brownbear Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 So it looks like Mo, and MLSE in general, are not happy with Craig Forrest public criticism of the job that's being done in the management sphere at TFC. Actually, Mo is pissed and has painted a big bulls-eye on Forrest. This doesn't seem to be bothering Forrest and he claims that he will continue telling it like it is as he is paid by Sportsnet, and not TFC. This is one of the benefits of a journalist/broadcaster not being on the payroll of the corporation that also owns the team. Distance yields independence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 This recent blog entry from Gerry Dobson seemed unusually candid for one of the team's regular play by play announcers:- http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/2009/09/25/cummins_blog_dobson/ The club has said all along that it will re-evaluate the coaching set up at the end of the season. It looks to me that Cummins will be gone either voluntarily or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I don't recall Craig saying anything that bad about Mo's job, other than suggesting the team needed some wide-players. Which is something tough to argue against. It seems to me like Mo is oversensitive, unless Craig has said something highly critical that I didn't hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Trader Mo has added some names to the roster which have to be considered scoops, but he's also added some names to the roster which have to be considered rubbish. Hard to be critical of a manager who in a about a year has added three 1st team players from the CMNT squad to the roster. But then again, the Devil is in the details isn't it? Cummins was done in long ago. It was out there in plain sight. Pick a different reason if you want a fight, MoJo. Sigi has given Seattle a bang-up maiden season whether they make the playoffs or no. Arena turned the Asylum in Carson completely around. Questions need to be answered why TFC with it's inflated payroll and as true a home field advantage as can be found in MLS can't be at least the 8th best team in this league. And boy, Trader Mo better have the right answers. Every single thing on this team has his fingerprints on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macksam Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca I don't recall Craig saying anything that bad about Mo's job, other than suggesting the team needed some wide-players. Which is something tough to argue against. It seems to me like Mo is oversensitive, unless Craig has said something highly critical that I didn't hear. I don't understand why Gala isn't played out wide. He's fast and can cross well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Others wonder that as well Macksam - apparently, and this is all conjecture/rumour as far as I am aware - Gabe has an ego issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 the way I see it, being on Mo's sh-tlist is a good thing. it means that you have a spine and are willing to speak truthfully on issues rather than coming across as a tool for MLSE's marketing and PR department. I'm happy to see guys like Forrest, DeVos, Paul James, Iarusci, etc... speaking fairly frankly about TFC's shortcomings. Trust me when I tell you that there is pressure to toe the party line. I have no doubt that TFC execs let their broadcast partners know quite quickly when they feel that one of their announcers has been too critical. Fortunately, i don't think any of these guys depend on TFC commentary as a sole source of income and thus they are more at liberty to speak their mind. There are too many commentators in this market who simply are not sufficiently informed about the real world of football to speak intelligently about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ag futbol Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 The funny part of all this is: the criticism of Mo Johnston has been so mild that it's barely noticable. Yet, somehow TFC managment manages to blow a gasket. He's just lucky nobody has started publicly making apt comparisons between TFC, Seattle, and various other turnaround projects. Needless to say, if we don't make the playoffs this year: he's got bigger problems than Craig Forrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSoccerFan Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Is there a link or anything?? or is this just hearsay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 TFC close to a playoff spot is better than not at all close. No multi-month long winless streak. More points, more goals, better play. If the curve is upward it is hard to complain. But next year it better continue in the same direction, if they just miss playoffs this year they have to make them next year. On this basis I would keep the exact same coaching and managerial structure. And solve the field surface at BMO so there are no more excuses coming out: grass for results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piltdownman Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 quote:Originally posted by ag futbol The funny part of all this is: the criticism of Mo Johnston has been so mild that it's barely noticable. Yet, somehow TFC managment manages to blow a gasket. He's just lucky nobody has started publicly making apt comparisons between TFC, Seattle, and various other turnaround projects. Needless to say, if we don't make the playoffs this year: he's got bigger problems than Craig Forrest. Very very true. Lets just hope Forrest doesn't somehow see himself replaced over this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuscan Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 I really can't see Sportsnet canning Forrest over something like this. It's his job to comment on what he sees happening around him in football. He's a Canadian football icon to top it off, and I hope that others on here besides myself would be up in arms if he was given the boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canucklefan Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 quote:Originally posted by piltdownman Very very true. Lets just hope Forrest doesn't somehow see himself replaced over this. It won't happen. As said before, Sportsnet pays Forrest salary, not TFC, there's no reason to wonder if he's going to lose his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 quote:Originally posted by brownbear So it looks like Mo, and MLSE in general, are not happy with Craig Forrest public criticism of the job that's being done in the management sphere at TFC. Actually, Mo is pissed and has painted a big bulls-eye on Forrest. This doesn't seem to be bothering Forrest and he claims that he will continue telling it like it is as he is paid by Sportsnet, and not TFC. This is one of the benefits of a journalist/broadcaster not being on the payroll of the corporation that also owns the team. Distance yields independence. Just curious, what is the source of your info? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bxl Boy Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Craig Forrest and criticism in the same sentence, without any negation ? He lost his pink glasses ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squizz1402635577 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 This issue isn't worth debating unless and until it's backed up by something substantive. I tried to find an article, blog post, anything that corroborated the original assertion (that front office is mad at Forrest for on-air comments) and found nothing. So, brownbear, either: a) my Googling skills aren't all I think they are, and there is some primary source that I just didn't find; in which case, please, supply us with a link to such a source you have a primary source of your own, someone on the inside who has provided you with this information, even though you didn't indicate as much in your original post, or c) you've made a blanket statement based on nothing other than your own opinion It's worth finding out which of these is the case before we continue ruminating about an issue which may be entirely fabricated. I'm not picking on you, brownbear, but if anyone is going to make statements about what other people think or are doing, they should be obligated to back it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcisoul Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Squizz, well put! It bugs me when people make a thread on this site without putting thier source. It makes the website look bad. I also don't mean to just go after brownbear either i see a lot of Threads started without sources but post your sources. If this is true I would be pissed I enjoy Forrest for his honestly, he calls refs out when they make a bad call, and gets upset at players who dive. I also think that he is a fan of TFC so he might say things that a fan would say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ag futbol Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Stepping back here, couple of things: - Teams going back-and-forth with journalists about coverage they like/hate is not terribly unusual. - There's a huge gap between Mo being pissed at Forrest, to Mo "wants forrest fired" - Considering our ratings are rivaling a D-list celebrity poker challenge ... TFC is going to have to suck it up. It's really only notable because it seems the TFC staff look to be taking media abuse 101 ( Paul Bernier to Kristian Jack, John Carver to just about anybody) AND there's really no critical coverage! - Nobody ever asked about a shocking inability of this team to keep possession in years 1 and 2 (and the long ball). - No question about the defender we've clearly needed for about 8 months now - Roster balance / performance of certain signings. I haven't seen one article about how the guy they ran out of town on a train is probably going to wing the golden boot this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ag futbol Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Stepping back here, couple of things: - Teams going back-and-forth with journalists about coverage they like/hate is not terribly unusual. - There's a huge gap between Mo being pissed at Forrest, to Mo "wants forrest fired" - Considering our ratings are rivaling a D-list celebrity poker challenge ... TFC is going to have to suck it up. It's really only notable because it seems the TFC staff look to be taking media abuse 101 ( Paul Bernier to Kristian Jack, John Carver to just about anybody) AND there's really no critical coverage! - Nobody ever asked about a shocking inability of this team to keep possession in years 1 and 2 (and the long ball). - No question about the defender we've clearly needed for about 8 months now - Roster balance / performance of certain signings. I haven't seen one article about how the guy they ran out of town on a train is probably going to wing the golden boot this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownbear Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share Posted September 29, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Metro Just curious, what is the source of your info? I can't tell you or I'd have to kill you. Let's just say a little birdie whispered it into my ear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouversoccerman Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 ^^ For what it's worth, I know brownbear's source...and it's a pretty solid one. I can't reveal it for the same reason as above... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 quote:Originally posted by kcisoul Squizz, well put! It bugs me when people make a thread on this site without putting thier source. It makes the website look bad. I also don't mean to just go after brownbear either i see a lot of Threads started without sources but post your sources. If this is true I would be pissed I enjoy Forrest for his honestly, he calls refs out when they make a bad call, and gets upset at players who dive. I also think that he is a fan of TFC so he might say things that a fan would say. You'd be surprised by how many things are said on this board on the basis of unnameable sources. It is not good journalism, but since we are not pretending to be the press, we have to accept it as it is the only way scoops can come out. So I am fine with it, occasionally I have made comments that were veiled or indirect on the basis of very reliable data, without being able to name a source. Others here do it frequently. I am not saying this info is a scoop or even true, and remain skeptical about everything (football is notorious for producing legitimate press stories that are pure fantasy). But it is not something to complain about unless the person doing it proves to be unreliable over and over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. You'd be surprised by how many things are said on this board on the basis of unnameable sources...Others here do it frequently. you talking about me? [][:0] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 quote:Originally posted by VPjr you talking about me? [][:0] There are quite a few insiders here, friends of this player, family of that, former teammates, know this player agent, board members of this or that club with word on their provincial Soccer Association, and so on. Others with their noses to the ground. Others doing active journalism, professional, semi-pro, enlightened amateur. All that means getting interesting tidbits that are poorly sourced, because naming sources means losing information, simple as that. The result is bad to middling journalism, frustrating speculation, perfectly justified questioning of data, but frequent scoops and accurate one step ahead releases of news that is worthy to be printed and eventually does come out confirmed. Sports journalism, commentary and blogging is ripe with this sort of stuff, as are most sport forums (I also read NBA blogs as my point of comparison). I can't understand for the life of me why someone would want to clean it all up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmynow Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 the notion of unnamed sources was originally only used in journalism of the past for life threatening situations, political scandals etc. Nowadays people throw it around even when talking about a situation between Mo Johnston and Craig Forrest. That's a misapplied use of unnamed sources, in my opinion. This isn't exactly a Watergate-level situation. There's also no editor to ask the person above to show the source and ensure its accuracy. We just have to trust somebody with no institutional checks and balances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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