tmcmurph Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 http://calgaryfoothillssoccer.com/news.php?news_id=941966 June 8th, 4 PM @ Shouldice. See you there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Worshipful of the MLS and minor-league route while dismissive of independent pro-Canadian leagues, going for the Euro-idiot vote with "football club"... not too impressed so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Worshipful of the MLS and minor-league route while dismissive of independent pro-Canadian leagues, going for the Euro-idiot vote with "football club"... not too impressed so far. OK, lets parse this bullshit: "Worshipful of the MLS": Promoting a game by stressing the professional connection is bad why? "minor-league route": Starting small and growing is bad why? "dismissive of independent pro-Canadian leagues": Ooh, please tell us about these mythical leagues and especially which one covers Alberta or at least has teams within a reaonable bus ride? "the Euro-idiot vote with 'football club' ": right, because the world game is shameful and somehow it is Calgary's fault that EVERY OTHER FUCKING CLUB IS DOING IT. Jeebus (brother) Bob! WTF would you think is realistic in Calgary today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Just to clarify... "minor-league route": Starting small and growing is bad why? By "minor league" I meant the literal definition "affiliated with and subservient to so-called major leagues", not the casual definition "small". I am pro-small. If Wheeldon is just stressing the MLS connection for marketing purposes and doesn't mean anything by it, that's fine. I'm taking him at his word until I have evidence to do otherwise. There are two NASL team (Edmonton and Minnesota) nearer to Calgary than the nearest USL Pro team. So if you're worried about buses, USL Pro isn't the way to go! (Of course there's no PDL-level team in that range. I have no problem with PDL.) EVERY OTHER FUCKING CLUB is using "football club", yes, and it's stupid every single time. Saying "oh well, these guys are all going to be Euro-sniffling inferiority-complex machines" is the surest way to ensure it keeps happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 See, now I am just more confused... Just to clarify... By "minor league" I meant the literal definition "affiliated with and subservient to so-called major leagues", not the casual definition "small". I am pro-small. OK, where in the world is the mythical nation that has "small" leagues that are not in some way connected by affiliations to the leagues above them? Most of the world (I'd say virtually ALL but I can't say I have looked at all nations football systems) is organized on national "pyramids" with amateurs at the bottom and the pros at the top. Why do you think that North America should be the lone exception to this rule. Even the yanks are moving away from their exceptional system of college development as they realize it is not the best way to develop players. There are two NASL team (Edmonton and Minnesota) nearer to Calgary than the nearest USL Pro team. So if you're worried about buses, USL Pro isn't the way to go! (Of course there's no PDL-level team in that range. I have no problem with PDL.) So they should have leapt right to NASL from nothing? I have no problem with the NASL as a goal in two to five years but why are you shitting on them for taking the time to build it up before investing the serious money needed for NASL? What are talking about USL Pro for? They are entering the PDL. How does USL Pro enter into the discussion? EVERY OTHER FUCKING CLUB is using "football club", yes, and it's stupid every single time. Saying "oh well, these guys are all going to be Euro-sniffling inferiority-complex machines" is the surest way to ensure it keeps happening. I think I see my mistake. I forgot that soccer was invented in North America. The traditional game of the tribes of the Eastern Woodlands was taught to the evil colonists who, unable to properly pronouce "soce-ker" (Native American for "shin kicking"), started to use the word foot-ball. The spread of the cult of "soccer" by evangelical misssionaries from the Great Lakes First Nations spread the game to places like Italy and Brazil via trading canoes where the locals loved the game but being xenophobic decided that they would make up their own names and to add insult to injury, use "football" when translating into the obscure language sometimes usd for commerce known as "English". You can call it soccer all you want (and I will too) but using the international word for the game is a sign of the worldwide nature of the sport not some inferiority complex. Now demonizing the "FC" useage, that is about as douchey-hipster as you can get. "Oh, look at me, I liked SOCCER before it was cool." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 OK, where in the world is the mythical nation that has "small" leagues that are not in some way connected by affiliations to the leagues above them? Most of the world (I'd say virtually ALL but I can't say I have looked at all nations football systems) is organized on national "pyramids" with amateurs at the bottom and the pros at the top. Why do you think that North America should be the lone exception to this rule. Even the yanks are moving away from their exceptional system of college development as they realize it is not the best way to develop players. "Affiliated with and subservient to". The minor league model of AAA baseball, not the pyramid model of the English Championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Oh come on! Now you are just being ridiculous. Calgary has not been set up like a AAA baseball team. Neither has Victoria Highlanders. Yes there are "reserve" teams in the USL Pro and developlment teams in the PDL but given the current realities what else are we supposed to do? Seriously, how else are we supposed to create proffesional third and fourth divisions without affiliations with MLS and NASL clubs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 You're attacking an argument I haven't made. I was replying to the interview where Wheeldon dismissed NASL and advocated the subservient USL Pro model. I'm not denigrating the entire concept of USL PDL. We've built several beautiful teams without sucking MLS dick to do it. In fact, the deeper Canadian clubs get into MLS the worse Canadian soccer has gotten. And evidence worldwide shows that farm teams are less well-supported than independent teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 You're attacking an argument I haven't made. I was replying to the interview where Wheeldon dismissed NASL and advocated the subservient USL Pro model. I'm not denigrating the entire concept of USL PDL. WTF?!?! Maybe you could have corrected that misperception at the beginning? Sheesh. So the actual argument you are making is that the USL Pro - MLS agreement to create reserve/affiliated teams in the USL Pro league is "sucking MLS dick" and somehow inherantly evil? Why? FACT: Promotion - relegation is not coming to NA soccer any time in the next decade, if EVER. FACT: MLS needs a competitive series of games for the reserve teams. FACT: A strong third division is neccessary for the long-term development of players. Unless you are somehow arguing that MLS is NOT the 1st Division in the US and Canada I fail to see how this is bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 WTF?!?! Maybe you could have corrected that misperception at the beginning? Sheesh. So the actual argument you are making is that the USL Pro - MLS agreement to create reserve/affiliated teams in the USL Pro league is "sucking MLS dick" and somehow inherantly evil? Why? It's not that it's evil, but it's because if you're in USL Pro, you would probably have to affiliate yourself with another MLS team. If those MLS reserve players do well there, they would go back to MLS. So, it would be hard to sell on to fans, and you would probably have to play those players from the MLS teams a certain amount of minutes instead of developing your own club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trillium Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 I wonder if the CSA will allow a PDL club to start and get playing out rights for 2015. Would a Prarie Div 3 league equivalent to Ontarios new League 1, not be a better model ? Eddies reserves as one team, Calgary and Lethbridge... from Alberta, Regina, Saskatoon, and Winnipeg so six to start. You could possibly sustain two teams in each of Edmonton, Calgary and Winnipeg at the Div 3 level, creating natural classicos over a few years, pushing the league to nine, and then look to add in a Brandon or Thunder Bay etc. if you got to 12 Div 3 teams playing in two conferences you have a potential of a 30 game season, 20 in your home conference and 10 out. Travel becomes pretty reasonable at that level in terms of Distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 It's not that it's evil, but it's because if you're in USL Pro, you would probably have to affiliate yourself with another MLS team. If those MLS reserve players do well there, they would go back to MLS. So, it would be hard to sell on to fans, and you would probably have to play those players from the MLS teams a certain amount of minutes instead of developing your own club. Actually that is the whole point, the USL Pro league has teams that are reserve teams, some that are simply affiliated, and some that are totally independant clubs. That is why I think it is a great option as it allows for all kinds involvement that produces a stronger and more stable league that allows for mutliple pathways to the top division. It represents a blend of the European and American systems to create something that could work here. MLS did not take over USL Pro, they formed a partnership that, so far, shows no signs of being anything other than a win-win. I think Ben has a huge chip on his shoulder in regards MLS which sometimes produces excellent commetary (see my signature line below) and yet sometimes produces irrational hate. I wonder if the CSA will allow a PDL club to start and get playing out rights for 2015. Would a Prarie Div 3 league equivalent to Ontarios new League 1, not be a better model ? I thought that Calgary already has the permissions they need from the CSA? A prairie D3 would be step up from the PDL for sure. I must again remind you that L1O is NOT a D3 but a provincial league and is on the same develpmental level as the PDL. The only recognized D3 in North America is USL Pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub Narcotic Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Why are we talking in hypotheticals here? Orlando City won USL PRO last year with SKC loanees, notably Dom Dwyer, and had great attendance throughout, helping them join MLS. Wilmington has been doing very well this year with TFC loanees and attendance seems fine to me; Charleston is not doing well this year but attendance doesn't seem any different than last year to me. Affiliation will, and is, working well in the North American pyramid because the choice is often between affiliation and having the club not exist or be in significantly worse shape financially and on the field. In addition, the big clubs are providing coaching, marketing, scouting and players that the host clubs would never be able to access as part of the USL/MLS agreement. I don't think LA Galaxy II will draw well, but for the independent clubs with a few loan players the MLS/USL has been a very good deal so far and all indicators are that it will continue to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 WTF?!?! Maybe you could have corrected that misperception at the beginning? Sheesh. Perhaps. It was perfectly clear to me but obviously there was some confusion. I regret the error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 You're attacking an argument I haven't made. I was replying to the interview where Wheeldon dismissed NASL and advocated the subservient USL Pro model. I'm not denigrating the entire concept of USL PDL. We've built several beautiful teams without sucking MLS dick to do it. In fact, the deeper Canadian clubs get into MLS the worse Canadian soccer has gotten. And evidence worldwide shows that farm teams are less well-supported than independent teams. Re: Wheeldon dismissing NASL - remember that Wheeldon is trying to join or has joined the USL, who are sworn rivals with NASL. If you're part of USL you will have to be publically dismissive of the NASL. In fact, if anything this shows that he's smart enough to know that. Who knows what he really thinks but that will need to be the company line if/when you decide to jump. Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Posted June 5, 2014 Author Share Posted June 5, 2014 Foothills U -23's still undefeated with a 1 - 1 draw against U of C tonight. Goal scorer for Foothills: "Jay" Wheeldon. 76th min. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Posted June 8, 2014 Author Share Posted June 8, 2014 Another article from the Calgary Sun: "Calgary Foothills developing soccer players" The Calgary Foothills Soccer Club’s habit of developing future pros goes back decades. But with professional clubs popping up in seemingly every corner of the continent in recent years, the club saw an opportunity to expand its development umbrella and bring elite-level soccer back to Calgary. Enter the Foothills U23 team, a development squad that’ll be making its debut in the United Soccer Leagues’ Professional Development League next year and is working its way through an exhibition schedule this summer. “There’s definitely an interest for high-level soccer to return to this city and what we’re trying to do is bring it back gradually,” said Tommy Wheedon Jr, the team’s head coach. “Instead of going smack, bang and trying to bring an MLS franchise in, which costs in the region of $40-50 million, we said let’s this bring in.” The Foothills team will be playing host to the Vancouver Whitecaps’ under-23 team on Sunday (4 p.m., Encana Field) in a game that’ll serve as a preview of what footie fans can expect next season. The Whitecaps are one of a handful of Major League Soccer teams that sport under-23 squads in the PDL, including both the nearby Portland Timbers and Seattle Sounders. The league’s also made up of a large contingent of unaffiliated teams, and has become a breeding ground for young North American talent. “In the last five years 150 players have been drafted from the PDL league into the MLS, the PDL really gives a clear pathway to the pros,” Wheedon said. “It bridges the game. We can play 16-17-18 year olds in this PDL league to gain exposure and opportunities at a higher level, and they’re right on the doorstep of the Sounders and the Whitecaps and the Timbers.” The new team also happens to be something of an organic extension of what the Foothills organization has been doing for years. This is the club, after all, that produced former England international Owen Hargreaves, as well as current West Ham academy player Malyk Hamilton and, most recently, new Chelsea signee Joey Cowlishaw. That reputation for nurturing young talent has reaped rewards even before the team officially kicks off its first league season, as former Whitecaps U23 keeper Simon Thomas chose to make the move to Calgary and train with the club for its exhibition season as he prepares to move back to Europe - he previously spent a year with Huddersfield Town’s reserve team. With a game against his former Whitecaps teammates on tap for this weekend, Thomas was happy to reflect on what he says has been a fruitful time training with the Foothills staff. “The club is big on developing players and that’s fantastic, it’s the way it should be in this country,” Thomas said. “The budget and the people involved around an MLS side is tough to compare to a youth club, but as under-23 clubs go, I think (Foothills) are doing it right and I think they are doing a better job than Vancouver is. “They’re putting the right people in place so that come 2015, when they enter the league, they’ll be a decent side and look to push on and get results.” Sunday’s game against the Whitecaps could also offer Calgary fans an opportunity to see how some homegrown talent is faring with the Vancouver MLS club. It’s expected that 17-year-old keeper Marco Carducci will be in the lineup, as well as left back Sam Adekugbe and midfielder Mitchell Piraux, both of whom plied their trade with the Foothills club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 Another fantastic outing for the Foothills U-23's as they defeat Whitecaps U-23's 2 - 1. Goal scorers for Foothills: Nat Tecle 36th. min. and "Jay" Wheeldon in the 68th minute on a superb free kick. Great crowd, great game, great weather. Also guest appearances by Theo Fleury (his son is in the Foothills system) and Mayor Nenshi. Overall a fantastic day out!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Cool man, how was the attendance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Cool man, how was the attendance? I know this. Lord Bob wasn't there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditty Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Cool man, how was the attendance? Announced: 1,225 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Posted June 14, 2014 Author Share Posted June 14, 2014 We finally have our own dedicated web-site: http://www.foothillsfc.ca/Default.asp?id=home&l=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 We finally have our own dedicated web-site: http://www.foothillsfc.ca/Default.asp?id=home&l=1 Ouch! An OK site but a huge red flag when I clicked on the "What is the PDL" link and they have published a bald-faced lie: it [PDL] ranks as the third tier in the North American Soccer Pyramid They might try to make that claim in Canada as they used to do when the A-League was listed as the D1 for Canada before MLS came to Canada. However now they are in a system (USL) that includes an actual D3 (USL Pro). Not good to start out with outright bullshit on you page. If any mdeai get wind of it (haha, yes unlikely) they will immediately assume everything the club says is full of shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 They might try to make that claim in Canada as they used to do when the A-League was listed as the D1 for Canada before MLS came to Canada. However now they are in a system (USL) that includes an actual D3 (USL Pro). Not good to start out with outright bullshit on you page. If any mdeai get wind of it (haha, yes unlikely) they will immediately assume everything the club says is full of shit. Yeah, it is weird. The site explicitly says: "USL Pro & NASL (2 separate leagues) - 2nd Tier" ...which is just not true. There's a reason USL itself doesn't draw attention to the "tier" USL Pro plays at. I mean, obviously the pyramid is fairly artificial, but USL Pro's third-division status is because they decided it wasn't to their advantage to meet the USSF's second-division requirements, so there's no ambiguity. There's also: "We, Calgary Foothills want to be the first youth club to operate our own U23 men's team to compete in the PDL leagues and provide a platform for our young players in Calgary a team they can strive to play on." ...which is another strange statement. The Abbotsford/Fraser Valley Mariners ran a PDL U23 team as an extension of their youth program years ago, and that's just off the top of my head in British Columbia. Of course they no longer exist, but it would certainly disqualify Foothills as "first". Unless they mean "the first in Calgary", which is a pretty bloody narrow thing to boast about. Very strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Yeah, there is a fine line between boosterism and exagerration and they may have gone a little over. Hopefully they will make some corrections before people who actually matter (not us obviously) start to notice. They have some time because the media won't start digging for negative stuff until the team hits their first losing streak or some sort of scandal comes up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.