The Importance of Jr. Hoilett

[Eh?]

So something happens that you don't believe is right and you just totally accept it without a fight?

Yes, it may be "common practice" today, but that doesn't mean Canadian supporters can't voice their displeasure and criticize individuals who "do wrong".

Just brutal.

Never said anyone couldnt voice their displeasure?

[Redcoatsforever]

I may have jumped the gun, those England comments pissed me off a lot.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Redcoatsforever
Premature rage

[BuzzAndSting]

**** Hoilett, he can eat ****.

That's the spirit.

You do know that friends & family of players as well as some players themselves read these pages?

[CUJO]

That's the spirit. You do know that friends & family of players as well as some players themselves read these pages?

why would they? (hoilett, jdg2 and co) all they care about is money and abandoning canada for greener pastures. i dont see why they should care about canadian soccer fans. and if those fence sitters who like to dangle carrots in front of our faces, giving false hope to people and then tear our hearts out because they want to play for another team feel like they didnt do anything wrong, then they proceed to read our thoughts about them and get upset? LOL! like we did something wrong? they should look in the mirror! Edited March 11, 2012 by CUJO

[BuzzAndSting]

why would they? (hoilett, jdg2 and co) all they care about is money and abandoning canada for greener pastures. i dont see why they should care about canadian soccer fans.

Hoilett hasn't abandoned Canada, it's all speculation until he pulls on a Jamaican or English jersey. JDG2 is going to play for Canada as early as June.

[RamR]

Has there been any confirmation of the comment and the context? If not then until there is we all need to reserve judgements... If not until he actually makes the choice. That being said I totally get it... As CMNT fans we are all always waiting for the worst to happen.

[rob.notenboom]

Could this possibly have been "taken out of context" ... if not, what an ass. Goddamn, why can't we catch a break!

If you are interested in the source, here it is:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17308534

No idea on whether it is ligitimate or not and I'm not on twitter so others will have to check that.

[ThiKu]

Can this be anything near a surprise for any of us? Like I've said before - he plays, he plays, he doesn't he doesn't. This is an example of exactly why Canada needs to cap-tie naturalized players via MLS (Camilo!, Frei!, Koffie!).....

He is right - playing for England isn't out of the realm of possibility when guys like Welbeck, Campbell, and Sturridge are playing in the England team and Hoilett is matching them kick for kick.

[Wingback6]

Can this be anything near a surprise for any of us? Like I've said before - he plays, he plays, he doesn't he doesn't. This is an example of exactly why Canada needs to cap-tie naturalized players via MLS (Camilo!, Frei!, Koffie!).....

He is right - playing for England isn't out of the realm of possibility when guys like Welbeck, Campbell, and Sturridge are playing in the England team and Hoilett is matching them kick for kick.

I would put him above those guys... certainly his stock has risen now that he's bagged a brace....

But do you see him picked ahead of players like Walcott, Ox-Chamberlain, Lennon, or Adam Johnson??

He's young, he may see it as a possibility, but does England, for sure? Consider JDG2, he made a similar choice, and look where he is now.

The one difference here, and I have no source to back this up, other than general impression, is that the Netherlands don't 'test drive' players at the national level, the same way England does/did under Cappello. Moreover, I think right now they have much bigger issues to worry about. And even if they were interested, I wouldn't expect him to be brought into the squad until after Euro's, and possibly much, much longer after that..

[Standard]

I think it's time to move on from Junior, he clearly has no interest and wants to play for England. I only want people that are committed to Canada want to play to rep Canada.

[ThiKu]

No he isn't ahead of the guys you listed. I don't think he's ahead of Welbeck or Sturridge either at this point....but he isn't far off those guys and they were all given chances.

Anyway, if his plan is to play for England I think he needs to speak with Arteta, and Cudicini. He certainly won't feature ahead of Euro's. Whoever runs the team will not be experimenting outside of the players they know.

[trueviking]

that quote seems a bit disjointed.....he might as well have said....i was watching video and knew he was weak on his left side...and i really like apple pie with ice cream.

until i see a real quote, i'm not getting worked up....english media cant be trusted.

[Tuscan]

I do believe we can make the Hex with the guys we have now (with JDG2 added for sure). We should forget about Jr. and take it as an added bonus if he ever does suit up for us. Originally I started this thread thinking JDG2 was gone for good, but now that he is slated to suit up for us, I wonder if Hoilett is such a big deal anymore. The loss of Begovic I think is the worse case for us than not getting Hoilett.

[CanadaSantos]

I do believe we can make the Hex with the guys we have now (with JDG2 added for sure). We should forget about Jr. and take it as an added bonus if he ever does suit up for us. Originally I started this thread thinking JDG2 was gone for good, but now that he is slated to suit up for us, I wonder if Hoilett is such a big deal anymore. The loss of Begovic I think is the worse case for us than not getting Hoilett.

seriously? have u been watching us for the past year? Since the last gold cup it was evident that we struggle big time in creating chances. even in several wcq matches against the like of Puerto Rico and saint kitts for crying out loud, and recently the friendly match against Armenia was a complete joke. We need Hoilett and JD2 desperately, without them i can't see us doing any damage in our group and sadly we will probably be in a battle with Cuba for last.

[alberta white]

Can this be anything near a surprise for any of us? Like I've said before - he plays, he plays, he doesn't he doesn't. This is an example of exactly why Canada needs to cap-tie naturalized players via MLS (Camilo!, Frei!, Koffie!).....

He is right - playing for England isn't out of the realm of possibility when guys like Welbeck Campbell, and Sturridge are playing in the England team , and Hoilett is matching them kick for kick.

Might be because the link didn't indicate any anything on David when I clicked on it but, Danny Welbeck was born in Manchester, and Daniel Sturridge (Chelsea?) was born in Birmingham so I don't get the comparison for the Justification for an England call up?

Also, not sure which Campbell were talking about either.

*** EDIT***

Found It!

"1734:

Blackburn midfielder Junior Hoilett, who scored both his side's goals in the 2-0 win over Wolves: "We've been scoring a lot of goals this season but we needed a clean sheet - it feels like six points today. I was watching videos of Wayne Hennessey before the game and saw he is weak on low shots so for the second goal I just went for it early in the bottom corner. It's not out of the question that I could play for England in the future."

I wonder who told him that ? I think Some one feeding him Porkies If you ask me.

Edited March 11, 2012 by alberta white

[Soccerpro]

Might be because the link didn't indicate any anything on David when I clicked on it but, Danny Welbeck was born in Manchester, and Daniel Sturridge (Chelsea?) was born in Birmingham so I don't get the comparison for the Justification for an England call up?

Also, not sure which Campbell were talking about either.

*** EDIT***

Found It!

"1734:

Blackburn midfielder Junior Hoilett, who scored both his side's goals in the 2-0 win over Wolves: "We've been scoring a lot of goals this season but we needed a clean sheet - it feels like six points today. I was watching videos of Wayne Hennessey before the game and saw he is weak on low shots so for the second goal I just went for it early in the bottom corner. It's not out of the question that I could play for England in the future."

I wonder who told him that ? I think Some one feeding him Porkies If you ask me.

Well there's the most telling statement in this saga so far.

[rob.notenboom]

Might be because the link didn't indicate any anything on David when I clicked on it but, Danny Welbeck was born in Manchester, and Daniel Sturridge (Chelsea?) was born in Birmingham so I don't get the comparison for the Justification for an England call up?

Also, not sure which Campbell were talking about either.

*** EDIT***

Found It!

"1734:

Blackburn midfielder Junior Hoilett, who scored both his side's goals in the 2-0 win over Wolves: "We've been scoring a lot of goals this season but we needed a clean sheet - it feels like six points today. I was watching videos of Wayne Hennessey before the game and saw he is weak on low shots so for the second goal I just went for it early in the bottom corner. It's not out of the question that I could play for England in the future."

I wonder who told him that ? I think Some one feeding him Porkies If you ask me.

oops ... mea culpa ... I meant to post that the quote was at 1734 but as I was typing I forgot. Gotta search through a lot of text to find it.

[Guest Brethers]

That doesn't really fit into what he was saying, why is it in there? I'm hoping he can't play for England, and I'm still sitting on the side of him not being able to represent them. I'm a bit disappointed though that this is the reason behind his stalling. As mentioned earlier, it will be like JDG2s Holland pipe dream, he will be on the cusp but in the end somewhat lost in the English national pool

[rob.notenboom]

Gotta agree with Standard ... might be time to move on. Huge disappointment (yes I know it's not over yet, but still). Much better route to naturalize some of our MLSers and get them into the team.

[Guest soccer1]

On what bases would he become UK citizen? One way I guess would be that he would apply to become a citizen in England after being there for a number of years etc...???

[Lou]

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/generic/01/48/60/05/fifastatuten2011_e.pdf

In addition to holding a British passport he would need to meet one of the following criteria:

(a) He was born on the territory of the relevant Association;

( His biological mother or biological father was born on the territory of

the relevant Association;

© His grandmother or grandfather was born on the territory of the

relevant Association;

(d) He has engaged in a minimum of five years education under the age of 18 within the territory of the relevant association

Rules a-c from FIFA Statutes linked above

Rule d is exclusive to British Home Nations and is used instead of "(d) He has lived continuously on the territory of the relevant Association for at least two years". It was introduced in 2010.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Lou

[Joe MacCarthy]

Much better route to naturalize some of our MLSers and get them into the team.

Why would we want to do that? How does that help the growth of Canadian soccer? That's no better than Junior playing for England or Bircham playing for us. It's a bogus shortcut that won't benefit the future.

What kind of message does that send to a young Canadian youth player?

[rob.notenboom]

Why would we want to do that? How does that help the growth of Canadian soccer? That's no better than Junior playing for England or Bircham playing for us. It's a bogus shortcut that won't benefit the future.

What kind of message does that send to a young Canadian youth player?

For the short term it might do quite a lot actually. If the CMNT made the hex and (dare I say it) went to the world cup, it may inspire an entire generation of athletes to take up the game. A couple strong players who are 'new Canadians' could go a long way to helping that happen. I realize that you have made your point very clearly in this thread and in the 'V's statement' thread and I understand your point. However, I don't think you are giving enough credit to the possible social effects of success. If teams in Toronto, Vancouver, and Montreal are successful and they have academies who are trying to develop players to be in their squads, then success without a lot of Canadian talent on the roster may still have a very powerful influence on potential future Canadian players. I don't disagree with you that it would be preferable to have more Canadians on all of these teams right now. I think it is quite reasonable to put that message forth officially as well. But it is not an all or nothing argument or situation as far as I am concerned. Just the fact that there are 3 professional teams in Canada right now will capture the attention and motivate some of our youth. If they are successful, this will be more influential. If they have good academy systems to channel these captured imaginations this is another major plus. Eventually there should be no shortage of Canadians on MLS squads and overseas if all this works out.

Two other things: 1) I have a great deal of experience with teenagers being a high school teacher and (for 10 years) a high school soccer coach. There is one thing that almost always disappointed me. Very few of them were fans of the game/had the passion for the game in them. Only recently that has started to change. The game is not so much on the periphery of the mental map of sports in North America. Part of this is the establishment of professional teams in Canada but it is supported by increased media coverage, increased attendance, etc. Having successful teams would be part of this culture shift.

2) I think my idea of what it means to be a Canadian might be a little more fluid than yours. If someone moves to Canada to play with TFC, VWFC, or IMFC, stays for a number of years, applies for and attains citizenship, loves and appreciates this country and how lucky they are to live here, then they are Canadian, period. If they then play for our national team I'm not sure if that sends a bad message to a young Canadian youth player or not. But I can guarantee that there are many Canadian youth players who would identify as there 1000s that are first generation immigrants themselves. I know dozens of first generation immigrants (my Dad was one) and I don't see them as any less Canadian than myself.

[rob.notenboom]

And to get back to Junior and the reason for this thread, I find it quite insulting that someone who was raised in this country and enjoyed all that it provides would cast that away for a shot to play with England. It would be a lot different if he had moved to England for a better life and found it there like so many have done in Canada, but if he plays for England it is simply because he wants to play in a World Cup and representing his home gets chucked in the trash. I don't have a lot of respect for that and I feel fine saying so whether he or his family reads these boards or not.

[JOGAKANATA]

And to get back to Junior and the reason for this thread, I find it quite insulting that someone who was born and raised in this country and enjoyed all that it provides would cast that away for a shot to play with England. It would be a lot different if he had moved to England for a better life and found it there like so many have done in Canada, but if he plays for England it is simply because he wants to play in a World Cup and representing his home gets chucked in the trash. I don't have a lot of respect for that and I feel fine saying so whether he or his family reads these boards or not.

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