Sinc_Tanc_Olympic_Action Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 I'm confused about soccer at the Pan Am Games. So there are no age restrictions, right? It is recommended countries bring in young players but that country still can bring in their veterans. Is that why Cristiane was allowed to play? She's around 30 years old. And if I remember from the highlights I watched of when Canada won the championship, we had a group of veterans too. (I just remember watching the PK's with Sinclair, Schmidt, Matheson, etc.) So Canada decided not to bring the veterans this time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkomar Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Herdman was interviewed on the CBC yesterday. He said that once the FIFA window for the World Cup was over, most veterans had to go back to their leagues. So, they decided to leave all of the veterans out (except Labbe) and see what the youngsters could do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67soccer Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Herdman was interviewed on the CBC yesterday. He said that once the FIFA window for the World Cup was over, most veterans had to go back to their leagues. So, they decided to leave all of the veterans out (except Labbe) and see what the youngsters could do. one thing for certain we know of Herdman is that he could sell snow to the Eskimos and make them believe they need more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red card Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Women's Pan Am games for football has no restrictions which mimics the Olympic rules. So, other than Canada, the other teams did bring nearly all the best players. Understandable given how weak these countries ex Brazil. I would have thought Brazil would want to audition some new players given they are looking to win gold next year at home. Men's Pan Am games also follows Olympic rules of being u23 tournament with 3 overage players allowed. Canada bought a B to B+ u23 team with no overage players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Is anyone else tired of hearing people say "she's only..." It was cute for a while but who cares. Is that all we have to be proud of? This is our national team. Age is irrelevant. Talk about players in terms of their game. So, they decided to leave all of the veterans out (except Labbe) and see what the youngsters could do. Again what does age have to do with it? Shouldn't it be the second-best 20 players in the country that get the opportunity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkomar Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Herdman says that they're looking for some youngsters to replace veterans. You can't know how good the young ones are going to be until you watch them play at the senior level. In these games, we've seen how difficult it is for most of them to play with so little time before being closed down. You're only going to be able to evaluate that by throwing them in and seeing how it goes. Looking good playing against their peers doesn't mean they're going to look as good playing against senior internationals. So, without this kind of test, you can't know who the second-best 20 players in the country are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Herdman says that they're looking for some youngsters to replace veterans. You can't know how good the young ones are going to be until you watch them play at the senior level. In these games, we've seen how difficult it is for most of them to play with so little time before being closed down. You're only going to be able to evaluate that by throwing them in and seeing how it goes. Looking good playing against their peers doesn't mean they're going to look as good playing against senior internationals. So, without this kind of test, you can't know who the second-best 20 players in the country are. Disagree. A "good" coach knows quickly the quality of a player without further ado. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Tend to agree, and you can gauge how players handle themselves in a training session. I want veterans who are stepping down or who are injured or have other commitments to be replaced by the best player possible. It shouldn't matter if that person if 15 or 35. You don't pick players so they become good, you pick players because they are good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thriller Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Kinzner's miss in Columbia game, this tourney in a nutshell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 I am really disappointed we didn't put a more competitive team out on our home soil, this was a missed opportunity to capture more new fans, attendance was fairly good anyway but how is it South American nations can bring basically their full World Cup side with all the travel and we put out a bunch of youngsters trying to move to the next level, are there not other opportunities to experiment! I never expected our full WC team after the tournament but after selling out THF for a friendly and snapping up tickets for the PanAms I really think fans in The Hammer deserved better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 I am really disappointed we didn't put a more competitive team out on our home soil, this was a missed opportunity to capture more new fans, attendance was fairly good anyway but how is it South American nations can bring basically their full World Cup side with all the travel and we put out a bunch of youngsters trying to move to the next level, are there not other opportunities to experiment! I never expected our full WC team after the tournament but after selling out THF for a friendly and snapping up tickets for the PanAms I really think fans in The Hammer deserved better! You make sense. Today's women game vs Colombia was not even on TV, at least I couldn't find it. We lost 1-0 but still I would have liked to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeanneMac Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Thoughts on tonights game???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulV Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 You make sense. Today's women game vs Colombia was not even on TV, at least I couldn't find it. We lost 1-0 but still I would have liked to see it. It was on Sportsnet One. I think the Canadian powers-that-be had the right strategy playing the young players in this tournament. It will be good experience for them playing against senior South and Central American sides. These are the teams they will have to play in the Olympics and future World Cups and they held their own, got a bit lucky getting to the knockout stage, and are now playing for a Bronze Medal. This is experience they can't replicate in the NCAA or whatever club teams they currently play on. It's been an entertaining tournament, but it's ultimately of little prestige or significance. A month from now it will be mostly forgotten until the next Pan Am Games. The experience gained will be the best use of the two weeks. If they can get a bronze medal, I think it would be more meaningful than a gold medal would be if we had sent a senior squad. First, of course, they have to score a goal or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkomar Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 The game is also still available as a Replay from the panam.cbc.ca website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Kinzner's miss in Columbia game, this tourney in a nutshell. We played a "D" team ranked beside the i's (Iran, Israel, India) and then lost three games without scoring a goal. I watched all our Women's World Cup games, Gold Cup games, and men's and women's Pan Am Games. Throw out the game against Ecuador who are and were especially abysmal that night and in those four tournaments we never scored more than a single goal in a game and the odds of Canada scoring in a game is about one in three. We score about once every 30 shots. The chances we've had to score in those four tournaments are enormous. We have a systemic problem of not producing and/or selecting the right players. I think the Canadian powers-that-be had the right strategy playing the young players in this tournament. It will be good experience for them playing against senior South and Central American sides. These are the teams they will have to play in the Olympics and future World Cups Good experience for who? The odds of conversion from youth team to senior is extremely low. That's a tracked pattern all over the world in women's soccer and here as well. Most of these players will disappear into the ether. We should have sent the second best 20 in the country. None of whom have commitments. We had a great chance to show the women of the country it's an open merit-based system and we blew it. Imagine if our workplaces were like this. It was a great year and the board of directors decided to share the wealth and give out bonuses and instead of you receiving one they gave it to someone 16 years of age because they wanted to see what they would do with it. And about the fans in Hamilton... was it just selective camera-work or was there a huge number of Colombian supporters there last night? is the GTA Colombian community that big or was it all 300 and their Pan Am Games staff/families, etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 . And about the fans in Hamilton... was it just selective camera-work or was there a huge number of Colombian supporters there last night? is the GTA Colombian community that big or was it all 300 and their Pan Am Games staff/families, etc? I think it was a bit of both, there were a whole lot of Columbian fans in the stands though! It gets back to my earlier post, if Canada had put a more recognizable experienced team out there I have little doubt the games would have been sold out with a pro Canadian crowd, it's great for youngsters to get experience but was this the tournament to do it in? I know many of my fellow Hamiltonians attended the sold out England match and a couple of the PanAm matches but when the team is over matched and not scoring it's hard to keep going back, I really feel like the CSA dropped the ball here and missed a great opportunity regardless of what some of you feel about the PanAm Games! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rightback Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 I really enjoyed last night's game, much more than any of the other Canada games I've seen recently men's or women's (except possibly the thrashing of Dominca). I thought we were always in it, saw some nice skill and energy from the youngsters. Wasn't this the full Columbian team minus Lady Andrade that beat France in the WWC? I think the kids did great except for the Canadian knack for finishing...I didn't find it disappointing at all. I don't know if anyone new really stood out for me since I already knew and like Buchanan, Fleming and Lawrence but I saw some nice confidence and moves from a few of the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Yoreli Rincon is their young star and went to Norway to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red card Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 They said their goal was to find new players for the Olympics. Well, I don't think they found anybody. Buchanan & Lawrence remain locks for the senior team. Fleming needs to stop dwelling on the ball so much and get stronger on the ball. Barring these improvements, she is coming off the bench. Labbe is not ready to be the #1 keeper. Her decision making is quite poor. Some flashes of potential was shown by Beckie, Levasseur, Carle, Quinn & Kirzner. But they all need much more seasoning to deliver consistent performances for a full match. Maybe Beckie is added to come off the bench late. Overall, the technical skills have improved compared to the u22 player we produced 10 years ago. But we still don't look fluid with the ball dribbling, passing or first touches compared to even a 3rd tier team like Colombia. Our running off the ball is non-existent. I can't recall ever a Canadian women's player doing a diagonal run. And other than Lawrence, we don't have players who can run at and take on midfielders and defenders which is a staple of the US team. Nobody on this particular team also knows how to cross the ball well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOGAKANATA Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Buchanan is the future, and I would like to see her move into a holding midfield role later on. Lawrence was poor and did not step up to the challenge considering she is part of the senior squad also Seen good things from fleming and fletcher. Overall the womens team has alot of bright spots. But their is still alot of glaring problems. People say "its Colombia from world cup"(excuse! we must stop this in canadian soccer, it doesnt help) but that is the first they ever beat Canada. Bottom line the womens ranking is slipping we are being left behind on this side of the program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Sure we are being left behind in men, women and youth alike as we keep hiring these dumb coaches who are just not even good politicians. I thought that with Montigliani, him being Italian, that coaching selection would change, but il fatso has proven me wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThruBall Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Our "development" system is broken. Full Stop! It's true the CSA and other provincial bodies are "attempting" to build one. However, their track record is abissmal and until they can flush the politics out of the system, the new and better "development" system won't be productive for the national teams for quite some time to come. A country our size will always present a challenge to see top prospects. In England Premiership teams have in excess of 200 scouts on the ground each showering geographies the size of Kitchener. There isn't the infrastructure anywhere in Canada to even come close to doing a decent comparable job. Take Chapman for the WNT. She has played her youth soccer right under the OSA noses and excelled in the NCCA. She never received an invite to the National Team program. She contacted Herdman via telephone and email over the course of two years and on 15 separate occasions and never received a response. When she landed her professional contract she was given a call up. If there were open try outs as a rule within the National Development Program, full transparency would exist and the players who are motivated would find a way to attend. Why not? I've seen many of the existing faces with in the NT program for quite some time. Ashley L was on the provincial squad back when she was years of age. There are few to none new faces. A series of open try outs, combines, would bring new players forward systematically every year at many ages. The simply solutions are sometimes the best. I just don't get why our NT won't implement open tryout. They can't afford the scouting infrastructure, by their own admission have empty shelves and have an aging / retiring team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67soccer Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Our "development" system is broken. Full Stop! I just don't get why our NT won't implement open tryout. They can't afford the scouting infrastructure, by their own admission have empty shelves and have an aging / retiring team. because if they do find gems that were not part of the Provincial programs then they would have admit they were wrong and God forbid that ever happened . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Game is 8:30pm local in Hamilton tonight. So 5:30pm PDT. Cuellar is no fool. It will be interesting to see their game plan. Mexico's starting goalkeeper Cecilia Santiago who played all their World Cup minutes has been on the bench the entire Pan Am tournament. Their defender Alina Garciamendez who logged all minutes is not in Canada any longer. The enigma that is Charlyn Corral is MIA, first after calling the program out as persona non grata, then after being included again after that as a result of "chickenpox". Renae Cuéllar who played in every game in the Cup has gone to Korea to play Mexico lost 0-1 to Colombia as well, although they had a slight edge in shots and similar possession to what we had against them. Our stats versus Brazil were fairly similar too. Should be a good game, the crowd will really help. Be nice to see them all get something for their hard work and commitment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Take Chapman for the WNT. She has played her youth soccer right under the OSA noses and excelled in the NCCA. She never received an invite to the National Team program. She contacted Herdman via telephone and email over the course of two years and on 15 separate occasions and never received a response. When she landed her professional contract she was given a call up. If there were open try outs as a rule within the National Development Program, full transparency would exist and the players who are motivated would find a way to attend. Why not? I am not surprised. Once I recommended a player to this guy Herdman but she was never contacted to attend an ID camp. Fully agree with open tryouts idea, it is the only way to fly. I believe the reason he doesn't have open tryouts is because he and his crew don't know what they are looking for and how to know if a player is good. It seems that only when someone else evaluates a players and offers a contract that Herdman jumps in, that way if she doesn't work he avoids being held responsible... it was the other guy's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.