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Alphonso Davies

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The Davies hype train is in full force after last night's performance. Marc Weber arguing that Davies should be signed to an MLS deal already, which I think is simply too soon. Davies has looked fantastic in some games this year, but he's also looked like a 15 year old in others, and the inconsistency is to be expected.

Now the obvious question is: Will the Caps sign Davies to an MLS deal this summer? Because, why not?

In two appearances he’s already shown that he’s ahead of some other players the Caps have inked to MLS contracts, and signing Davies to an MLS deal would allow the club more flexibility in how they develop him this season.

...

Robinson and the staff will want to keep Davies humble and hungry, but there’s no reason they can’t do that on an MLS deal. Davies can still spend most of the season in USL, but they’ll have the bonus of being able to throw him into an MLS game now and then. And don't discount the shop window element here. He’s the best prospect they’ve had in the MLS era.

http://www.theprovince.com/sports/soccer/weber+talented+teen+hero+whitecaps+residency+players/11976172/story.html

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I agree with Weber. He was arguably their best player yesterday and I say a call up to the senior men's national team should happen to. He has the stride of Pogba and the footwork of Hazard. I know all the previous posters are being conservative and tempering expectations because of the past letdowns us Vs have gone through, but I'm just going to ******* say it...I think he's going to be the most popular athlete on a Vancouver sports team since Pavel Bure. 2 nights ago was phenomenal.

Edited by Macksam

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1 hour ago, Macksam said:

I agree with Weber. He was arguably their best player yesterday and I say a call up to the senior men's national team should happen to. He has the stride of Pogba and the footwork of Hazard. I know all the previous posters are being conservative and tempering expectations because of the past letdowns us Vs have gone through, but I'm just going to ******* say it...I think he's going to be the most popular athlete on a Vancouver sports team since Pavel Bure. 2 nights ago was phenomenal.

Those are big skates to fill, but I hope you are right.

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2 hours ago, Macksam said:

I agree with Weber. He was arguably their best player yesterday and I say a call up to the senior men's national team should happen to. He has the stride of Pogba and the footwork of Hazard. I know all the previous posters are being conservative and tempering expectations because of the past letdowns us Vs have gone through, but I'm just going to ******* say it...I think he's going to be the most popular athlete on a Vancouver sports team since Pavel Bure. 2 nights ago was phenomenal.

Come on...I don't think he's anywhere near ready to play on ththe Senior Men's team. He's played well in a few pro matches. That's it. Let's not get carried away here. I also thought he was pretty poor against England in the U-19 friendly (which wasn't surprising given his age and experience level).

Excited about his future but let's give him a few more years of developing.

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There's a maximum number of players the whitecaps can sign to senior contracts but loan to VWC2, no? I imagine if they wanted to give him some time, they could sign him and keep him on the bench in case they were in the position to give him a few run-outs (like last 10 minutes in a game they are winning 2-0), while loaning him after each game to start for VWC2. He might miss a few road games, but it's arguable that training with the first team could help his development more than anything, and as long as Vancouver isn't near that limit it could work out

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3 hours ago, Macksam said:

I agree with Weber. He was arguably their best player yesterday and I say a call up to the senior men's national team should happen to. He has the stride of Pogba and the footwork of Hazard. I know all the previous posters are being conservative and tempering expectations because of the past letdowns us Vs have gone through, but I'm just going to ******* say it...I think he's going to be the most popular athlete on a Vancouver sports team since Pavel Bure. 2 nights ago was phenomenal.

Not even close. Sorry but Octavio & Nico were on a mission with Pedro providing ammo. Davies did great 1v1 but he turned the ball over a lot with passes that were too weak. Maybe it was the surface or jitters but he was far from the best player. 

Davies reminds me a lot of Manneh when he was first brought to the team. That is a great thing because Manneh is turning out great. For now I'll just call Davies our "Sterling in the rough" :)

 

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2 hours ago, Floortom said:

Come on...I don't think he's anywhere near ready to play on ththe Senior Men's team. He's played well in a few pro matches. That's it. Let's not get carried away here. I also thought he was pretty poor against England in the U-19 friendly (which wasn't surprising given his age and experience level).

Excited about his future but let's give him a few more years of developing.

We need a creative guy that can take defenders on and generate offence.

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2 hours ago, TRM said:

Not even close. Sorry but Octavio & Nico were on a mission with Pedro providing ammo. Davies did great 1v1 but he turned the ball over a lot with passes that were too weak. Maybe it was the surface or jitters but he was far from the best player. 

Davies reminds me a lot of Manneh when he was first brought to the team. That is a great thing because Manneh is turning out great. For now I'll just call Davies our "Sterling in the rough" :)

 

Disagree. He may have shown that in the first half, but he improved as the game went on. His style is also completely different to Manneh. 

Edited by Macksam

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16 minutes ago, Macksam said:

We need a creative guy that can take defenders on and generate offence.

We definitely do...just not sure Davies is that guy YET. Do you really think he's better than Petrasso / Osorio / Froese right now? All those guys are borderline Senior team players and I can't see Davies being called ahead of them in the next couple of years.

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OT - we have all (slightly) adopted Floro's dialect, no?

More and more I am noticing folks, including myself, using 'ya' or no as a suffix to their sentence, ya?  

love it. Love Davies' upside aswell. 

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Just an observation and a chance to heap more praise on this guy...

Has a Canadian academy kid ever had a better debut start with their first team?

Forget this kid is 15 for a second and just as a player can anyone remember an academy kid running with the opportunity they had like this kid did? I can't think of one off the top of my head. I understand it was against an NASL team and he was surrounded by first teamers but I think what he did might be the best first start for an academy kid I've ever seen. I mean there isn't a ton of competition for that but just something to consider.

Get him on a league minimum contract, he's back up if someone goes down and it probably doesn't change the fact that he'll likely be in USL 99% of the season anyways. Homegrown kids don't affect the cap either. The only reason I could see why is if they're worried the mls contract might mess with his mentality or something.

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^Russell Teibert looked fantastic as a dynamic left winger in the Whitecaps' MLS debut match against Toronto in 2011. If flip-flopgate hadn't stopped him in his tracks, his career could have been very different. Teitur T was a fan and likely would have played him a lot. He'd have had the opportunity to establish himself in the team to an extent that his 18-month long dicking by Martin Rennie might not have happened. 

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2 hours ago, lazlo_80 said:

Just an observation and a chance to heap more praise on this guy...

Has a Canadian academy kid ever had a better debut start with their first team?

Forget this kid is 15 for a second and just as a player can anyone remember an academy kid running with the opportunity they had like this kid did? I can't think of one off the top of my head. I understand it was against an NASL team and he was surrounded by first teamers but I think what he did might be the best first start for an academy kid I've ever seen. I mean there isn't a ton of competition for that but just something to consider.

Get him on a league minimum contract, he's back up if someone goes down and it probably doesn't change the fact that he'll likely be in USL 99% of the season anyways. Homegrown kids don't affect the cap either. The only reason I could see why is if they're worried the mls contract might mess with his mentality or something.

Jordan Hamilton's first team debut for a real match was in this same tournament and he scored 2 goals

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I've been saying for a while that this kid is the real deal and I think yesterday was another step in the right direction. I think we have to give major props to Carl Robinson for taking a chance on a 15 year old in that game and allowing him to play through mistakes and improve throughout the game. I don't know if he will get an MLS contract this year but I wouldnt' be surprised if he gets one in the off season................................I think it is safe to say he is the best player in the Country for his age group, and i'm not too aware of other countries but for a 15 year old can we put him in discussions as one of the top in North America? Is that something Canada has ever had, i feel even with the hype of others before him, alphonso seems to be more of a complete package type palyer than petrasso, bustos, boakai etc during their come up (just opinion not fact so don't crucify me). 

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10 hours ago, Macksam said:

Disagree. He may have shown that in the first half, but he improved as the game went on. His style is also completely different to Manneh. 

Still made some bad short passes in the second half but did get better and made the hard passes. Much better in the second half. Ironically that was when Robbo was on the opposite side of the field and not directing him.

Completely different? What? You obviously missed the speed he brings out wide, the chasing down long balls easily beating the defender to them, the willingness to take on defenders and beat them, especially in tight quarters along the end line and incredible acceleration from a stop! The only thing he doesn't do (yet) is the full speed runs with the ball between his feet. Sorry but the biggest difference is that Davies is much larger physically.

Our "Sterling in the rough"!

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3 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Boakai had (has?) huge hype as well and seems to be struggling a bit at the moment.

I agree Davies looked great, expecially for a 15 year old, but maybe we should wait a couple years before we start throwing out the Pogba and Hazard comparisions lol

 

Freddy Adu, anyone?

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10 hours ago, lazlo_80 said:

Just an observation and a chance to heap more praise on this guy...

Has a Canadian academy kid ever had a better debut start with their first team?

Forget this kid is 15 for a second and just as a player can anyone remember an academy kid running with the opportunity they had like this kid did? I can't think of one off the top of my head. I understand it was against an NASL team and he was surrounded by first teamers but I think what he did might be the best first start for an academy kid I've ever seen. I mean there isn't a ton of competition for that but just something to consider.

Get him on a league minimum contract, he's back up if someone goes down and it probably doesn't change the fact that he'll likely be in USL 99% of the season anyways. Homegrown kids don't affect the cap either. The only reason I could see why is if they're worried the mls contract might mess with his mentality or something.

RT's debut with the Caps was great way back when that franchise debuted against TFC. He was a left winger that game and arguably MOTM. It's too bad things fell apart after with the lack of starts.

1 hour ago, TRM said:

Still made some bad short passes in the second half but did get better and made the hard passes. Much better in the second half. Ironically that was when Robbo was on the opposite side of the field and not directing him.

Completely different? What? You obviously missed the speed he brings out wide, the chasing down long balls easily beating the defender to them, the willingness to take on defenders and beat them, especially in tight quarters along the end line and incredible acceleration from a stop! The only thing he doesn't do (yet) is the full speed runs with the ball between his feet. Sorry but the biggest difference is that Davies is much larger physically.

Our "Sterling in the rough"!

I didn't miss Davies' speed or willingness to take on defenders.

Maybe I should have clarified and said that Manneh doesn't have anywhere near the upside that Davies has shown so far. Manneh's only strength is running at defenders when he's built up some acceleration and has space, something I agree Davies doesn't do as well right now, but he will in the future. Right now, Davies has a great first touch, composure and technical ability to out dribble defenders in close quarters, all things Manneh lacks and will never develop. The sky is the limit for this Davies....Manneh not so much.

Sterling in the rough? Lol, let's do a little better and say an unrefined Ricardo Kishna.

Edited by Macksam

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14 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Boakai had (has?) huge hype as well and seems to be struggling a bit at the moment.

I agree Davies looked great, expecially for a 15 year old, but maybe we should wait a couple years before we start throwing out the Pogba and Hazard comparisions lol

 

He looked exactly like Pogba when he made those huge strides and charged up the field during large portions of the game, which is why I said he looked like Pogba.

Edited by Macksam

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8 hours ago, Coramoor said:

Jordan Hamilton's first team debut for a real match was in this same tournament and he scored 2 goals

Touche.

 

Also, to those referencing Teibert's MLS debut, that's a good one too. Good discussion all around.

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Pump the brakes a bit.  The kid was good but there is no guarantee.. we've seen young Canadians play better i.e. Jaime Peters against Brazil U20s.  Kennedy Owusu Ansah played in a friendly for LA Galaxy as a 16 year old and turned heads... then ended up in 2nd division Finland.

I think the sensible thing to do would be to send him back to USL, let him continue to work hard and if he earns another chance there are more opportunities coming up with the final and CCL.  If he takes his chance again then give him a first team HG deal.  

The thing I wonder is this.. would it be better to NOT sign him to an MLS deal from Vancouver if there is interest from overseas hypothetically?  Once he gets an MLS deal the league will get a cut of any transfer or future transfer.  

Edited by Keegan

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Keegan is there different rules for selling on a homegrown versus a regular mls player?

i know with normal mls players the league gets a cut but when it's a homegrown is that the case as well? If so that's ridiculous. 

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1 hour ago, lazlo_80 said:

Keegan is there different rules for selling on a homegrown versus a regular mls player?

i know with normal mls players the league gets a cut but when it's a homegrown is that the case as well? If so that's ridiculous. 

Found this from here: http://www.blackandredunited.com/dc-united-transfers/2015/8/3/9092423/andy-najar-transfer-rumor-newcastle-anderlecht-dc-united

Clubs keep 75% of transfer fees for HG, for any other player they keep 2/3

So you keep ~9% more with a HG

 

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The kid has absolutely got to develop, and only if he does things right for the next 5 years will he be a competent pro. We have some glaring examples in Canada of players making wrong decisions, not allowing themselves to develop properly (Wyn Belotte, maybe Peters too).

I was looking at earliest debuts in Spanish league history and there is just one younger, a 15 year old from the 70s who played for a modest club in top flight. Of players you might know, Bojan Krkic the Stoke striker, age 16 with Barça for a friendly and just 17 official, and Muniain who was just named in the same sex scandal as De Gea, also 16 at Bilbao. Messi too, was almost 17 for his first friendly and 17 for an official match. All three relatively short compact players with low centre of gravity and good skills, and all three attackers.

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