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Ukraine - Canada Post-Match Thread [R]


loyola

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I read this site a lot but don't usually post anything. The result against Ukraine really got me going though. As a Ukrainian-Canadian, or an ethnic Canadian of any background, I'm one of the rare ones that supports Canada over my ethnicity and was really thrilled about the result. Like everyone else I wish Canada held on but I'll take that score against that opponent anytime.

Reading these posts about DeRo got me thinking and I wanted to see what you guys thought of an idea I had. I'm not as knowledgeable about the MNT as most of you, even though I watch every game, so I'm almost expecting this suggestion to be knocked down for some reason. But I'll give it a shot:

How about using DeRo up front as a forward, maybe just behind another striker? Most of you seem to agree that he slows down the game at midfield. It would take him away from that game-controlling midfielder role but keep him in a spot where he (and we) can use his talent which is scoring goals. We have some time to experiment with something like that before the Gold Cup and I don't see how it could hurt. If it works, it could even extend his international career since he would be running less than a midfielder. It would be a waste to not use him and we don't have the depth to refuse the services of a guy like that. But I agree, the team has looked decent when he hasn't been there. Also, I always hated the lone-forward setup. On a team like Canada, that forward never gets the support he needs. This might help.

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One thing I'll give to this new look MNT is they have movement and the technical ability is really there. As nation we should never drop below this level of play, which should at least be the Bench mark for how our national teams at all levels should compete . I very proud of what done By our mens National today they should alot heart and cunning.

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I read this site a lot but don't usually post anything. The result against Ukraine really got me going though. As a Ukrainian-Canadian, or an ethnic Canadian of any background, I'm one of the rare ones that supports Canada over my ethnicity and was really thrilled about the result. Like everyone else I wish Canada held on but I'll take that score against that opponent anytime.

Reading these posts about DeRo got me thinking and I wanted to see what you guys thought of an idea I had. I'm not as knowledgeable about the MNT as most of you, even though I watch every game, so I'm almost expecting this suggestion to be knocked down for some reason. But I'll give it a shot:

How about using DeRo up front as a forward, maybe just behind another striker? Most of you seem to agree that he slows down the game at midfield. It would take him away from that game-controlling midfielder role but keep him in a spot where he (and we) can use his talent which is scoring goals. We have some time to experiment with something like that before the Gold Cup and I don't see how it could hurt. If it works, it could even extend his international career since he would be running less than a midfielder. It would be a waste to not use him and we don't have the depth to refuse the services of a guy like that. But I agree, the team has looked decent when he hasn't been there. Also, I always hated the lone-forward setup. On a team like Canada, that forward never gets the support he needs. This might help.

I think that's a decent idea. De Ro has proven he can smash free kicks form multiple areas of the field and that's something that, unlike his pace, will continue to stay with him as he gets older so just having on the field for that almost seems worth it. De Ro has also shown that he creates more when he plays just ahead of the mid and behind the forwards, taking space to run onto defenders to create his chances. Unfortunately for this scenerio to play out our formation would have to change from what SH has showed almost every game as coach so I think it's unlikely. If it were to happen it would ideal to try it at the GC against a minnow like Guadalupe.

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I think Dero as a forward would be the ideal spot for him. Unfortunately for him we are'nt using a formation where he would fit into that role. If we do employ a more traditional 4-4-2 we should try and use him there, I think it would be his best position.

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Reading these posts about DeRo got me thinking and I wanted to see what you guys thought of an idea I had. I'm not as knowledgeable about the MNT as most of you, even though I watch every game, so I'm almost expecting this suggestion to be knocked down for some reason. But I'll give it a shot:

How about using DeRo up front as a forward, maybe just behind another striker? Most of you seem to agree that he slows down the game at midfield. It would take him away from that game-controlling midfielder role but keep him in a spot where he (and we) can use his talent which is scoring goals. We have some time to experiment with something like that before the Gold Cup and I don't see how it could hurt. If it works, it could even extend his international career since he would be running less than a midfielder. It would be a waste to not use him and we don't have the depth to refuse the services of a guy like that. But I agree, the team has looked decent when he hasn't been there. Also, I always hated the lone-forward setup. On a team like Canada, that forward never gets the support he needs. This might help.

Your opinion is as valid as anyone else's here :)

Yes I think Dero up top with Ali Gerba (one fast pressure type, one power type) would be a good mix. The truth is with the way the younger generation are coming on I think we might see a real dogfight for positions all over the pitch not just at forward. While they will be old (34 for Dero & 30 for AliG) in 2 years when we go into qualifying they could still be very handy.

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i really think it is time that hart just went with an all out youth movement....i have played as much professional football as diesel in the last two years...i love the guy to death but this is all about building for the future now.

i agree about dero....i still think he has a place, but probably as a substitute.

while a player may not be cap tied to a country from a friendly, i think emotionally it would be more difficult for a player to move having made an appearance for the senior national team already...for that reason i would have tried harder to get some of the young guys a run onto the pitch.

anyone see the footy show where hart said that he is going to head to spain to talk to JDG2 about coming back into the fold?...and then talk to FIFA about how it could be done...i thought he was a lost cause, but maybe not......maybe that would spark his brother back to life...i really think JDG needs to head back to europe...he has lost his heart....a rejuvenated JDG with JDG2 at his side would sure look good with the new breed that is taking us forward.

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Your opinion is as valid as anyone else's here :)

Yes I think Dero up top with Ali Gerba (one fast pressure type, one power type) would be a good mix. The truth is with the way the younger generation are coming on I think we might see a real dogfight for positions all over the pitch not just at forward. While they will be old (34 for Dero & 30 for AliG) in 2 years when we go into qualifying they could still be very handy.

MNT needs to focus on getting Jonathan and Hoilett in the program Asap. The Midfield is our best aspect, Defence needs more work , mobility flexibility perhaps

Attokara can give us that aspect. Stalteri has brought good service to MNT but he is a liabilty and he should be replaced with somebody quicker and hungrier.

Ontopic

Dero is the type of striker we need but I dont think he is suited for International play, His tactical awareness is not at the level to compete anymore Imo. But that being said everybody should be given a Chance to make the Squad.

We as nation got a good result against The Ukraine, from this We must build from Csa right down to the Grassroots, No more favouritism or qualification based on orgin for Adminstrators. This a Multicultural society and The Csa and provincial Organizations need to reflect that. Meaning No matter if the coach is from Sri lanka or Bolivia he should be able to represent Canadian soccer as MNT coach OR Technical Director at Provincial or National level. There's Coaches in this country that are Overwhelmingly qualified and Truely know how to teach our childrens programs and even to certain Exent Senior programs how to Excel in this game. And Due to that fact that they may not fit the mold or Speak with a Third world Accent they are not given fair Opportunity to do what Most people in the community Know these men are capable of, This must stop!. If We are to truely move forward in The business of football.

JOGA

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What a great game to get your first cap Finchster!

I missed the game as I was on the road but had fun reading 34 pages of the inmatch thread. Great result and I had a feeling we would do well without dero and de Guzman.

What I like best about this group is for the first time ever no one is guaranteed a spot on this team. It's refreshing to see players have to fight for a spot.

It would be great to see JDG2 in a Canada uniform but he'll have to earn his place in the team like everyone.

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Nobody speaks about it or even notices it. Our national anthem was played today -- and maybe 2 or even 3 players even mouthed the words. Most stood there like mercenaries (forgetting the anthem that they grew up with). CRAP! Maybe we should be a little bit more CANADIAN and remember the words that they, - as kids were raised - or maybe not - raised with. What a concept. I'm not asking for a New Zealand Huka performance, but please, can we remember OUR song. The Ukraine boys had it together. We looked like we were VISITING the Queen. SAD. Let's put some spunk into our national anthem. I think it's all about passion; passion for your your country. And it all starts with OUR song.

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Nobody speaks about it or even notices it. Our national anthem was played today -- and maybe 2 or even 3 players even mouthed the words. Most stood there like mercenaries (forgetting the anthem that they grew up with). CRAP! Maybe we should be a little bit more CANADIAN and remember the words that they, - as kids were raised - or maybe not - raised with. What a concept. I'm not asking for a New Zealand Huka performance, but please, can we remember OUR song. The Ukraine boys had it together. We looked like we were VISITING the Queen. SAD. Let's put some spunk into our national anthem. I think it's all about passion; passion for your your country. And it all starts with OUR song.

Eh, even during the olympics few hockey players sang the anthem...non-hockey players did, but hockey players who sang it were few and far between.

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great result for canada

a 2-2 tie with a tough euro opponent

the nats are on abit of a swing lets just hope it continues

Excellent result. Yes, they blew a two-goal lead... but it's a two-goal lead against a strong European side, in Europe. And they still held on for the draw. All things considered, that's pretty damned good.

The FIFA points picked up today could end up being massive when the seeding for World Cup qualifying comes around, too...

2 goals away to ukraine,should mean a good number of points for the rankings.canada needs to schedule more friendlys now to improve their fifa ranking.last thing we need is another group of death seeding.

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2 goals away to ukraine,should mean a good number of points for the rankings.canada needs to schedule more friendlys now to improve their fifa ranking.last thing we need is another group of death seeding.

Goals, from my understanding, don't count any more. It's win, loss, tie and based on your opponents rank...

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CRAP! Maybe we should be a little bit more CANADIAN and remember the words that they, - as kids were raised - or maybe not - raised with. What a concept. I'm not asking for a New Zealand Huka performance.

Umm I think you mean Haka.

Anyway, what a game today I think that was a brilliant performance. There were obvious areas where we need to improve, but as far as playing away to a top side, wow I think we did great. Even if we remove the Jackson goal and lost 2-1, I would have been very happy with how we approached the game. We didn't sit back we didn't look lost, we had intent and wanted to play football, wanted to win and challenged a very good team. Yeah we took on some pressure but what other team in the world wouldn't against Ukraine on their home field?

As a few have pointed out look at the depth we are building, man it looks promising. More than just the competition for spots, with our full first choice of players our bench is looking really deep.

I know a lot of people have been knocking on De Guz (me included) and maybe he isn’t first choice starter anymore, but I think he still has a valuable roll on this team. Case in point I believe he is exactly the guy we could have used to bring on late in this game to settle things and instil a sense of calm with the guys to finish off the game. He’s probable still a starter in most cases but you never know, I don’t think anything can be taken away from what the team has achieved in the last two games.

So the question is with such a good performance in this game, looking at who wasn’t there today where do/would they have fit in? (Let’s not let the player depth run too deep, I’m talking guys who have started and are likely to start)

Johnson, Peters, De Guzman, Klukowski, Dunfield, Gerba, Friend, Hume

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I know a lot of people have been knocking on De Guz (me included) and maybe he isn’t first choice starter anymore, but I think he still has a valuable roll on this team. Case in point I believe he is exactly the guy we could have used to bring on late in this game to settle things and instil a sense of calm with the guys to finish off the game. He’s probable still a starter in most cases but you never know, I don’t think anything can be taken away from what the team has achieved in the last two games.

You're probably right, a silky holder might have been able to break up the passes the Ukrainians were starting to thread through. OTOH maybe what the CDN midfield needed was the bite of Dunfield's cleats! Either way, I can see that the game came apart for about 30 minutes with people tracking the ball instead of marking their man, leaving players open far too often.

As I said earlier, this is a chance for our team to learn what can be done when the inevitable mid-game adjustment is made by the opposing team. Hart needs to learn just as the players do, but I'm quietly hopeful.

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I think it is to early to knock Dero...I mean judge him when we have all of our best on the pitch...you can argue that his last match with Canada was not with the besy players around him...

I am a little pissed that at this time of night I am getting only the AP or whatever report of the game....TSN, CBC, Sportsnet and the Globe all have the same three line report of the game...I am getting more info on this thread....

Yes after 10 years of him playing like s-hit for Canada and 10 years of showing he can not play at international level, it is too early to knock DeRo. The only role he could possibly play for the MNT now is as a striker to come in with 10 or 15 minutes remaining. However, we have several alternatives who are just as good while if I were his coach I wouldn't want his attutide in the locker room for the little he could contribute to the team.

I would still keep DeGuz but would play him as a destroying defensive mid and he would no longer be a guaranteed starter. Obviously Hutch is more suited to an offensive role. I don't agree with those that say his improved play is due to him playing in Holland, he only just moved there. I think playing there will help him but we will start seeing that in a few more months. I think his improved play was the role he was given and the fact he had surrounding players who he could work with.

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I enjoyed seeing a spirited performance from our younger players but I'm not going to go overboard here. Ukraine took our team lightly and showed in the second half that our quality has a long way to go. I don't see the point of trashing players who weren't there but that seems to be a tradition on the Nat. team thread. Using the logic espoused here, I would suppose that Argentina would be well advised to dump Messi as he once again failed to lead Argentina with goals against Japan in their 1-0 loss.

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Atiba was 'Player of the Day' in the following FIFA article:

http://www.fifa.com/worldfootball/news/newsid=1315382.html#argentina+fall+japan+canada+hold+ukraine

Player of the day

Atiba Hutchinson (Canada)

On a day when Cavani and Suarez stood out for Uruguay, the Canadian attacker took the honours by marking his 50th appearance for his country with a goal on their visit to Ukraine. The PSV Eindhoven man made his international debut in 2003 and is the 20th Canada player to reach a half century of caps.

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Some interesting Dwyne facts:

- he's played in 10 matches since the beginning of 2008, and only 2 of Canada's last 16 overall

- 3 of those are wins

- the three wins are against St Vincent (2x) and Martinique

- the team is 5 wins (Honduras, Cyprus, Jamaica, El Salvador, Guatemala), 5 draws, 6 losses in the matches without him over the same period.

Have a look at the matches yourselves, and draw your own conclusions.

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Agreed Villus. We have too many youngsters who can play the wings right now ahead of DeRo. yep he has class ability, but frankly, I'll take Hume, Jackson, Simpson, Issey etc over De Ro in a first XI on the wing on our 4-5-1/4-3-3.

still need to sort out our CF though....it's gotta be someone very mobile, I think, because we don't have the ability to deliver the right ball to Friend, nor provide the support once he's had his first touch or before he's had it.

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