Joe Keeper Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Im surprised that this has not been posted just yet. The Hoilett brothers are training with TFC in TO. They phoned up Nelson and specifically requested this. When the media pressed them about choosing a national team this morning, Hoilett arrogantly brushed them off and said he was remaining silent for now. I for one am somewhat in shock as to how TFC can allow this... Why do we? How much more of this do we have to take? It breaks your bloody heart when we see soccer people in this nation allowing, encouraging, furthering and sanctioning this kind of use and abuse. Its moves like this that show players that it is OK to continue to use our programs to launch their careers with countries they have no business playing for. Players are defecting because often, soccer operators in this country are allowing them to think it is OK because we allow this kind of ****e when it comes down to it. TFC think nothing of this and even use Hoilett's actions for self promotion on Facebook. At what point do we admit that a lot of it is our own fault for continually rolling out the red carpet for these dbags? At least we are getting an appropriate response from some sectors of the media: Sid Sixeiro interview: This was just refreshing to watch. He hits the nail on the head for my money. http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/ Besides continue to shake my head at the unspeakable incompetence of TFC, all I can do is hope that the media will use this insult along with the Judas Leroux celebration at BMO to start to change the culture of allowing this kind of abuse to continue... Its time to start speaking up about these defections. It starts with the fans and media. Change starts with reactions like Sid Sixeiro's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkingatlamport Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I for one am somewhat in shock as to how TFC can allow this... Why do we? How much more of this do we have to take? Why not? Tons of players train with other teams during off seasons. It helps create relationships with the player, the team they are currently playing for, and helps the younger guys. It's a good move for TFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Keeper Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share Posted June 4, 2013 Why not? Tons of players train with other teams during off seasons. It helps create relationships with the player, the team they are currently playing for, and helps the younger guys. It's a good move for TFC. I see your points, but only to a degree. I think you are really missing what is going on here under the surface of the deep problems facing Canadian soccer right now. You need to look at this move symbolically as well as functionally in the bigger context of the defections that have ravaged us in the last decade or so. I admit it is still not as bad as say certain other players whom have screwed us over in the past training with TFC, but what it shows it that these guys can do whatever they like and take whatever they want from Canadian soccer resources and continue to use it to further their own ambitions. At what point do we admit that Canadian soccer resources are being drained too much and that the national team's world cup qualifying drought is connected to this drain on talent? National and club team development resources in Canada should be dedicated to developing talent for the national team, players whom want to play for us. Is this especially not true in a country with already limited resources? By allowing Junior to further access resources we are sanctioning his flip flopping and selfishness. Its time to start speaking out against this kind of acceptance of our own dire situation to me. This is not about convenience as far as Hoilett is concerned, this is about continuation of the problems facing the men's national team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Between LeRoux over the weekend and this today it really has been a bit of a "let's rub it in Canadian supporters' faces" couple of days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkingatlamport Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I admit it is still not as bad as say certain other players whom have screwed us over in the past training with TFC, but what it shows it that these guys can do whatever they like and take whatever they want from Canadian soccer resources and continue to use it to further their own ambitions. At what point do we admit that Canadian soccer resources are being drained too much and that the national team's world cup qualifying drought is connected to this drain on talent? National and club team development resources in Canada should be dedicated to developing talent for the national team, players whom want to play for us. Is this especially not true in a country with already limited resources? By allowing Junior to further access resources we are sanctioning his flip flopping and selfishness. Its time to start speaking out against this kind of acceptance of our own dire situation to me. This is not about convenience as far as Hoilett is concerned, this is about continuation of the problems facing the men's national team. Toronto FC is owned by MLSE, a privately owned organization. Its training facilities were paid for in the tune of $20 million by MLSE itself. They are doing what's good for their organization, which could use all the help it can get at this point, at their own expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 It can't hurt to have him see the facilities he'll have if he plays for Canada (and maybe one day TFC, which won't be possible if he doesn't play for Canada). He himself said the facilities were impressive and better than what they have at QPR. He's waiting to see if Jamaica makes the World Cup... if not I think he's ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killgod Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Henry should slide tackle and break his ankle into pieces, make his decision for him. YOU PLAY FOR NO ONE. Fin. This whole charade with him and JDG2 just mocks us on the footballing stage and I bloody hate it. Even if these guys ever play for us, it still undermines and insults the **** out of Canada that we had to ****ing beg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoatmealCrisp Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I get what you're saying, but I've always been under the impression that Soccer Canada were just free tenants of the Kia Training Ground. What choice do they really have? And between the amount of money that TFC have invested in training facilities and their academy, it's hard to argue that the sum total of its contribution to Canada's national program hasn't been a positive one. I can only hope that the Aird's and Aleman's of this generation being willing to commit to Canada this young is a sign of the progress we're making. As for Hoilett, whatever. Given the season he had at QPR this year, who knows where he'll even be when we're next playing meaningful matches. The fact that he hasn't accepted a cap with the Reggae Boyz yet leads me to think he's waiting to see if they make the WC, and on the surface they seem like the weakest team in the Hex. He certainly wasn't worn down from all the first team action he was seeing the past 5 months. EDIT: That was meant to be a reply to Joe Keeper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 LOL, certainly touched a nerve with Sid. Weeee!!!! Might be a bit touchy right now after Sunday's events and I suspect he's being a bit dramatic for effect but sometimes you need to be. Boil the issue down until you get to the very basics, the black and white of things because as complex as some decisions can be in the making in the end the choice results in an absolute. It's just that black and white. That being said I don't see what the fuss is about. TFC's management can run their club as they see fit and if the Hoilett bros "come home" for the summer to visit with Mum & Dad and all the rest and get some time in with the local club I see more good in it than harm. Reminds them where they come from. It's easy and quite natural for young men to forget that sometimes. So I stay (probably for no good reason) cautiously optimistic. If however my unjustified hopes are dashed and for some Gawdforsaken reason Junior rejects Canada I'll be the 1st to line up with Joe Keeper and Co. to vilify the man and his apologists until the very end for taking everything about us, and Canada, for granted. So there. (Plus I think it'll be great fun for the Hoilett's to get together and watch Jamaica crash and burn out of The Hex this month from Canada). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1zzurri Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Just continue rubbin' it in. For F*** sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bully Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Selfish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFC07 Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 This isn't a bad thing since he gets a chance to practice with Canadian players while seeing what TFC/Canada has to offer. If he already decided not to play for Canada, then yeah, having him train with TFC would be very bad idea. I still believe he thinks England will cap tie him; I don't think he will choose Canada in the end though (just a gut feeling). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFC07 Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Toronto FC is owned by MLSE, a privately owned organization. Its training facilities were paid for in the tune of $20 million by MLSE itself. They are doing what's good for their organization, which could use all the help it can get at this point, at their own expense. This is true, BUT MLSE probably doesn't know about Junior training with TFC. It's TFC manager (former teammate of Juinor) that let Junior train with the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Keeper Posted June 5, 2013 Author Share Posted June 5, 2013 Toronto FC is owned by MLSE, a privately owned organization. Its training facilities were paid for in the tune of $20 million by MLSE itself. They are doing what's good for their organization, which could use all the help it can get at this point, at their own expense. Again, I agree partially. Just to clarify, I hope you understand that this is not a trial for either brother. The media asked them about a signing this morning and they categorically denied that this is why they are here. They are strictly here to train for the upcoming BPL season. If this was a trial, this would not be an issue at all. TFC may be their own entity but they operate under the auspices of the CSA and are solely sanction by them. Any pro club in Canada is charged to certain degrees with the development of Canadian talent for national team programs. It is the same in any country. Again, I would ask that you look at what this represents in terms of the deeper problems facing Canadian soccer. I would also debate that this move is in TFC's best interests. TFC are pulling a move here that is going to anger and upset a lot of the Canadian soccer community. This move is actually incredibly stupid from a PR perspective. This is just a cozy little arrangement between a bunch of QPR players and it blatantly ignores the social context of CDN soccer right now. I am sorry to disagree so strongly with this move by TFC, but if it is, as you say, representative of an organization taking care of their own interests first and foremost and only themselves then this is an insult and the epitome of what is wrong wioth the game in Canad. This has been the underlying problem with Canadian soccer, we exist with no singular unity for progress and development and support of one another. We have been a collection of self serving fiefdoms for decades. If you look at what more and more people are trying to achive with the reform movement in and for the CSA it is to overcome this exact kind of fragmentation. That being said, I don't think that this is an intentional gaffe by TFC completely. It is actually in their case probably just insanely naive. But this too is part of the problem, we need more people on the same page about combating the problems of fragmentation in Canadian soccer. It is expected most programs will loose a player or two along the way. You have to look at the defection problem in a Canadian context. We more than most other aspiring soccer nations need all the talent we can get. Talent does not come along here as much as in even Japan or even the USA. The defection situation has become endemic. One can to some degree forgive TFC's extreme stupidity in this case, however it is more Junior Hoilett that some of us have the major issue with. However, on TFC's part, this move is kind of akin to the WCQ debacle in Montreal a few years ago when we played Honduras. In an effort to promote their own corporate partnership with the CSA (which is just fine) BMO handed out thousands of "thunder sticks" to fans to cheer with. The problem was the promotional devices were all Honduran blue! Again not intentional, but it is these kind of moves ignorant of the real situation that severely undermines creation of a unified Canadian soccer culture which develops successful clubs as well as successful players whom want to play for Canada and build the game up here. This kind of move shows that we are not a serious soccer nation. It caused major outrage from fans, players and media. What respectable soccer nation allows this? Good soccer countries develop talent that want to play for their national teams because they take pride in their program and their national shirt. They respect themselves and demand it from their players, we need to start doing this. How does the national team ever break out of this culture of failure if we sanction and accept this kind of behavior from players like Hoilett? All I am trying to say here is that this kind of boneheaded move by our soccer representatives as well as this continued use and abuse of our soccer programs in the country as a whole by players like Junior is a big part of what is holding our programs and teams back. Its time to speak out... More and more of the media are taking this correct attitude. Just look at the interview on Sportsnet as well as the interview tactics that were used in an interview with Frasier Aird last week. How would it look if after this little training stint Junior went on to suit up for Jamaica? How would you feel? It says he wants to be Canadian and use our programs but only if it helps his career personally or as a launch pad to other things. How is this any different than Leroux's classless display against fans at BMO on sunday? Until we show players that this development system is for the Canadian national teams and Canadian soccer as a whole, this will continue to happen. Its time to speak out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe MacCarthy Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Change will never be affected until people sharing the opinion of Joe Keeper phone the call-in shows and bomb the comment sections of websites calling out organizations like MLSE for doing these things. All you ever see and hear are the, for lack of a better term, Canada haterz. It's no good bitching here. Bomb Sportsnet with emails and posts backing Sid Sixeiro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe MacCarthy Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Just listened to the clip, great stuff Sid. He said something at the end that really rang true. He said "I know this won't get much play" Help him out and show him some support. Rogers (owners of Sportsnet) own 37.5 % of MLSE and they would like to hear from you. Your feedback is important to us and we do our best to respond to each and every inquiry. Send us your comments/questions to feedback@sportsnet.rogers.com Tim and Sid Twitter @timandsid @tim_micallef @Sid_Seixeiro Email TimAndSid@sportsnet590.ca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigzTFC Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 http://www.nextsportstar.com/index.php/show/anthony-totera-june-4th-2013/ Anthony Totera goes off as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe MacCarthy Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 A lot of this stuff smells to high heaven especially when our own Prime Minister had his picture taken with the Whore (and I like Harper) The aiding and abetting of these clowns has to stop and they have to be called out. About time thank you Sid. I just sent the above to TimAndSid@sportsnet590.ca and also a link to this page. Send Sid some sugar and email him and show your support here as well. "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore" Public enemies: Whoregreaves, Lensky, Vitoria, DeGuzman (at least he became a citizen but he screwed around until then) Begovic, Hoilett, Leroux (who am I forgetting?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFC07 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Okay, now I have changed my mind. Hoilett shouldn't be training with the team at all. Ryan Nelsen needs to be talk to by someone in MLSE. This is going to be a PR nightmare for TFC (the last thing we need right now) I am an SSH, so I am going to send an email to TFC FO (my sales rep) or through "TFC council". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forster01 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 http://www.nextsportstar.com/index.php/show/anthony-totera-june-4th-2013/ Anthony Totera goes off as well His rants are Top Notch!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 His rants are Top Notch!! You can tell the guy is a bit out there but he's passionate as hell and I love it. We need more of that raw passion for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe MacCarthy Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 If however my unjustified hopes are dashed and for some Gawdforsaken reason Junior rejects Canada I'll be the 1st to line up with Joe Keeper and Co. to vilify the man and his apologists until the very end for taking everything about us, and Canada, for granted. So there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzAndSting Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 This is a very big mistake by TFC. They have policies at their Academy to develop Canadian soccer players correct? Don't players have to be committed to play for Canada to be a part of the set up? On the other hand they have guy training with them who has refused to play for Canada! Totally hypocritical and just one mistake after another with this team. Why do they always come off as amateurs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi44 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Canadian, In Canada, training with a Canadian team, but not on Gold Cup preliminary roster. Conclusion? Not playing for Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFC07 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 This is a very big mistake by TFC. They have policies at their Academy to develop Canadian soccer players correct? Don't players have to be committed to play for Canada to be a part of the set up? On the other hand they have guy training with them who has refused to play for Canada! Totally hypocritical and just one mistake after another with this team. Why do they always come off as amateurs? I don't think they have policies that players have to play for Canada (However, there were talks of creating such policies when academy was first started), but players at the academy have to sign an agreement that they're committed to TFC only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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