jpg75 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 ...it's now basically any player under 24 years of age. Which would put it at anyone born in 88' and on, possibly 87' which would put Morfaw in contention of one too. Cap went from 2.1 million - 2.3 million. Anyone who is 24 years old or younger during the season is eligible for a DEV contract, so for the 2011 season the cut off is the 1987 birth year. The Cap has risen from $2.55M last year to $2.67M this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Anyone who is 24 years old or younger during the season is eligible for a DEV contract, That means 90% of the Caps are eligible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Do the two GA players count against the 2 developmental spots? Or can they be part of the 20 senior roster players? By my count, the Caps should have more than $1m of cap space. I don't want to tell them what to do, but I'd sign three DPs who aren't named Savage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Do the two GA players count against the 2 developmental spots? Or can they be part of the 20 senior roster players? By my count, the Caps should have more than $1m of cap space. I don't want to tell them what to do, but I'd sign three DPs who aren't named Savage. They count as DEV spots, and you would want them to always be on the DEV roster or else their higher-than-the-average-rookie salary starts to count against the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masster Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Correct me if i'm wrong but I think each team starts with 8 international spots and we traded for 2( 1 from Chivas and 1 from Seattle) so I think we have 10 in total. Do these international spots revert back to their original team after a certain period of time of do they belong to the Caps forever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 3 more in the supplemental draft international defender Michael Boxall (NZ) as the first overall pick in the 2011 MLS Supplemental Draft on Tuesday morning. The club then used their two other picks to select Canadian midfielder Joe Anderson (19th overall) and American defender Santiago Bedoya (37th overall). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKottonmouthed1555362307 Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 Added some references in some hyperlink's on the OP, hopefully they clear up some roster limits confusion, they are blue little numbers in square parenthesis' if you couldn't find them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smapti Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 They count as DEV spots, and you would want them to always be on the DEV roster or else their higher-than-the-average-rookie salary starts to count against the cap. I don't think it matters if a GA contract is on senior or development side, it won't count against the cap. So for example if VW could have 2 GAs and 10 dev and thus only 18 contracts count against cap. Its just so confusing. Do these international spots revert back to their original team after a certain period of time of do they belong to the Caps forever? Lenarduzzi said they last for a year or two but wouldn't disclose what he had for the 2 he acquired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKottonmouthed1555362307 Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 I think a GA clearly has to be a DEV contract, GA is essentially a DEV program, how could it not be automatically DEV status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I don't think it matters if a GA contract is on senior or development side, it won't count against the cap. So for example if VW could have 2 GAs and 10 dev and thus only 18 contracts count against cap. Its just so confusing. Any contract on the Senior roster counts against the cap. If you stick a GA player on the Sr. roster you are essentially foregoing his GA status, that's why it would be idiotic to move a GA player from the DEV roster to the Sr. one. http://www.mlssoccer.com/regulations (A) SENIOR ROSTER Other than at specified times during preseason or through injury situations (e.g., a player added as either a disabled list replacement or a season-ending injury replacement), an MLS team shall have no more than 20 Senior Roster players at any time. The Senior Roster is comprised of the following players, who all count against a team's salary budget: If you want to add 2 extra players to the DEV roster then move 2 existing and deserving non-GA players up to the Sr. roster and offer them min. salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamo Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Any contract on the Senior roster counts against the cap. If you stick a GA player on the Sr. roster you are essentially foregoing his GA status, that's why it would be idiotic to move a GA player from the DEV roster to the Sr. one. http://www.mlssoccer.com/regulations (A) SENIOR ROSTER Other than at specified times during preseason or through injury situations (e.g., a player added as either a disabled list replacement or a season-ending injury replacement), an MLS team shall have no more than 20 Senior Roster players at any time. The Senior Roster is comprised of the following players, who all count against a team's salary budget: If you want to add 2 extra players to the DEV roster then move 2 existing and deserving non-GA players up to the Sr. roster and offer them min. salary. I think there is some confusion around the what is considered "roster" and senior and development...everyone who is on a roster can be put on the game day 18. So GA players on the Dev roster can still play on game day...the DEV roster is not the same as the PDL roster where a player has to be transfered from the PDL roster to the "Senior" roster....this is a difference between MLS and USL. GA players can play on game day and still do not count against the "Salary Budget". Moving from D2 to D1 we have to get used to a new language. We could for instance sign a player to a PDL contract and then put them on the DEV roster that would allow them to play MLS games and then move them back to the PDL roster when Salgado arrives to put him on the DEV roster. That is my understanding at least. ***That was in general to the thread and not directed to you JP us west coasters are used to a Senior roster and a Development roster being two different "teams". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Yes Slamo, that's correct. Any of the 30 players under contract with the club can play on game day. 20 "Senior roster" players count against cap and the 10 DEV do not. Any of the 30 players on contract as well as guest players/trialists can also play on the reserve team. I know you guys are trying to figure things out, i was in the same boat back in '06/'07 so i asked alot of questions over on BigSoccer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKottonmouthed1555362307 Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 Yes Slamo, that's correct. Any of the 30 players under contract with the club can play on game day. 20 "Senior roster" players count against cap and the 10 DEV do not. Any of the 30 players on contract as well as guest players/trialists can also play on the reserve team. I know you guys are trying to figure things out, i was in the same boat back in '06/'07 so i asked alot of questions over on BigSoccer. Has this really been the confusion? I figured it was pretty clear that all 30 players were game day eligible. I find it hard to think Caps fans were unaware of this before the MLS era started that players on DEV contracts can play everyday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamo Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Has this really been the confusion? I figured it was pretty clear that all 30 players were game day eligible. I find it hard to think Caps fans were unaware of this before the MLS era started that players on DEV contracts can play everyday.The rules from USL are quite different. Players on "development" contracts were not eligible to play. For instance, Edwini-Bonsu and Cody Arnoux are both on Development contracts right now...so saying development roster may cause some understandable confusion. REB nor Arnoux are eligible to play for MLS (I imagine both will be gone before the season starts, but that is another matter). Just in your statement you say, "players on DEV contracts can play everyday" which is technically incorrect. Players on the DEV ROSTER can play. The Caps will have 30 players on MLS contracts (some will be on the DEV roster) and another 30 on Development Contracts playing in the PDL or on loan. Throw in the reserve league and you can see where some confusion comes from. Roster and contract are two very seperate things. The benefit of the DEV roster is it is unlimited so we will get to see a lot of movement and chances for guys like Alderson, Tiebert, Corbin-Ong, Coulton, Caleb et al to play PDL and Reserve league games and get a chance to sit on the bench for a couple of MLS games to get a variety of experience. I suspect the Caps may opt for a 28 man roster to allow for more movement and get more of a chance to bring a lot of the young fellows up for road trips and to get some first team training from time to time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesareavailable Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Not sure how euphemistically you mean "sit on the bench for a couple of MLS games"...PDL guys cannot play in an MLS game until they become employees of MLS, right? Which your academy/PDL guys aren't? Reserve games, training, sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamo Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Not sure how euphemistically you mean "sit on the bench for a couple of MLS games"...PDL guys cannot play in an MLS game until they become employees of MLS, right? Which your academy/PDL guys aren't? Reserve games, training, sure...On this point I am not sure how the "league contracts" work. In USL you could sign a fellow to a one game contract etc from the PDL to the USL. So, my thought is that we could do the same, but with MLS control over contracts I am not sure it is so simple to sign one of the PDL players to a one week "trial" or whatever the case may be. I am sure there are all sorts of loopholes though. It is the MLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smapti Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 On this point I am not sure how the "league contracts" work. In USL you could sign a fellow to a one game contract etc from the PDL to the USL. So, my thought is that we could do the same, but with MLS control over contracts I am not sure it is so simple to sign one of the PDL players to a one week "trial" or whatever the case may be. I am sure there are all sorts of loopholes though. It is the MLS Maybe TFC fans can help, but I'm sure Henry played a few games before signing a HG contract, of course it could have been just Champions league and not MLS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Has this really been the confusion? I figured it was pretty clear that all 30 players were game day eligible. I find it hard to think Caps fans were unaware of this before the MLS era started that players on DEV contracts can play everyday. I don't know what you guys are confused about, but there seems to be alot of questions being asked and some misinformation being spread so if i can keep things clear then i hope it's helping. Re: playing in MLS, a player is required to be signed to an MLS contract to be eligible to be play in the league. Henry and Lindsay (and other academy players) could only play in the CCL and friendlies prior to signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 ^ And the Voyageurs Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamo Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 I don't know what you guys are confused about, but there seems to be alot of questions being asked and some misinformation being spread so if i can keep things clear then i hope it's helping. Re: playing in MLS, a player is required to be signed to an MLS contract to be eligible to be play in the league. Henry and Lindsay (and other academy players) could only play in the CCL and friendlies prior to signing. My question to that would be the flexibility in MLS contracts. No confusion on having players needing to have MLS contracts. But the DEV roster spots are unlimited so if we have 28 players on the roster can you sign a two week contract with a PDL player count him as a DEV roster spot etc? Specific Example: Tiebert doesn't make the MLS roster, signs a PDL (developmental) contract, Half way through the years Caps want to bring him on a road trip due to whatever circumstance, because there are only 28 players on a 30 man roster - can they sign Tiebert to a MLS contract for 10 days or so? There doesn't seem to be a rule around this....but as we've seen with the Arnoux situation; the league tends to make retroactive rules whenever someone comes up with a loophole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 My question to that would be the flexibility in MLS contracts. No confusion on having players needing to have MLS contracts. But the DEV roster spots are unlimited so if we have 28 players on the roster can you sign a two week contract with a PDL player count him as a DEV roster spot etc? Specific Example: Tiebert doesn't make the MLS roster, signs a PDL (developmental) contract, Half way through the years Caps want to bring him on a road trip due to whatever circumstance, because there are only 28 players on a 30 man roster - can they sign Tiebert to a MLS contract for 10 days or so? There doesn't seem to be a rule around this....but as we've seen with the Arnoux situation; the league tends to make retroactive rules whenever someone comes up with a loophole. Ok, first off you are still interchanging PDL and Development contracts and you need to condition yourselves that they are completely different things. Now that Vancouver is in MLS you will no longer be able to "sign" players to a PDL contract and retain their professional rights - they will essentially be amateurs that can leave to sign with anyone outside of MLS at any time. The club is going to have to be careful to sign any player they believe to be important ASAP. For the sake of your example if they sign Teibert to an MLS contract it would have to be for 1 season (or the rest of the season whenever he signs). If they want to drop him back to the PDL he would have to be waived and the rest of the league would be free to sign him. MLS Senior roster - 20 spots DEV roster - 10 spots ------------------------------------- PDL - 0 spots (no contract with club, discovery claim needed to sign unless was part of academy - non-HG players do not belong to club and cannot play in MLS) Residency - 0 spots (amateur contracts, club can sign as homegrown player - players cannot play in MLS) Talking about this stuff is making me wonder how the Homegrown player regulation is going to work out in the coming years because there will be hundreds and hundreds of players who could sign with their clubs, but if the club doesn't sign them what happens to their MLS rights? Is there an expiration? Can another club step in at any time after a player leaves an Academy and make a discovery claim to sign him? I would then assume the parent club would have right to match any offer the same way they have the right to sign them and bypass the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKottonmouthed1555362307 Posted January 20, 2011 Author Share Posted January 20, 2011 Ok, first off you are still interchanging PDL and Development contracts and you need to condition yourselves that they are completely different things. Now that Vancouver is in MLS you will no longer be able to "sign" players to a PDL contract and retain their professional rights - they will essentially be amateurs that can leave to sign with anyone outside of MLS at any time. The club is going to have to be careful to sign any player they believe to be important ASAP. For the sake of your example if they sign Teibert to an MLS contract it would have to be for 1 season (or the rest of the season whenever he signs). If they want to drop him back to the PDL he would have to be waived and the rest of the league would be free to sign him. MLS Senior roster - 20 spots DEV roster - 10 spots ------------------------------------- PDL - 0 spots (no contract with club, discovery claim needed to sign unless was part of academy - non-HG players do not belong to club and cannot play in MLS) Residency - 0 spots (amateur contracts, club can sign as homegrown player - players cannot play in MLS) Talking about this stuff is making me wonder how the Homegrown player regulation is going to work out in the coming years because there will be hundreds and hundreds of players who could sign with their clubs, but if the club doesn't sign them what happens to their MLS rights? Is there an expiration? Can another club step in at any time after a player leaves an Academy and make a discovery claim to sign him? I would then assume the parent club would have right to match any offer the same way they have the right to sign them and bypass the draft. Thank You, hopefully this clears it up for people who are still confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Perhaps you could also explain for the rest of us how the MLS Reserves fit into this structure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesareavailable Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Let me murk up the waters, Slamo: earlier you said VWFC (the blue and white slice of the MLS corporate loaf) might go with a 28 man roster, or some such. Four or five Residents like Teibert, or whoever has the best shot at playing a meaningful role, could sign MLS contracts, occupy roster spots, and still be pingponged on loan to the PDL club. Some wouldn't want to be bound to an MLS contract under those conditions, I'm sure. That said, we don't actually know the status of these new "development" contracts: they pay 31,250 but are they terminable by the club, as dev contracts were in their previous incarnation, not subjecting the player to a waiver process? If that were the case, willing participants could choose to go back and forth between PDL and MLS...again, why would they, though. You'll learn, too, that the rules aren't so inscrutable or arbitrary. The dance between Arnoux and MLS long predates vancouver's involvement...really surprising that Lenarduzzi tried that one on in the face of his new corporate masters...remember, slice of a loaf, as opposed to independent football club... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesareavailable Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Perhaps you could also explain for the rest of us how the MLS Reserves fit into this structure? Any player on the 30 man roster, Academy players and trialists are eligible to play in Reserve games. There were, previously, limits on minutes played in corresponding first-team games...hence mainly reserves, unused subs, local players on "non-guaranteed call up agreements, stadium staff, television personalities, etc. got a game. This revival is mainly to benefit the under-24s in development slots and to introduce academicians to the higher level of play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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