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Offseason TFC player thread. Who to keep....


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It's clear TFC needs a stud CB. They could also use another attacking/goal scoring threat (what team couldn't)

Players who I think should return

1. Cordon

2. Ecks

3. Morgan

4. Henry

5. Plata

6. Soolsma

7. Frings

8. Danny K

9. Johnson

10. Kocic/ Frei - wouldnt be too worried if one of them leaves

11. Lindsay

12. Avila

13. Marosevic

14. Stinson

15. JDG - however clearly not on his currently salary, but he's under contract through 2012

16. Terry Dunfield - I don't rate him, but he's Canadian and doesn't make much

17. Keith Makubuya - academy kid, doesn't cost anything even though he hasn't really played

Players who should be shown the door

1. Harden

2. Borman

3. Martina

4. Yourass

5. Viator

6. Sturgis

7. Zavarise

Trade Bait/Haven't seen enough to form an opinion

1. Iro - trade bait...please

2. Bouchiba - Injured all year

3. Davies - played once

4. Griffit - hasn't played

5. Gold - doesn't play, mediocre American kid, could care less

6. Omphroy - hasn't played

7. Cann - have to see how he's recovered from injury

8. Williams - have to see how he's recovered from injury

Roster

8 M Eric Avila 23 5' 8" 149 USA Active

25 D/M Danleigh Borman 25 5' 9" 160 South Africa Active

17 M Elbekay Bouchiba 32 5' 10" 164 Netherlands Inactive

12 D Adrian Cann 31 6' 3" 180 Canada Inactive

16 M Oscar Cordon 18 5' 9" 155 Canada Active

29 D Kyle Davies 22 5' 10" 160 USA Active

6 M Julian de Guzman 30 5' 7" 150 Canada Active

23 M Terry Dunfield 29 5' 10" 165 Canada Active

27 D Richard Eckersley 22 6' 169 England Active

24 GK Stefan Frei 25 6' 3" 195 Switzerland Active

22 M Torsten Frings 34 5' 11" 170 Germany Active

26 M Matt Gold 23 5' 9" 165 USA Active

21 M Leandre Griffit 27 5' 8" 155 France Active

20 D Ty Harden 27 6' 1" 190 USA Active

4 D Doneil Henry 18 6' 180 Canada Active

3 D Andy Iro 26 6' 5" 205 England Active

9 F/M Ryan Johnson 26 6' 1" 180 Jamaica Active

30 GK Milos Kocic 26 6' 4" 200 Serbia Active

14 F Danny Koevermans 32 6' 3" 175 Netherlands Active

37 M Nicholas Lindsay 19 5' 9" 155 Canada Inactive

13 F Keith Makubuya 18 5' 11" 165 Canada Active

70 F/M Peri Marosevic 22 5' 9" 162 Bosnia & Herzegovina Active

33 F Javier Martina 24 5' 9" 156 Netherlands Active

5 D Ashtone Morgan 20 5' 11" 165 Canada Active

2 D Demitrius Omphroy 22 5' 10" 165 USA Active

7 F Joao Plata 19 5' 2" 135 Ecuador Active

18 F Nick Soolsma 23 5' 10" 175 Netherlands Active

15 M Matt Stinson 19 5' 10" 165 Canada Active

11 M/D Nathan Sturgis 24 5' 10" 150 USA Active

55 D Eddy Viator 29 5' 11" 155 Guadeloupe Active

31 D Dicoy Williams 25 6' 2" 187 Jamaica Inactive

19 D Mikael Yourassowsky 28 5' 10" 165 Belgium Active

28 M Gianluca Zavarise 25 5' 11" 168 Canada Active

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Might as well just cut and paste what I posted elsewhere on this.

[14 back for sure]

Eric Avila - AM - 23 - USA - Keep

Oscar Cordon - AM/CM - 18 - Canada - Keep

Julian de Guzman - 30 - DM/CM - Canada - Keep [doubt they'll buy out his contract now]

Terry Dunfield - DM - 29 - Canada - Keep

Stefan Frei - GK - 25 - Switzerland - Keep [edit: probably going to be traded by the looks of things]

Torsten Frings - DM/SW - 34 - Germany - Keep

Ty Harden - CB - 27 - USA - Keep

Doneil Henry - CB - 18 - Canada - Keep

Ryan Johnson - CF/LW - 26 - Jamaica - Keep

Milos Kocic - GK - 26 - Serbia - Keep

Danny Koevermans - CF - 32 - Holland - Keep

Peri Marosevic - 22 - CF/AM/RW - USA - Keep

Ashtone Morgan - 20 - LB - Canada - Keep

Matt Stinson - CM - 19 - Canada - Keep

[probably about 6 or 7 of these 13 back]

Kyle Davies - 22 - CB - USA - Maybe [has he done enough to impress Winter?]

Richard Eckersley - RB - 22 - England - Maybe [would be good to keep but depends a lot on terms of the loan deal]

Matt Gold - DM - 23 - USA - Maybe [has he done enough to hang around when the next batch of draft picks arrive?]

Andy Iro - CB - 26 - England - Maybe [with Harden and Henry around for less money he could be surplus to requirements]

Nicholas Lindsay - 19 - W - Canada - Maybe [will he be the same player, does Winter actually rate him?]

Keith Makabuya - 18 - CF - Canada - Maybe [seldom seen in first team terms does Winter actually rate him?]

Demetrius Omphroy - 22 - RB - USA - Maybe [has he done enough to hang around when the next batch of draft picks arrive?]

Joao Plata - 19 - LW/RW - Ecuador - Maybe [would be good to keep but depends a lot on terms of the loan deal]

Nick Soolsma - RW - 23 - Holland - Maybe [almost a keep but on enough money that he is vulnerable if better option is identified]

Dicoy Williams - CB - 25 - Jamaica - Maybe [will he be the same player, does Winter actually rate him?]

Danleigh Borman - LB/LW - 25 - South Africa - Maybe [will still need depth on the left but could lose out to training camp invite or draft pick]

Elbekay Bouchiba - DM - 32 - Holland - Maybe [will he be the same player, does Winter actually rate him?]

Adrian Cann - CB - 31 - Canada - Maybe [will he be the same player, has the Charlestown contract holdout really been forgiven?]

[these 6 older players should be moving on because clearly not a factor in first team terms]

Leandre Griffit - RW - 27 - France - Release

Javier Martina - 24 - RW - Holland - Release

Nathan Sturgis - DM/RB/LB - 24 - USA - Release

Eddie Viator - CB/RB - 29 - Guadeloupe - Release

Mikael Yourassowsky - LB/LW - 28 - Belgium - Release

Gianluca Zavarise - CM/AM - 25 - Canada - Release [too old to take a place from a more promising younger player with greater potential]

Should be easy enough to strengthen the depth and address the central defence situation by bringing in around 9 to 10 new guys based on a combination of the use of allocation money, six discovery signings, trades, NCAA draft picks and Academy graduates.

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Might as well just cut and paste what I posted elsewhere on this.

[14 back for sure]

Eric Avila - AM - 23 - USA - Keep

Oscar Cordon - AM/CM - 18 - Canada - Keep

Julian de Guzman - 30 - DM/CM - Canada - Keep [doubt they'll buy out his contract now]

Terry Dunfield - DM - 29 - Canada - Keep

Stefan Frei - GK - 25 - Switzerland - Keep

Torsten Frings - DM/SW - 34 - Germany - Keep

Ty Harden - CB - 27 - USA - Keep

Doneil Henry - CB - 18 - Canada - Keep

Ryan Johnson - CF/LW - 26 - Jamaica - Keep

Milos Kocic - GK - 26 - Serbia - Keep

Danny Koevermans - CF - 32 - Holland - Keep

Peri Marosevic - 22 - CF/AM/RW - USA - Keep

Ashtone Morgan - 20 - LB - Canada - Keep

Matt Stinson - CM - 19 - Canada - Keep

[probably about 6 or 7 of these 13 back]

Kyle Davies - 22 - CB - USA - Maybe [has he done enough to impress Winter?]

Richard Eckersley - RB - 22 - England - Maybe [would be good to keep but depends a lot on terms of the loan deal]

Matt Gold - DM - 23 - USA - Maybe [has he done enough to hang around when the next batch of draft picks arrive?]

Andy Iro - CB - 26 - England - Maybe [with Harden and Henry around for less money he could be surplus to requirements]

Nicholas Lindsay - 19 - W - Canada - Maybe [will he be the same player, does Winter actually rate him?]

Keith Makabuya - 18 - CF - Canada - Maybe [seldom seen in first team terms does Winter actually rate him?]

Demetrius Omphroy - 22 - RB - USA - Maybe [has he done enough to hang around when the next batch of draft picks arrive?]

Joao Plata - 19 - LW/RW - Ecuador - Maybe [would be good to keep but depends a lot on terms of the loan deal]

Nick Soolsma - RW - 23 - Holland - Maybe [almost a keep but on enough money that he is vulnerable if better option is identified]

Dicoy Williams - CB - 25 - Jamaica - Maybe [will he be the same player, does Winter actually rate him?]

Danleigh Borman - LB/LW - 25 - South Africa - Maybe [will still need depth on the left but could lose out to training camp invite or draft pick]

Elbekay Bouchiba - DM - 32 - Holland - Maybe [will he be the same player, does Winter actually rate him?]

Adrian Cann - CB - 31 - Canada - Maybe [will he be the same player, has the Charlestown contract holdout really been forgiven?]

[these 6 older players should be moving on because clearly not a factor in first team terms]

Leandre Griffit - RW - 27 - France - Release

Javier Martina - 24 - RW - Holland - Release

Nathan Sturgis - DM/RB/LB - 24 - USA - Release

Eddie Viator - CB/RB - 29 - Guadeloupe - Release

Mikael Yourassowsky - LB/LW - 28 - Belgium - Release

Gianluca Zavarise - CM/AM - 25 - Canada - Release [too old to take a place from a more promising younger player with greater potential]

Should be easy enough to strengthen the depth and address the central defence situation by bringing in around 9 to 10 new guys based on a combination of the use of allocation money, six discovery signings, trades, NCAA draft picks and Academy graduates.

More or less what I was thinking. Except when it comes to Harden.

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We need a left footed CB BAD, Iro is like a black dichio.. playing out of position at centre back and with no heading ability. The man is beyond awful, he is a PK waiting to happen anytime an attacker is near him in the box and how does someone who NEEDS to head the ball to keep their job miss so many headers??

----------------Koev-------------------

Plata---------------------------Johnson

--------JDG------------------Avila-----

----------------Frings------------------

Morgan----------------------Stinson

------------LCB------Cann--------------

----------------Frei------------------------

If that lineup can stay healthy I think we are looking good for the playoffs. I chose to keep Stinson at wing/full back, he's looked pretty good on that side even though it may not be his natural position.

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Older internationals who were debutantes to the league this year and proved to be "meh" backups at best, like Viator and the Belgian Pole, are a dime a dozen and I wouldn't be surprised to see them get released in the time and way that Croat-Argentine, the Russian, the Lativian, and the Spanish DP were dispatched at season's end last year. Ditto Martina. Some guys are tradeable, like Sturgis and perhaps Borman. Zavarise is a good squad guy: though academy guys like Morgan and Stinson and to a lesser extent Henry made the jump I don't necessarily believe that is an accurate representation of a trend to the positive with the other candidates coming up from the youth ranks in the very immediate future. It's also quite possible for those younger guys mentioned to regress somewhat, as well, so I'm not big on unloading a guy like Zavarise yet.

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First step is who to protect in the expansion draft. They can protect 11 players, while Generation Adidas players & Homegrown players (ie. all the young Canadians from the academy) are exempt from being selected.

Players who I think they are definitely not going to protect & won't be back:

Borman

Martina

Griffit (couldn't even remember that we had him until I saw this thread)

Gold (pretty irrelevant player - can't see him being protected)

Ormphroy (what did he play, 6 seconds this year? As we need room for the likes of Lindsay, Makabuya & Cordon to get playing time I doubt they are going to go out of their way to protect this guy)

Viator - they gave him a shot at right back but even when Eckersley went down Stinson, Henry & even Davies were played ahead of him. I doubt he'll be back, definitely won't be protected.

Players who probably won't be protected but won't get taken as Montreal probably won't want them:

Iro (made way too many mistakes to protect)

Harden (no offense, but too mediocre to use up one of the 11 spots on)

You're Ass (not worth an international spot)

Davies (doubt he'll be protected or taken)

Bouchiba - never played a minute due to injury, but why bother protecting him?

Sturgis - it's never seemed like Winter has rated him, but if he doesn't get picked I could see him sticking around.

Players who could be back next year but who still might not get protected:

De Guzman (he wasn't protected last year, they figured nobody would take him at that salary, I suspect the same again)

Frei (if he's still Gen.Adidas he might not be eligible - I have to wonder if he's on his way to Europe that and that's why Kocic has been starting all the games this year)

Cann

Williams (not sure any team will take a player - even a Canuck - whom they are not sure when they'll be back or if they will re-gain form)

Players on the bubble:

Avila (not helped by a miserable performance in his last game, but I suspect he's still in their plans. Not sure if he'll be protected)

Marosevic (he and Avila are probably closer to the 11 than.....

Zavarise (I think they still rate him and see potential here - note that they put him on ahead of Marosevic today. I'd agree with what Bearcat said as well, and if Winter & co. are aware of how much Saputo & co. seem to like fellow Italo-Canadians, I can see him being taken by Montreal).

Players they are likely to protect

Frings

Koevermans

Kocic (they need to protect at least one keeper)

Plata*

Eckersley*

Johnson

Dunfield (if it were an American expansion team it would be different, but no point in dangling affordable, experienced Canadian players in front of a Canadian expansion team in an expansion draft)

Soolsma (a bit of Dutch favouritism perhaps but he's probably earned a spot here and sharing the lead in assists over the past season doesn't hurt either - chemistry seems to be there with Koevermans)

*That's assuming they think they will be able to get them back for next season from the clubs that own them. If not, they won't bother to protect them, which would open a couple of spots for players on my bubble list to join the protected 11 or pehraps JDG & Frei. As it is, there are already 3 spots on my list still available.

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Man this team has a lot of player on the books... The certainly took advantage of being able to put guys on the IR.

I think the need for quality is apparent at more than a few spots and the borderline internationals need to be shown the door to make room for better players.

Please find: central defender, a really high-quality FW type, and a playmaker.

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Man this team has a lot of player on the books... The certainly took advantage of being able to put guys on the IR.

I think the need for quality is apparent at more than a few spots and the borderline internationals need to be shown the door to make room for better players.

Please find: central defender, a really high-quality FW type, and a playmaker.

Aren't those the 3 players every single team wants?

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Please find: central defender, a really high-quality FW type, and a playmaker.

Toronto FC has a number of playmakers, Julian de Guzman (if you aren't a fan of his, check out Soolsma's goal from today and DK's goal against Dallas, to name a few), Joao Plata, and Torsten Frings.

They also have the hottest forward in the whole league in Danny K and not a bad player in Ryan Johnson.

If they can get the defence locked down, I think this team is set in the other areas. Depth is always nice, but hopefully the academy will come through.

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IMO, Iro and Harden need to get far far away from this team. I like Soolsma, Plata, Johnson and Koevermans up front.

Why? Yes Iro was awful when first arrived but is now putting in some decent performances.

Harden is one of our most improved players and isn't on too much, would probably keep both.

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Why? Yes Iro was awful when first arrived but is now putting in some decent performances.

Harden is one of our most improved players and isn't on too much, would probably keep both.

When has Iro put in a decent performance? Even in TFC's match vs. Dallas I thought he was the worst player on the pitch and almost cost us the game.

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Iro is totally crap, he's a poor mans Zat Knight (tall, akward, no football IQ) and that's not saying much. If he was back home in England he'd be playing at the Conference level.

Harden is an affordable, somewhat competent backup. I would keep him around as a #4 CB behind Cann, Williams and the really-good-CB-we-need-that-better-be-brought-in ;)

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I question if TFC can afford to not do everything necessary to keep both Plata and Eckersley. Also, I'd rather see Iro back than Harden. I know Iro had some massive blunders that lead to goals, but he is a good big central defender to have back there. He was on a downslope at this point, and I think a full off-season with his new club will show that he is more than what he showed since coming over from Cbus.

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When has Iro put in a decent performance? Even in TFC's match vs. Dallas I thought he was the worst player on the pitch and almost cost us the game.

Well much improved performances, although that isn't saying much. Still think he can be a decent player for us.

Harden >> Iro though.

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I would guess that Joao Plata will be back for three reasons.

First, I doubt LDU Quito would let Plata go to Europe without a transfer fee. On top of that, the market for players purchased under the age of 21 and without a Euro passport is very selective and tends to focus only on the very best players and involve only say the top 50 clubs in Europe (possibly even fewer). Plata has a few strikes against him that will keep big clubs from taking a chance on him. Two of those are his size and the fact that he only began making waves this year in MLS. Take a look at which players under the age of 21 who moved to European clubs from South America with a transfer fee and you only see a few big clubs in the market and targeting only a small number of players. The transfer market has changed in the last few years.

Second, we cannot overlook the development opportunity being afforded young players in Toronto. I know it is difficult for some TFC fans to recognize this given the weak performance of this year's team but it's worth repeating that Winter and de Klerk come from one of the most highly-respected development clubs in the world and especially don't underestimate de Klerk who worked within that club for nine years. Add to that recognized veteran players like Frings and Kouvermans and I am certain that LDU Quito will see value in letting Plata stay another year. On top of that, I doubt LDU Quito would be willing to pay the salary needed to bring him back to Ecuador.

Third, Plata seems to be comfortable and settled in Toronto. I also think the salary that can be offered by Toronto would be comparable to the salary that would be offered by any European clubs willing to pay a transfer fee.

My feeling is that this negotiation will be more about salary and whether Toronto can make the move permanent. In the end, it will likely be a loan extension.

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On the young Canadians, specifically, Stinson, Morgan, and Henry, they are high quality and will likely get a lot better quickly. They are likely to be much more important to next year's team than we think. In fact, I would think we might even read concerns on this board and others in a year or two about any or all three of them heading to Europe.

Morgan is a natural left back which are hard to find

Henry is a high quality young central defender. No one should be worried that he has played positions because that's how many young central defenders get developed.

Stinson is in a development environment that every young player likely dreams of. Stinson essentially plays a similar position that Winter did when he played and gets to play with Frings next to him. I suspect he will continue his rapid rise.

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The end of season press conference might provide some answers on this. All the Academy graduates (with the exception of Lindsay obviously) were talked about positively by Aron Winter so suspect they will all be back now. Bouchiba and Soolsma seem confident about being back next season in interviews that are hidden away on the second page right now on the Toronto FC TV clips, for what's worth. Iro states his agent has talked with TFC about coming back next season.

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Why? Yes Iro was awful when first arrived but is now putting in some decent performances.

Harden is one of our most improved players and isn't on too much, would probably keep both.

Sorry, but I have yet to see a decent Iro performance. The guy is just flat out, not good.

I'll admit that Harden is much better than Iro, but I don't think he's good enough to be a starting back. Maybe keep him on the bench...

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I really don’t think Harden should see the field in a non-replacement role next year. The only reason he seems improved is because he lined up beside Iro. The usual howlers by Iro out-howeled those that Harden that were usually called out in the pre-Iro era.

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On the young Canadians, specifically, Stinson, Morgan, and Henry, they are high quality and will likely get a lot better quickly. They are likely to be much more important to next year's team than we think. In fact, I would think we might even read concerns on this board and others in a year or two about any or all three of them heading to Europe.

However, it's not uncommon for very young players to take a step backwards as well and sometimes hit the "glass ceiling" with what they can do. Hopefully, these guys will continue to progress.

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