Robert Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Mont Pete put all his eggs (and our money) into one basket, the senior Canadian Women's National team and lost that gamble big-time. The women spent four months in Italy and have one shot on goal in three matches to show for it. The gamble also included getting the right to host the Women's World Cup in 2015. What on earth for? How much money is the Canadian soccer community going to have to shell out for that privilege? We should not expect a lot of sponsorship dollars after our performance in Germany, because corporation that sponsor sport teams or players usually want to be identitified with winners like Wayne G., Tiger W., Sidney C. and the likes. We should also brace ourselves for a poorly prepared senior Men's World Cup campaign, because there's no way we have the money to put them up in Brazil or Argentina for four months. So here we are Mont Pete, you have spent all the money that the Canadian Men's National Team has earned over the years and wasted it all on the Women. How rightuously Canadian of you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyrus Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 And, for the opposing glass-is-half-full side of the argument, this is a great opportunity to finally get away from the women's game as a cornerstone of the program -- women's soccer is a fringe sport, played in a few countries, men's soccer IS the game. The program will rebound, and the rebound will be led by the clubs -- Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal, Edmonton... maybe Ottawa if they ever figure out how to repair a stadium -- and none of these clubs operate a women's program (well, I guess Vancouver does, but they don't play at Empire). The recovery will come, led by Canadian men's talent developed in part through our clubs. Even if we had won the Women's World Cup, no one would have noticed. It's a truly fringe sport. I'm a fan, and I would have to look up the last five Women's World Cup winners. I can name the Men's cup winners off the top of my head, so can all of you, and we all remember where we watched the game. The women's game simply can't compete with that, so why did we imagine it could? A women's program will continue, but it will have to be self-sufficient. More a collection of ladies on NCAA scholarships than a fulltime team. And what the hell went wrong in Italy? Did they overtrain? Fight internally? Drink wine and eat pasta? (Training the Espisito way!) But that's a topic more for the women's forum... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachRich Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Wow, I can see why no one will post here as there is so much misinformation about the money the WNT gets. The truth is the majority of the money the WNT gets is restricted funding from Sports Canada, Own The Podium (COC) and etc. This extra funding is based on performance of the team in CONCACAF, WWC and Olympics. Details start here http://www.cansoc.org/showthread.php?42323-Morace-to-stick-with-national-team-through-London-Olympics&p=412308&viewfull=1#post412308 The upside of this restricted funding is it should free up money for other programs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Eh? Geezus, Bob, what are you on about now? Seriously, man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I'm not sure about the finacial aspect of it but I know the CSA was really hyping this women's team as they should! The problem is the tournament was a complete disaster and does nothing to justify any time and money that was put into the program! Add to that we're saddled with a tournament that no other country wanted and I wonder what's next! I'm not privy to the inner workings of the CSA but I can say this flame out in Germany did nothing but hurt our chances of bringing in sponsorship money and I hope the CSA isn't left bankrupt trying to host this somewhat fringe tournament! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I'm not sure about the finacial aspect of it but I know the CSA was really hyping this women's team as they should! The problem is the tournament was a complete disaster and does nothing to justify any time and money that was put into the program! Add to that we're saddled with a tournament that no other country wanted and I wonder what's next! I'm not privy to the inner workings of the CSA but I can say this flame out in Germany did nothing but hurt our chances of bringing in sponsorship money and I hope the CSA isn't left bankrupt trying to host this somewhat fringe tournament! I hope you're being sarcastic about "fringe tournament", when in Edmonton the U17 women packed Commonwealth, and 73,000 people turned out to see Canada v. Germany. If you're not being sarcastic, I'll point out that you're clearly making these statements out of sexism and leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I hope you're being sarcastic about "fringe tournament", when in Edmonton the U17 women packed Commonwealth, and 73,000 people turned out to see Canada v. Germany. If you're not being sarcastic, I'll point out that you're clearly making these statements out of sexism and leave it at that. I'm being neither! I'm aware that women"s soccer has received some decent support over the years in this country, my point is that if we don't bring in good revenue from tickets sold at a fair prices it could be a financial disaster! It's all fine and dandy to say Canada has great support for the NWT but what about all the matches that don't involve us? Opening match in Germany had a huge crowd, how many showed up for the rest of the matches? I don't know whether this tournament will make or lose money, my whole point was that Canada at this point is a much less appealing team to watch and it remains to be seen whether Canadians will scoop up tickets for matches not involving Canada! Don't try pulling out the sexist label because I state that this isn't exactly Copa America we're hosting here! No other country wanted the tournament, that's a fact, draw your own conclusions from that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmateo Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Funny thing about support - its the supporters that make it, not the players or success of the players. Canadians will come out in numbers to watch the world cup, put money into the CSA coffers, if they are properly encouraged to go. Throwing up your hands right now, walking away, or making up stupid "analysis" about money being misspent, and spreading such crap WILL help to ruin the World Cup here in 4 years. Even more stupid is the fact that local clubs get significant revenue from female players, and interest in both the mens and womens game can be mutually supportive of both teams potential for international success down the road. But hey, instead of focusing on REAL problems, lets shoot ourselves and our the person standing next to us in the foot and yell "ITS A FOOT RACE!". It seems the theme of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I'm being neither! I'm aware that women"s soccer has received some decent support over the years in this country, my point is that if we don't bring in good revenue from tickets sold at a fair prices it could be a financial disaster! It's all fine and dandy to say Canada has great support for the NWT but what about all the matches that don't involve us? Opening match in Germany had a huge crowd, how many showed up for the rest of the matches? I don't know whether this tournament will make or lose money, my whole point was that Canada at this point is a much less appealing team to watch and it remains to be seen whether Canadians will scoop up tickets for matches not involving Canada! Don't try pulling out the sexist label because I state that this isn't exactly Copa America we're hosting here! No other country wanted the tournament, that's a fact, draw your own conclusions from that! I didn't "pull the sexist label" because you said it wasn't exactly Copa America, I called the sentiment that the Women's World Cup is a "fringe tournament" sexist. The fact that it was your sentiment is entirely your own fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmateo Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 How about the 'fact' that every serious country knew Canada was going to host the next cup after closely losing to Germany (if you haven't noticed a serious football country...). And yes they probably are waiting for the numbers from Germany to see if they want to be serious about hosting the following version. Unfortunately resources are tight for running a women's world cup and countries are not going to spend money to 'practice bid'. It also means that women's world cups are very efficient with the money they do receive; meaning it is really easy to turn a profit - the bidding committee does not promise to build stadiums or renovate existing one, or build new infrastructure. They convince FIFA that the stadiums and infrastructure are there for other purposes and then rent them. FIFA takes care of the major sponsors, INTERNATIONAL television contracts and prize money. Ticket sales and national sponsors covers hosting costs (rental fees) with the rest left over to be spread around. It is not an expensive event all things considered, and this world cup is drawing more attention INTERNATIONALLY than the last. Odds on it being a bust in 2015...? don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I didn't "pull the sexist label" because you said it wasn't exactly Copa America, I called the sentiment that the Women's World Cup is a "fringe tournament" sexist. The fact that it was your sentiment is entirely your own fault. You're calling a person who watched every Canadian match in the WWC and every CONCACAF qualifyer sexist! I consider the recent U17 tournament "somewhat fringe" compared to the Men's WC, EURO Championships, Copa America and tournaments like that FWIW! You're entitled to your opinion as myself and everyone else on this board is, I don't take kindly to being labelled something I'm not by someone who doesn't even know me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 Why do people resort to a "sexist defence" when some one points out that women's soccer is somewhat fringe? The homeless World Cup is somewhat fringe, as is the Gay World Cup. Does stating these facts make me a snob, or a homophobe? The bottom line is that the quality of women's soccer in general is very poor, and in Canada's case extremely poor. The officiating at the women's World Cup is even worse. Why should the women get the amount of support the CSA has extended to them at the expense of the men's game? Money that the men's game receives has to be shared with the women, but apparently the women can keep their Own the Podium money to themselves. Doesn't the government belief that the Canada's men can Own the Podium if they are given the same kind of funding? And why would Mont Pete accept federal money destined exclusively for the women's program? Is Mont Pete sexist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Why do people resort to a "sexist defence" when some one points out that women's soccer is somewhat fringe? The homeless World Cup is somewhat fringe, as is the Gay World Cup. Does stating these facts make me a snob, or a homophobe? The bottom line is that the quality of women's soccer in general is very poor, and in Canada's case extremely poor. The officiating at the women's World Cup is even worse. Why should the women get the amount of support the CSA has extended to them at the expense of the men's game? Money that the men's game receives has to be shared with the women, but apparently the women can keep their Own the Podium money to themselves. Doesn't the government belief that the Canada's men can Own the Podium if they are given the same kind of funding? And why would Mont Pete accept federal money destined exclusively for the women's program? Is Mont Pete sexist? If a homeless world cup or a gay world cup existed, it might be a fringe activity. Given that women account for 51% of the population and are in fact the higher achieving national team in Canada, no, it is not fringe, and no, it is not sexist to give more money to them, they're out earning it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 If a homeless world cup or a gay world cup existed, it might be a fringe activity. Uh... http://www.homelessworldcup.org/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Gay_and_Lesbian_Football_Association You can throw in the Cerebral Palsy World Cup and Beach Soccer too...all fringe competitions. The Women's World Cup is a little more mainstream, but only a fraction of the people that follow the Men's World Cup are actually paying attention to it. It is fringe-ish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 If a homeless world cup or a gay world cup existed, it might be a fringe activity.QUOTE] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Gay_and_Lesbian_Football_Association. Long bob, Short bob, Curly bob, Flat bob, side Partings and Baldie heads! I imagine theres a Fringe or two in there as well! Strangley... When I Wikie'd for Homeless Football Association, this happened... "Did you mean: women's football association" * EDIT: DARN YOU JPG75 your too quick for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 The only thing not "fringe" when compared to the World Cup, though, would be the wedding of Kate and Wills. http://ca.news.yahoo.com/womens-world-cup-opener-between-germany-canada-ratings-141307665.html Canada-Germany got 662,000 viewers. That's a midweek hockey game number, so not what I'd call "fringe" exactly (but not yet front line, either). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fort York Redcoat1555362293 Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I count on Robert to make outrageous threads that have little to no research to back them and I have not been let down. Shine on! The money aspect aside, the CSA are getting the negative attention for focusing on the lesser followed but higher ranked team and will continue to do so for thinking they'd rather aspire to be a big fish in little pond. I will agree that a focus on the Mens qualifiers next up will help more but be a harder road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Uh... http://www.homelessworldcup.org/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Gay_and_Lesbian_Football_Association You can throw in the Cerebral Palsy World Cup and Beach Soccer too...all fringe competitions. The Women's World Cup is a little more mainstream, but only a fraction of the people that follow the Men's World Cup are actually paying attention to it. It is fringe-ish. ...I stand corrected...the gay world cup doesn't really confuse me though, the fact that there's a homeless world cup I find baffling...where do they send the invitations? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 ...I stand corrected...the gay world cup doesn't really confuse me though, the fact that there's a homeless world cup I find baffling...where do they send the invitations? Yep and how do you play at home for the qualification rounds if your ...well... homeless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Peter Montopoli is not trying to bankrupt Canadian Soccer, instead he is trying his best to get proper funding for the unique situation that Canada is in. He also recognized the importance of the Voyageurs, assisting in our special seating arrangements, and also made sure the Nutrilite Canadian Champions are awarded with the "Voyageurs Cup" rather than an award named after a Toronto sportswriter. The Canadian dilemma is that we have a top 20 WNT (arguably #6) competing in the 3rd highest profile FIFA event, while we have a mid-80s ranked MNT trying to qualify for the LARGEST FIFA event, with a very limited budget compared to serious efforts by other countries. And we don't have our OWN professional league for both men & women. My suggestion is not to choose whether or not we should support only one program (don't forget the U17s, u20s, and Olympic squads). Instead we should concentrate in also finding the necessary corporate and public funding, including re-evaluating the funding from all clubs and provinces. This is the way we can get World Class coaching and instruction, just like other sports like swimming, boxing, skiing, and even water polo. This is extremely easier-said-than-done, that is also why I find the title (and the originator) of this thread humorous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I found the WWC painful to watch but I would not agree that it is a "fringe" sporting event. Certainly second-tier but probably no more "fringe" than the Pan American or Commonwealth Games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 The best thing about the whole Women's World Cup tournament is the fact that the CSA's ineptness is now finally on display to the whole world to see. We have officially become the laughing stock of the international soccer. Thanks Mont Pete! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Did they give us an official plaque or medal or something? I mean, it's one thing for us to be claiming to be the laughing stock (sic) but now that it's official I expect some sort of bauble of recognition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 8, 2011 Author Share Posted July 8, 2011 16 countries. Only 2 of them wound up with "ZERO points after the group stage, Canada and Equatorial Guinea. Canada scored 1 goal and conceeded 7, while Equatorial Guinea scored twice as many goals and conceeded just as many. We finished dead-last, and you want a medal to commemorate the feat. The fact that Equatorial Guinea took part shows that the Women's World Cup is still in the "making up the numbers" phase. Until women's soccer gets to the "seperating the wheat from the chaff" stage it will remain a fringe sport. This is the sixth Women's World Cup tournament. The United States and China have hosted it twice, while Germany and Sweden have held it once each. That doesn't exactly show that countries are lining-up to host this event. The Canadian Women's National team has one great player, one who works hard and the rest can be replaced by any nine Canadian girls off the street. Their coach is an embarrasment on tv when it comes to speaking english, because obviously she could not comprehend Brenda Irving's questions. The CSA is nuts for extending her contract. What is going to change between now and next year? But that's okay, because the world will once again get to see how incompetent the CSA is for extending her contract. What do you think would happen if Morace coached the Italian women's national team and put in a performance similar to what she did with Canada. The rotten tomatoes would be flying. Could Morace land a coaching position with any other national association with her current resume? Hah, maybe in Pakistan. Christine Sinclair should have never opened her mouth to support Morace, that is not her job. I can understand why she did so and I respect her to much to hold it against her. But the hiring and firing of a coach is not up to the players. Did they give us an official plaque or medal or something? I mean, it's one thing for us to be claiming to be the laughing stock (sic) but now that it's official I expect some sort of bauble of recognition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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