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Steven Vitória


Yohan

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I'm going to predict that he will be one of the top CB's in MLS. He will score a handful of goals as well as be an Omar Gonzalez-like presence in the back. 

 

Really? 

 

I ask because my Bullshit Detector doesn't work so well when its wet (Original 16 Copper currently) and sarcasm doesn't always translate well on these forums.

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Well he's not getting any minutes with Benefica and he's not really in their plans. 

 

He's a bit of a case study in the smaller European leagues.  He was doing very well for Estoril; even playing as their captain and helping them qualify for last year's Europa league; however Estoril is a small club and doesn't have the money or prestige of Benefica or Porto so he moved on there and is now very firmly on the bench.

 

I have no doubt he'll do fine in MLS and we don't have many CB's playing at a high level right now.  So if he moves here he would be a good starter for the national team; however he'll always be dreaming of making the World Cup for Portugal.

 

He'd be an improvement so at the end of the day we should take anyone who will help us make it.  But taking him sends a message that it's alright to be a player's 2nd choice.

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No, we shouldn't beg players to wear the shirt. Ever. Period.

And I would rather lose games with players who wear the country's badge with honour, than suck up to some snivelling punk who decided Canada was not good enough for him. Plus, His grand total of 7 minutes with Benfica does not require me to blow smoke up his ass.

I find it strange that some will clamour for Vitoria, while ignoring two plenty capable CB's in Edgar and Henry, one of whom has spent more time at a higher club level than Vitoria (albeit not since 2010), and another who just transferred to a higher level 6 weeks ago. Astonishing, really....

I didnt say start him over henry or edgar. Bring him into camp and may the best plyr win.

I'd rather not shun every player who in his teen years turned his back to canada. Difference of opinion i guess. Id beg for players to play for us to get us to the world cup.

I mean honour and going with the guys who have been true to you is great. But life isnt fair and sometimes u gotta do things in a way u wish u didnt have to.

I can see why u feel that way though.

Edited by king1010
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Agree. But what if a player begs us to play?

 

Bid difference to me if he comes crawling back and admits his mistake. We can be magnanimous can't we?

This sub has a big thing with being holier than thou when it comes to players who spurn us, and some of it is justified, but saying we don't need him and that he wouldn't add anything is ridiculous. He hasn't even said anything at all recently.

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Yeah, just some wild speculation because he might be coming to MLS.  Big deal.  Its mean nothing.  Just a player trying to get some playing time because he can't get it with his parent club. American league, Scottish league, Eredivisie, it doesn't matter.

 

Geezus, the only reason he may be crossing the Altantic is because he might be more comfortable with it than some others.  LIke I wrote, doesn't mean anything.

 

Internationally (regardless of where this gentleman's career takes him) as far as I'm concerned the die has been cast.  For good or bad it's Case-Closed.  

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High standards dont get you to the world cup. We could be the most loyal country with the shittiest players because every player that thinks twice about representing us rejected lol. Id want him back. 

 

This could be untrue in that it lacks foresight.  A player like Vittoria coming back now sends the message that it is okay to ALL our holdouts, we will take you back no matter how you treated us in the past.  Other players might be like "Oh, I know they are trying to call me NOW, but if I don't accept and maybe my career rockets to where England or the US or whatever want me...I'll go there cuz I'm not captied, and Canada is a fallback option.

 

High standards in this prevent players from thinking we're okay with being a fallback option.  Fallback options don't get you to the World Cup. 

 

 

Agree. But what if a player begs us to play?

 

Bid difference to me if he comes crawling back and admits his mistake. We can be magnanimous can't we?

 
If we as a fan base can't even agree to what constitutes a traitor, how can we possibly define what is an acceptable apology?
 
I'm sorry, but "Canada's sorta cool, I'll put on the red, I guess, maybe" will sound like an apology to some peoples' ears, while "I wish I would have chosen Canada earlier" will sound like an assholism to the opposite spectrum.  
Edited by madmonte
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This could be untrue in that it lacks foresight. A player like Vittoria coming back now sends the message that it is okay to ALL our holdouts, we will take you back no matter how you treated us in the past. Other players might be like "Oh, I know they are trying to call me NOW, but if I don't accept and maybe my career rockets to where England or the US or whatever want me...I'll go there cuz I'm not captied, and Canada is a fallback option.

High standards in this prevent players from thinking we're okay with being a fallback option. Fallback options don't get you to the World Cup.

If we as a fan base can't even agree to what constitutes a traitor, how can we possibly define what is an acceptable apology?

I'm sorry, but "Canada's sorta cool, I'll put on the red, I guess, maybe" will sound like an apology to some peoples' ears, while "I wish I would have chosen Canada earlier" will sound like an assholism to the opposite spectrum.

I think you're way over thinking the reprecussions of us accepting him back. Each situation is unique and different. No tellig how other players will act.

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There are a lot of people that overthink the same way that I do.  Including families/agents/coaches of players that are involved in making these decisions and influence these decisions.  Trust me, the info in something like this is definitely analyzed by players that have World Cup aspirations.  

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I'm just wondering if there are precedents in national teams saying publicly no to a certain player. I do think that if he gets picked it will create a @%)*storm in Canadian soccer and that some players would threaten to retire internationally if traitor X would play for Canada. I know that the selection of Sammir created that problem in Croatia, but it's a totally different situation, because Sammir is a Brazilain born footballer that has played in Croatia long enough to play for them. The difference between Vitoria and all the other "American" players is that most of them (if not all of them) were players who had weak American ties and that the USSF didn't pursue as seriously and they wouldn't be considered traitors, because they were German or Icelandish or Norwegian.

 

I seriously need to find a comparable example, so it would be pretty much a first a player who turned down the country he lived for his first 16 years to choose to play for another one and who would want to come back. The closest comparaison I can draw to is Sandro Grande, but Italy never called Grande (ie Grande was a player who declined call-ups to Canada because he thought that Italy would call him and only got called up by Canada when he was playing for the Impact in 04-05ish) I didn't hear a lot of complaining when Grande played for us. I do agree that Vitoria did something  worse than Grande, but fact of the matter is that if Grande would have been good enough for Italy, he would never have played for Canada because the rules changed in 2009.

 

I'll be honest, I'm not against Vitoria and show him the noose like people on this forum, but I'm not going to be like John Cusack in say anything... and put a Boombox outside of PPL Park or wherever the Union train for him to come. It shouldn't be up to Floro to try to convince him to the national team, it's up to him if he's serious about it,

 

Here's what I would do for any traitor if they would want to have a sniff at the national team

1) He would need to write a letter of apology to the CSA, fans, etc. and reach out to the CSA, not the other way around and I would even ask him to pay some sort of a fine for something like that and that letter would need to be made public

2) He would not play on his first call-up to see if he's serious about that.

3) If he does something wrong off the pitch, (Whining and complaining would be considered IMO) he's off for good

Edited by Blackdude
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This could be untrue in that it lacks foresight.  A player like Vittoria coming back now sends the message that it is okay to ALL our holdouts, we will take you back no matter how you treated us in the past.  Other players might be like "Oh, I know they are trying to call me NOW, but if I don't accept and maybe my career rockets to where England or the US or whatever want me...I'll go there cuz I'm not captied, and Canada is a fallback option.

 

High standards in this prevent players from thinking we're okay with being a fallback option.  Fallback options don't get you to the World Cup. 

The other way to look at it is if he helps us to win and get further in WCQ than we have in decades then it might actually help stop the flow of dual citizens bailing on us. 

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I'm just wondering if there are precedents in national teams saying publicly no to a certain player. I do think that if he gets picked it will create a @%)*storm in Canadian soccer and that some players would threaten to retire internationally if traitor X would play for Canada.

The same Canadian internationals who congrat tweet their buddy Jonothan De Guzman on winning WC bronze are going to draw a line in the sand and retire internationally? I doubt it. 99% of our guys won't care.

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I've been thinking about this a lot. I don't think banishing these guys would make any future traitors think twice before defecting. They'd take the risk regardless I imagine.

I've come to terms with the lack of national pride in international football. It's sad but it's the reality.

Taking the American approach (aka accepting every dual national with open arms) would improve our squad and make it more attractive to those with multiple options.

Edited by Obinna
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I've been thinking about this a lot. I don't think banishing these guys would make any future traitors think twice before defecting. They'd take the risk regardless I imagine.

I've come to terms with the lack of national pride in international football. It's sad but it's the reality.

Taking the American approach (aka accepting every dual national with open arms) would improve our squad and make it more attractive to those with multiple options.

This.

Times have changed. Theres no national pride. Its all a business. Accept it and bite your tongue or we'll never get to the world cup.

Every player would jump ship to play in the world cup. Edgar wouldve loved to play for england. Julian for holland. Dont kid yourself. If they were good enough theyd be playing for them, regardless of what canadas policy is for defectors.

If theyre going to defect they probably dont care if canada never lets them play again. They made their decision and if it doesnt pan out o well they just wont play intl football.

But on the other hand if we qualify for the world cup while biting our tongue and allowing defectors back in, then in the future we may be first choice to cdns because we're always in the world cup.

Then when we become a perrenial top 50 nation and top 4 concacaf we can say screw u to defectors.

But right now were the ugly kid in highschool and cant say no to our ex gf whose the hottest girl in the school but had a fling with the football qb and now wants us back..... Kinda like that u know?

Edited by king1010
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