madmonte Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Sounds like a case of "I tried my options elsewhere, but they didn't want me, so maybe I'll settle for Canada" Forgive me if I don't seem that excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Gagne Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Sounds like a case of "I tried my options elsewhere, but they didn't want me, so maybe I'll settle for Canada" Forgive me if I don't seem that excited. You have reached your quota of positive votes for the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floortom Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Vitoria looks to be 4th string in Philly His coach today said this on Vitoria's status: "I play the guys that perform in training". Not even sure he warrants a call-up at this point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toontownman Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Ouch! Sounds like he is heading for the exit door from that quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finchster Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I am usually not one for throwing away players, but this is certainly one guy I think we can afford to ditch. He's 28, he's not an upgrade over Hainault, Edgar, Jakovic who are around the same age and plays the same position (but depth is useful). I don't know I don't really care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 We got lucky. We tried to debase ourselves by taking this shitheel, but weren't able to before his being on-field garbage became as obvious as his being off-field garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
db707 Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Would rather turn to Mallan Roberts or Wandrille Lefevre if we need depth. Guys who may not be much better but worked to become citizens and would wear the jersey with pride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Wait...who are we talking about again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addona Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Would rather turn to Mallan Roberts or Wandrille Lefevre if we need depth. Guys who may not be much better but worked to become citizens and would wear the jersey with pride. Yeah, or Opare ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Vitoria looks to be 4th string in Philly His coach today said this on Vitoria's status: "I play the guys that perform in training". Not even sure he warrants a call-up at this point This is not the whole quote and it is really somewhat deceptive to post only that portion of it and also any qoutes like this should have a link to their source. The full quote is this: On Steven Vitoria Steven’s a guy who had a tough injury early on in the year. He’s worked his way back. Currently, I play the guys that perform in training. He’s had some better days in the near future in training, but the team tends to pick itself through the week on the work on the field, and he currently sits behind Ethan. So, again, he’s working and striving to get back in that starting lineup. He’ll keep pushing for that. I expect him to do that and win that spot back eventually. It is around the 30th minute of the video: http://www.phillysoccerpage.net/2015/07/29/transcript-and-video-jim-curtins-weekly-press-conference-12/ Personally I consider Vitoria to be among the worst of our traitors and do not want to see him ever put on the red and white even if he were to become a star in MLS or in Portugal. He is on loan from Benfica and the Union really overpaid for him (he is costing them similar to what the Impact is paying for Ciman). That being said he started the first 9 games for the Union and then missed the next 11 due to injury. He has only been back from injury for 2 weeks so it is not that surprising that he may be not performing as well in training as a fully fit player. It remains to be seen whether Vitoria is an MLS level player who would help our national team or not (although I hope he is never given that opportunity). His player CV is actually pretty sparse, a few good seasons in the Portugese 2nd division and one good season in the first division with a small team. Obviously Benfica saw something in him to sign him but they are not infallible either and he has not broken through at all there. And Philadelphia's defence has been pretty poor all season both during the games he played and while he was injured. Nevertheless, once he is fully fit and recovered from injury he may still show that he is a good MLS defender. As much as I personally dislike those players who choose to play for other countries for which they have a tenuous link we don't need to exaggerate every career pitfall they have or make them seem worse players than they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Time Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Great post, Grizzly! Context is very important when quotes are used. And, I like that your opinion is stated clearly without personal bashing. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAVIERF Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 friends canada needs the more the merrier, bring him on,...... redemption songs lads we forgave TEVEZ you can forgive this fellow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 The problem JAVIER is that every time we take someone back, we are saying to the next guy it's okay to be a holdout. It's okay to make Canada your second choice, if you can't get on at Portugal, no problem we'll take you back. I think it's better to make a statement and not call the worst of those traitors, as Grizzly called him, because it's more fair to the players that DID choose to actually play for us and help us get to points in qualifying. Some guy that waits until the hex to decide to join, or even worse, till we actually qualify for a World Cup? NOW we're good enough for you? Piss off to those players. Shoulda helped us get there. Early in a campaign is when it's easy to be forgiving, though. But I say send a message, don't call Vittoria. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 To play devil"s advocat, if we send a message is anyone really going to notice (let alone, listen)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 The problem isn't in sending the message that it's not okay. By accepting players like Vittoria in, that is the message you are sending, in that it is okay to be a holdout. And I think people (players) would probably notice that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yomurphy1 Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) The problem isn't in sending the message that it's not okay. By accepting players like Vittoria in, that is the message you are sending, in that it is okay to be a holdout. And I think people (players) would probably notice that. Not that I'm a fan of Vitoria, but the precedent is already that its okay to be a holdout. I think its more a general disrespect for the program than following closely what's going on with other hoidouts. None of our players have the media profile to do this, but when is the last time we've seen one of our players criticize a fence sitter? Even JDG while encouraging JDG2 to play for Canada never criticized his brothers decision. We need people who are proud and vocal about the program. We also need people to make traitors villains outside of the V's. If there's a place for tribalism in the world, it's right here. Edited July 31, 2015 by yomurphy1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghonj Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 I think what would be more effective than trying to get a groundswell of negativity against traitors is making stars out of our current national team players. How many soccer fans in Canada can name one of our recent starting lineups? As long as they are under the radar, so will holdouts be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 To play devil"s advocat, if we send a message is anyone really going to notice (let alone, listen)? No. Probably not. That however doesn't devalue the necessity of sending the message. Maybe I'm old fashioned but sometimes (most times) it isn't that you win the fight, it's that you are willing to fight the fight. Tooth and claw. And really in this instance it's a pretty easy choice. It's not as though we're a "Steven Victoria" away from a WC Finals appearance is it? His absence from our NT is, to be VERY generous, a luxury we can easily afford. So send the message and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCF08 Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 The problem isn't in sending the message that it's not okay. By accepting players like Vittoria in, that is the message you are sending, in that it is okay to be a holdout. And I think people (players) would probably notice that. Players are going to hold out anyway. You can't stop it. Canada's place in world football is nearly non-existent and until that changes, player will try and holdout for better opportunities. It's the same with player contract renewals at smaller clubs. They'll holdout for a bigger club on a free transfer and only accept a contract renewal when someones doesn't come in for them. Canada has only 1 interest and that's getting the best players on the pitch so that the best results can be obtained. If Vitoria by merit deserves to be part of the starting XI (i believe he does) then Canada should call him and play him for the good of the nation footballing wise. Holding grudges is not the right way moving forward. Having good relationships with players and providing the best infrastructure, coaching and improving Canada's stature in world football will get a quicker decision from players, nothing else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califax Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 I think the point of not calling him is to change the way of thinking you listed above. People won't hold out if they know they can't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCF08 Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 (edited) I think the point of not calling him is to change the way of thinking you listed above. People won't hold out if they know they can't You can't change that by doing that. The only way you can change that is by having good relationships with players, improving infrastructure, provide good coaching and winning matches and improving the stature of Canadian football. Being immature and holding grudges against players who are good enough for the squad will not help Canadian football. Players at clubs do exactly the same. Zakaria Bakkali denied a new contract at PSV last season so PSV told him to go to the reserves for a year. They didn't play him (even in reserves), he didn't change his mind because he wanted to wait for a bigger club. He has recently signed a 5 year contract with Valencia. Players will holdout if they want to holdout regardless if they can play in the future or not. The only way to change it is to improve the things i've said and that gives player less excuses to holdout. The players have all the power in football and setting deadlines or demanding a player to play as a Canadian Football Association will not help one bit. Edited August 1, 2015 by SCF08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califax Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 (edited) You can't change that by doing that. The only way you can change that is by having good relationships with players, improving infrastructure, provide good coaching and winning matches and improving the stature of Canadian football. Being immature and holding grudges against players who are good enough for the squad will not help Canadian football. Players at clubs do exactly the same. Zakaria Bakkali denied a new contract at PSV last season so PSV told him to go to the reserves for a year. They didn't play him (even in reserves), he didn't change his mind because he wanted to wait for a bigger club. He has recently signed a 5 year contract with Valencia. Players will holdout if they want to holdout regardless if they can play in the future or not. The only way to change it is to improve the things i've said and that gives player less excuses to holdout. The players have all the power in football and setting deadlines or demanding a player to play as a Canadian Football Association will not help one bit. I mean, I disagree completely. Also, club isn't country. You call it immature, I call it creating a culture where we are your first choice or we are no choice and with players with rapidly deteriorating skills, it's a rather comfortable hill on which to die. Bottom line, we shouldn't have too woo Canadians to play for Canada. Edited August 1, 2015 by Califax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradMack Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Steven Vitoria is like the Canadian Soccer Meek Mill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradMack Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Russell Teibert = CSJ Steven Vitoria = CSMM Cyle Larin = CSD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 You don't develop pride in Canada by debasing yourself to every asshole traitor who might want to play for us now that it's in his interests. If Vitoria was genuinely remorseful, if he was apologizing to his country on television for his childish betrayal, that would be one thing. But Canada's men's team already has too many mercenaries who don't really give a fuck about the maple leaf, and look how well that's done for us. Pieces of disloyal shit should not have the honour of representing our country, and we shouldn't let talent throw off our moral compasses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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