Robert Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Why does the CSA exclude past Nutrilite championship results in seeding teams for the Nutrilite Canadian Championship? Are last year's MLS and NASL championship results more important/relevant than last year's Nutrilite Canadian Championship results? Does any other national soccer association seed its competitions by using only the results of outside competitions? The CSA's rule for seeding is: "Teams will be seeded according to their final position their respective leagues ~ Major League Soccer teams first followed by NASL (or equivalent). Where more than four teams are eligible for entry into the Nutrilite Canadian Championship a play-in competition will be organised by the CSA in the fall prior to the Nutrilite Canadian Championships. Major League Soccer clubs will receive a bye direct to the Nutrilite Canadian Championship." Please answer the question first before giving us your opinion on Robert starting another thread on this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Why does the CSA exclude past Nutrilite championship results in seeding teams for the Nutrilite Canadian Championship? Are last year's MLS and NASL championship results more important/relevant than last year's Nutrilite Canadian Championship results? Does any other national soccer association seed its competitions by using only the results of outside competitions? The CSA's rule for seeding is: "Teams will be seeded according to their final position their respective leagues ~ Major League Soccer teams first followed by NASL (or equivalent). Where more than four teams are eligible for entry into the Nutrilite Canadian Championship a play-in competition will be organised by the CSA in the fall prior to the Nutrilite Canadian Championships. Major League Soccer clubs will receive a bye direct to the Nutrilite Canadian Championship." Please answer the question first before giving us your opinion on Robert starting another thread on this issue. Just as a heads up, if you use the Nutrilite results from last year, the seeding doesn't change. But you're correct, they should be seeding using the Nutrilite results instead of the League results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Just as a heads up, if you use the Nutrilite results from last year, the seeding doesn't change. But you're correct, they should be seeding using the Nutrilite results instead of the League results. Most domestic cup competitions use previous league standings as seeding, IIRC. Our closest neighbour does this with the US Open Cup, and in one of the 347993148654 other threads that Robert has started on this subject, it was shown that Italy does this for the Coppa Italia. However, you are correct that the Nutrilite results would have seeded the teams exactly as they were, so really Robert is grasping at straws here (again). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DontPanic Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 i agree that the NCC should be used, and hopefully will be used next year so TFC can play edmonton again and rest up for the Vancouver v Montreal winner. Wait a second..thats the conspiracy..dastardly Toronto would have to play the lower seed again next year. i was so happy to see a "robert thread" but then was very disappointed by the low comedy value in this one. please try again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 It's groundhog day in the voyageurs cup sub forum. Expect a new thread on this topic tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Most domestic cup competitions use previous league standings as seeding, IIRC. Our closest neighbour does this with the US Open Cup, and in one of the 347993148654 other threads that Robert has started on this subject, it was shown that Italy does this for the Coppa Italia. However, you are correct that the Nutrilite results would have seeded the teams exactly as they were, so really Robert is grasping at straws here (again). They do. But I'm of the opinion we should be using previous cup standings, because there's no promotion/relegation between NASL/MLS, so NASL sides will always be the lower seeds, regardless of if they're reigning champions or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 You're all missing the point here, whether the Towrads decide to use the Voyageur's Cup or respective league standings: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 Well, its nice to see that a few agree that the Nutrilite matches should be used in the seeding process. If MLS and NASL matches are also used, maybe they could be weighted in a similar fashion that is employed in Europe to determined the winner of the Golden Boot award. For example, MLS points could be multiplied by 2, while NASL points could be multiplied 1.5. I don't care who is seeded first, second or third, as long as it is a fair system and that everybody knows what the system is. Personally, I don't see why, in a four-team competition there can't just be a draw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Crampton Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Personally, I don't see why, in a four-team competition there can't just be a draw? Because this isn't just a knockout Cup tournament held for its own sake. It's a tournament specifically designed to qualify its winner for our regional club championship. The CSA has an interest in trying to make sure the best prepared club represents Canada in that tournament. Establishing the principle that clubs from lower leagues will necessarily have a more difficult path to the final now, before the tournament starts expanding, is a sensible measure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 Does the same apply to the Men's World Cup. The eight seeded countries are placed in one bowl (none of the countries are assigned numbers 1 through 8). Three more bowls contain eight coutries which are seperated so they are not drawn against each other in the group stages. FIFA does this to avoid the number 1 ranked country in the world meeting the number 2 ranked country in the group stage. However, Spain for example is not grouped with the weakest country from each of the remaining three bowls. The way the CSA conducted their "DRAW" this year clearly favoured the TFC in every regard. Because this isn't just a knockout Cup tournament held for its own sake. It's a tournament specifically designed to qualify its winner for our regional club championship. The CSA has an interest in trying to make sure the best prepared club represents Canada in that tournament. Establishing the principle that clubs from lower leagues will necessarily have a more difficult path to the final now, before the tournament starts expanding, is a sensible measure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ranul Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 there should be a rule that should not have the first round matches repeat the next season . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 there should be a rule that should not have the first round matches repeat the next season . Why? Why should clubs not be seeded according to performance? That's stupid. The phrase "Familiarity breeds contempt" comes to mind. The more you play, the bigger the rivalry/hatred becomes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 Good point. Most major sports leagues in North America and Europe try to find way that make it more difficult for clubs to become dynasties. They feel its bad for business if teams like the Montreal Canadians, the New York Yankees and the Real Madrids of the world dominate major competitions for five consecutive years. The CSA on the other hand goes out of its way to help the TFC win the Nutrilite Canadian Championship year after year? What does Mont Pete know that Sepp Blatter and Gary Bettman are obviously missing? there should be a rule that should not have the first round matches repeat the next season . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyslexic nam Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 If nothing else, one has to admire your persistence... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Just uppin' the N in the S/N ratio... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue and White Army Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Because this isn't just a knockout Cup tournament held for its own sake. And that's why the US Open Cup is far, far superior to the Canadian Championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 And that's why the US Open Cup is far, far superior to the Canadian Championship. I love those superior crowds and media attention it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I love those superior crowds and media attention it gets. And the far superior B teams the MLS fields because they don't care about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue and White Army Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 It's the Yanks' problem for not recognizing a great competition. Should the English FA Cup only include the top two divisions, because Manchester United occasionally play their stiffs? Having amateur clubs compete with professionals is fantastic. Whine all you want, but the US Open Cup makes the NCC look like a parochial weekend festival by comparison. The NCC desperately needs to include more divisions. It's getting stale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 It's the Yanks' problem for not recognizing a great competition. Should the English FA Cup only include the top two divisions, because Manchester United occasionally play their stiffs? Having amateur clubs compete with professionals is fantastic. Whine all you want, but the US Open Cup makes the NCC look like a parochial weekend festival by comparison. The NCC desperately needs to include more divisions. It's getting stale. Your club should try winning it, then. Mix it up a bit. In all seriousness, I want the NCC to eventually become an open competition, too. The key word is "eventually", as building a national cup from the top down requires stability that only the fully pro clubs can priovide right now. It'll happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThiKu Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Robert. It's not funny anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Crampton Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 And that's why the US Open Cup is far, far superior to the Canadian Championship. I like the US Open Cup too and wish the Americans would recognize the great little tournament it could be but the Canadian Championship is better than anything we've had since the early '90s in Canada so I'm in no way unhappy with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 I agree, it's slightly better than nothing. But does the CSA, through the Nutrilite Canadian Championship, do any thing to bridge the enormous gap that exists between professional and amateur players development in Canada? I like the US Open Cup too and wish the Americans would recognize the great little tournament it could be but the Canadian Championship is better than anything we've had since the early '90s in Canada so I'm in no way unhappy with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I agree, it's slightly better than nothing. But does the CSA, through the Nutrilite Canadian Championship, do any thing to bridge the enormous gap that exists between professional and amateur players development in Canada? I think we all know the answer to this question; the Voyageur's Cup was an inside job. www.NCCtruth.org Wake up sheeple! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 I think we all know the answer to this question; the Voyageur's Cup was an inside job. www.NCCtruth.org Wake up sheeple! Stop posting fake links dammit. I wanted to read some real conspiracy theories! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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