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3 hours ago, PiedPilko said:

This is why I don't think Larin up front is so clear cut. Cava hasn't gotten a lot of service in Vancouver, but I don't think that means his finishing talent has just disappeared. He is so good at knocking those in, from bouncing passes.

I mean.. seeing how Larin lit up the league on his first season as Rookie on an awful expansion team at 19 years old... unless Cavallini start putting those number Larin is still it for me (not to mention he doesn't get credit for getting starts on a much bigger club than the Whitecaps)

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28 minutes ago, LeoH037 said:

I mean.. seeing how Larin lit up the league on his first season as Rookie on an awful expansion team at 19 years old... unless Cavallini start putting those number Larin is still it for me (not to mention he doesn't get credit for getting starts on a much bigger club than the Whitecaps)

Does Cavallini have a former Ballon D'Or winner feeding him passes within 10 yards of goal for him to finish? I must have missed that. 🙄

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There's something to be said about the fact that Larin is trusted by the coaching staff at Besiktas and is considered starter material (even if not an undisputed one), given the club is not known for giving players his age such responsibility. I argue if Larin goes to go back to MLS today, he hits the ground running and lights up the league again. And those passes being "fed" by a former Ballon D'Or still had be buried behind the net by an inexperienced rookie.

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8 hours ago, LeoH037 said:

There's something to be said about the fact that Larin is trusted by the coaching staff at Besiktas and is considered starter material (even if not an undisputed one), given the club is not known for giving players his age such responsibility. I argue if Larin goes to go back to MLS today, he hits the ground running and lights up the league again. And those passes being "fed" by a former Ballon D'Or still had be buried behind the net by an inexperienced rookie.

Maybe this is controversial, but I feel like Cavallini could play at a similar level if he wanted to. Larin's path to Besiktas wasn't so linear. He had that great rookie season, and then he proceeded to score at a similar rate to Cava in Liga MX for the next 2. I think it's close, and you have to take the higher level of play into account, but from what I've seen of the two, Lucas is the more consistent finisher. 

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6 minutes ago, PiedPilko said:

Maybe this is controversial, but I feel like Cavallini could play at a similar level if he wanted to. Larin's path to Besiktas wasn't so linear. He had that great rookie season, and then he proceeded to score at a similar rate to Cava in Liga MX for the next 2. I think it's close, and you have to take the higher level of play into account, but from what I've seen of the two, Lucas is the more consistent finisher. 

It's not controversial because it's already proven. He played in Liga MX, which is at least comparable to Turkey if not better.

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Cav has also produced for the national team. Not at outstanding levels but there is something to look at. While Larin, even when he is good form in the MLS, has underperformed to being non-existent for the national team.

So I would need to see Larin at least at 75% of David's Belgium club level to move him ahead of Cav if Larin doesn't deliver much coming on as a sub for Canada.

David still gets the start ahead of both if playing with one striker and want to get all our top mids on the pitch.

 

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8 hours ago, red card said:

Cav has also produced for the national team. Not at outstanding levels but there is something to look at. While Larin, even when he is good form in the MLS, has underperformed to being non-existent for the national team.

So I would need to see Larin at least at 75% of David's Belgium club level to move him ahead of Cav if Larin doesn't deliver much coming on as a sub for Canada.

David still gets the start ahead of both if playing with one striker and want to get all our top mids on the pitch.

 

Look at Larin's supporting cast with the nats. The bulk of his games with the nats were played under Floro, and has yet to receive any semblance of a consistent run of games under Herdman's system. I have nothing against Cavallini, but to write him as clear of Larin is ridiculous 

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12 minutes ago, LeoH037 said:

Look at Larin's supporting cast with the nats. The bulk of hid games with the nats were played under Floro, and has yet to receive any semblance of onsistent run of games under Herdman's system. I have nothing against Cavallini, but to write him as clear of Larin is ridiculous 

Stating it is "ridiculous" is actually ridiculous.

History shows Cav overtook Larin on club form a couple of years ago. Cav has always outperformed Larin at the national team level.

Larin has only closed the gap this year at the club level but he hasn't surpassed Cav. If you think he has, it isn't to any significant degree.

Larin now has to show he can close the gap at the national team.  He has it show it in training to Herdman or as sub to the rest of us. He can't no longer be missing the net on breakaways or missing tap ins for Canada.

Cav is also a better sub in many situations since he is more of a different striker compared to David than Larin. So like Cav did one year ago today, he came in as a sub for David and scored.

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I actually think Cav would work better when we have less of the bell and Larin when we have more. Cav isn't fast by any means, but he's a really good post player on the counter. His wrecking ball style and lay offs worked very well against LAFC. Larin is good in the box, better than Cav who is worse than one may expect given his build.

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6 hours ago, red card said:

Stating it is "ridiculous" is actually ridiculous.

History shows Cav overtook Larin on club form a couple of years ago. Cav has always outperformed Larin at the national team level.

Larin has only closed the gap this year at the club level but he hasn't surpassed Cav. If you think he has, it isn't to any significant degree.

Larin now has to show he can close the gap at the national team.  He has it show it in training to Herdman or as sub to the rest of us. He can't no longer be missing the net on breakaways or missing tap ins for Canada.

Cav is also a better sub in many situations since he is more of a different striker compared to David than Larin. So like Cav did one year ago today, he came in as a sub for David and scored.

That's just the thing tho, he has yet to start any game under Herdman and its unfair to compare him with Larin's record under Floro when the guy hasn't even been getting a chance. So yes, saying Cav is clear is ridiculous.

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33 minutes ago, LeoH037 said:

That's just the thing tho, he has yet to start any game under Herdman and its unfair to compare him with Larin's record under Floro when the guy hasn't even been getting a chance. So yes, saying Cav is clear is ridiculous.

Larin started vs Mexico alongside Cavallini in the 2019 Gold Cup. Cavallini scored the lone Canadian goal that game

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I posted this previously but worth repeating. In CNL/GC Lucas  scored vs Mexico, USA & Haiti.  Cav is playing on stronger teams than Larin under Floro  but unless he lights it up in Turkey,  at this point Cav should start. Larin will have the opportunity to win his spot back during WCQ ..healthy competition is what we have all wanted for years. As for David, I would prefer him not leading the line. Don't want him going up vs big CBs  with Concacaf refs in charge. Would prefer either Cav or Larin up front.

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11 hours ago, LeoH037 said:

That's just the thing tho, he has yet to start any game under Herdman and its unfair to compare him with Larin's record under Floro when the guy hasn't even been getting a chance. So yes, saying Cav is clear is ridiculous.

I don't see the difference of missing sitters whether if Floro or JH on the sidelines. Those errors are not Floro's. See what I mean?

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This may sound counter intuitive to some but I don't think we should be judging our starting striker on goals scored. With our style of play the striker is very much a supporting role where we depend on them to hold up the ball and bring our wingers/midfielders into the play. The best option is clearly Cavallini. If/when we need a striker to finish chances in matches where we overload the opposition then I think the answer is David.

Even think back to the 2017 Gold Cup where Cavallini had yet to even score for Canada - he was a fantastic contributor and clear starter because of his support play. When we brought in Larin and let him start vs. Jamaica the wheels fell off. I'm a big Larin fan, I just don't think he's the best fit for us to start.

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6 hours ago, MtlMario said:

I don't see the difference of missing sitters whether if Floro or JH on the sidelines. Those errors are not Floro's. See what I mean?

Exactly this. Larin had chances that he failed to convert. Sure, a lot of time has passed, but it doesn't change the fact that there is a significant gap in national team performance. 

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