matty Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Just now, BringBackTheBlizzard said: FIFA caps the number of venues at 12 and joint hostings don't need to be done on a 50:50 or 33:33:33 basis when there is a massive population imbalance involved. No it doesn't, you're right there, but looking at 2002 when it was mostly a 50/50 split despite Japan having more than double South Korea's population (atm it's 127m to 50m). It is likely the US gets most of the duties for a 2-way split but there's a strong possibility Canada gets at least 4 cities, given this isn't a piggyback host and the current political climate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmfranck Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: FIFA caps the number of venues at 12 and joint hostings don't need to be done on a 50:50 or 33:33:33 basis when there is a massive population imbalance involved. Are those the rules for the expanded world cup? I doubt these "rules" are anything more than conventional, and if not they are at least open to exceptions I'm sure. One only has to look at the next Euro (and joint Olympic bids) to see where tournament sports are heading. That is... spread the wealth, ... and mostly the cost! I think a 25%,50%,25% split is more than possible. That's a minimum of 3 Canadian cities imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamondium Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, Rheo said: Wonder what the over/under will be on pages on this board when it's announced. 400? 285 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_M Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Csmro doesn't play at cepsum and montreal is an awful place for a cpl team. Quebec is more interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted February 22, 2017 Author Share Posted February 22, 2017 12 hours ago, Complete Homer said: You've sold me on CEPSUM for sure. <SMALL_DIGRESSION> Notice how I was able to reply to your post without quoting the whole damn thing!!! And no, it's not just you. CAN WE PLEASE NOT QUOTE THE ENTIRETY OF REALLY LONG POSTS. Scrolling through the same long posts three or four times is really freaking annoying. #firstworldproblems </SMALL_DIGRESSION> Seems like a cool stadium plan to me (but I visited Montreal like, twice, back in the 70's, so what do I know.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmfranck Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 5 minutes ago, Big_M said: Csmro doesn't play at cepsum and montreal is an awful place for a cpl team. Quebec is more interesting. Well, they definetly played the Haiti friendly there. I don't get your argument. How is it an "either or" proposition? When discussing a potential CPL implementation in Toronto, i don't see anyone saying "Hamilton (or Ottawa) is more interesting". We're discussing the merits of an "expansion" in Montréal on its own merits, and not doing a comparative study between the viability of CPL in both markets (Montréal and Québec). I think the positive impact of a CPL team in Québec city for the league is a given at this point. The CPL NEEDS a team in the province, no two ways about it. My question wasn't related to that. It was : Why do people always imply that teams in the biggest Canadian markets are a must for the league to be a success, but when it comes down to it, only Vancouver and Toronto are mentionned in "dream CPL team lists"? Like, were talking about a second team in Vancouver ON TOP of a team in Victoria. That's a lot more "contingenté" than what would happen in Montréal. But that being said why do you think Montréal is an awful place for CPL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 13 hours ago, Gopherbashi said: I suspect an AHL type league would be more likely - some CPL academy system. I don't see how a startup standalone D2 league would offer an on- or off-field quality substantially different from the existing D3, but I wouldn't rule out an organic growth from the cream of the existing D3s into something a step above everyone else at that level. My idea for a Canadian D2 AHL Type League De-sanctioning of NASL and USL in Canada by the CSA, all D2 clubs must join the CSA Pyramid CPL B-teams and MLS B-teams joins D2 Clubs should be encourage to move into Canadian medium size markets near the main club for better coverage in Canada No "B-Team or II" names allowed, teams must have unique identity just like in the AHL Higher Canadian Quotas than CPL with limited spots for internationals Eligible to V-Cup No Promotion to CPL Example of Single Table Division 2 Kelowna (Vancouver Whitecaps) Sherbrooke (Montreal Impact) Oshawa (Toronto-Danforth/Midtown) Kingston (Ottawa) Nanaimo (Victoria) Lethbridge (Calgary) Greater Sudbury (Toronto FC...what? They can afford it, and good place to start to claim the title "Ontario's Team" ) St.Catharines-Niagara (Hamilton) Red Deer (Edmonton) Guelph (Kitchener-Waterloo) Barrie (North York/York Region) Charlottetown, PEI (Halifax) Trois-Rivières (Quebec City) Moose Jaw (Regina) Brandon (Winnipeg) Prince Albert (Saskatoon) Brantford (London) Sarnia (Windsor) Milton (Mississauga) St.John's, NFLD (Moncton) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_M Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Attendance would be low. It's just not a good market for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 29 minutes ago, Big_M said: Csmro doesn't play at cepsum and montreal is an awful place for a cpl team. Quebec is more interesting. You need a presence in the major markets to increase the value of potential TV rights. Quebec City should have a team first, that's a given but Montreal should follow after due to the lucrative potential of a heated rivalry and the value of the Montreal Metro area (over 4 million people) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 10 minutes ago, Ansem said: Greater Sudbury (Toronto FC...what? They can afford it, and good place to start to claim the title "Ontario's Team" ) Thunder Bay would be better for Northern Ontario. Would have a better name for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 15 hours ago, Gopherbashi said: I suspect an AHL type league would be more likely - some CPL academy system. I don't see how a startup standalone D2 league would offer an on- or off-field quality substantially different from the existing D3, but I wouldn't rule out an organic growth from the cream of the existing D3s into something a step above everyone else at that level. This. I have 0 expectations of ever seeing a D2 in our pyramid the way things stand now with what we have, and what we are expecting/hoping to get in the near future (CPL, and more D3 leagues). The only way I see a D2 league as a possibility is probably a 2 league system (West and East) that uses promotion from the D3 leagues in their region. So teams from, say, L1BC and L1P (prairies) would be fighting for promotion to CWL (Canadian Western League) and L1O, PLSQ, L1A (Atlantic) would be fighting for promotion to CEL (Canadian Eastern League). But that scenario I could only see happening in a magical future where teams in the D3 leagues are becoming pro, and making money and are naturally growing to the point of needing something grander than the D3 league they play in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: FIFA caps the number of venues at 12 and joint hostings don't need to be done on a 50:50 or 33:33:33 basis when there is a massive population imbalance involved. No, there is no cap on the number of venues. There is a minimum. Both Korea and Japan had 8 host venues each and the latter had and still does four times the population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: ...and nothing to do with CalgaryNext project getting the necessary funding and Halifax finally getting a CFL sized stadium built out of public infrastructure money? Maybe I'm too cynical. I seriously just spit coffee all over my fucking desk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Complete Homer Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 34 minutes ago, ted said: <SMALL_DIGRESSION> Notice how I was able to reply to your post without quoting the whole damn thing!!! </SMALL_DIGRESSION> Seems like a cool stadium plan to me (but I visited Montreal like, twice, back in the 70's, so what do I know.) Sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 2 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said: Interesting snippet: Beyond that, 2026 is the lightning rod for the movers and shakers of the CPL. The hope is that the CSA will be able to make a solid bid to host the World Cup in 2026, and “we’ve got to improve the Canadian player pool to the degree that we’ve earned a place in that global conversation”. Have long suspected that was the case, so it's good to see it confirmed. What happens if it is a joint rather than a solo bid? A Canadian World Cup bid (solo or joint) was always going to be a key part of the CPL's plan. Not one person on here disagreed with you when you constantly brought it up. However, you exclusively mentioned it as a key driver for the sole purpose of stadium development. However, reading the above "interesting snippet", it's clear, and it always was to most of us as Complete Homer just mentioned, leveraging the event to drive interest in the CPL and use it for other marketing purposes is an integral part of hosting the event. It's not just about getting a few venues built. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 12 minutes ago, matty said: Thunder Bay would be better for Northern Ontario. Would have a better name for sure 6 minutes ago, Kent said: This. I have 0 expectations of ever seeing a D2 in our pyramid the way things stand now with what we have, and what we are expecting/hoping to get in the near future (CPL, and more D3 leagues). The only way I see a D2 league as a possibility is probably a 2 league system (West and East) that uses promotion from the D3 leagues in their region. So teams from, say, L1BC and L1P (prairies) would be fighting for promotion to CWL (Canadian Western League) and L1O, PLSQ, L1A (Atlantic) would be fighting for promotion to CEL (Canadian Eastern League). But that scenario I could only see happening in a magical future where teams in the D3 leagues are becoming pro, and making money and are naturally growing to the point of needing something grander than the D3 league they play in. Something like this? Division 2 Canadian National Soccer League League's Champion enters V-Cup in Round 4 with MLS and CPL teams Canadian Western League Nanaimo would be the CWL season champion. Advance to Semi-Finals of the National League** Lethbridge vs. Thunder Bay. Winner face Nanaimo for the CWL Championship* Nanaimo (Victoria)** Lethbridge (Calgary)* Thunder Bay (Toronto FC...what? They can afford it )* Kelowna (Vancouver Whitecaps) Red Deer (Edmonton) Moose Jaw (Regina) Brandon (Winnipeg) Prince Albert (Saskatoon) Sarnia (Windsor) open for promotion from D3 based on a Memorial Cup Canadian Eastern League Sherbrooke would be the CEL season champion. Advance to Semi-Finals of the National League** Oshawa vs. Kingston. Winner face Sherbrooke for the CEL Championship* Sherbrooke (Montreal Impact)** Oshawa (Toronto-Danforth/Midtown)* Kingston (Ottawa)* St.Catharines-Niagara (Hamilton) Guelph (Kitchener-Waterloo) Barrie (North York/York Region) Charlottetown, PEI (Halifax) Trois-Rivières (Quebec City) Brantford (London) Milton (Mississauga) St.John's, NFLD (Moncton) open for promotion from D3 based on a Memorial Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kent Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, Ansem said: Something like this? Division 2 Canadian National Soccer League League's Champion enters V-Cup in Round 4 with MLS and CPL teams Canadian Western League Nanaimo would be the CWL season champion. Advance to Semi-Finals of the National League** Lethbridge vs. Thunder Bay. Winner face Nanaimo for the CWL Championship* Nanaimo (Victoria)** Lethbridge (Calgary)* Thunder Bay (Toronto FC...what? They can afford it )* Kelowna (Vancouver Whitecaps) Red Deer (Edmonton) Moose Jaw (Regina) Brandon (Winnipeg) Prince Albert (Saskatoon) Sarnia (Windsor) open for promotion from D3 based on a Memorial Cup Canadian Eastern League Sherbrooke would be the CEL season champion. Advance to Semi-Finals of the National League** Oshawa vs. Kingston. Winner face Sherbrooke for the CEL Championship* Sherbrooke (Montreal Impact)** Oshawa (Toronto-Danforth/Midtown)* Kingston (Ottawa)* St.Catharines-Niagara (Hamilton) Guelph (Kitchener-Waterloo) Barrie (North York/York Region) Charlottetown, PEI (Halifax) Trois-Rivières (Quebec City) Brantford (London) Milton (Mississauga) St.John's, NFLD (Moncton) open for promotion from D3 based on a Memorial Cup My idea was about growth up from D3, where as you seem to be running with the idea of MLS and CPL putting their B teams in the league in nearby cities. For example, if we were basing it on recent results, the teams in the CEL would more likely be something like Sigma FC, Vaughan Azzuri, Woodbridge Strikers, North Mississauga SC, CSMRO, AS Blainville. This is so far off into the future that I'm neither for nor against the idea of having reserve/academy teams in the D2 league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 The sticking with a maximum of 12 venues thing was widely reported when the new 48 team format was ratified: http://www.usnews.com/news/sports/articles/2017-01-08/fifa-set-to-approve-bigger-richer-world-cup-on-tuesday ...FIFA predicts organizing costs for "16x3" rising from $2 billion to $2.3 billion, giving a potential profit rise of $640 million. Though a "16x3" World Cup would still need a maximum of 12 stadiums, the demand for 16 more top-quality training camps and hotels suggests FIFA would look for 2026 hosts with existing capacity. A North American bid from two or three of the United States, Canada and Mexico is currently favored in a contest that could start within weeks... http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/01/10/509153401/fifa-expands-world-cup-format-to-48-teams ... And, rebuffing criticism, Infantino said the new format will take place in the same number of days as the previous one, 32, thereby not adding to the time that clubs would need to release players. The tournament will also be played in 12 stadiums, as it is currently... Can well believe that this 2026 hosting angle was a "lightning rod" for interest at one point, but with a three way joint bid in the offing and FIFA concerned mainly about increasing their profit margin it's difficult to see much happening outside of the three MLS markets at this point. http://in.mobile.reuters.com/article/sportsNews/idINKBN15W05V ...Victor Montagliani, speaking to Reuters by telephone hours after FIFA said it would encourage co-hosting for the 2026 World Cup, said a three-way bid with the United States, Mexico and Canada was one option but did not rule out games in Central America or the Caribbean. For Montagliani, head of the governing body for soccer in North and Central America and the Caribbean, FIFA's welcoming of joint bids and the expansion of the tournament to 48 teams from 32 in 2026 meant a multinational bid made sense. "Especially with 48 teams and the increased infrastructure that requires, not so much from a stadium standpoint but training facilities, hotels and all the other things, having the opportunity with three or more countries that are geographically close, it would be reasonable," said Montagliani... Can understand why the dream of a solo bid might not be completely dead however: http://in.mobile.reuters.com/article/sportsNews/idINKBN15W05V U.S. Soccer Federation president Sunil Gulati has said his federation has yet to decide whether to bid alone for 2026 or jointly with Canada and/or Mexico. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimliJetsMan Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 I honestly think Canada can and should do a solo bid for the World Cup. The only joint bid I would even consider being a part of is a 50/50 bid with the States. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyFromToronto23 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 The CanPL should be 24-32 games in a season from March/April to October with a Eastern Confrence and a Western Confrence and playoffs from October till November-December and the team with the most points in the regular season win a trophy ( just like MLS ) Western ConfrenceVictoriaVancouver Bunaby/Surrey Edmonton Calgary Saskatoon Regina Winnipeg Saskatoon Thunder Bay ( They have the Thunder Bay chill and yes I know it's Ontario but it's northern Ontario) Eastern Confrence Kitchener-Waterloo London Hamilton Toronto (Midtown/Danforth or North York ) Laval Montreal-Downtown Québec City MonctonHalifax Mississauga Top 5 from each conference makes it the the playoffs and the team that finished in 1st in each conference skips all the way to the conference finals and the other 4 teams in the playoffs play Another club they will be 4 clubs in the quarterfinals then 2 in the semifinals and then whoever makes it to the confrence finals will play the team who finished in 1st during the regular season and each playoffs matches are 2 legs home and away and AND the Champions of the CanPL & THE AMWAY CANADIAN CHAMPIONSHIP goes to the CONCACAF Champions league And the champions of the CanPL qualify automatically to the quarterfinal round of the Amway Canadian championship along with the 3 Canadian MLS clubs And the Champions of the CanPL will qualify for a CONCACAF champions league (if CONCACAF gives Canadian teams another spot taking 1 from the Caribbean clubs) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyFromToronto23 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 15 minutes ago, DannyFromToronto23 said: The CanPL should be 24-32 games in a season from March/April to October with a Eastern Confrence and a Western Confrence and playoffs from October till November-December and the team with the most points in the regular season win a trophy ( just like MLS ) Western ConfrenceVictoriaVancouver Bunaby/Surrey Edmonton Calgary Saskatoon Regina Winnipeg Saskatoon Thunder Bay ( They have the Thunder Bay chill and yes I know it's Ontario but it's northern Ontario) Eastern Confrence Kitchener-Waterloo London Hamilton Toronto (Midtown/Danforth or North York ) Laval Montreal-Downtown Québec City MonctonHalifax Mississauga Top 5 from each conference makes it the the playoffs and the team that finished in 1st in each conference skips all the way to the conference finals and the other 4 teams in the playoffs play Another club they will be 4 clubs in the quarterfinals then 2 in the semifinals and then whoever makes it to the confrence finals will play the team who finished in 1st during the regular season and each playoffs matches are 2 legs home and away and AND the Champions of the CanPL & THE AMWAY CANADIAN CHAMPIONSHIP goes to the CONCACAF Champions league And the champions of the CanPL qualify automatically to the quarterfinal round of the Amway Canadian championship along with the 3 Canadian MLS clubs And the Champions of the CanPL will qualify for a CONCACAF champions league (if CONCACAF gives Canadian teams another spot taking 1 from the Caribbean clubs) I put Thunder Bay in the western conference because it's closer to Winnipeg then Toronto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, DannyFromToronto23 said: And the champions of the CanPL qualify automatically to the quarterfinal round of the Amway Canadian championship along with the 3 Canadian MLS clubs 3 Canadian MLS Club should qualify for quarter finals in the same round as CPL Teams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 7 minutes ago, Ansem said: 3 Canadian MLS Club should qualify for quarter finals in the same round as CPL Teams I agree My system is weird. The Top 5 CPL teams (no matter what) are in the cup and the 3 MLS teams are too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansem Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 4 minutes ago, matty said: I agree My system is weird. The Top 5 CPL teams (no matter what) are in the cup and the 3 MLS teams are too. Shouldn't all CPL teams be part of the tournament? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matty Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Just now, Ansem said: Shouldn't all CPL teams be part of the tournament? In eventually yes. I however think a top 5 situation will provide added stakes to the leagues early years when there are 6 to 8 teams which is greatly needed. Once the league hits 12 teams the automatic spots need to be provided. I understand if you feel it should be every team every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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