Whitecaps 2016

[BearcatSA]

8 hours ago, TRM said:

It's official.

http://www.whitecapsfc.com/post/2016/07/11/whitecaps-fc-sign-canadian-international-defender-david-edgar

and so is the other one

http://www.whitecapsfc.com/post/2016/07/11/whitecaps-fc-sign-canadian-international-defender-marcel-de-jong

So our back line just got a huge boost.

Good for Cancon, but for the on field improvement I'll take a wait-and-see on this one for the time being.

[Ruffian]

Staying up late in Toronto to watch the game tonight to catch a glimpse of your two new CanMNT players. Jealous!

[TRM]

Robbo was saying MDJ was game ready but that Edgar might need a bit to get up to game ready. Depends on the position. If they play him at CB and push Parker out to RB (most likely IMHO) then he could start tonight. If he's playing RB that's a lot more running. Hope to see them both myself naturally.

[shermanator]

Edgar isn't in the 18 tonight. I think that's fair, given that he is in preseason form while the rest of the club is in the middle of their season.

[TRM]

2-0 over RSL. Good to get a clean sheet but a bit lucky. Ousted had to make a few good saves and the crossbar late was way too close for comfort.

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, TRM said:

2-0 over RSL. Good to get a clean sheet but a bit lucky. Ousted had to make a few good saves and the crossbar late was way too close for comfort.

Stadium silent, Southside fidgety, Curva mumbling---into three minutes of extra time up 2-0 and everyone thinking just watch RSL tie it up. As if those late chances were worth two, a new away goals rule: everything scored into stoppage time is worth double.

[Unnamed Trialist]

As for the game, thought Bolaños had one of his better matches, though the team was coasting most of the way. Luckily RSL seemed to be doing similar, though they had more corners and got deeper and fouled us, so for me it looked they were a bit more excited about the game than we were, until we got the goals. Until the goals we were playing at 80% intensity and seemed to not care too much about having this stadium full of people and being pro footballers and all, seemed like quite the bother.

The entire back of the team was cutting off passes and tackling well, then stupidly giving the ball away immediately on dumb outlet passes. To make those kind of dumb mistakes constantly, I guess you need foreigners. No Canadian has ever been allowed to make such poor plays consistently under Mr. Robinson.

[shermanator]

Copying this from the Alphonso Davies thread. He signed with the first team today. If I'm not mistaken, he's the youngest player ever signed by a Canadian professional club ever? I'm part excited for the signing, and part terrified it's going to push him to quickly. But either way, congrats to Davies!

http://www.whitecapsfc.com/post/2016/07/15/whitecaps-fc-add-15-year-old-residency-product-alphonso-davies?hootPostID=65e88a94c7000269d534d53f18166b3a

[Unnamed Trialist]

11 hours ago, shermanator said:

Copying this from the Alphonso Davies thread. He signed with the first team today.

I don't get why they did this, what are they trying to prove? They do not believe in their own academy, as the U-18 plays the USDDA final this weekend, and the WC2 leads their division, what more do they want? And the Caps youth is doing this without Davies playing a role, when he could have. 

We have not seen Teibert thrive, there is no reason Sam could not get minutes looking at what Smith is doing, Froese is a fine player with a strong upside who has gotten zero continuity..the club is screwing around sending out this bits of bait and we are supposed to grab at them, but I am frankly tired of it. A team that did not even play that well last year, though playoff level, and worse this year, you might as well not even have an academy and develop players if this is going to be the case. 

Davies will simply have one game he is exposed as not being quite ready, they'll send him back to the second team, where he will do just fine developing with a good bunch of guys, and he will NOT stand out for them in any particular way. Because no way Robbo is going to play this guy regularly, he is now on the same track as all Canucks before him.

[youllneverwalkalone]

I don't know. Robbo seems very high on this kid. I suspect Manneh's injury acclerated something that would have happened next March anyway. I think we'll see him play. Possibly as soon as tonight.

[yothat]

as long as he continues to get games with the usl whitecaps..That's a good level for being 15/16 year old. they continue to  bring him along slowly.

[TRM]

18 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

1)  there is no reason Sam could not get minutes looking at what Smith is doing,

2) Froese is a fine player with a strong upside who has gotten zero continuity.

3) A team that did not even play that well last year, though playoff level,

 

1) Sam plays LB where Harvey is, not RB where Smith is. If Sam played RB he would be.

2) Love Kianz but his passing is suspect but yes he has great potential but gives it away too much.

3) We were THIRD in the entire league last year. That was the best year a Canadian team has ever had in MLS.

From the very limited minutes in V's Cup and tonight I'd say he is better than any of the others at the MLS level. All need improvement in different areas but Alphonso is the best rounded IMHO. Small sample size and all disclaimers apply.

[TRM]

2-2 draw against Orlando tonight. Larin gets his 9th on a nice header. Larin vs Waston was an interesting match up and Cyle handled the huge Tico as good as anyone I've seen. Nice battle to watch with CONCACAF implications. On his goal he got on the back post and was in an aerial duel with Harvey. Total mismatch and he buried it.

Smith can't sit soon enough. Doesn't block crosses worth a damn, gave up a PK but fortunately they missed it. Other teams are totally aware of this liability and milking it for all it is worth. He is one of those super athletic players who've gotten by their entire life on it.

Kudo is a good forward but the rest of the team has to stop sending balls up to him like he is 6'2" and 190 lbs. That was Rivero. I doubt if Kudo can do the holding forward routine and I don't know if the rest of the team can change their stripes. Bolanos, Nico and Kudo play good together but the long balls out of the back that Rivero would hold up is not going to be an option now.

[BearcatSA]

10 minutes ago, TRM said:

Smith can't sit soon enough. Doesn't block crosses worth a damn, gave up a PK but fortunately they missed it. Other teams are totally aware of this liability and milking it for all it is worth. He is one of those super athletic players who've gotten by their entire life on it.

I'm not sure whether his nickname should be "Train Wreck" or "Tire Fire."  Awful.  He needs to go.

[shorty]

Harvey has played RB before when they have been stuck.  They could have previously used Sam at LB and Harvey at RB.  The thing is that everything has to be taken in context from week to week.  They could have used Sam and Harvey in this way before, but at those times either Aird was healthy or Smith wasn't sucking as blatantly as he is now.  Or, a different CB pair was working and Parker was free to slot in at RB. 

Heading into yesterday, Parker and Waston had been doing well together so Robbo probably didn't want to slide Parker over, and De Jong showed his rust on Wednesday otherwise De Jong at LB and Harvey at RB might have been an option.  Might still see this Saturday although it's not a great option, because Harvey isn't as effective going forward on the right as he is on the left.  No worse than what we have now though.  I think Robbo keeps holding out for what Smith should be able to do in attack, but hasn't (time and again).  We need Aird healthy and Edgar fit.

[Gordon]

On July 16, 2016 at 3:48 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

I don't get why they did this, what are they trying to prove? They do not believe in their own academy, as the U-18 plays the USDDA final this weekend, and the WC2 leads their division, what more do they want? And the Caps youth is doing this without Davies playing a role, when he could have. 

We have not seen Teibert thrive, there is no reason Sam could not get minutes looking at what Smith is doing, Froese is a fine player with a strong upside who has gotten zero continuity..the club is screwing around sending out this bits of bait and we are supposed to grab at them, but I am frankly tired of it. A team that did not even play that well last year, though playoff level, and worse this year, you might as well not even have an academy and develop players if this is going to be the case. 

Davies will simply have one game he is exposed as not being quite ready, they'll send him back to the second team, where he will do just fine developing with a good bunch of guys, and he will NOT stand out for them in any particular way. Because no way Robbo is going to play this guy regularly, he is now on the same track as all Canucks before him.

MLS wants to make sure they get a transfer fee for him I think. It's too bad, because the top end of his potential is directly proportional to getting out of Vancouver IMO. Hopefully there is a lot of guaranteed money, because I think signing is a huge mistake for the kid.

[TRM]

Levis gets his first team debut as a sub against Crystal Palace. Congrats!

[IceCreamMan]

Put in a number of good crosses including Waston's goal. Davies also impressed once again. Expectations are going to get out of control for this kid quick. 

[shorty]

A lot of the youngsters acquitted themselves well, in fact.  Levis and Davies were especially good, though.  Nice to see De Jong looking more composed and Edgar getting a goal on his first start.  Pity that Parker got fleeced couple of times just after coming on at RB.  You could see he and De Wit were not used to each other at all.  Other than that it was a pretty complete performance.  They could have scored 6 but for the CP keeper making a couple of really nice saves, Bola's wide open chance getting blocked, and Hurtado not expecting Aird's cross to make it through three defenders.

[Unnamed Trialist]

We played way better than I thought, as well as Pars making some of our guys look really good. For me I thought Canadians McKendry, Davies, were good. Edgar showed great intensity and was focused, he looked like a true pro beside Kah, careless and with very negative body language throughout. De Jong is a bit unsure of himself, did not seem to be clear on his job. I thought the team started well, slipped, came back admirably, and had some great moments. But as I say, the rival helped, they looked like an average MLS team.

CP is 2nd division quality, my son thought they were well below teams that have been relegated out of La Liga. Sure, it is preseason, but they are fighting for starting spots. Where was the push and drive, that was disappointing.

Apart from the well-taken goals by Campbell, which our defenders had to do better on, the only player with full quality on that team IMO is the Korean Lee, maybe that other stockier black mid forgot his name. That team was very poor and not the kind of rival we should be paying to see in a friendly. But ni the end, something I was cynical about, and was not going to see (it was the only eve my kid was off work and could see the Caps) turned out fairly entertaining, all credit to the Caps for taking it seriously and wanting to show well.

[Ruffian]

 

[TRM]

17 hours ago, IceCreamMan said:

Put in a number of good crosses including Waston's goal. Davies also impressed once again. Expectations are going to get out of control for this kid quick. 

You mean they aren't already? Where have you been?

 

[TRM]

Fabian Espindola from DC to the Caps for Al Ocation. At 31 we will get more mileage out of him than Perez. And for $200k about the same price as Perez and a lot cheaper than Rivero so that still leaves a DP spot open.

[Unnamed Trialist]

20 hours ago, TRM said:

Fabian Espindola from DC to the Caps for Al Ocation. At 31 we will get more mileage out of him than Perez. And for $200k about the same price as Perez and a lot cheaper than Rivero so that still leaves a DP spot open.

More of the same, we are signing in the same way over and over again, by rote.

What I don't get is that our most successful recent goal scoring experience, Camilo, had a quick and mobile guy coming in behind a target striker of sorts and finding goals. Since then we've basically thrown that formula out the window, and we sign strikers, the guys up front. So much effort on them. And no effort on the striker that can come in behind, a Camilo type. 

I know Caps got burnt on that one, but to be so embarrassed you just try to sweep the successful formula under the carpet so no one remembers, insisting on a target model that has never really worked for us, is plain silly. As is this never playing a 4-4-2 letting two strikers work together up high. I mean never, except maybe a desperate last 8 minutes losing. Kudos and Perez together, sure it would work.

I am sure Octavio would have scored more, Blas as well would be scoring, in a different system. So either sign a guy to play the Camilo role (who could be Kudo, I think he could do it), or just play the damn 4-4-2 so we get more from what he already have. 

[TRM]

On 2016-07-21 at 6:38 PM, Unnamed Trialist said:

More of the same, we are signing in the same way over and over again, by rote.

What I don't get is that our most successful recent goal scoring experience, Camilo, had a quick and mobile guy coming in behind a target striker of sorts and finding goals. Since then we've basically thrown that formula out the window, and we sign strikers, the guys up front. So much effort on them. And no effort on the striker that can come in behind, a Camilo type. 

I know Caps got burnt on that one, but to be so embarrassed you just try to sweep the successful formula under the carpet so no one remembers, insisting on a target model that has never really worked for us, is plain silly. As is this never playing a 4-4-2 letting two strikers work together up high. I mean never, except maybe a desperate last 8 minutes losing. Kudos and Perez together, sure it would work.

I am sure Octavio would have scored more, Blas as well would be scoring, in a different system. So either sign a guy to play the Camilo role (who could be Kudo, I think he could do it), or just play the damn 4-4-2 so we get more from what he already have. 

Very true. The problem as you've suggested is that it would require a change to a true 4-4-1-1 which we don't do much of. Even with the previous success of Camilo left aside you could see it with Hurtado & Manneh in the TFC game. I'm hoping if we can solidify our back and stop bleeding goals then we'll see it but we seem wedded to the 4-5-1 and Fabian is not a lone striker type. At least in Perez, Rivero and Hurtado you could see that they could handle the physical demands of the lone forward role but be less than productive in the goals department.