Forum/website update

[Admin]

My apologies if this is sudden, but circumstances haven't been great.

The website should be updated soon. Most likely this weekend.

The change requires some explanation.

The URL www.cansoc.org was never supposed to be the permanent URL of the Voyageurs. It was supposed to be temporary, but DNS for thevoyageurs.com ect... didn't get changed.

The new domain will be www.canadiansoccernews.com. It is easy to remember and completely to the point. thevoyageurs.com will be used as well if we get the opportunity to do so.

Our forum will not change, it will be upgraded with new features and many bug fixes. The front end represents the consolidation of several bloggers from across the country, hence the name canadiansoccernews. The Voyageurs will have our own blog in the list of blogs. This will be very good for our people like Gian-Luca who put in a lot of effort to write articles.

It's a win win situation for the bloggers and our forum. We get continuously updated Canadian soccer content and both of us benefit from the traffic. The bloggers don't have to run a bunch of independant sites. Currently we have our forum + mostly dead front end, after we will have our forum + lively front end.

Perhaps we could think of them as our own personal media slaves. If they don't mention the Voyageurs in every other article, I'll translate their blogs into Chinese.

The bloggers are

Yvan Delia-Lavictoire - Montreal Impact- French and English

Pierce Lang - Vancouver Whitecaps

Andew Bucholtz - Vancouver Whitecaps

Ben Rycroft - It's Called Football Show

Rudi Schuller - Canadian perspective on soccer in Europe

Ben Knight - Canadian Soccer and TFC

Duane Rollins - TFC

Daniel Squizzato - Canadian Soccer

Jamie Doyle - Canadian Soccer

Voyageurs - All our fantastic contributers

[Lord Bob]

(DISCLAIMER: I write a Canadian soccer blog that is not part of this project. I don't think I'm speaking from a biased position, but I want to state my potential conflict of interest.)

Watch me a dick towards an exciting new project by a bunch of bloggers I really respect. But here it goes anyway.

My understanding is that the blogger guys are starting up a for-profit project to collect all their blogs in one spot. I remember Ben Rycroft mentioning on It's Called Football there'd be integration with the Voyageurs, but I wasn't expecting us to be sharing a domain. Is there going to be Voyageurs branding on these blogs, similarly to what Gian-Luca and anyone else who writes a blog here currently sees?

If the setups are more discrete than this post makes them sound, I have no problem with anything. But I'm not comfortable with our group endorsing commercial soccer writing, and while I might be a lone voice in this I'm also a bit flabbergasted there wasn't any mention of this until half a week before it happens.

[Unnamed Trialist]

(DISCLAIMER: I write a Canadian soccer blog that is not part of this project. I don't think I'm speaking from a biased position, but I want to state my potential conflict of interest.)

Watch me a dick towards an exciting new project by a bunch of bloggers I really respect. But here it goes anyway.

My understanding is that the blogger guys are starting up a for-profit project to collect all their blogs in one spot. I remember Ben Rycroft mentioning on It's Called Football there'd be integration with the Voyageurs, but I wasn't expecting us to be sharing a domain. Is there going to be Voyageurs branding on these blogs, similarly to what Gian-Luca and anyone else who writes a blog here currently sees?

If the setups are more discrete than this post makes them sound, I have no problem with anything. But I'm not comfortable with our group endorsing commercial soccer writing, and while I might be a lone voice in this I'm also a bit flabbergasted there wasn't any mention of this until half a week before it happens.

I totally agree, how can we go anywhere if there is absolutely zero consultation. BTW, I have seen changes, I have been on the V-board for more than ten years.

How come none of the bloggers, who I suppose believe in open communication and blog to be heard, have said a word, have been overwhelmingly silent on this? Bad omen.

I do not agree with the URL either. How the hell can you be so categorical about its logic or rationality, when frankly it sort of sucks. Canada Soccer News sucks, not a lot, not like really a lot, but it still sucks. It is boring as sin and heartless and not exactly a fan URL. Not a supporter group URL at all.

(Disclaimer: I once was asked to participate as a blogger in a future project and of course said cool, yeah, but then never heard a single thing ever again. The current front page is dead as a doornail, so I am not sure our great existing Voyageur bloggers give a damn about the V-site, at least not enough to embarrassed by an outdated front page. So is this what we confide in, reading Gianluca about Peru and wondering if the guy who said he might just write about the Ukraine match every really got around to it? Or not?)

Get with it guys, already huge numbers have gone to their respective club sites where they can chat about Canada news with the Voyageur BS of recent years, now all the more reason to do so. Have fun with the site.

[Richard]

The Voyageurs are giving up their identity and independence with this rather abrupt move, what does the membership think, were they consulted? If the bloggers wish to co-operate in some fashion, for profit too I imagine, then they should do it independently of the Voyageurs which I have always understood to be an independent, not-for-profit association of Canada soccer supporters. I see this as the Voyageurs website being co-opted by the independent bloggers to their (the bloggers) advantage. If this plan proceeds then I recommend those not happy with it set up a new, independent Voyageurs forum.

[Admin]

How is cansoc.org our identity?

I want thevoyageurs.com to be the forum. If it can happen it will.

Try finding a good domain. If someone can find one great.

For profit? Seriously? Blogging about Canadian soccer? It's about people's effort not going to waste and helping each other out. That is it.

[Admin]

I totally agree, how can we go anywhere if there is absolutely zero consultation. BTW, I have seen changes, I have been on the V-board for more than ten years.

How come none of the bloggers, who I suppose believe in open communication and blog to be heard, have said a word, have been overwhelmingly silent on this? Bad omen.

I do not agree with the URL either. How the hell can you be so categorical about its logic or rationality, when frankly it sort of sucks. Canada Soccer News sucks, not a lot, not like really a lot, but it still sucks. It is boring as sin and heartless and not exactly a fan URL. Not a supporter group URL at all.

(Disclaimer: I once was asked to participate as a blogger in a future project and of course said cool, yeah, but then never heard a single thing ever again. The current front page is dead as a doornail, so I am not sure our great existing Voyageur bloggers give a damn about the V-site, at least not enough to embarrassed by an outdated front page. So is this what we confide in, reading Gianluca about Peru and wondering if the guy who said he might just write about the Ukraine match every really got around to it? Or not?)

Get with it guys, already huge numbers have gone to their respective club sites where they can chat about Canada news with the Voyageur BS of recent years, now all the more reason to do so. Have fun with the site.

I told them you were interested and they thought it was a great idea. Not sure what happened but my guess it was just time, and I ended up here and things fell through the cracks. I think you should write a blog, it would be excellent.

Ben is in charge of the blogging stuff and if anyone want's to do something approach him.

The URL is a bit sterile, but totally self explanatory. thevoyageurs.com will be pointing our own content/forum someday.

[Admin]

The Voyageurs are giving up their identity and independence with this rather abrupt move, what does the membership think, were they consulted? If the bloggers wish to co-operate in some fashion, for profit too I imagine, then they should do it independently of the Voyageurs which I have always understood to be an independent, not-for-profit association of Canada soccer supporters. I see this as the Voyageurs website being co-opted by the independent bloggers to their (the bloggers) advantage. If this plan proceeds then I recommend those not happy with it set up a new, independent Voyageurs forum.

We are not giving up anything.

We are getting Canadian soccer content for the front end of the site.

None of those people can even moderate the forum. They can post articles in a category. That's it.

[nolando]

Keep panties on, people.

Back up a step - start a new thread about the proposed changes, and then come to some sort of resolution. You could even do a survey to gauge popular opinion or have vote amongst actual active members.

No-one is disparaging another v's hard work, but let's respect the identity, spirit and collective-ness of our little group. There are so many things we can do to make this site and group better but this process and the actual finished product will all be much better if we move forward together.

[Vic]

Bob I'm not sure what your blog is but I'd like to read it. The two guy's I truly enjoy reading are Ben Knight and Jeffrey who posted above. There's also "From a Left Wing" but she's an American.

The image below is a crude 5-minute mockup of how I think a Voyageurs site should function and leans more to the community as a whole. And I've already v2'd it in my mind and would add another vBulletin widget of the thread names & posters of the most recent 10-15 forum posts on the homepage as well. I think I would also add some enhanced visibility to the 'About' and 'Forum' links too.

The main concept behind the homepage is an organic 'live' nature which makes it a place for people to one-stop shop and find out what's new right at this moment. It has a human-interest photo-of-the-week/month and three columns of content - (1) Canadian soccer news and articles populated from external sources, (2) the featured bloggers content via a merged rss, and (3) twitter updates from Canadian soccer "players" (i.e. the CSA, media pundits, national players, etc).

The primary site content/navigation is explained below the mockup and are areas I think we could maintain that are of interest and bring value to the Canadian soccer community.

My plan was to behind-the-scenes try to find a way to pull it off in the next month and put it up somewhere and throw it up the flagpole for comments, but seeing as how some of there's already some feedback I thought I'd post it up now in case it adds any value.

[Sam]

I like the idea. Agree with the sentiment it probably should have gone to the members first, but I like the idea of the Voyageurs being more than just a forum. One recommendation I would make would be to not allow comments on the blog, instead automatically start a thread in the forum about each blog post. I follow Republik of Mancunia a Manchester United blog and the discussion on the site's forum is pretty poor because all the best discussion takes place in the blog comments, I don't want the Voyageurs to turn into blog comments.

[Admin]

Bob I'm not sure what your blog is but I'd like to read it. The two guy's I truly enjoy reading are Ben Knight and Jeffrey who posted above. There's also "From a Left Wing" but she's an American.

The image below is a crude 5-minute mockup of how I think a Voyageurs site should function and leans more to the community as a whole. And I've already v2'd it in my mind and would add another vBulletin widget of the thread names & posters of the most recent 10-15 forum posts on the homepage as well. I think I would also add some enhanced visibility to the 'About' and 'Forum' links too.

The main concept behind the homepage is an organic 'live' nature which makes it a place for people to one-stop shop and find out what's new right at this moment. It has a human-interest photo-of-the-week/month and three columns of content - (1) Canadian soccer news and articles populated from external sources, (2) the featured bloggers content via a merged rss, and (3) twitter updates from Canadian soccer "players" (i.e. the CSA, media pundits, national players, etc).

The primary site content/navigation is explained below the mockup and are areas I think we could maintain that are of interest and bring value to the Canadian soccer community.

My plan was to behind-the-scenes try to find a way to pull it off in the next month and put it up somewhere and throw it up the flagpole for comments, but seeing as how some of there's already some feedback I thought I'd post it up now in case it adds any value.

That is pretty much what is on the table at the moment.

Recent thread and post widgets are on the front page (they just don't show up currently cause no one is posting in the forum)

When I suggested even buying people coffee cards for contributing content eight months ago I was met with total scorn.

So the menu structure is good, we have/had it but we need the content.

I would like to see the whole site be a one stop directory for all of soccer in the country. It is the place to go, and the Voyageurs name will be all over it.

[Vic]

That's great to hear. I would key in on the 'live' aspect as much as possible like the recent posts and tweets. And the more bloggers the merrier. I would definitely go after Jeffrey and Bob too, because I really enjoy both their commentary.

Websites are always unfinished art. I know we have mods but perhaps a formal website 'committee' (God I can't believe I said the word) would be a good step going forward. I think it would also protect you from getting overwhelmed too.

Hard to believe how long we had that old forum before vBulletin which is miles ahead.

p.s. since it's November 11 and time to honor those who fought before us - check it, 1999:

And if you want a little more nostalgia: Voyageurs Archives

[Lord Bob]

I'd like to re-ask this question, since it hasn't been answered yet: is there going to be Voyageurs branding on these blogs, similarly to what Gian-Luca and anyone else who writes a blog here currently sees? In short, are we going to be providing an implied endorsement as well as hosting services to these articles?

I don't understand why we're doing this at all. What do we possibly gain from compromising ourselves like this? We're a national supporters' group, not a content provider. We sing and we cheer, we ramble about the national team, and we get into pointless sniping matches about how much each others' clubs suck.

Having a bunch of bloggers who are already active on their own sites post under one domain name doesn't help us. Quite the contrary! It injures the perceived neutrality of the Voyageurs when we run opinion pieces on our website, under our domain, surrounded by our branding, and thus with our implied endorsement. It distracts from the mission of this group, which is as a gathering place for Canadian soccer supporters, not to be a media company. It associates our name with subjects that have nothing to do with what the Voyageurs have banded together for. It opens us up to potential liability, both legal and moral, as the host of content that could be libelous and is almost certain to be controversial. It risks injuring hard-built relationships when an employee of a company or a director of a soccer association can go to our website and see an editorial, under our name and surrounded by advertising, which attacks his organization. It creates one part of the Voyageurs' website that will have one mission (to chase readers) while the forum will have its own mission (to support Canada). To have such an immense change in the scope of our little group thrown at us unilaterally is, frankly, poorly-conceived.

For profit? Seriously? Blogging about Canadian soccer? It's about people's effort not going to waste and helping each other out. That is it.

Oh, believe me, I know there's not much money in that. But there's some. I get paid to do it, Duane Rollins's site is part of the Score's blogging network, and It's Called Football has previously received sponsorship. Are you saying "none of these bloggers will be getting any money for their writing" or "it doesn't matter whether they get any money"? I've got nothing against people turning a profit on their writing, but a fair bit against a soccer supporters' group helping a selected cadre of bloggers do so.

Keep panties on, people.

Back up a step - start a new thread about the proposed changes, and then come to some sort of resolution. You could even do a survey to gauge popular opinion or have vote amongst actual active members.

It's Thursday night. We've just been told that the changes will be implemented on the weekend, and the involved bloggers have been advertising "going live" on Monday. This isn't "proposed". Excuse me if I seem like I'm in a rush to deal with this.

Bob I'm not sure what your blog is but I'd like to read it.

Thank you! But I'm not going to mention what my website is. I don't want anyone to think that I'm picking this fight out of envy or because I want people to read only my more-precious-than-gold website.

I would like to see the whole site be a one stop directory for all of soccer in the country. It is the place to go, and the Voyageurs name will be all over it.

Altering the mission of the Voyageurs is not one man's decision to make, no matter how much he has contributed to our success already. I happen to think that goal is both impossible and unwise. Looking at this thread, I see people who agree with me and people who don't. But I think we can all agree that it's a discussion we should have had before the decision was made.

[Sam]

I think it is important to make sure the blogs are titled as just that - opinions that do not reflect the opinions of the Voyageurs. And yes we probably shouldn't have anti-CSA blogs on our front page, but having professional opinions on our front page can't hurt the appeal of the Voyageurs IMO.

[nolando]

It's Thursday night. We've just been told that the changes will be implemented on the weekend, and the involved bloggers have been advertising "going live" on Monday. This isn't "proposed". Excuse me if I seem like I'm in a rush to deal with this.

LB, I'm with you. If you found yourself panty-less, then slip them back on, sir, and know that I support your opinion.

[squizz1402635577]

As one of the involved bloggers, I could spell out all of my reasons for being involved in this project... but I fear it would be perceived by some as a disingenuous public toeing of the party line.

So instead I'll say that if anyone wants to hear my reasoning and motivation, feel free to email me. canadiansoccerguys (at) gmail (dot) com

[Cheeta]

Ah...see. Told you. Early days yet but I'm sure I'll be glad that I put my helmet on.

" I'd like to re-ask this question, since it hasn't been answered yet: is there going to be Voyageurs branding on these blogs, similarly to what Gian-Luca and anyone else who writes a blog here currently sees? In short, are we going to be providing an implied endorsement as well as hosting services to these articles?"

Outside of an inferred "casual association" which will come from a shared front page I'd have to say no. And I'm not only comfortable with that I'd offer up the opinion that there shouldn't be one either. Voyageur based articles/blogs will remain V based contributions and published as such. The point of sharing the net-geography is about channeling traffic, niche traffic in all likelihood, towards the Vs site/forum or in the case of the various bloggers towards their blogs. It's a two way street and should be.

"I don't understand why we're doing this at all. What do we possibly gain from compromising ourselves like this? We're a national supporters' group, not a content provider.

Ah, but I disagree. We are a content provider. We need to be a content provider. And by content I mean presenting topics of interest or discussion which keep Canadian football active in the minds of the supporters and casual fans alike. That's important in promoting the game and our NTs. Getting it out to the population that there is always something interesting going on in Canadian footie, if not at home then abroad.

And not just with the forums although that is an important part of things. Forums can only do so much. Many people just "don't do" internet forums. We have an alternative media source, a dedicated crew which regularly blogs about the events of the day. Why not utilize it for everyone's benefit?

Just my opinon. Not my gig and I've little to no inside info on the scheme. But on the surface of it sharing a bit of space seems to have more advantages than pitfalls. At least to my mind and so long as a clear firewall between the two bodies has been established.

[Lord Bob]

"I'd like to re-ask this question, since it hasn't been answered yet: is there going to be Voyageurs branding on these blogs, similarly to what Gian-Luca and anyone else who writes a blog here currently sees? In short, are we going to be providing an implied endorsement as well as hosting services to these articles?"

Outside of an inferred "casual association" which will come from a shared front page I'd have to say no.

Glad to hear it, but I'm still concerned.

I've done a fair bit of writing for sites in a "network" that share assets like the front page, general layout, and so on. You'll be unsurprised to hear that these sites wind up being associated with each other even if the people involved in each site and the content that comes out of the sites are completely different: just earlier this week I read an article in an English soccer weekly that smeared a soccer network I've done some work for as insipid en bloc. There are twenty-three individual soccer websites in that network, each written by different people on different subjects in a different style. No matter. It's all one network, and the writer's opinion on a small part of it turned into his opinion on the whole network.

This is human nature, and it's particularly dangerous when you're associating something as allegedly neutral and unifying as a supporters' group with something as unavoidably polarizing and divisive as sports editorial writing.

"I don't understand why we're doing this at all. What do we possibly gain from compromising ourselves like this? We're a national supporters' group, not a content provider.

Ah, but I disagree. We are a content provider. We need to be a content provider. And by content I mean presenting topics of interest or discussion which keep Canadian football active in the minds of the supporters and casual fans alike. That's important in promoting the game and our NTs. Getting it out to the population that there is always something interesting going on in Canadian footie, if not at home then abroad.

Why? I have absolutely no idea how that falls under the mandate of a supporters' group. We support the team, we don't write copy! If you go to a Canadian soccer blog (except for very few dishonourable exceptions), you will see the blogs linking to each other, referring to each others' posts, expanding on each others' ideas, telling each other why they're idiots. It's a community in a very real sense. How many readers need to hand-held and told "it's okay, there's a large number of blogs at this one website". What are we, BigSoccer? I can obviously see why this would be good for the writers involved, and I don't begrudge Duane or the Ben who isn't me or the other Ben who isn't me or Squizz or Andrew or any of them some success. Frankly, they deserve it. I just can't conceive how it would be worth the costs for us, the supporters.

I don't think such a site is needed at all. If I did think such a site was needed, I don't think the Voyageurs would be involved. If Jamie wanted to start a Canadian soccer super-blog with the lineup listed above, have the super-blog link to the Voyageurs, have the Voyageurs website link to the super-blog and the other Canadian soccer blogs out there, I'd have no complaints. Hell, I'd even promote it where I could. Strengthening the Canadian soccer community is a fine idea. However, the idea of integrating the Voyageurs with this aforementioned superblog is terrible. We sacrifice independence and the perception of neutrality (see my previous post).

And the clearest, most glaring problem remains: that this was sprung on us with no consultation whatsoever and next-to-no warning. Even now, all we know about this scheme comes from the first post and a few facts wrangled out by weasels like me.

[ray]

I have no problem with some front page content coming from the canadiansoccernews group of bloggers. However, I don't think the Voyageurs site itself should be part of that domain. It makes this supporters group look like part of the soccer blog media which we are not. The Voyageurs are not about soccer news so much are reacting to soccer news. So by all means, let the front page resemble something like Vic's mockup but we should not be part of that domain.

It is great what the Voyageurs admins have done for the site and it is greatly appreciated. However, this change should really have been the subject of consultation.

[El Hombre]

Full disclosure: I post the following as a Voyageur. Even though I'm a moderator, I was not involved in any of this setup.

Lord Bob, I appreciate your concerns and share some of them myself. My take on it is this: the day to day experience on this forum will not change. The only thing that I foresee happening is that we will have more traffic and more discussion due to people who regularly frequent the attached bloggers coming to the site and seeing content that is put up under the Voyageurs banner. My understanding is that yes, there will be a Voyageurs banner, just like there is a 24th Minute banner, an Onward Soccer banner etc. So any content that we put up will be clearly defined as ours.

What this means is more work for me and the other mods as we will have to work harder to police any new users who join the site based on visiting one of the blogs. This means that, for example, someone new to the Whitecaps sees the BC centric blog and then eventually stumbles upon us. It will be my job to make sure that he understands that the Voyageurs are Canadian soccer supporters and that baiting of TFC fans or Impact fans will not be allowed. We already have enough of that here as it is, so we do not need more. Our job (as in the Voyageur moderators) is to keep the existing Voyageur experience as intact as possible. Truth be told, I'm not looking forward to this as it will become increasingly difficult with increased traffic. However, on the flip side, increased traffic, if moderated properly, can only be a good thing. If we can make the Voyageurs forum the place to talk Canadian soccer, and stop splitting membership with Big Soccer, that's great in my mind.

However, as I said, I do share some of your reservations. I read some of the bloggers regularly anyways and for the most part they seem inline with what we do. I do hope that there is some mutual respect between the bloggers and what we do. It wasn't that long ago that one of the bloggers in this venture intimated that the Voyageurs were becoming increasingly obsolete or some such thing. I immediately stopped reading his blog and am a little miffed that we'll be sharing internet space with him. Hopefully the forthcoming relationship will be reciprocal and things will run smoothly.

One thing I do hope for is that the list of bloggers is not restrictive. I'd like to see your blog added and Jonovision's blog added and maybe even Trident's (even though he doesn't agree with how the Voyageurs conduct their business). If this isn't open for other bloggers to join, I'll be very disappointed.

Jeffrey: If you are interested in contributing blog entries to this venture or something similar, why not do it under the Voyageurs banner? It would be great to have a weekly blog entry (or more frequent if you wish) from the perspective of a Canadian in Europe. Go ahead and do it. From what I understand, we'll have our little corner in this thing so it would be great to have regular content. Don't wait for someone to ask you to participate, get stuck in and do it. This came up when River City was complaining this past summer about Vees wanting to be more involved but then waiting around to be asked to be involved. That's the wrong approach. No one asked me to put together a weekly newsletter. It's an idea I had so I went ahead and did it. Whether it's useful or not or has any impact, I have no idea but I still spend time every Tuesday putting it together. No one has asked me to and if people find it annoying, I'll stop. But you won't know any of that until you start doing it.

I actually don't mean to single you out here Jeffrey, this is more a post for all the Vees out there. If you want to get involved, then do it. PM me and I'll help as much as possible.

Conclusion: I do not see these changes affecting the Voyageurs too much except for increased traffic. However, if in a couple weeks, people are still unhappy we should have a serious discussion about it and if enough people think this is detrimental to what the Voyageurs stand for, we should pursue solutions to change the setup or opt out completely. I've been around here for long enough to know that if enough active Vees are still really unhappy, we can work to change the situation. Nothing can be done that cannot be undone. But first, I believe that we should give it a try to see how things fall out.

[e_2]

I want thevoyageurs.com to be the forum. If it can happen it will.

Why is thevoyageurs.com not the domain?

[gator]

^ Fair post El Hombre! I certainly appreciate all that you and the other moderators do on here! My main concern is the Voyageur identity being protected, if you feel it will be, that's good enough for me, as you mention, things can be changed if necessary! I like the idea of blogs being easily accessed, I enjoy reading them even if I don't always agree! The other point about increased traffic is a good thing, sometimes it can get quiet on here, the more the merrier, we've had some very good new members join in the last little bit! It's nice to have threads to respond to even in slow news time, not everyday do you have a defection like yesterday that gets everyone wound up and posting their opinion! I guess what I'm saying is I'm willing to give the new format a chance!

[ted]

While I agree with the general thrust of Lord Bob's concerns it is a little disingenuous to be claiming that this has been sprung on you suddenly. The is was discussed in a thread started by LB back in May. So LB, you did know about this a long time ago even if you forgot. Now, most V's probably never even looked at that thread so it is surprise to them which leads me to:

I am disgusted that such a major change to this site is proceeding without so much as a "hey whatta you guys think?" in the form of a poll. Maybe the new stuff is a great idea but without the consensus of the people who make up the Voyageurs it looks like little more than an attempt to privatize the Voyageurs for the benefit of some bloggers.

[RJB]

Decisions like this need to happen slower, and with input from the general membership. Some really valid questions are being asked, and we need to have time to provide answers. There are a few people who clearly put in the bulk of the work for this website, but I believe that it still belongs to all Voyageurs. Informing the membership early and often will provide a chance for any concerns to be raised, but it will also keep those hard workers who run this site from being lightning rods.

That said, I think that what is happening looks quite promising. I like the idea of bringing all those people together at the Voyageurs site. Let's hope it works out they it has been suggested.

[Admin]

I will post more in a bit... but I just want to make this clear.

The Voyageurs are not LOSING a website.

There will be a dedicated Voyageurs website at cansoc.org / canadian-soccer.com / eventually thevoyageurs.com

It is the forum, which will remain The Voyageurs forum, but in an attempt to gain more exposure be hosted at canadiansoccernews.com along with the blogs with connections back to the Voyageurs website. The Voyageurs will be one of those blogs on the site from which our regular posters can participate.