropped the ball on this one. They chose not to look at him and when given a chance to scoop him from the Czechs they blew him off. Again. They can't complain about him going in another direction. 

Not sure why you can't seem to allow that to sink in. Guess it's easier to rip the kid instead. 

I never ripped the kid at all? I've actually said I don't blame him or his family.

[Big_M]

All this arguing for someone who will probably never become a pro

[El Hombre]

3 hours ago, Ottawafan74 said:

If the CSA coaches couldn't take the time to evaluate him, bring him to a try out or even scout his games how can they determine he isn't quality enough to be part of the program?  Too many kids are falling through the cracks yet we want to put the blame on a kid wishes to strive to higher level. In this case the CSA f'ed up. 

Bigger issue is they have not learned from their mistakes and are continuing to inproperly evaluate talent. In fact it's getting worse; basically the CSA won't look at a kid unless they are in one of the five pro youth programs ( possibly four soon ) or are provincial. 

I'm not anti CSA. Just calling a spade a spade. 

Or you're making stuff up.  One of the two.

The actual timeline of events is as follows:
November 2012: Goes over to Millwall for a trial.
July 2013: Moves to London after joining their Academy.
November 2013: Played his first game for the Czech U17 team.

During that time, the only camps he would've qualified for would've been our own U17 team.  It would be interesting to know which of Bustos, Froese, Boakai or any of the rest of our U17 team that played at the World Cup that you would drop for this kid from Kinburn.  Don't forget that this would be the same U17 World Cup that the Czech Republic didn't qualify for.

So, I'm not sure what special considerations you expect the CSA to make for this kid who, to be frank, was just another kid in an English academy.  If you've followed the national team for any length of time, you would know that our history has been riddled with kids at English academies.  Some make it, some don't. 

Now to conjecture: it is a stretch to believe that this kid needed to go on trial with a second rate academy like Millwall's to get noticed but then somehow is amazing enough in two months of academy action to catch the eye of the Czech Republic FA.  To believe it happened that way seems a little naive.  If it did, good for him, I had no idea the Czechs had scouts checking birth certificates of non-English players on teams that are just coming off seasons where they were two points away from being relegated from the Championship.  It's a little more believable that, once he made it to England (or perhaps even before), he (or his agent) lobbied the Czech Republic FA so that they notice him.  I don't think I've made too many leaps in logic there.

I'll admit that ten-fifteen years ago, you may have had a point.  However to maintain that things are getting worse is just ridiculous.  Will kids fall through the cracks?  For sure.  However this happens quite a bit, all over the world, especially for kids that are under 16.  You're lucky to be able to use your expert skill in hindsight to determine that this was a missed opportunity.  However, to use this as a jumping off point for your axe-grinding is tiresome.  There's obviously blame for both parties but to expect this to not happen in the future is ludicrous.

[jpg75]

Doesn't Kris Twardek have his own thread?