Martin Nash calls Roberto Brown a "baby"

[Swangardian]

...Let's be honest Impact fans. If some Central American player reacted like Brown against our National Team, only to go off on a stretcher and come back as if he had been healed by God himself, we'd all be pissing on him...

Nash on Roberto Brown: "He's a baby"

By Marc Weber THE PROVINCE Sun, Oct 11 2009

Martin Nash was stoic. He didn't sulk. But he did call Roberto Brown a baby.

Nash, the Vancouver Whitecaps captain, was dealt a straight red card in the Caps' 3-2 loss to the Montreal Impact in the first leg of the USL-1 final Saturday at Swangard Stadium.

He'll miss the return leg Saturday in Montreal.

Nash faced the media after, accepted his fate, put on a brave face and expressed his belief in his teammates. And then took a shot at his victim.

"There's nothing I can do about it," he said. "I'm disappointed but I missed the Toronto game here [June 2] and the guys stepped up and won that, so I have all the confidence in the world, especially the way they played in the second half here.

"He fouled me seconds before. I went in for a tackle. I don't think there was much in it. He cried like a baby and the referee [Carol Anne Chenard] bought it. She bought into his squealing."

The replay showed Nash coming in late. It seemed like a payback tackle, though not overly harsh. Brown's could have been a foul, too.

Brown was taken off on a stretcher, only to come back in a minute later and almost score twice. The crowd gave Nash a light round of applause as he headed down the tunnel. Brown was booed mercilessly.

Nash needed to play 66 minutes Saturday to reach 20,000 for his Whitecaps career. Saturday's rematch was to be his 250th game for the club. He'll reach neither milestone this season.

But all that matters now is how Vancouver gets on without its leader and best passer. They'll be buoyed by their 4-1-1 mark without him in the lineup this season.

"We were in a similar situation before Toronto and guys stepped up then," said head coach Teitur Thordarson. "So I just expect the younger guys to fill in that place again."

He might be more concerned with how ineffective Nash and Kenold Versailles were through 50 minutes against Montreal’s midfield, a group that includes three former Whitecaps in David Testo, Joey Gjertsen and Tony Donatelli.

Thordarson’s options to replace Nash include Tanzanian youngster Nizar Khalfan, who was pulled from the wing at halftime Saturday, and Chris Pozniak, normally a centre back. Gordon Chin (knee) isn't expected to be fit and Justin Moose has been used on the wing since coming back from injury.

Winger Ansu Toure (thigh) is expected back for the second leg, while defender Lyle Martin left Saturday’s game limping.

By Marc Weber, Sports Reporter#8232;

mweber@theprovince.com

[Swangardian]

By the way, tonight's ref, Carol Anne Chenard is from QUEBEC.

Figures. A Quebecer AND a woman;)

[mtl-supporter23]

^someone forgot to turn their filter on...

Anyways regardless of Browns antics or not, there is no denying that Nash's tackle was a reckless one and even had he not succeeded in clipping Brown a card would of been shown. For a veteran player and captain to retaliate so recklessly, Nash has only himself to blame for his sending off. He should stick to playing on the field rather than complaining at the end of the match, whats done is done.

[Trident]

quote:Originally posted by Swangardian

By the way, tonight's ref, Carol Anne Chenard is from QUEBEC.

Figures. A Quebecer AND a woman;)

at frappe, we booed her when we saw it was her, and whenever she was on the screen.

Sure brown embellished, but if your captain is dumb enough to give him that opportunity, then stupidity will be punished.

What captain calls more attention to it after.

Babies are the ones that cant let something dumb they did go, and blame others.

[Swangardian]

I'm not defending Nash...

I'm just saying that there is a double standard. This board always has people complaining about players who go down and scream in agony as if they are shot, and then go off on stretchers, and come back healthy about 2 minutes later when Canada plays in CONCACAG matches.

What about when guys on our club teams pull that? Isn't that part of the #1 complaint we have about CONCACAF?

[Guest Jeffery S.]

Brown was likely hurting from the tackle, and he likely recovered. I think it was legit enough. The problem with all you couch potatoes is that you think getting hit does not hurt, and that pain cannot go away.

Bash your head by accident on a kitchen cupboard some day and you'll see what the pain curve looks like. First 15 seconds excruciating on the floor. After 50 seconds able to finish poaching your eggs.

I am just saying this because I don't know the situation with Brown, as none of us do. I bet he has a mark on his foot as he was nailed. Nash deserves an orange. He also retaliated for a non-call. And right in front of the ref in midfield where it was totally unnecessary.

Arguing that a guy getting tackled recklessly and later recovering is somehow bogus just shows ignorance about playing a sport though.

Finally: Whitecaps played way better without him and often do, because his supposed dominance in the midfield frequently distorts the rest of the team: he is all over the place, lhis freedom means he travels into other's zones, he neither truly is attacking mid nor dedicated to defending mid, and the others just assume bit roles both forward and back.

Teiter accepts this, but often with Nash playing well the team actually is weakened as a whole.

[Montreal_FC_fan]

Late tackle, studs up not even close to the ball right on the ankle. Any ref in the world would of gived him a red card. If it was Nash who received the tackle he would of been "crying like a baby".

I totally agree with Jeffrey S. on what he said.

By the way, I think SRC said that the ref is actually from Ottawa.

[Grizzly]

Whether he embellished or not is hard to say. However, even if he did what bothers me is when players embellish a tackle that is not worthy of a red card. In this case that tackle was absolutely worthy of a red card, studs up and not even near the ball. It is possible that had he not gone down like that real or not the foul would not have gotten the red card it deserved but the key is that it deserved a red card. Also they showed Brown a couple of times later in the game when there was no reason to fake and he was noticeably limping.

I am not really sure why you are complaining anyway since at even strength Montreal was completely dominating Vancouver. It wasn't until the sending off that Vancouver started to play well and gain confidence with the goals while at the same time making the Montreal players who were previously playing with confidence insecure. From the run of play before the sending off, it could have easily been 3-0 Montreal, with the sending off Vancouver almost managed a tie. I like Nash at USL (not international) level because he has some great skills and his flaws are not as exposed as at a higher level. I don't agree with Jeffrey's opinions about why the Caps played stronger but nevertheless they were inspired in the absence of their captain.

[Trillium]

quote:Originally posted by Swangardian

By the way, tonight's ref, Carol Anne Chenard is from QUEBEC.

Figures. A Quebecer AND a woman;)

No Caroline is from Ottawa, played her soccer in Ottawa and became a ref in Ottawa .. then went to University in Quebec.

[Mr.Impact]

quote:Originally posted by Swangardian

By the way, tonight's ref, Carol Anne Chenard is from QUEBEC.

Figures. A Quebecer AND a woman;)

As opposed to Inbred and from the British Isles? I guess that more common in BC. Stop complaining you wanker.

[MTL_4_LIFE]

He got what he deserved.

Nash the real BABY

[Swangardian]

quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S.

Brown was likely hurting from the tackle, and he likely recovered. I think it was legit enough. The problem with all you couch potatoes is that you think getting hit does not hurt, and that pain cannot go away.

Bash your head by accident on a kitchen cupboard some day and you'll see what the pain curve looks like. First 15 seconds excruciating on the floor. After 50 seconds able to finish poaching your eggs.

I am just saying this because I don't know the situation with Brown, as none of us do. I bet he has a mark on his foot as he was nailed. Nash deserves an orange. He also retaliated for a non-call. And right in front of the ref in midfield where it was totally unnecessary.

Arguing that a guy getting tackled recklessly and later recovering is somehow bogus just shows ignorance about playing a sport though.

Ok so when Canada plays Costa Rica and Honduras and players from that region take their swan dives, we can criticize them. But when a Panamanian on a Canadian Club Team does the same thing, it was legit, and anyone who is disgusted by the acting has neve been injured nor played the sport? Are Craig Forrest and Jason DeVos couch potatoes with ignorance about the sport? Because they certainly criticize the practice. Then again, I guess they don't have as many caps as you do.

Remember when the MNT lost 2-1 in Montreal, and the Honduran bastard took the dive in injury time?

We've all had those injuries. Getting cleated is not fun. But he was on the ground for more than a minute and actually screaming and looked like he was dying before being stretchered off. Classic trick from his region! Have you not watched CONCACAF games before?

I understand, we see it at all levels...fine...take a dive and go down to show you were tripped. THEN GET UP and continue playing! There is no need for you to be carried off on a stretcher and have some "magical" water squirted on your injury. But then again, I guess some players have magic healing powers after looking like their foot has fallen off, right Mr. Athlete?

Besides, Brown has done this before. Just look at this photo: http://www.westislandgazette.com/meagher/8748#

Appaently he was dead on the field!

Sadly my friend, it is supporters like you who make excuses for this awful practice who keep it going and accepted.

[Guest Jeffery S.]

quote:Originally posted by Mr.Impact

As opposed to Inbred and from the British Isles? I guess that more common in BC. Stop complaining you wanker.

The general working principle is that you should not have a ref from either team's jurisdiction--the provincial association in this case--doing a game. So this sort of debate cannot happen. I am not sure they are always concerned about that in USL or even MLS, and maybe travelling costs are a factor. But I think it is a good way to go, and if she was from Ontario, then perfect, from Ontario.

She still reffed like she was from Québec, no one can say Caps were favoured and Impact can't say they were not.

[tmcmurph]

quote:Originally posted by MTL_4_LIFE

He got what he deserved.

Nash the real BABY

So next time a Whitecap player gets tripped and the ref doesn't call it don't do a stupid retaliation but grab your ankle and roll around. Seriously, if after being tripped Nash had grabbed his leg and stayed down she would have then called it.

I've seen her officiate other Caps games this year and all I can say is she is not a division 2 level ref. She doesn't control the games and is erratic and inconsistent in her calls constantly. Back to the recreational leagues for her. Sorry but she just doesn't cut it at this level.

I think Teitur summed up my feelings about the straight red in his post game interview saying it was "totally bull****". He and I are both biased about it and I can agree it was a dumb retaliation but I haven't seen the replay yet. It looked like one foot, not 2, and toe not studs. I could be wrong (I'm used to being wrong, I'm married )

Oh well we are only down 1 goal and we have 90 minutes to erase that deficit. Onward! It will only make the Caps inevitable victory that much sweeter! [8D]

[Cheeta]

Chenard's funny. I won't be as hard on her as some of you lads. Better than some ref's and certainly the choice of the more physical teams or people who are fans of allowing the match to flow although she seems to make some questionable calls now and again. But she does tend to let the boys play, for the most part, and tries to reel things in a little too late after they get out of hand. That's my opinion anyway.

She got the Nash booking spot on I'd say. Dude? Right in front of the ref? Come on...

And yes Brown is a baby. Not sure holding up that tackle as an example of that makes a very good case though. He got hurt, he maybe sold it a little but I'm sure he had a pretty honest "owie" to bargain with during the sale.

[tmcmurph]

quote:Originally posted by Cheeta

1 >Chenard's funny.

2 >But she does tend to let the boys play, for the most part, and tries to reel things in a little too late after they get out of hand. That's my opinion anyway.

3 >She got the Nash booking spot on I'd say. Dude? Right in front of the ref? Come on...

4 >And yes Brown is a baby. Not sure holding up that tackle as an example of that makes a very good case though. He got hurt, he maybe sold it a little but I'm sure he had a pretty honest "owie" to bargain with during the sale.

1) That is one term for it. I have another!

2) She doesn't control a match at all is another way of putting it.

3) And Nash got tripped right in front of her the same 5 feet away. No call. The difference was Nash didn't sell it. He got up and played.

4) I know getting kicked in the ankle hurts, I've had it happen to me, and yes Brown was hurt but he sold it like he was having a near death experience.

So yellow yes, red no and I'll leave it at that. We agree on more than we disagree so on to the next game.

[SteveBeau]

quote:Originally posted by tmcmurph

1) That is one term for it. I have another!

2) She doesn't control a match at all is another way of putting it.

3) And Nash got tripped right in front of her the same 5 feet away. No call. The difference was Nash didn't sell it. He got up and played.

4) I know getting kicked in the ankle hurts, I've had it happen to me, and yes Brown was hurt but he sold it like he was having a near death experience.

So yellow yes, red no and I'll leave it at that. We agree on more than we disagree so on to the next game.

A 2 foot tackle on another player's ankle with spikes up and no intention of playing the ball is a yellow??

Oh, ok.... I wasn't aware they re-wrote the rule book, thanks for the heads up.... (rolls eyes)

[loyola]

I've seen the replay here:

http://www.radio-canada.ca/sports/soccer/2009/10/10/004-MTL-VAN--samedi.shtml

and I don't think Nash was foul on the play, Brown got the ball IMO and Nash fell or even dove. Nash left the ball expose and wasn't really protecting it so he lost it. And even if there was some contact with his feet I don't think that deserve a call because Brown clearly got the ball as well.

Red card, deserve IMO, dangerous play and I doubt Brown reaction had an impact on Chenard decision.

[nolando]

Thanks Jeffrey...I started my Thanksgiving off with a belly laugh. Great thread - classic V's stuff.

[Keano]

That ref buries the Impact normally, she goes the extra mile to try and show she's not biased. Unprofessional remarks by Nash who should know that his tackle was on the borderline between a yellow and a red and it was a selfish revenge play.

Brown was visibly hobbled for the rest of the match, his two goal opportunities were not the result of his miraculous recovery but rather poor defending, a man down by Vancouver. It's not like he ran the ball through 5 guys at any point. Or even ran at all ever, but that's another story

[Mr.Impact]

quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S.

The general working principle is that you should not have a ref from either team's jurisdiction--the provincial association in this case--doing a game. So this sort of debate cannot happen. I am not sure they are always concerned about that in USL or even MLS, and maybe travelling costs are a factor. But I think it is a good way to go, and if she was from Ontario, then perfect, from Ontario.

She still reffed like she was from Québec, no one can say Caps were favoured and Impact can't say they were not.

Would you feel different if her name was Mary Chapman,married to her brother, and from Williams Lake? We wouldn't be talking about the ref, if the score was reversed.

[Daniel]

The ref is officially from Ontario. That makes here eligible to ref Impact games (and she's blown more than one call against the Impact this year) as much as someone from Toronto.

The non-call on Brown is debatable, the straight red is not. Once play continued, Nash's tackle was a straight red. End of story.

She might have made a mistake not signaling a foul against Brown, but once that decision's taken, Nash can't be doing what he did. What's next? People debating that Zidane should only have gotten a yellow in 2006? That's as clear a straight red as I've ever seen.

[jonovision]

The Nash call was right, but Chenard and her crew did a terrible job overall.

[Guest Jeffery S.]

quote:Originally posted by Swangardian

Ok so when Canada plays Costa Rica and Honduras and players from that region take their swan dives, we can criticize them. But when a Panamanian on a Canadian Club Team does the same thing, it was legit, and anyone who is disgusted by the acting has neve been injured nor played the sport? Are Craig Forrest and Jason DeVos couch potatoes with ignorance about the sport? Because they certainly criticize the practice. Then again, I guess they don't have as many caps as you do.

Remember when the MNT lost 2-1 in Montreal, and the Honduran bastard took the dive in injury time?

We've all had those injuries. Getting cleated is not fun. But he was on the ground for more than a minute and actually screaming and looked like he was dying before being stretchered off. Classic trick from his region! Have you not watched CONCACAF games before?

I understand, we see it at all levels...fine...take a dive and go down to show you were tripped. THEN GET UP and continue playing! There is no need for you to be carried off on a stretcher and have some "magical" water squirted on your injury. But then again, I guess some players have magic healing powers after looking like their foot has fallen off, right Mr. Athlete?

Besides, Brown has done this before. Just look at this photo: http://www.westislandgazette.com/meagher/8748#

Appaently he was dead on the field!

Sadly my friend, it is supporters like you who make excuses for this awful practice who keep it going and accepted.

Fans like you are only going to be happy in your fantasy land watching the mascot do cartwheels.

And it wasn't a dive, as any half moron would tell you. But nice try.

I have said in my view the official hurt the Whitecaps, and that officiating has done so in almost all the Caps home games I have seen this year, live or USLLive. Sometimes linesmen, often refs. Quite a few penalties not called, feeling we have to chin up and be stoic an awful lot, that we won't get any favours. And I am not a ref whiner, I think you usually get the result you deserve.

The ref is what I see in fourth tier Spain a lot, she has fitness, more or less follows the play closely, is in the right spot, is competent. But she does not really watch the play, she reacts to the "way" it looks, and she calls politically, as if there is a right or wrong time to call a penalty, a foul, pull out a card. Parts of the game get called in one way, parts in another, you always get the tough-and-plenty-of-cards 20 minutes and the play-on-be-tough-boys 20 minutes. No single criteria. NO help from the linesmen, who she did not rely on either. She was a cun-t at times too, the yellow for Marlon celebrating the goal, total anti-football mentality. No communication either, even being bilingual, because she lacks the confidence to do so.

But the red to Nash was possible, it was harsh but it was not out of the question, I think it was early enough to let it go with a yellow and a talk-to, but she decided he was going to injure his opponent, which it did look like.

[Mr.Impact]

Nash has been going at it long enough to know better especially wearing the captains band. He let his team down, with no chance at redemption in Saturdays Final.