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Probably one of the shittest takes I've read on this board. And that's saying something. 😭

I'm not saying he is better than Bradley, but the cost of Bradley certainly isn't justified when Fraser can come in his place.

It looks like that inter-league loan that I suggested for Liam a year and a half ago is finally materializing:  

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14 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

It’s 2 games, he made the bench for both and played in 1. Let’s see what happens after 5-10 games.

DO you think he'll get many chances after Priso and Okello played well in CL??  Do you think he'll get more playing time when Poz and Osorio come back into the starting line up??  I dont think I have ever seen TFC so depleted with injuries and they chose younger guys, and have even younger guys with more hype (Rutty) yet to see.  Its not just writing on the wall anymore, its chiseled into stone.  

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28 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

DO you think he'll get many chances after Priso and Okello played well in CL??  Do you think he'll get more playing time when Poz and Osorio come back into the starting line up??  I dont think I have ever seen TFC so depleted with injuries and they chose younger guys, and have even younger guys with more hype (Rutty) yet to see.  Its not just writing on the wall anymore, its chiseled into stone.  

I do think so, he will have to take them when they arrive. Dorsey didn’t do himself favours with his performance.

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46 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

It’s 2 games, he made the bench for both and played in 1. Let’s see what happens after 5-10 games.

I agree. The team is missing 10 players through injury, played yesterday, and play Montreal in 2 days.  Fraser's fresh for the weekend, and two games not starting the season in a CCL tie doesn't mean anything. 

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4 minutes ago, Trois Reds said:

I agree. The team is missing 10 players through injury, played yesterday, and play Montreal in 2 days.  Fraser's fresh for the weekend, and two games not starting the season in a CCL tie doesn't mean anything. 

If he doesn’t start vs MTL and they’ve got some injuries maybe my legs of concern will rise, but I think Armas is still in the whole let me see all of my team in action phase. 
 

My expectation and understanding is that Mavinga, Poz, Oso and Deleon are ready and available for Saturday and they were held out as precaution yesterday. 

Edited by Dominic94
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3 minutes ago, Dominic94 said:

If he doesn’t start vs MTL and they’ve got some injuries maybe my legs of concern will rise, but I think Armas is still in the whole let me see all of my team in action phase. 
 

My expectation and understanding is that Mavinga, Poz, Oso and Deleon are ready and available for Saturday and they were held out as precaution yesterday. 

FWIW Deleon played last night, maybe Fraser gets in to the game vs Montreal, I have my doubts after an unproven winger went in last night when the team was desperately trying to hold on!

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15 minutes ago, gator said:

FWIW Deleon played last night, maybe Fraser gets in to the game vs Montreal, I have my doubts after an unproven winger went in last night when the team was desperately trying to hold on!

It’s fair, but at the same time he put in an unproven striker and started unproven midfielders.

it doesn’t seem to bode well for Liam, it’s also a very crowded team, time will tell.

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I am not convinced the writing is on the wall for Fraser. It has only been 2 games under Armas, one in which he came on as a substitute. I need a few more games than that to see what happens before I hit the panic button. Priso is ahead of him for the time being, but he's a young player and young players are prone to inconsistency. I think Fraser will get his chance, maybe as soon as the weekend for all we know. The good thing too is that advancing in CCL provides more chances for everyone, Fraser included.

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3 hours ago, gator said:

That was a ridiculous substitution and almost cost TFC the tie, clearly there is no future for Fraser there, he needs to get out asap!

First of all I don’t see what they see in Dorsey he has never impressed anytime I’ve seen him . I still think it’s too early with Fraser he may still have a chance with Armas. However, in the end he just might not have what it takes for this level hopefully I’m wrong about that . Yes we all want every Canadian to have successful careers but not all will unfortunately. I think another MLS will take him and give him a shot he still has his age going for him so still has some time to make it at this level.

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I suspect we won't see much of Fraser on the field the same time as Bradley but at the same time it's a long season and I suspect we won't be seeing Bradley constantly on the field for this long season, even with them using Priso's legs to cover much of the ground that Bradley used to so that Bradley doesn't have to. So Liam should still get a lot of playing time.

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400min last year, 23 years old and 3 hot young prospects in central midfield barking at his heels.  4 established starters in front of him..Bradley, Poz, Delgado, Oso that he hasnt been able to displace.  No matter how you juggle the midfield, slipping Oso here, Poz to forward, Bradley to injured reserve, Delgado to wing etc etc...there are too many guys in there for him to get the minutes he needs.  I'd hate to see him be Ashton Morgan 2.0, and get 10 games a year until he is 28 and everyone say well he just didnt have enough talent.  

As for Dorsey, he is still a GA pick.  So isnt he basically free on the salary cap??  TFC will give him miles more looks than a regular draft pick.  But he didnt even show much at TFC2.  

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7 hours ago, Bison44 said:

As for Dorsey, he is still a GA pick.  So isnt he basically free on the salary cap??  TFC will give him miles more looks than a regular draft pick.  But he didnt even show much at TFC2.  

And TFC will also need to prove that he was worth taking over Buchanan... pro sports GMs tend to not like to admit they made a mistake and want to prove the naysayers wrong at all costs (I’m a Bears fan who had to endure 4 years of Trubisky getting yet another look because he was taken ahead of so many other better QBs)

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Fraser I suspect would have gone to CB if either of them had to be subbed out and that is a reasonable consideration not to start him in case he has to move into that position, I think Priso is very good and is a different skillset to Fraser and if Armos wanted that in the lineup I understand that as well, I just can't get over Dorsey being brought in to see the match out over Fraser because that was the last substitution opportunity! The MLS season hasn't even started, injuries will happen and maybe Liam is just patiently waiting for his opportunity still, I just hope he gets a chance prove he can or can't play at this level!

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8 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

I suspect we won't see much of Fraser on the field the same time as Bradley but at the same time it's a long season and I suspect we won't be seeing Bradley constantly on the field for this long season, even with them using Priso's legs to cover much of the ground that Bradley used to so that Bradley doesn't have to. So Liam should still get a lot of playing time.

Yes,  from the get go, i have always viewed and read Fraser’s as the guy who will spell and be groomed to take over for Bradley.  So i dont know why it is being assumed that he should be the guy who will be slotted in in roles that dont fit his attributes and skillsets.

Edited by Free kick
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I dont know, 15min left, you bring out Priso, why not put in the purest DM you have on the bench to help the team hold on??  Start Bradley and Fraser together, no way, but at the end of the game its not a like for like switch, you want someone to help close out the game.  That seemed like a perfect time for Fraser. 

I guess we'll see if it was all part of a plan.  Rest Fraser, keep his legs fresh so that he can take Bradleys spot on opening day. HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!  If thats what happens then we'll know if Armas has real Huevos Rancheros.  

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I’d be interested to hear Liam’s side of this one day, they really have botched his development and he’s the epitome of TFC don’t play the kids and probably the reason Jonathan David turn them down all due to respect to Hamilton and Chapman but Fraser was seen as really something good for good reason. For covid a move wasn’t realistic if we’re being honest so many issues right now but why not before ? How many promises were broken ? 

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I like Fraser a lot, personally and as a player.  I think he is a good player who should have been utilized better in recent years with Toronto FC.  Given how crowded that TFC midfield is, I would like to see him move on and get minutes elsewhere.

I will say this though, the Liam Fraser hype train went up significantly after his performance for Canada vs USA when MAK went down injured.  He's not shown the same type of performances for TFC after that Canada game, albeit in limited minutes and opportunities.  Because he played such a significant role in one of our team's biggest results in years, I believe people are convinced he is a superstar.  The calls for him to play more grew substantially after that game and rightly so.  We all want to see if he can perform like that game in game out.  I am just going to be honest, I have always rated Okello higher especially from watching him play in person and now I rate Priso even higher as well.  That's not to say I wouldn't love to see him play regularly for Toronto, I am just not sure it's going to happen given the depth in the central midfield position at the club.

I hope he proves me wrong though because I am a big fan of him.

Edited by Corazon
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14 minutes ago, Corazon said:

I like Fraser a lot, personally and as a player.  I think he is a good player who should have been utilized better in recent years with Toronto FC.  Given how crowded that TFC midfield is, I would like to see him move on and get minutes elsewhere.

I will say this though, the Liam Fraser hype train went up significantly after his performance for Canada vs USA when MAK went down injured.  He's not shown the same type of performances for TFC after that Canada game, albeit in limited minutes and opportunities.  Because he played such a significant role in one of our team's biggest results in years, I believe people are convinced he is a superstar.  The calls for him to play more grew substantially after that game and rightly so.  We all want to see if he can perform like that game in game out.  I am just going to be honest, I have always rated Okello higher especially from watching him play in person and now I rate Priso even higher as well.  That's not to say I wouldn't love to see him play regularly for Toronto, I am just not sure it's going to happen given the depth in the central midfield position at the club.

I hope he proves me wrong though because I am a big fan of him.

Good post. Agree with all but I feel his performance in the 2020 Camp Poutine deserves mention. He was definitely one of the better players and that was just a few months after the USA game, so a continuation of good form in a Canada shirt.

In a short time he went from the young player who'd just get called into Canada camp to make up he numbers, to making a breakthrough and earning 4 caps. Let's not forget he was unlucky not to get called into Olympic Qualifiers, where he probably would have been one of the leaders in midfield.

Of course Priso and Okello were also unavailable for the same reason, so you can't say for sure, but I honestly think had he played he could of had himself a good tournament and the narrative around him would have been more positive. Now talk has turned negative because Priso and Okello are preferred for the time being. It's still very early days though and if we had to call a squad tomorrow for WCQ I am not convinced Herdman calls Priso and Okello ahead of Fraser, because those 4 Canada caps likely give him the edge, at least in my mind.

He needs to win minutes soon, but there should be chances if TFC can keep their CCL run going. Canada has a lot of matches this year as well.    

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14 hours ago, Dominic94 said:

I’d be interested to hear Liam’s side of this one day, they really have botched his development and he’s the epitome of TFC don’t play the kids and probably the reason Jonathan David turn them down all due to respect to Hamilton and Chapman but Fraser was seen as really something good for good reason. For covid a move wasn’t realistic if we’re being honest so many issues right now but why not before ? How many promises were broken ? 

But Chapman and Hamilton had decent runs in the team. Hamilton especially because Jozy was injured so much.

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With Armas playing a 4-2-3-1 and Pozuelo expected to play 90%+ mins at the 10 spot, tfc will have okello, bradley, priso, osorio and delgado battling for minutes. Maybe he plays Osorio or Delgado one one wing but still theres no way Fraser will play much unless Bradley has a major injury. A loan or selling him would be best at this point. 

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On 4/15/2021 at 11:32 PM, Dominic94 said:

I’d be interested to hear Liam’s side of this one day, they really have botched his development and he’s the epitome of TFC don’t play the kids and probably the reason Jonathan David turn them down all due to respect to Hamilton and Chapman but Fraser was seen as really something good for good reason. For covid a move wasn’t realistic if we’re being honest so many issues right now but why not before ? How many promises were broken ? 

You think Liam Fraser's lack of playing time is why Jonathan David turned down TFC/MLS? Fraser signed a first team contract the same month that David joined Gent (January 2018). There was a pretty long list of academy signings that got no time or very close to no time before that, I doubt David came back from the future after having seen how Fraser would eventually get little playing time.

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8 minutes ago, Kent said:

You think Liam Fraser's lack of playing time is why Jonathan David turned down TFC/MLS? Fraser signed a first team contract the same month that David joined Gent (January 2018). There was a pretty long list of academy signings that got no time or very close to no time before that, I doubt David came back from the future after having seen how Fraser would eventually get little playing time.

I thought Fraser was signed earlier tbh, my mistake. I have read that David didn’t sign with TFC because they didn’t play their youth. 

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