youllneverwalkalone Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Below is a very incomplete and unscientific list of players "developed" by the 3 surviving Canadian A-League clubs (Lars and a couple other would make the Alberta United list). From 2000 to 2008, everybody here would cringe anytime one of these guys still playing in the league were called up to the MNT. But if we compare current MLS development results for the 3 clubs, total, you get 7 caps and 144 MLS appearances for Nana Attakora, Ashtone Morgan, Doneil Henry, and Russell Teibert -the only internationals produced by Canada MLS to date. I know it's early days, but we're now pumping a fair bit of money into professional academies that aren't producing players capable of stepping into MLS at the age of 18 or 19. Obviously this ties into the professional league/D2/D3/NASL expansion threads, but I find it really shocking that lack of playing time could actually be sending this generation to a worse fate than the one that came before. I know the "Lenarduzzi" school of thinking is that Darwinian selection will ultimately ensure that the MNT is better off because of MLS, but I just don't see this happening unless we can get a D2 level back in this country beyond FCE. Toronto Lynx 1997-2006 Robbie Aristodemo - 7 caps, 115 appearances for the Lynx Dwayne DeRosario - 71 caps, 7 appearances for the Lynx Atiba Hutchinson - 62 caps, 4 appearances for the Lynx Chris Pozniak - 24 caps, 42 appearances for the Lynx Marco Reda - 7 caps, 82 appearances for the Lynx Adrian Serioux - 19 caps, 116 appearances for the Lynx Paul Stalteri - 84 caps, 16 appearances for the Lynx Montreal Impact 1993-2011 Patrice Bernier, 49 caps, 73 appearances for L'Impact Mauro Biello, 4 caps, 108 appearances for L'Impact Adam Braz, 12 caps, 145 appearances for L'Impact Adrian Cann, 9 caps, 22 appearances for L'Impact Jason Devos, 49 caps, 55 appearances for L'Impact Ali Gerba, 31 caps, 61 appearances for L'Impact Gabriel Gervais, 11 caps, 150 appearances for L'Impact Andre Hainault, 32 caps, 3 appearances for L'Impact Patrick LeDuc, 3 caps, 221 appearances for L'Impact Nevio Pizzolitto, 8 caps, 281 appearances for L'Impact Greg Sutton, 16 caps, 132 appearances for L'Impact Antonio Ribeiro, 3 caps, 138 appearances for L'Impact Chris Williams, 3 caps, 38 appearances for L'Impact Vancouver 86ers/Whitecaps 1993-2010 Carlo Corrazin, 59 caps, 77 appearances Jeff Clarke, 19 caps, 170 appearances Marcus Haber, 3 caps, 41 appearances Kevin Harmse, 9 caps, 36 appearances Steve Kindel, 4 caps, 245 appearances Martin Nash, 38 caps, 244 appearances Johnny Sulentic, 2 caps, 110 appearances Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Good post. We seriously need 3 teams or more at the NASL level. Correct me if I am wrong, but we can expect Ottawa in 2014 and Hamilton in 2015? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 I think only Ottawa are confirmed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 But at least that's movement in the right direction, combined with the youth programs the MLS teams and NASL teams bring to the table. I really wish Calgary could get one, too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvroArrow Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Some of the players on your list did little more than have a cup of coffee based on the amount of games they played (eg. Hutchinson, Hainault). Can these clubs really claim any role in producing these players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 31, 2012 Author Share Posted October 31, 2012 Some of the players on your list did little more than have a cup of coffee based on the amount of games they played (eg. Hutchinson, Hainault). Can these clubs really claim any role in producing these players? Probably not. And this is readily conceded in the first sentence of the opening post. Presumably, if Atiba Hutchinson were coming up today, he would likely be in the TFC academy. But could he have that cup of coffee with TFC now? There are quite a few regulations against coffee in MLS. This is part of the point. The A-League was much better positioned to serve hot beverages and allow players to transition to professional careers. When you see Sigma FC producing professional player after professional player, you begin to ask "did we **** this whole thing up?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alberto7 Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 You can add Nick De Santis on the Impact list. He had 9 caps and 219 games with the Impact. When I look carefully at the Impact players who went on to the CMNT, I see that a lot of these guys did not get a fair chance to play with the Nats: Biello 4 caps Cann 9 caps Leduc 3 caps De Santis 9 caps Pizzolitto 8 caps Ribeiro 3 caps Anyone have any theories as to why a guy like Biello didn't get a fair shake? He was one of the best USL players at one point as was Pizzolitto. BTW, Biello played 343 games with the Impact. He played 108 games in his first go around before he played the 1999 season with the Rhinos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Probably not. And this is readily conceded in the first sentence of the opening post. Presumably, if Atiba Hutchinson were coming up today, he would likely be in the TFC academy. But could he have that cup of coffee with TFC now? There are quite a few regulations against coffee in MLS. This is part of the point. The A-League was much better positioned to serve hot beverages and allow players to transition to professional careers. When you see Sigma FC producing professional player after professional player, you begin to ask "did we **** this whole thing up?" Great point. One problem with MLS (esp the Canadian teams) is that player movement is difficult. The salary cap creates a restriction for player movement in general. It is not as simple as signing a player, you have to consider how to fit the player within the cap. It is worse for academy graduates. As an academy graduate, you might see limited minutes and look for a move for more playing time, but another club in MLS is not going to pick you up if they cannot fit you under the cap. Furthermore, Canadians are not domestics outside Canada which makes the situation worse. The way MLS is set up is not ideal for academies. They need to get reserve teams paired up with NASL teams and create a second division, where reserve players can get more games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 You can add Nick De Santis on the Impact list. He had 9 caps and 219 games with the Impact. When I look carefully at the Impact players who went on to the CMNT, I see that a lot of these guys did not get a fair chance to play with the Nats: Biello 4 caps Cann 9 caps Leduc 3 caps De Santis 9 caps Pizzolitto 8 caps Ribeiro 3 caps Anyone have any theories as to why a guy like Biello didn't get a fair shake? He was one of the best USL players at one point as was Pizzolitto. BTW, Biello played 343 games with the Impact. He played 108 games in his first go around before he played the 1999 season with the Rhinos. They got a fair shake. They were all good USL players but were not international level. The few games they played for Canada they were mostly not very good and that is why they were not called again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearcatSA Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 They got a fair shake. They were all good USL players but were not international level. The few games they played for Canada they were mostly not very good and that is why they were not called again. +1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betterredthandead Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 They got a fair shake. They were all good USL players but were not international level. The few games they played for Canada they were mostly not very good and that is why they were not called again. Jason Jordan was one guy I thought should've gotten called up at some point. I'd love to see a league for Canadians with strict rules for the rosters. Something along the lines of the top league in India, or second tier down in Vietnam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Jason Jordan was one guy I thought should've gotten called up at some point. I'd love to see a league for Canadians with strict rules for the rosters. Something along the lines of the top league in India, or second tier down in Vietnam. Yes, I think he did get called once but Holger did not play him even though we needed to sub someone on during that game. I would agree he did not get a fair shake but the ones listed by Alberto did get a chance and did not play very well. Jordan should have at least got the same chance. Also not mentioned was Grande who played 12 games for us and at times provided the national team with some needed midfield creativity but at other times really killed us with terrible defensive play that was not punished in USL but was punished at the international level. Also to expand on AvroArrow's point that some of the guys barely played in USL, a few like DeRo and Hainault not only did not play much in USL but for the most part were developed in MLS, which is against the hypothesis of the thread. Nevertheless, I do agree that MLS is not enough and we do need a second tier that has more clubs than FCE. Still I think we are better off with 3 MLS clubs than 3 USL/NASL clubs even if it takes a few years for that to show. But yes better still would be 3 MLS clubs and at least an equal number of division 2 clubs and eventually hopefully more division 2 clubs than MLS clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Jason Jordan was one guy I thought should've gotten called up at some point. I'd love to see a league for Canadians with strict rules for the rosters. Something along the lines of the top league in India, or second tier down in Vietnam. That right there speaks to how sad our national leagues are. Those two countries shouldn't even be spoken in the same breath as our MNT, yet we wish to emulate their domestic system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 You know, Jordan's still playing VMSL and doing reasonably well. And Canada does need forward depth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted November 1, 2012 Author Share Posted November 1, 2012 You know, Jordan's still playing VMSL and doing reasonably well. And Canada does need forward depth... Imagine how well he'd be doing if he didn't weigh 500lbs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Yeah, as others have pointed out I'd say in the case of the Lynx the development/identification was done more by the youth Nats and the Lynx just picked up the local guys until they went overseas. For some, like Poz, that was a year or so and probably helped, and for some, like Hutch, it was a fallback they never really needed. I know this thread is focusing on the players developed by Canadian A-League clubs, but I'd also argue that a strong D2 outside the Canadian teams is also needed. The American A-League teams were littered with Canadians, some not so memorable, but others relatively so. Rochester gave Onstad solid post CSL seasons, Richmond were DeRo truly found his feet after the Zwickau misadventure, and other places gave depth players like Dugas a place to play. The A-League was no heydey, but looking back now it had its benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.