Jump to content
ted

Canadian Premier League

Recommended Posts

I've ran the idea of a Regina team past a few Rider fan friends this week are they were all pretty skeptical. With a total operations budget of even $2M a year you are taking a substantial amount of the RIders yearly profit to gamble on an unproven concept. This will never sit well on a fanbase that saw their team almost go insolvent within living memory. Nor has anybody heard anything in terms of rumours from the Riders organization about this team getting organized.

 

Yeah, to be honest if I am going to put a franchise in Sask, I would put it in Saskatoon so that they have something to call their own. I know the Riders will always been Saskatchewan's team, but putting a potential team in Regina to potentially compete with the Riders, just doesn't strike me as wise.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've ran the idea of a Regina team past a few Rider fan friends this week are they were all pretty skeptical. With a total operations budget of even $2M a year you are taking a substantial amount of the RIders yearly profit to gamble on an unproven concept. This will never sit well on a fanbase that saw their team almost go insolvent within living memory. Nor has anybody heard anything in terms of rumours from the Riders organization about this team getting organized.

If the Riders think that their current CFL fan base is the primary target audience for a soccer team, IMHO they are making a mistake right out of the gate. I know a lot of Rider season ticket holders (and I'm one too) and many of us are incredibly excited about a potential pro-soccer team. However, the ones that are excited are already soccer fans. The ones that aren't still think soccer is a game for wimps and that's an attitude that's certainly not restricted to SK.

If the Riders are going to own a soccer club and if they are smart about it, they will partner with the local soccer clubs and build their fanbase that way. Their are 1000s of soccer playing kids in Regina. Many of them are not fans, but many of them can be converted. The ones that stay on to play at older age groups often have parents and family that are soccer fans. Add to that, a growing contingent of teens/20yr olds that have grown up watching EPL, CL, WC, and to a lesser extent MLS, and you *might* have a reasonable fan base. Hell maybe even a decent supporters group.

One thing the clubs in town lament is a potential pro-path that they can pitch to their players to keep them in the sport. This is a bit better now with the Whitecaps partnerships and Wolves partnership with QC United. If you could get the clubs onside early, get them to see how a new Canadian league could benefit them right away, and get them to start pitching a pro-team to their people, you might have something. Heck if you could commit to paying solidarity fees to clubs whose players you sign, that might help a lot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, to be honest if I am going to put a franchise in Sask, I would put it in Saskatoon so that they have something to call their own. I know the Riders will always been Saskatchewan's team, but putting a potential team in Regina to potentially compete with the Riders, just doesn't strike me as wise.

Several months ago I would have agreed with you. Tuscan and I have had a ton of discussions about Stoon vs Regina. Stoon has a much richer soccer tradition, bigger clubs with deeper histories, the city has a pretty decent history of supporting soccer infrastructure, and there is a huge adult rec community in Stoon.

Now I'm not so sure.

I've been combing through the Riders financials and looking at a few other factors and they are gaining more weight in my mind.

First - I don't think that you need a ton of Rider fans to be casual soccer fans. Of course it wouldn't hurt, but there is a fair number of soccer fans in the city already. The WCP Cup (a mini World Cup run every April gets 1000s of fans (no exaggeration). In the indoor facility for the final it's standing room only.

2 - The Riders have a ton of revenue. Unless you can find a Stoon company or org with their financial clout you are already behind. The Riders have 80 local sponsors so already have a potential list to start with and approach from a marketing perspective. Assuming the national sponsors/TV comes through (admittedly a big assumption), and the financial side would make a lot of sense.

3 - The Riders org itself is very successful. They have the stadium infrastructure, game day operations, and hierarchy without having to create this from scratch. Of course they would all have to be re-tasked for soccer, or more likely they would need to hire, but the org itself is already there and this is a major bonus.

One disclaimer though ... I shudder to think what a soccer game would be like if it is like a Rider game. The Rider game-day exp is fantastic, but almost none of it would translate to a soccer game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I doubt the community owned teams in the CFL would be the ones contributing to this new league. How would that even work?

The Riders have a board of directors and a club president and make decisions similarly to a regular company. I thought this was odd too but I've been assured by some of my more business savvy friends that being community owned is not an impediment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will tell you one thing. It would be awesome if the CSA said straight right out the gate "All games are reviewed after they are played. You get caught diving, expect a fine and suspension". I don't know if they can do that without upsetting FIFA, but I think it would go a long way towards soothing some of the most common complaints I find most Canadian's have with Soccer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will tell you one thing. It would be awesome if the CSA said straight right out the gate "All games are reviewed after they are played. You get caught diving, expect a fine and suspension". I don't know if they can do that without upsetting FIFA, but I think it would go a long way towards soothing some of the most common complaints I find most Canadian's have with Soccer.

This is solid. Implementing subtle Maple Syrup type rules like this and making players sit out for 4 minutes minimum when hurt would give the league a unique angle....in a good way.

Edited by Macksam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is solid. Implementing subtle Maple Syrup type rules like this and making players sit out for 4 minutes minimum when hurt would give the league a unique angle....in a good way.

 

5 sounds better, but yes, I agree with something. Failure to do so, is an automatic yellow.

 

Soccer can spare no expense to see this crap eliminated from the game, and ideally maybe other nations make take a page out of our book.

Edited by -Hammer-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Haven't the Aussies done something similar to that? From my experience, aussies generally don't have any tolerance for diving/ feigning injuries either.

 

Wouldn't shock me in the slighest.

 

Australia and Canada are bizarre reflections of each other in many ways. Both nations of easy going, beer drinking, hard nosed badasses who deal with ridiculous climates.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wouldn't shock me in the slighest.

 

Australia and Canada are bizarre reflections of each other in many ways. Both nations of easy going, beer drinking, hard nosed badasses who deal with ridiculous climates.

I lived in Australia for a while. Australia is the opposite of Canada. They don't get a **** about political correctness for starters...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I lived in Australia for a while. Australia is the opposite of Canada. They don't get a **** about political correctness for starters...

 

Yeah, hence the bizzare. One is hot, one is cold. One was one of the most prized and loyal British colonies, the other was a prison colony. One has stuck to the traditional British sports (Cricket, Rugby, Soccer and Aussie Rules) the other is mainly US sports (Baseball, Football, Basketball, and Hockey). One thinks E is small time delinquent druge and Pot destroys lives, one thinks the opposite (from my 2nd hand understanding), one is reserved and the other is very outgoing.

 

Yet somehow they remain remarkably the same on the political spectrum (left of centre), remarkably same military wise, remarkably same in degrees of world influence, remarkably similar economies and remarkably similar people.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Definitely agree, we need to put this anti-soccer sentiment to bed, and the only way to do that is to have a "Well OURS don't do that type of shite" mentality.  

1) Stiffly punish divers(retroactively if need be)

2)^Like above said, make sure guys can't flop around and come back on right away so theres no incentive to do so

3) Instant replay on any questionable goal scoring play

 

You do that and we might have a chance of winning over some soccer skeptics.  Also make sure its reffed pretty openly, base it on EPL standards.  Lots of jostling and hard-nosed play encouraged, and market the F out of anyone who plays this way.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Definitely agree, we need to put this anti-soccer sentiment to bed, and the only way to do that is to have a "Well OURS don't do that type of shite" mentality.  

1) Stiffly punish divers(retroactively if need be)

2)^Like above said, make sure guys can't flop around and come back on right away so theres no incentive to do so

3) Instant replay on any questionable goal scoring play

 

You do that and we might have a chance of winning over some soccer skeptics.  Also make sure its reffed pretty openly, base it on EPL standards.  Lots of jostling and hard-nosed play encouraged, and market the F out of anyone who plays this way.  

 

 

You have reached your quota of positive votes for the day

 

That is really the biggest gripe everyone I know has with soccer. They don't want to see diving, they don't want to see embellishing your injuries, they don't want to see a player who got slide tackled to scream out in pain unless it's serious. They want you to take a knee/sit down and keep quiet until you compose yourself and then get back up as soon as you can and play.

Edited by -Hammer-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's no way that instant replay comes to this league and also no way to force a player that leaves the pitch to miss X minutes. Especially when the goal of the CSA is to host the FIFA World Cup, not the CSA World Cup.

 

Asking referres to ref a certain way is wrong. I do think that referees will ref what has got them there. I would find it worse that they would want to implement rules outside of the Laws of the Game because we don't like fakers and such. That's why there's a referee, he's supposed to be independent of the league and the teams. If you want something like that, you have to train your referees a certain way so they want that.

 

I'm all for having a disciplinary commitee to fine/suspend players for improper conduct on the pitch. It's done in MLS, I expect that it would be done here if we have proper video. (Because sometimes form one angle it looks like a dive, but from a better angle, you think that it's a foul.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMO, the following interview Re: Philippe Davies from Marc dos Santos gives another use case as to why we need a domestic league that pays the average player a living wage. Davies was wanted by the club, but he walked away because the money was better to coach at a youth club than play professionally in Ottawa. 

 

So, while there are opportunities in Canada, they aren't necessarily ones that make financial sense for a player. Shaun Saiko and Paul Hamilton (both NASL Best XI players in their careers) are two other examples of players with some pretty decent talent that chose to walk away because the money to be an average Joe Public was better.

 

Was Davies ever going to amount to much more than he showed the last few years? Probably not. But there is that small chance that he would have. Having players who are competent at the NASL level choose to walk away at age 24 is a shame.

 

http://total-mls.com/nasl/nasl-news/furious-news-philippe-davies-retires.html'> http://total-mls.com/nasl/nasl-news/furious-news-philippe-davies-retires.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMO, the following interview Re: Philippe Davies from Marc dos Santos gives another use case as to why we need a domestic league that pays the average player a living wage. Davies was wanted by the club, but he walked away because the money was better to coach at a youth club than play professionally in Ottawa. 

 

So, while there are opportunities in Canada, they aren't necessarily ones that make financial sense for a player. Shaun Saiko and Paul Hamilton (both NASL Best XI players in their careers) are two other examples of players with some pretty decent talent that chose to walk away because the money to be an average Joe Public was better.

 

Was Davies ever going to amount to much more than he showed the last few years? Probably not. But there is that small chance that he would have. Having players who are competent at the NASL level choose to walk away at age 24 is a shame.

 

http://total-mls.com/nasl/nasl-news/furious-news-philippe-davies-retires.html

I would like to see wages be a bit higher too, but realistically they don't need to be a lot more.  The decision process Davies went through is similar to what hockey, baseball, and basketball players at lower levels have to make after they've played pro for a few years.  Many get on with their life, especially if they have options.  Those who have no options will keep playing.  Even in the CFL you regularly see guys walking away for off the field opportunities, and they are paying a lot more than NASL.  The only leagues where this doesn't happen are the big 4 in North America. 

 

So you need to balance what is good value for ownership where they can attract enough good players, and also what is fair for the players.  I think the free market kind of solves this problem to some degree.  USL generally pays less than NASL.  If USL couldn't attract any players, they would have to pay more.  But at this point, they seem to keep finding players so if someone is willing to play for what you're offering, the owners will keep paying that amount.

 

Jason

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would like to see wages be a bit higher too, but realistically they don't need to be a lot more.  The decision process Davies went through is similar to what hockey, baseball, and basketball players at lower levels have to make after they've played pro for a few years.  Many get on with their life, especially if they have options.  Those who have no options will keep playing.  Even in the CFL you regularly see guys walking away for off the field opportunities, and they are paying a lot more than NASL.  The only leagues where this doesn't happen are the big 4 in North America. 

 

So you need to balance what is good value for ownership where they can attract enough good players, and also what is fair for the players.  I think the free market kind of solves this problem to some degree.  USL generally pays less than NASL.  If USL couldn't attract any players, they would have to pay more.  But at this point, they seem to keep finding players so if someone is willing to play for what you're offering, the owners will keep paying that amount.

 

Jason

 

Exactly. Sometimes, players playing at a lower level or somewhere that pays less look at other options when they realise that they are not good enough for the higher levels. I don't think a domestic league would have changed anything in this case. He was never going to get higher and had a good opportunity back home and took it. Good for him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To lazy to go back and see if this has been mentioned. Just a theoretical to throw out there, since I've been reading about the success of Chivas and Athletic Bilboa recently. What would peoples opinion be on one team in this Canadian league being an "All Canadian team"? As in, only people born in Canada or only players with Canadian passports could play? I don't think it would ever happen in this day and age, but just an idea.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What would peoples opinion be on one team in this Canadian league being an "All Canadian team"? As in, only people born in Canada or only players with Canadian passports could play?

It would be a great way to ensure a team that never finished above last place and would have no positive impact on player development. It would appeal to a tiny number of die-hard xenophobes who would not actually buy tickets but whinge a lot online.

Just my opinion of course. ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It would be a great way to ensure a team that never finished above last place and would have no positive impact on player development. It would appeal to a tiny number of die-hard xenophobes who would not actually buy tickets but whinge a lot online.

Just my opinion of course. ;)

Sure, if the team just played Canadians for the sake of playing Canadians. However, a team that invested in youth development and produced high quality homegrown player would make such a vision work. Brampton would be an obvious candidate for such an endeavor. Edited by Macksam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Definitely agree, we need to put this anti-soccer sentiment to bed, and the only way to do that is to have a "Well OURS don't do that type of shite" mentality.  

1) Stiffly punish divers(retroactively if need be)

2)^Like above said, make sure guys can't flop around and come back on right away so theres no incentive to do so

3) Instant replay on any questionable goal scoring play

 

You do that and we might have a chance of winning over some soccer skeptics.  Also make sure its reffed pretty openly, base it on EPL standards.  Lots of jostling and hard-nosed play encouraged, and market the F out of anyone who plays this way.  

Yes Please! 

 

I've been advocating the above for some time within my small circle, or to whomever has spared me the time to listen. If we're going to have our own league, it needs to be done right, period.

And while we're at it, why not have this league be known for standing against what most fans (and outlier fans) despise: weakness.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's no way that instant replay comes to this league and also no way to force a player that leaves the pitch to miss X minutes. Especially when the goal of the CSA is to host the FIFA World Cup, not the CSA World Cup.

 

The push for some sort of a pro league under direct CSA sanctioning was obviously tied into the 2026 World Cup bid and that means everything would be run according to FIFA's norms, so dreams of a style of soccer Don Cherry might approve of is not on the agenda. The 2026 bid is not dead yet but think it's on life support with Sepp Blatter gone and Traffic people running into legal issues given a CSA-NASL-Traffic axis of mutually shared interests appeared to be involved. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well maybe the missing X minutes is a bit far, but really, if you haven't heard the anti-soccer sentiment, than you must live under a rock.  Honestly, I'd rather stamp this out for good and potentially make some people(even fairweather) fans, than have a long shot at hosting a WC.  

I'm a little ignorant on the regulations, but could a Canadian league not operate at all independently of FIFA in terms of stiffness of fines, etc?  I'm not trying to be a stick in the mud, I just see that as the only way to get some people into it.  Like if I can honestly tell my soccer hating friends "Well actually, theres no diving in the canadian league, because the punishment is too stiff".  I need to be able to tell people that or else all respect is lost.  We don't need to go to extremes and make it hockey, but we need to get rid of the BS thats preventing it from being respected in Canada.  And then at least if we do that then we can say we tried.

Like perhaps it isn't feasible, but I think to pretend like that isn't the smartest route in terms of being pragmatic about making soccer popular culture in Canada(the obvious goal) it's what we would need to strive for.

Perhaps it can't be done, but don't tell me it isn't what should be done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like long term which would you chose: one world cup in canada, or a long term, successful canadian league with 8-14 teams that was part of the popular culture and accepted by the average Canadian.  I just feel like put that way it's a no brainer, despite the year long euphoric high I would experience if we hosted a WC.  Sorry to double post.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...