Montreal's first signing, a DP!

[shawn_strat]

According to RDS:

http://www.rds.ca/impact/chroniques/327515.html

Nelson Rivas. Nicknamed Mike Tyson in Italy. Seems like a good start!

Everything is supposed to be announced at a press conference this afternoon.

[Jeremy]

Hmmm......... hasnt played lots of games lately, this guy.

[shawn_strat]

Hmmm......... hasnt played lots of games lately, this guy.

It is kind of hard to break in at Inter. They're a couple of steps higher than MLS!

[Keegan]

42 league matches in 5 years but not a bad first signing, he should be a good MLS player if he can stay healthy

[Keano]

Injury problems over the years but 40-50 games at the top of Italy. Size and strength for MLS, no question... only 28...was earning 1 million Euro last year so probably between 1-2 million USD.

I'm excited about it, I think if paired with a quicker more imaginative-type CB (like Camara, wink wink nudge nudge saynomore saynimore) this could be a good signing. Marsch seems to be holding true to his word in building outward from the goal line.

He played only 1 game in the Ukraine last year, hopefully that was just due to injuries.

Only thing is he's only been called for Columbia once. I hope that's injuries and not something else.

[Jeremy]

Maybe that's a good thing, we won't lose him every international date.

[Keano]

le12ejoueur Yvan.DeliaLavictoire

by 127Montreal

"We were very creative in our negociations with Nelson, and he does not qualify as a DP" - Nick De Santis #MLS #IMFC

negating the thread title

[shawn_strat]

Oh well, it means he took quite a pay cut then. He was making a million euros per season before. Not a bad catch at all then.

[Mr.Caca]

He wasn't playing a lot, so it's normal his paycheck diminished. I'm still glad he's paid under 350 000$, I would have guessed something between 500k and 750k.

[Grizzly]

I think he would have been a poor signing as a DP. Not enough pedigree to be a DP player. Sure he has played at a high level club but on the other hand he hardly played there. Indeed he hasn't really played a lot of games in a season since he left Colombia 5 years ago. Even at River Plate he only played 9 games. At the very least he would have been a very risky signing as DP, one signed for potential rather than what he has accomplished. Some of this might have been due to injury but that makes him an even more risky signing. As a non-DP this has the potential to be a very good signing though again not without risk. However, if we want to have the potential of having a good team in the first year of MLS we probably have to make some risky signings.

[Keano]

I think he would have been a poor signing as a DP. Not enough pedigree to be a DP player. Sure he has played at a high level club but on the other hand he hardly played there. Indeed he hasn't really played a lot of games in a season since he left Colombia 5 years ago. Even at River Plate he only played 9 games. At the very least he would have been a very risky signing as DP, one signed for potential rather than what he has accomplished. Some of this might have been due to injury but that makes him an even more risky signing. As a non-DP this has the potential to be a very good signing though again not without risk. However, if we want to have the potential of having a good team in the first year of MLS we probably have to make some risky signings.

Yes, I like it as a non DP. I see that they are trialing a CB who played over 100 games for Dijon prior to their promotion to Ligue 1 and was still with them even after the promotion; that could be the kind of steady professional experienced partner that would help ease any risk associated with Rivas' lack of recent games.

[Grizzly]

Yes, I like it as a non DP. I see that they are trialing a CB who played over 100 games for Dijon prior to their promotion to Ligue 1 and was still with them even after the promotion; that could be the kind of steady professional experienced partner that would help ease any risk associated with Rivas' lack of recent games.

Yes Alexis Zywiecki could be a good signing at the right price even if we did not have a lot of luck with League 2 signings this year. :http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/alexis-zywiecki/leistungsdaten-detail/spieler_57485.html

Former Whitecap Wes Knight is also in camp, could be a decent depth signing. Has anyone seen a full list of the players in camp?

[CanadianSoccerFan]

le12ejoueur Yvan.DeliaLavictoire

by 127Montreal

"We were very creative in our negociations with Nelson, and he does not qualify as a DP" - Nick De Santis #MLS #IMFC

Sounds like they copied the Caps and frontloaded a hefty NASL deal

[Keano]

Yes Alexis Zywiecki could be a good signing at the right price even if we did not have a lot of luck with League 2 signings this year. :http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/alexis-zywiecki/leistungsdaten-detail/spieler_57485.html

Former Whitecap Wes Knight is also in camp, could be a decent depth signing. Has anyone seen a full list of the players in camp?

I believe they list it in the article on the official website

[Grizzly]

I believe they list it in the article on the official website

Thanks you are right, I missed that. A few interesting names:

http://www.montrealimpact.com/News/News.aspx?language=EN

[Gordon]

I have posted what follows on this site and another a few time over the last 5 years or so. Hesitate to do it again because the inevitable result is a deluge of bile heaped upon Canadian players. But here goes anyway. You win in MLS based on the quality of your domestic players. The formula is to find domestics who can hold their own – and pay them appropriately - and recruit foreign players from economies where medium MLS salaries seem pretty decent. Latin America is the usual source.

The pool of MLS quality American players has been well picked through – but I am quite fearful that Montreal is choosing to follow the same path - looking from scraps in that bargain bin is a losing strategy as TFC and VWFC have ably demonstrated. Canadian MLS teams should have an advantage because of the Canadian talent pool that is available to them. While not as deep or expansive as our southern neighbours, neither is it as depleted. You are not going to get them paying chump change however, and investing in expensive European (or European based) players diminishes the ability to pay domestics decently. Passing on Bernier was a mistake – there is not a comparable domestic (US or Canadian) midfielder readily available to Montreal – and I see no evidence of any efforts to bring home Canucks who can play. Hopefully something is going on behind the scenes.

Vancouver has some pretty decent imports on their side - Hassli, Camillo, Chiumiento, and Koffie range from excellent to good – yet have only 4 wins. It isn’t because their imports haven’t been good enough. Toronto may have seen the light – I say may because a handful of young canucks for a short period of time, given their history, does not convince with certainty – and their record shows the better their domestic content the better their season. But they too have always pissed around the edges at best, and most of the decent Canucks making a living as an International on American MLS teams came into the league after the TFC franchise existed.

Edit: This is not a criticism of this particular signing per se. IN isolation, it may well be a very good signing, my worry is the trend I see forming, and the past experience and patterns of the two previous Canadian entries into MLS

[Grizzly]

^^ I don't think they passed on Bernier. He wanted to play instead of waiting 6 months so he signed a one year contract with an out clause. He wants to come back and if both sides can reach a reasonable financial deal he will be back next year.

I agree that the way Canadian players have been treated by the two teams is shameful and there should be more Canadians on the Caps roster while TFC was at least improved in that category this year. However, I don't think the key to success in MLS or the reason both teams have been failures is a certain ratio of Canadians to Americans to Internationals. The reason the teams have been poor is not because the ratio is off but because they have had incompetent managers and coaches making player personel decisions. Then to cover up their incompetency (TFC)/make things easy upon themselves (WC) they came up with the theory that Canadian quotas were to blame and got the league to reduce them to a ridiculous low. Indeed I am absolutely certain that had TFC hired a good manager instead of Mo, they could have in their first year with the original Canadian quota still fielded a better team than they have at any time in their history.

Neither the American or Canadian player pool is maxxed out of quality players. Like in any pool you have to have a good talent scout to find the good ones and the ones with potential. And then you have to give them a good coach who can employ them in a way that plays to their strengths and abilities and not their weaknesses. Of course any team will have some successes and failures but I don't think either Johnson or Soehn had a success rate any higher than a law of probability or what an average fan playing football manager would achieve. (I will give Winter a pass since it seems like he has formed a decent nucleas with some potential if he makes some other good signings in the offseason).

Whether Marsh is the competent type of manager lacking in Canada remains to be seen. We certainly know that NDS is of the Johnson/Soehn ilk so hopefully he is just negotiating contracts. He needs to utilize all three available markets, not neglect any of them including the Canadian one and find better players there than most of the other managers.

[Jeremy]

Can we keep only 1 thread on Rivas?

[youllneverwalkalone]

As much as I understand and agree (I think) with what Gordon is saying, I wouldn't minimize the value of those international slots (as VWFC have done by wasting at least 4 of them of players who don't feature).

With 8 international slots, I would think a Canadian expansion team would want to devote a large amount of their resources to finding 8 international starters at key positions. Hopefully they are good players, but also quality people because I would think it wise to give each of them an understudy from the academy to ensure young players are progressing through to the 1st team. The remaining 14 slots are for experienced pros.

I guess what FCE have shown is more to Grizzly's point that with some scouting and decent man management, these guys don't necessarily have to have "MLS experience." VWFC "MLS experienced" players have been some of our worst, most technically limited, most mentally inept members of the squad. Rather than the international players spending time tutoring younger players on the finer aspects of the game, they are simply hanging their heads in frustration that a member of the 1st team, a so-called professional, cannot give and receive a pass.

[Gordon]

^^ I don't think they passed on Bernier. He wanted to play instead of waiting 6 months so he signed a one year contract with an out clause. He wants to come back and if both sides can reach a reasonable financial deal he will be back next year.

I agree that the way Canadian players have been treated by the two teams is shameful and there should be more Canadians on the Caps roster while TFC was at least improved in that category this year. However, I don't think the key to success in MLS or the reason both teams have been failures is a certain ratio of Canadians to Americans to Internationals. The reason the teams have been poor is not because the ratio is off but because they have had incompetent managers and coaches making player personel decisions. Then to cover up their incompetency (TFC)/make things easy upon themselves (WC) they came up with the theory that Canadian quotas were to blame and got the league to reduce them to a ridiculous low. Indeed I am absolutely certain that had TFC hired a good manager instead of Mo, they could have in their first year with the original Canadian quota still fielded a better team than they have at any time in their history.

Neither the American or Canadian player pool is maxxed out of quality players. Like in any pool you have to have a good talent scout to find the good ones and the ones with potential. And then you have to give them a good coach who can employ them in a way that plays to their strengths and abilities and not their weaknesses. Of course any team will have some successes and failures but I don't think either Johnson or Soehn had a success rate any higher than a law of probability or what an average fan playing football manager would achieve. (I will give Winter a pass since it seems like he has formed a decent nucleas with some potential if he makes some other good signings in the offseason).

Whether Marsh is the competent type of manager lacking in Canada remains to be seen. We certainly know that NDS is of the Johnson/Soehn ilk so hopefully he is just negotiating contracts. He needs to utilize all three available markets, not neglect any of them including the Canadian one and find better players there than most of the other managers.

Hopefully you are right about Bernier.

It is not about ratios of domestic to internationals. It is about managing a salary cap and an import restriction. If you want to win in MLS you need approximately 8 domestic players who are at an MLS level. In whatever combination of starters and backups works best. If you start 8 Internationals, for example, you absolutely need to have quality domestic back ups so you don't suck when your internationals need a rest/are called up/injured/suspended. And you need three that can start. More likely you will be looking at 5 or 6 starters so you can have a few internationals to back up key skill positions given the dearth of domestic attacking mids for example. But in any event, you need those players and you need to do it within a salary cap. You are far more likely to find value - i.e. quality players who do not cost a lot - in the international market. And if you only bring in scrub NA players then you are going to suck, no matter how good your internationals are. Even if you have 8 good international starters.

[Gordon]

As much as I understand and agree (I think) with what Gordon is saying, I wouldn't minimize the value of those international slots (as VWFC have done by wasting at least 4 of them of players who don't feature).

With 8 international slots, I would think a Canadian expansion team would want to devote a large amount of their resources to finding 8 international starters at key positions. Hopefully they are good players, but also quality people because I would think it wise to give each of them an understudy from the academy to ensure young players are progressing through to the 1st team. The remaining 14 slots are for experienced pros.

I guess what FCE have shown is more to Grizzly's point that with some scouting and decent man management, these guys don't necessarily have to have "MLS experience." VWFC "MLS experienced" players have been some of our worst, most technically limited, most mentally inept members of the squad. Rather than the international players spending time tutoring younger players on the finer aspects of the game, they are simply hanging their heads in frustration that a member of the 1st team, a so-called professional, cannot give and receive a pass.

You have to recruit well from both the domestic and international player pools. I am not suggesting that international players are not important, only that there are a lot more of them available for reasonable salary cap hits as compared to domestic players.

[Keano]

Hopefully you are right about Bernier.

It was basically not a secret, with twitter being what it is... they wanted to wait, he didn't, so he went in search of a 1 year deal in Denmark but made sure it had an out. As Grizzly says.

[Gordon]

It was basically not a secret, with twitter being what it is... they wanted to wait, he didn't, so he went in search of a 1 year deal in Denmark but made sure it had an out. As Grizzly says.

I have no reason to doubt Grizzly. While we don't always agree, I have no reasons to question his knowledge, facts or integrity and I don't find him unreasonably optimistic or pie in the sky either. My intent was to respond to the "if" they reach agreement on financial terms portion of what he said. Hastily written from work and sloppy as a result, so thank you for bringing it to my attention. Hopefully Bernier signs. And hopefully Montreal avoids the same errors made by Toronto and Vancouver at start-up.

[Keano]

http://www.rds.ca/soccer/