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I would also love to see this move happen for Froese. He looked like he was ready to break into the first team near the end of 2015, but his 2016 season was quite disappointing (although he did look good for WFC2 in the playoffs). Similar to Adekugbe, I don't think he's going to get a real shot at anything more than an occasional start and few sub appearances, plus Voyageurs Cup and CCL games.

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28 minutes ago, shermanator said:

I would also love to see this move happen for Froese. He looked like he was ready to break into the first team near the end of 2015, but his 2016 season was quite disappointing (although he did look good for WFC2 in the playoffs). Similar to Adekugbe, I don't think he's going to get a real shot at anything more than an occasional start and few sub appearances, plus Voyageurs Cup and CCL games.

I agree with most of that, except I will bring up the departure of Pedro Morales. Does that create an opening for Froese to get another chance? Don't think he'll be a starter, but if he could get Aird like minutes I'd be happy. That being said, I'd like to see him get a chance with the 1st team at Fortuna Dusseldorf also.

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57 minutes ago, shermanator said:

According to this article, Froese has impressed with Fortuna Dusseldorf II, and it sounds like they want him. Article also says they may not have enough time to get him transferred before the deadline on Tuesday.

http://www.rp-online.de/nrw/staedte/duesseldorf/sport/bei-froese-fehlen-nur-noch-nuancen-aid-1.6566494

2 goals and 2 assists in 3 games with the U-23's? Nice.

Easy to forget he is still 20 years old.

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Always thought he was hard done by at the caps. Must seriously sucks in training because he always looked half decent in cameos especially out wide. Think it's harder through the middle where he wants to play.  

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1 hour ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Anyone else think it is ironic that young Canadians like Adekugbe and Froese - with a Canadian club - have to go to Europe in order to get playing time? And it's not like they are going to tiny 4th division teams either..

Froese has had plenty of playing time with the Whitecaps. It hasn't always been with the first team, but it wouldn't be in Düsseldorf either. Do we really consider Düsseldorf's second team a step up from his situation in Vancouver? 

Edited by C2SKI

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Less games in 2016 than 2015 with the big club and 13 games in USL is plenty of playing time??  If he can get more minutes in Dusseldorf's second team, learn some new tricks in Germany..I say go young man.  He doesnt want to get stuck like Tiebert has or passed over for the next gen of academy youngsters and american draft picks.  

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2 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Anyone else think it is ironic that young Canadians like Adekugbe and Froese - with a Canadian club - have to go to Europe in order to get playing time? And it's not like they are going to tiny 4th division teams either..

Well Froese is going to a 4th division team because that is where Dusseldorf's 2nd team plays and he is signing with them not the first team. Dusseldorf's first team is 2nd Budesliga which is not a step up from MLS either. What is good about this transfer if it happens is that the 4th division is much better than USL as far as playing level goes, the coaching and training facilities should be superior and he will have a lot more opportunities to move up to a higher level and not get stuck whether it is with Dusseldorf's first team (which does play in the 1st Bundesliga sometimes) or by catching the eye of another club.

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8 hours ago, Bison44 said:

Less games in 2016 than 2015 with the big club and 13 games in USL is plenty of playing time??  If he can get more minutes in Dusseldorf's second team, learn some new tricks in Germany..I say go young man.  He doesnt want to get stuck like Tiebert has or passed over for the next gen of academy youngsters and american draft picks.  

At 20, he's on the verge of being a regular MLS player, and Robbo seems to have plans for him going forward. For the second season in a row, he's been in the top 10 players league wide, for minutes earned by his age group.

The club has also arranged a fantastic opportunity for him to learn and play in Germany. I would be thrilled with a loan for Kianz, if Robbo doesn't see him with the first team immediately. I don't want to see one of our brightest young players transfer to a 4th division side though. Far too many players have stalled there, and I think his current situation is better.

Teibert has well over 100 first team appearances. Quit pissing on our lads accomplishments.

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I don't think any Whitecaps supporters can be pumping the tires of what their academy has produced so far. Fact is, the Whitecaps have yet to produce a player that is an every game starter at the MLS level yet.

Teibert, who I would argue has been the best player they've produced, looked like he could be an every game starter a few years ago, but right now is nothing more than a depth piece (and one that I think many Whitecaps supporters want out of Vancouver). Adekugbe and Froese have been "on the verge of the first team" for 3 years now and both have had to get loaned out to develop further. Bustos, Levis and McKendry are nothing more than depth for the occasional MLS game / Voyageurs Cup / CCL. Davies looks like he'll be the real deal, but it's too early to say yet. Not exactly results to be trumpeting.

And to be an "equal opportunity hater", neither TFC nor the Impact have produced anyone better. Doneil Henry is probably the best player that TFC have developed, and his injury problems are mounting. The Impact cut the best player they developed (in my opinion) unceremoniously in the summer. Tabla is in a similar position as Davies. I'm not counting Osorio as he was only with the TFC Academy for a few months before going straight to MLS.

Outside of Davies, does anyone foresee any of the young Canadians on the Whitecaps will be in a better spot at the end of 2017? Maybe Bustos? For everyone else though, I don't think 2017 will be any different than 2016, 2015, 2014, etc. That's why I'm hopeful that the players that appear to have hit the glass ceiling in Vancouver get out so they can progress at a better rate.

Edited by shermanator

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Until the quality of the player that academies are producing eclipses imports that makes the club money, via on pitch talent, shirt sales or PR interest, business is always going to beat out giving youth minutes in the hope they will bloom. Football is a results driven business and immediate success in an instant gratification culture and generation is make or break. 

Not saying I agree with that but it is a reality. I know you could argue that developing the youth is best business, in the long term it is. With such tight-fisted management you would think Carl Robinson would be expected to play all youth products. It is also a chicken and egg situation where by the youth products need game time to prove themselves better than imports but in reality there is still a big gap in quality that hopefully the USL and the youth set ups will fill over time. I believe the future is bright but we are also 5-10 years away from it. 

What Whitecaps are doing setting up loans for the youth better than USL but not ready to hold down a first team spot is smart for everyone involved. 

Switching gears to Russell Tiebert. This is possibly the 3rd, certainly the 2nd season in a row I have hoped Tiebert would get the heck out of dodge for his own sake. I am a big fan and I think the whitecaps have really hurt, possibly permanently now, his progression by shackling the positives in his game trying to make him in to a DM. Tiebert has been too adaptable, its like being a great substituent teacher after a few years on the subs list you have screwed yourself out of a permanent position by being too reliable. Russell needs to be starting week in week out at this stage of his career, he has shown too much loyalty while the Whitecaps made him their Canadian poster boy they never concerted that faith into regular minutes. That might have been due to his training and better players in the squad too but for me they gambled on his development and the move to DM.

The idea wasn't far fetched or without merit. Tiebert as a Deep Lying playmaker was a good shout imo. That might well have been the goal. He had good delivery and had a great eye for a long pass, not to mention a ridiculous engine necessary for playing central mid.  However where I think it has gone wrong is the Caps coaching team trying to drill into him defensive skills at the cost of the abilities he already possessed. From the minute he was moved centrally you could see he was caught in two minds conflicted with instructions to sit deep, break up play and keep it simple vs. his natural urge to bomb forward and create/pick out passes. He simply has never recovered to show the promise he had before the change of position. Maybe the hope was to reintroduce the former parts to his game and make him a much better rounded player however while he can run all night and gets stuck in he has become simply average all round.

I can see Tiebert being a CPL player for start-up given his current trajectory. I hope he gets a move somewhere with different coaching staff and minutes where he can rediscover what made him so promising early on in his career.

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Nobody is downplaying Tieberts/Froese accomplishments, but like Toontown most of us hope for better from both.  Being a spot starter depth guy isnt what I thought Tiebert would become 3 years ago.  I just dont want Froese caught in a logjam in the Caps midfield and not get the minutes he needs to develop.  And its not a TFC-IMPACT-CAPS thing.  Every CDN club has some guys that probably would do with a move if they could get more playing time elsewhere.  If there are better situations for Hamilton, Chapman, Tabla, Jackson-Hamel, Bustos, Morgan etc I think they need to give it a chance.

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26 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

 Every CDN club has some guys that probably would do with a move if they could get more playing time elsewhere.  If there are better situations for Hamilton, Chapman, Tabla, Jackson-Hamel, Bustos, Morgan etc I think they need to give it a chance.

Agreed, but I think Froese can do better than a development squad in div 4 Germany. I think MLS clubs and players should aim higher than that with transfers. A loan might be different.

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Happy for Kianz, thought his growth was stunted in 2016 after looking like he could break through. Perhaps there's a better chance of him doing so with Fortuna, seems that at minimum he impressed with the reserves.

That club seems to like their Canadians. Piette, Alderson and now Froese.

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Happy this went through. Perhaps a better chance to break through here than at Vancouver. Hope he can get some first team minutes asap.

Anyone know if his contract is for the first team or U23? (Or is it the same).

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From the Sandor article:

“This is a good opportunity for Kianz to continue his development both on and off the pitch,” Whitecaps coach Carl Robinson said in a statement issued by the club. “This move will also open a pathway for our young midfield players who are ready to compete for minutes.”

So is Robinson really saying that Kianz was keeping other players out of the lineup?

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2 hours ago, El Hombre said:

From the Sandor article:

“This is a good opportunity for Kianz to continue his development both on and off the pitch,” Whitecaps coach Carl Robinson said in a statement issued by the club. “This move will also open a pathway for our young midfield players who are ready to compete for minutes.”

So is Robinson really saying that Kianz was keeping other players out of the lineup?

Maybe he has Kianz and Andrew Jacobsen mixed-up. 

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