A Workable National D3?

[Juby]

.

If the mods won't do any, I'll say it. I really wish you'd give it a rest, Juby. This is bordering on obsessive.

I don't care if he sometimes mentions D2 in a D3 thread; I enjoy his posts a heck of a lot more than yours.

we'll see what you say in a few months when your trying to discuss other topics and he's still repeating these points even if it makes no sense in regards to what everyone else is saying. The reason were sick of the D-2 arguement is because this about the 50th d-3 topic he repeated his d-2 objections too and theirs even a d-2 thread going where all these posts would be appropriate. (why is someone off topic repeating themselves 20% of the discussion?)

When your done listening to him poo poo a d-2 off topic, you'll try and move on to other subjects and he'll keep repeating himself about d-2. All I did was quote what he said, if it lacks consistency, it's his own stupid fault. the only reason he's here and off topic, is to feign opposition and be a fart even when he's got nothing to say

[brettinhalifax]

.

If the mods won't do any, I'll say it. I really wish you'd give it a rest, Juby. This is bordering on obsessive.

I don't care if he sometimes mentions D2 in a D3 thread; I enjoy his posts a heck of a lot more than yours.

What the heck does that have to do with a national D3? Jeez... give it a rest.

BBTB goes off topic

Juby complains about BBTB being off topic.

dmont complains about Juby complaining about BBTB being off topic.

brettinhalifax complains about dmont complaining about Juby complaining about BBTB being off topic.

OK now where are we? D3 discussion. BBTB takes a right hand turn. Juby adds another right hand turn. dmont turns right again. And then I add one more right turn.

HALLELUJAH! WE'RE BACK ON TRACK PEOPLE!

[Juby]

What the heck does that have to do with a national D3? Jeez... give it a rest.

BBTB goes off topic

Juby complains about BBTB being off topic.

dmont complains about Juby complaining about BBTB being off topic.

brettinhalifax complains about dmont complaining about Juby complaining about BBTB being off topic.

OK now where are we? D3 discussion. BBTB takes a right hand turn. Juby adds another right hand turn. dmont turns right again. And then I add one more right turn.

HALLELUJAH! WE'RE BACK ON TRACK PEOPLE!

ON TOPIC: Okay, I tried this a couple of times but can anyone give us a breakdown as to what their highest local amateur levels are like? Thiku talked about BC, A lot of us probably have discussed ONT ad nauseum, and QUE is changing (hard to peg, and maybe we should see how it settles). Outside of these provinces, Are their any teams that might be paying a few guys, any pretty stable high level amateur leagues?

[ThiKu]

No one is getting paid to play in BC outside of Whitecaps...or if anyone is it is strictly off the books and defo not even close to a semi-pro wage (getting paid something does not a semi-pro make). haha, although there are rumours PoCo FC in the Fraser Valley Soccer League are paying their players. Totally uncomfirmed. But that's as close as I've heard of anyone getting paid here.

[Juby]

No one is getting paid to play in BC outside of Whitecaps...or if anyone is it is strictly off the books and defo not even close to a semi-pro wage (getting paid something does not a semi-pro make). haha, although there are rumours PoCo FC in the Fraser Valley Soccer League are paying their players. Totally uncomfirmed. But that's as close as I've heard of anyone getting paid here.

I think the best we can do right now (and for free in BC) is just try and get a lot of teams to the table for a non binding discussion and to encourage something like that old 10K semi pro I think we were talking about in another thread (a pt contract and two youth contracts/scholarships). I don't know how we could enforce it but maybe the CSA could convince them it's in their own interest?

Now I'm gonna try something, I hope it comes out in a proper format, Its an actual chart for what I summarized earlier:

The goal of this table is to make good on the two largest expenses and necessary levels for incomes, the hope is that by being profitable too even, sponsors conceivably could overcome the smaller extra costs, and remember, if the attendance for that skill level is too high, it won't work.

REG|Travel |Youth |ATT=(ATT*10$*16GAMES~CON)=TO|SUGDSAL|Summary

1 |350000 |200000|4000=750 000,5000= 1 000 000|600 000|+0.95-1.2mil,-0.95mil 1

1 |350000 |150000|3000= 600 000, 4000= 750 000|480 000|+0.75-0.9mil,-0.83mil 2

2 |180000 |120000|2000= 400 000, 2500= 500 000|350 000|+0.52-0.62mil,-0.53mil 3

2 |180000 |100000|1000= 200 000, 1500= 300 000|200 000|+0.3-0.4mil, -0.38mil 4

4+?|80000* |70000 |750= 150 000, 500 = 100 000|120 000|+0.17-0.22mil, - 0.2mil 5

6+?|50000* |50000 |500= 100 000, 250 = 50 000 | 75 000|+0.1-0.15mil, -0.125mil 6

REG = Regions, Travel in negative $, Youth Programs are Positive $(I'm assuming the bigger the team the bigger the program, but that's not always true), SUGDSAL is suggested salary; it's still a variable but if you pull it too far down then attendance will follow

*means varies by region

ATT*10*16GAM~CON is attendence, times a ten dollar tickets over an ideal 16 home games rounded up around 20~25% to include concessions, it's not a guarentee, more like a necessary standard.

1 - looks good on paper but requires 4 - 5 000 regular attendees (not likely but it would be a pro product)

2 - Same boat as 1, high risk, potentially high reward, it's the more cost effective (lower salaried) version

3 - I like this level, the risk isn't too high, the needed attendance isn't huge but the salaries are still pretty good and theirs still room for sponsors.

4 - Like 2 is for 1, 4 is to 3, at this point we do see a shortfall but it's not as terrible because were dealing with a lot less money which requires far less sponsors to fix (like 40 000?).

5 and 6 - This is just spreading (6) and improving (5)something like the CSL model. It generally looks pretty stable consider a wide variety of ownership could handle it, sponsors weren't mentioned and it has the lowest attendance levels built in.

[Macksam]

Born 1940 played pro soccer scoring some three goals in his pro career in Scotland... managed Vancouver for two years.

Mmmm so this if the deep thinker who is making recommendations ?

Sorry again .. most of these retreads dont get it at all, D3 or D2 does not matter its an issue of having facilitys untill the CSA and everyone else in soccer gets a plan in place to fund and build SSS stadai at 5k or 10k depending on the ambition for D3 or D2, nothing will move ahead.

We need a single design that can be replicated accross the country ... natural turf, concessions parking etc. then the design and basic engineering drawings should be given to anyone who wants to build a stadia.

If as a business person i can invest 10 million own a five thousand seat stadia and have long term lease on land i.e. fifty years, I can see starting a d3 or D2 club.

My cost of money runs at 3% so a payment of 300k per year on revenue from 20 home games. So 15k per game for capital payments

At a ticket pricing equal to the price of a movie.. i.e. ten dollars you need to draw 1500 per game to fund the stadium, concessions give you another minimum ten dollars per person sales with 30% net profit or $4500 per game, x 20 = 90k revenue.

Which would let you have team budget for player salaries of 5k per player roughly.

You will nee added revenue sources and clearly would need to average more then 2000 per game to make it viable ... year over year, but is possible.

It starts with stadia.

Under the control of the club not a mucipality the stadia must be soccer only and with natural turf.

Yeah, stadia is a big issue, which is why I thinnk partnering with universities is essential.

[ThiKu]

So through 9 pages some good ideas for a D3. Seems it's expected to be regional. Likely not dissimilar to the CSL but with a u23 focus? Salary expectations not really known. Number of clubs per province not really known. Investors completely unknown. I seem to be the only one interested in Club Canada u19/23.

A nationwide D3 will probably be similar to the CHL, but maybe even smaller regions. IE, the western conference will likely only cover BC-Alta, if not even smaller and be just BC and just Alta as separate "leagues."??

It seems most believe a nationwide u23 D3 would be the beginnings of a nationwide D2. In that some teams can still enter USL Pro/NASL straight off and play in a D2 level. Then if some of the u23 D3's really thrive can look at the potential of moving up to those leagues or if enough strong D3 franchises to ask those NASL/USL teams to move "back" to Canada and create a league that way? IE, organic growth?

There'd be playoffs.

WHAT WOULD BE NEEDED TO MAKE THIS SUCCESSFUL? Major sponsorship? MLS academies? TV/streaming? Amway Cup participation? Selling players to overseas/MLS? Being a "Canadian domestic national team"? (ie, select the best from the u23 league similar to Generation Adidas and take them on tours, arrange "B" internationals and things like?). Youth league/club support? (ie, a u23 team supported by/run-by a youth club in a major city, or by a conglomeration of youth clubs feeding directly into the "first team"??). COACHING? Salary/Salary Cap? Foreign-player rule?

Stadiums? 500 capacity SSS - with a concession, lighting, monitored entry/exit routes, closed-off viewing (ie, tarps in tall chain link fences surrounding fields), no track of course if there is streaming....?? every community can manage that. Heck, my little hometown has a 1000-seat stadium (maybe more?), no track, no football lines, great lighting, and ability to close off viewing from non-paying spectators, as does the neighbouring city....and others could also here quite cheaply.

What are your guys' ideas on how to make such a thing succesful?

[Juby]

It's probably too ambitious because of travel but it would be amazing if they ran a nationwide cup concurrently with regional divisions.

[dmont]

.

1) CSA and Provincial Association(s) announce their intention to form a D3 semi-pro league that will play a regular season against regional opponents, followed by playoffs against other participating leagues (CSL, Quebec, etc) up to a national D3 Champ, who will play in the Canadian Championship in years where there are an odd number of D1 and D2 regular teams in the tournament. Request letters of intent, plus deposits.

2) Fans form supporter groups in a given municipality (see San Antonio model), trying to reach 100, 200 paid/hardcore members.

3) Supporters group leaders contact former players/sports management types to form managment/pitch teams.

4) Pitch teams speak to municipalities, venues, provincial associations, CSA, amateur clubs (as potential feeder clubs), potential sponsors getting all the numbers and details about operational costs.

5) Pitch team engages local businesses and potential owners about putting up the money.

6) You got the money, you got the management, just sign the players and start playing.

[ThiKu]

It's probably too ambitious because of travel but it would be amazing if they ran a nationwide cup concurrently with regional divisions.

Yes, that would be amazing! Isn't that the Amway Cup though? Meaning, MLS/NASL are in the Amway Cup, and there is hope that Can D2/3 would have some access to that cup as well...?? But yes...love such a cup.

[ThiKu]

.

1) CSA and Provincial Association(s) announce their intention to form a D3 semi-pro league that will play a regular season against regional opponents, followed by playoffs against other participating leagues (CSL, Quebec, etc) up to a national D3 Champ, who will play in the Canadian Championship in years where there are an odd number of D1 and D2 regular teams in the tournament. Request letters of intent, plus deposits.

2) Fans form supporter groups in a given municipality (see San Antonio model), trying to reach 100, 200 paid/hardcore members.

3) Supporters group leaders contact former players/sports management types to form managment/pitch teams.

4) Pitch teams speak to municipalities, venues, provincial associations, CSA, amateur clubs (as potential feeder clubs), potential sponsors getting all the numbers and details about operational costs.

5) Pitch team engages local businesses and potential owners about putting up the money.

6) You got the money, you got the management, just sign the players and start playing.

Point 5 & 6 being the part that make people go "pipe dream". I truly hope this d3 discussion can go somewhere. I realize this forum is more Football Manager than reality but you know....I hope it happens.

By the way - can someone develop a Canadian d2/3 system that piggy backs with MLS/NASL on Football Manager somehow! I'd go out and buy the game then! Until then I'll hang on until Montreal is in the 2013 version

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

So through 9 pages some good ideas for a D3. Seems it's expected to be regional. Likely not dissimilar to the CSL but with a u23 focus? Salary expectations not really known. Number of clubs per province not really known. Investors completely unknown. I seem to be the only one interested in Club Canada u19/23.

Couple of points to clarify on that. Firstly, we have a very strong indication that a U23 focus was recommended but we have no clear picture of whether the CSA gave them the green light to move onto phase two. My impression is that they didn't and asked them to instead go back and seek more input from people. Hence the series of blog entries on the Rethink Management website. Secondly, we do actually have access to the broad outline of what a regional D3 league with a U23 focus might look like based on the four options that were posted in that context:

The Regional Under-23 Development framework also has a youth development focus and draws upon many of the features of the three Canadian minor hockey leagues (Western Hockey League, Ontario Hockey League, Quebec Major Junior Hockey League) and two largest U.S. minor hockey leagues (American Hockey League, Central Hockey League) but also includes features that are specific to the Canadian football market. A possible league model could feature:

• Four regional leagues that are principally located in Canada’s four largest provincial football markets (BC, Alberta, Ontario, Quebec)

• Each regional league would be comprised of five or six teams, one of which would include a development team from the region’s nearest professional club.

• Clubs could be privately owned, community owned in the form of a supporters trust, integrated within an existing amateur club structure, or a blend of all three models.

• Opportunity for each team to field two or three over-age players who are nearing the end of their careers and who have an interest in staying in the game as player-coaches.

• Teams would travel to away matches by motor-coach.

• An end of season tournament among the top clubs in each league to determine a national champion (similar to hockey’s Memorial Cup) with the winner getting the opportunity to play their way into the Amway Canadian Championship and compete for the Voyageurs Cup.

• Possibly inter-league and/or tournament-play against NASL and USL Pro clubs.

• Possibly coordination with CIS football programs in the form of playing season, access to facilities, talent supply and scholarships.

[kj52]

I know the biggest issue in Alberta that dwarfs virtually every other consideration regarding new leagues is quite simple - who are the money guys going to be who are prepared to lose wads of cash?

[ThiKu]

Couple of points to clarify on that. Firstly, we have a very strong indication that a U23 focus was recommended but we have no clear picture of whether the CSA gave them the green light to move onto phase two. My impression is that they didn't and asked them to instead go back and seek more input from people. Hence the series of blog entries on the Rethink Management website. Secondly, we do actually have access to the broad outline of what a regional D3 league with a U23 focus might look like based on the four options that were posted in that context:

QUOTE]

Wow, thanks BBTB for feeling the need to clarify as some sort of authority - you must be one? Let me clarify for you;

1. No one here suggested the CSA has given the "green light" to anything. This is a discussion form. We are discussing. Feel free to quote someone who stated "The CSA has approved a nationwide u23 and are developing it." We're discussing what it MIGHT look like.

2. The ReThink "blogs" have been very balanced. They don't suggest a leaning in any direction.

http://rethinkmanagementgroup.com/in_league - it posts all 4 options/ideas equally, and then posts emails from "fans."

3. yes ReThink posted what it believe is a "broad" outline. Absolutely they did. My post was asking the folks ON THIS BOARD what THEIR broad outline was - as a consensus for what we're all discussing here re: a u23 nationwide league. It seems we generally all have one. Regionalized, semi-pro, SSS, sponsorship, Amway Cup, so on and so forth. If I wanted to post ReThink's outline, I would have.

There was actually a pretty reasonable email sent to ReThink on April 25. Here it is - not a terrible kicking-off idea for a league but would need "teams" to be made of the NTC's and lots of leg-work etc...but not a terrible idea:

The following email is one of more than a dozen responses we received from supporters of Canadian football while the survey ran regarding the new league options that we presented. The email is posted here unedited in its entirety.

Dear Rethink,

With regards to the Club Canada option, why not use the existing National Training Centres? At that point with the current 9 PDL clubs, the 5 NTC's would make a nice 14 team base.

Thanks,

JP

Thoughts?

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

I know the biggest issue in Alberta that dwarfs virtually every other consideration regarding new leagues is quite simple - who are the money guys going to be who are prepared to lose wads of cash?

The best bet on that might be the larger youth clubs that can afford to have a full-time club head coach. If the new League1Ontario league gets off the ground next year it might blaze the trail for others to follow in that sort of regard:

http://www.league1ontario.com/

They have a strong focus on the use of U-20 players:

http://www.league1ontario.com/League1ApplicationPackage.pdf

Roster regulations:

•18 player game day roster with minimum of 8 players U20, 5 of which must be in starting line-up

•Maximum 3 imports (non-Canadians) per club

•Maximum of 5 substitutions per match. All substitutions are permanent

•Minimum of 5 players signed to a professional contract with minimum annual compensation of $2,000 per player

•Minimum player payroll of $20,000 in Year 1, escalating 10% per annum in Year 2 and Year 3.

[Redcoatsforever]

The best bet on that might be the larger youth clubs that can afford to have a full-time club head coach. If the new League1Ontario league gets off the ground next year it might blaze the trail for others to follow in that sort of regard:

http://www.league1ontario.com/

They have a strong focus on the use of U-20 players:

http://www.league1ontario.com/League1ApplicationPackage.pdf

Roster regulations:

•18 player game day roster with minimum of 8 players U20, 5 of which must be in starting line-up

•Maximum 3 imports (non-Canadians) per club

•Maximum of 5 substitutions per match. All substitutions are permanent

•Minimum of 5 players signed to a professional contract with minimum annual compensation of $2,000 per player

•Minimum player payroll of $20,000 in Year 1, escalating 10% per annum in Year 2 and Year 3.

Because nothing says "trail-blazing" like "we announced well after people were expecting us to that we won't be operating in 2012."

Also, given that the LPSQ have been talking about working with the CSL on a trophy and haven't mentioned the L1O once to my knowledge, it seems like the CSL have already won this one.

[ThiKu]

To be fair, the intention of L1O is definitely the correct path though. It could very well prove to be the model. BBTB is correct, clubs that can afford full-time TD's are a good indicator of being clubs that can feed into a u23 program, but realistically you want the u23 league to be more like PDL in that it is "exclusive." So you don't have 15 clubs in close geography but rather 1 team covering a larger geographic area so the local youth teams can feed into it as a group. IE, Fraser Valley Mariners FC who cover an area of over 600,000 people.

[Juby]

Because nothing says "trail-blazing" like "we announced well after people were expecting us to that we won't be operating in 2012."

Also, given that the LPSQ have been talking about working with the CSL on a trophy and haven't mentioned the L1O once to my knowledge, it seems like the CSL have already won this one.

*This is me trying to stay out of a big arguement, edit: a went on a little longer then I should have*

I don't want to jinx the L1O but I am getting annoyed with bbtb acting like certain L1O ideas aren't also CSL ideas with a lot less salary too work with. It's super funny that he describes the youth oriented setups as trailblazing here because when the Mississauga Eagles pretty much did that, IIRC the whole moron brigade acted like they were a ponzi scheme for offering cheap trials (*coughtfc*). But here we see the same approach on a smaller scale and bbtb calls it 'trail blazing'? It's funny how his opinion changes based what league were discussing and not with the facts.

Also, a question to bbtb, what exactly makes your point 'the best bet'? You didn't compare it to other 'bets'. You didn't explain your rational. You have a history of ignoring the obvious to make childishly unlikely speculations (He once claimed TFCA was leaving the CSL because they didn`t update their site, in January). To me, when someone tries to jazz up a bad point with arrogant wording, it`s just being decietful (trying to trick new people). Also, people keep worrying about investors, so to bbtb again, how is it our best bet to ignore the 16 investing groups in the CSL for a smaller, not yet operational league?

[Red and White]

So through 9 pages some good ideas for a D3. Seems it's expected to be regional. Likely not dissimilar to the CSL but with a u23 focus?

If this ends up happening, I think it would be a good direction to take. The idea of a set of provincial leagues culminating in a Memorial Cup (minor hockey) style final, where the winners of each league meet in neutral ground and battle for the national championship, is plausible at this point. The U23 focus is welcome as well, but teams should be given incentives to field U23's instead of being forced (ex. Canadian U23's can be less of a salary cap hit).

WHAT WOULD BE NEEDED TO MAKE THIS SUCCESSFUL? Major sponsorship? MLS academies? TV/streaming? Amway Cup participation? Selling players to overseas/MLS? Being a "Canadian domestic national team"? (ie, select the best from the u23 league similar to Generation Adidas and take them on tours, arrange "B" internationals and things like?). Youth league/club support? (ie, a u23 team supported by/run-by a youth club in a major city, or by a conglomeration of youth clubs feeding directly into the "first team"??). COACHING? Salary/Salary Cap? Foreign-player rule?

Stadiums? 500 capacity SSS - with a concession, lighting, monitored entry/exit routes, closed-off viewing (ie, tarps in tall chain link fences surrounding fields), no track of course if there is streaming....?? every community can manage that. Heck, my little hometown has a 1000-seat stadium (maybe more?), no track, no football lines, great lighting, and ability to close off viewing from non-paying spectators, as does the neighbouring city....and others could also here quite cheaply.

- MLS Academies (and other CSL / PDL / PCSL teams) would be an excellent starting point. Of course, they'd have to accept invitations to join.

- TV/Streaming can not be underestimated. They provide a means of interacting with potential fans and keeping interest up. They'd help the casuals stay connected with the team, hopefully leading to them going out to more games. NASL streams all their games free on U-Stream. That's a great move.

- Amway Cup participation? Yes. Ditto for Salary cap.

- The stadiums you described are a reasonable expectation, but with 1k-2k capacities instead of 500?

There'd be playoffs.

It's probably too ambitious because of travel but it would be amazing if they ran a nationwide cup concurrently with regional divisions.

A best of both worlds solution could be having the top half of every regional division qualify for the Amway Canadian Championship? Have them play in early rounds before MLS and NASL clubs come in.

[ThiKu]

Yes 500 as minimum stadium. There should actually be a maximum stadium capacity as well...then if demand is made you can expand or move locations as needed. SSS.

Sure, the Amway Cup suggestion you made is a nice one.

[Juby]

I never bothered the first time, but it might not be a bad idea to submit a concept or two to rethink. You'd probably lose 'credit' to a certain degree but it might actually get heard

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

If this ends up happening, I think it would be a good direction to take. The idea of a set of provincial leagues culminating in a Memorial Cup (minor hockey) style final, where the winners of each league meet in neutral ground and battle for the national championship, is plausible at this point. The U23 focus is welcome as well, but teams should be given incentives to field U23's instead of being forced (ex. Canadian U23's can be less of a salary cap hit).

On the national championship idea. One already exists for the ten provincial cup winners at the amateur level and with occasional exceptions (one held in Newfoundland about ten years ago comes to mind) it never seems to make much of an impact in terms of spectator interest and mainstream media coverage. Moral of the story? I think people sometimes overstate the importance of the national angle. In Australia they don't bother with it at the D3 sort of level and being provincial/state champion seems to be enough for people maybe because it's good to have the big championship game being at a location that fans, who followed the regular season, can easily attend. The format and funding of the tournament would need to be carefully planned. Not worth doing from a promotional standpoint unless some of the games can be televised from coast to coast on a channel like Sportsnet or TSN I would have thought but that can be expensive.

On the U23 focus I think the key is that right now Canadian soccer does a reasonable job of developing players up until the mid-teens but then there is often no obvious route to the pro level and many of the best prospects stop playing the sport competitively when there is no youth team to play for any more and they find they can't easily get a game for the top amateur/semi-pro teams in their city. The academy teams of the MLS and NASL teams will help but the best prospects at 16 are not always the best players by 23 years of age. There needs to be something similar to the NCAA/PDL development route south of the border, which provides a competitive environment and at times close to fully pro style training into the early 20s prior to being drafted in an MLS context or signing with a team at D2 level.

[Juby]

On the national championship idea. One already exists for the ten provincial cup winners at the amateur level and with occasional exceptions (one held in Newfoundland about ten years ago comes to mind) it never seems to make much of an impact in terms of spectator interest and mainstream media coverage. Moral of the story? I think people sometimes overstate the importance of the national angle. In Australia they don't bother with it at the D3 sort of level and being provincial/state champion seems to be enough for people maybe because it's good to have the big championship game being at a location that fans, who followed the regular season, can easily attend. The format and funding of the tournament would need to be carefully planned. Not worth doing from a promotional standpoint unless some of the games can be televised from coast to coast on a channel like Sportsnet or TSN I would have thought but that can be expensive.

Wow, The obvious reason isn't the word 'national' being overblown, it's that the provincial tournament of amateur teams is AMATEUR... It's not the national angle, your trying to say it won't work at D-3 because it doeesn't work at like D-5?(what a dumb point) Then you even skirt the issues where you mention the lack of tv coverage but the 'moral of the story' is if provincial amateurs don't inspire people by being national for a day, nothing will? If you have nothing to say you don't have to respond. It's not mandatory.

On the U23 focus I think the key is that right now Canadian soccer does a reasonable job of developing players up until the mid-teens but then there is often no obvious route to the pro level and many of the best prospects stop playing the sport competitively when there is no youth team to play for any more and they find they can't easily get a game for the top amateur/semi-pro teams in their city. The academy teams of the MLS and NASL teams will help but the best prospects at 16 are not always the best players by 23 years of age. There needs to be something similar to the NCAA/PDL development route south of the border, which provides a competitive environment and at times close to fully pro style training into the early 20s prior to being drafted in an MLS context or signing with a team at D2 level.

Once again, he acts like he's looking at the issue and then gives an inexplicably unbacked response. How is the solution to the lack of semi pro and pro opportunities to create more amateur opportunities, There's no shortage of non paying opportunities, there's a shortage of middling opportunities to process the gobs of amateurs. You clearly are looking at the question but your answer isn't the reasonable solution you portray it as. He literally is saying the solution to the lack of d-3 is to ignore d-3 and focus on D-4. Look at the final sentence, Their already is something similar to NCAA/PDL developement, and it's more amateur teams (It's like he takes painful steps to avoid pointing out the obvious, more CSL or just semi pro models.)

note: and I'm not trying to insult the PDL teams, but we already have that level and two out of three teams already prefer to do their scouting and development at a higher level. It's not a lack of PDL opportunites, there's a lack of opportunities for an excess of players who should be playing at a higher level. If we just needed more PDL teams we would have a lot of our top prospects duking it out for those spots then trying to bypass that level altogether.

[Redcoatsforever]

On the national championship idea. One already exists for the ten provincial cup winners at the amateur level and with occasional exceptions (one held in Newfoundland about ten years ago comes to mind) it never seems to make much of an impact in terms of spectator interest and mainstream media coverage. Moral of the story? I think people sometimes overstate the importance of the national angle.

That's amateur. Full stop. Not comparable to having a team that plays at a professional venue with paid players and a televised series of matches. It's apples and oranges.

[Juby]

I wonder if we could break down what travel costs would be over paticular regions? I know I'm being too rigid when I say an 'ideal 16 home games' but could we get some typical trip info over these areas?