Pathetic media coverage

[Califax]

quote:Originally posted by Varsity Tyler

That's exactly what I'm saying. 2000-2500 on a weekday? Half the stadium can't make it on time for a weekday home match, but you want thousands to do just that for a match in Ohio. Fat chance.

Also, who is going to be organizing this trip for the supposed masses? Not the people who have organized the last ones - I promise you that much.

Realistically, if we draw Columbus away on a weekday (when school is back in, too) I'm guessing 300-ish, roughly the same number which recently went to Montreal midweek. Coincidentally, I think that's roughly the number which went from TO to Montreal for the WCQ.

But aaaaaaaanyways .... how bout that media? lol

You lost me, and when you didn't I don't agree.

1. I don't care if the Columbus police hurt your feelings, if it were me I'd have thicker skin.

2. I find it hard to believe there are that many people who are not "Canadian" who are in supporters groups. You live in Canada, you like soccer, you should care about our national team. This is why the media does not publish stuff about us. Because people feel team Canada is an afterthought behind, TFC, ENGLAND, PORTUGAL, ITALY, Man United, Liverpool, Barca, Celtic and 100's of others... If supporters cared as much about country in which they reside then they do about club there would be something to write about, since they don't, there isn't, can't blame em.

[JamboAl]

Unfortunately though, a significant number of soccer fans living in Canada do not support our national team. I'll give you an example...in my office alone, there are some rabid supporters of Ireland, Celtic, Montenegro, Italy, Arsenal, England, Man United and Roma. Not one of them even knew or cared that Canada played WC Qualifiers last summer. All thought I was nuts to travel to watch a "loser team" like Canada. They are all Canadian born or immigrated in the last 10 years and guess who they support in hockey, yep Canada. Blood boils everytime I think about it but I've learned to accept it.

How do you argue with people who are so fickle...they'd stop supporting their team if they sucked, but would never admit it.

[Bertuzzi44]

quote:Originally posted by JamboAl

Unfortunately though, a significant number of soccer fans living in Canada do not support our national team. I'll give you an example...in my office alone, there are some rabid supporters of Ireland, Celtic, Montenegro, Italy, Arsenal, England, Man United and Roma. Not one of them even knew or cared that Canada played WC Qualifiers last summer. All thought I was nuts to travel to watch a "loser team" like Canada. They are all Canadian born or immigrated in the last 10 years and guess who they support in hockey, yep Canada. Blood boils everytime I think about it but I've learned to accept it.

How do you argue with people who are so fickle...they'd stop supporting their team if they sucked, but would never admit it.

QFT

[RS]

quote:Originally posted by Califax

You lost me, and when you didn't I don't agree.

1. I don't care if the Columbus police hurt your feelings, if it were me I'd have thicker skin.

2. I find it hard to believe there are that many people who are not "Canadian" who are in supporters groups. You live in Canada, you like soccer, you should care about our national team. This is why the media does not publish stuff about us. Because people feel team Canada is an afterthought behind, TFC, ENGLAND, PORTUGAL, ITALY, Man United, Liverpool, Barca, Celtic and 100's of others... If supporters cared as much about country in which they reside then they do about club there would be something to write about, since they don't, there isn't, can't blame em.

Please stop speaking about things you obviously don't know.

And Tyler;'s right, should TFC move on to the group stage, you will see no where near the amount of travelling support that there was from the past two March dates in Columbus. I'd say his 300-400 estimate is bang on.

[youllneverwalkalone]

quote:Originally posted by BringBackTheBlizzard

For a city well on the way to having a majority of relatively recent immigrants from Asia I would file that under dubious assertion, personally.

It's really hard to give you an award for your dumbest post, as each one seems to top the next, but this is pretty close. You obviously don't spend much time in Vancouver or with Asians. But thank you for not letting that stop you from explaining the demographics of our city to us. The racist undertones are a nice touch as well. And thank you for not letting any facts get in your way: like the fact that both metro Vancouver and metro Toronto have approximately 25% of their population identifying themselves as "Asian." I guess all of ours are straight off the boat. I'd better tell my girlfriend to throw all those Canucks jerseys and t-shirts in the trash and go learn to speak Chinese with the rest of the Vancouver Asians.

I'd suggest your new handle should be Gwailo, but I've come to find it's usually a sign of respect. And I have a feeling your dumbest post ever if still to come, so I'll save that prize for a later date.

[Califax]

quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone

It's really hard to give you an award for your dumbest post, as each one seems to top the next, but this is pretty close. You obviously don't spend much time in Vancouver or with Asians. But thank you for not letting that stop you from explaining the demographics of our city to us. The racist undertones are a nice touch as well. And thank you for not letting any facts get in your way: like the fact that both metro Vancouver and metro Toronto have approximately 25% of their population identifying themselves as "Asian." I guess all of ours are straight off the boat. I'd better tell my girlfriend to throw all those Canucks jerseys and t-shirts in the trash and go learn to speak Chinese with the rest of the Vancouver Asians.

I'd suggest your new handle should be Gwailo, but I've come to find it's usually a sign of respect. And I have a feeling your dumbest post ever if still to come, so I'll save that prize for a later date.

If people are going to throw the race card around for no reason at all it's probably time a MOD locks the thread....

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Farcical stuff really. Asia isn't exactly famed for its love of hockey so devotion to hockey is something that has to be acquired and which has to build over several decades before "to the bone" would sensibly apply. If Vancouver were heading for a majority of recent immigrants from Russia and Finland it might be a different story.

[Soro17]

BBTB,

Nothing matches the fervour of the newly converted. To suggest that only Finnish and Russian immigrants could be "to the bone" hockey fans is one of the most ridiculous assertions I have seen on this board. A lifelong hockey player, I agreed to play as a sub in the Ismaili ball hockey league. These guys were some of the biggest and most fervent hockey fans I have met, and were fantastic ball hockey players to boot. Not one of them was born in Canada - most came to Canada as children from East Africa. I am sure that you will find some further justification for your misguided view of the ethnic requirements for being a hockey fan. But there it is.

Back to the topic. My bro is a producer at CKNW. Another poster on this board also was a producer at CKNW. I am sure they will both tell you that there are two problems: first, the on-air hosts are in their 50s generally and don't know anything about soccer, don't want to learn and as a result don't want to talk about it. Secondly, when they do talk about soccer, and Canadian soccer in particular, the reaction from listeners is overwhelming indifference. Unless Canada achieves a positive result (ie. Gold Cup 2000) or has a controversy (ie Gold Cup 2007), we are likely stuck with the status quo until the next generation of broadcasters and listeners comes on the scene. Fortunately, with all of the alternative media sources out available, there are fewer and fewer reasons to read the province or listen to the Team 1040 / CKNW / CHED etc.

http://www.akysbbc.com/hockeyregistration/

[Strisce]

Full-Time on the Team 1040 had CMNT interim coach Stephen Hart on tonight.

Talked Gerba, win over Jamaica, juggling technical director and coaching job, Greg Sutton, and Asmir Begovic's future.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

I can come up with anecdotal stuff as well, soro17. I was in a relationship with a woman from mainland China for over four years. She told me that felt very uncomfortable when we went to a London Knights game and had zero interest when I suggested going to the next game because she said she had felt out of place and unwelcome. She never seemed to have a problem that way when we went to soccer games. It's obviously not sensible to extrapolate too far from an isolated anecdote like that so I'd point out to people instead that the idea that recent immigrants are instantly transformed into hardcore hockey fans upon arrival to Canada flies in the face of recent mainstream media stories like this:-

http://www.torontosun.com/news/columnists/michele_mandel/2008/10/27/7216281-sun.html

Not sure why the journalist felt the need to bring race into it, however. I've seen much the same pattern to that described amongst recent immigrants from Scotland and various European countries and the passion for soccer if anything has been rekindled amongst that demographic over the last 10 or 15 years because it has become much easier to watch games from over in Europe on a regular basis. 15 to 20 years ago I used to watch HNIC quite a bit and the Blue Jays in the summer because of the lack of other options. Now I almost never do. As cable television channels have proliferated and the role of the internet has expanded, the power of national media outlets like the CBC to shape a uniform national society distinct from that of other nations has weakened considerably. We are increasingly living in what Marshall McLuhan described as the "global village".

[TT5]

quote:Originally posted by Soro17

BBTB,

Nothing matches the fervour of the newly converted. To suggest that only Finnish and Russian immigrants could be "to the bone" hockey fans is one of the most ridiculous assertions I have seen on this board. A lifelong hockey player, I agreed to play as a sub in the Ismaili ball hockey league. These guys were some of the biggest and most fervent hockey fans I have met, and were fantastic ball hockey players to boot. Not one of them was born in Canada - most came to Canada as children from East Africa. I am sure that you will find some further justification for your misguided view of the ethnic requirements for being a hockey fan. But there it is.

Back to the topic. My bro is a producer at CKNW. Another poster on this board also was a producer at CKNW. I am sure they will both tell you that there are two problems: first, the on-air hosts are in their 50s generally and don't know anything about soccer, don't want to learn and as a result don't want to talk about it. Secondly, when they do talk about soccer, and Canadian soccer in particular, the reaction from listeners is overwhelming indifference. Unless Canada achieves a positive result (ie. Gold Cup 2000) or has a controversy (ie Gold Cup 2007), we are likely stuck with the status quo until the next generation of broadcasters and listeners comes on the scene. Fortunately, with all of the alternative media sources out available, there are fewer and fewer reasons to read the province or listen to the Team 1040 / CKNW / CHED etc.

Paul Chapman from the Province was on the TEAm 1040 afternoon show and talked soccer numnerous times, quite enjoyable when he ranted about Michael Owen going the Man Utd. (paul is a Liverpool fan). I agree that soccer isn't the most popular topic on the radio, but the TEAm 1040 has a good 2 hour soccer show on Sunday nights. I listen to that and when I can online for Soccer Steve in Edmonton and Nigel Reid's radio show in Toronto. I think there is one in Montreal though, but you can't podcast it, so I can't listen much.

[El Hombre]

quote:Originally posted by Califax

If people are going to throw the race card around for no reason at all it's probably time a MOD locks the thread....

<mod>Or, you kids could start playing nice and stop debating how much Asians may or may not like hockey in a thread about the lack of Gold Cup coverage in Canadian media. Let's get back on topic.</mod>

[JamboAl]

Personally, I think the CBC website is single-handedly trying to promote the Gold Cup all it can by often putting it as the lead article on cbcsports.ca. So we should at least give credit to the public broadcaster.

Also, I think 1st and 2nd generation Asian-Canadians probably associate with hockey more than any other sport out there; it's part of trying to be part of Canadian culture.

Sorry, El Hombre, had to give my 2 cents. If you want, you can personally ban me at the Georgetown tomorrow night.[]

[youllneverwalkalone]

quote:Originally posted by Califax

If people are going to throw the race card around for no reason at all it's probably time a MOD locks the thread....

Haha. This thread was started by a Vancouver guy. Another Vancouver guy brings up some good points about media coverage in Vancouver and he's told by a ONT guy that his points are not valid because the majority of Vancouver's population are Asians who have just stepped off the boat. Meanwhile, you are running your mouth about how the TFC supporters groups are to blame for the lack of media coverage. And then you ask for moderator intervention because the thread is off topic. Wow. [:0]

[Califax]

quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone

Haha. This thread was started by a Vancouver guy. Another Vancouver guy brings up some good points about media coverage in Vancouver and he's told by a ONT guy that his points are not valid because the majority of Vancouver's population are Asians who have just stepped off the boat. Meanwhile, you are running your mouth about how the TFC supporters groups are to blame for the lack of media coverage. And then you ask for moderator intervention because the thread is off topic. Wow. [:0]

Sorry where did you say you were from?

The coverage is fine, I've seen it in the papers, I've seen it on on TV. I haven't seen a lot of it but I've seen it. It's enough. No one cares. I work at a sports channel. We have to sift through 8 tons of hockey coverage just to find the pisser let a alone anything footy related. But overwhelmingly that is what people want.

So where do we start? We could blame the media. I blame people who love soccer but for some odd reason don't follow Canada, in the manner they follow other clubs. It's ground zero for me, and I don't think that is totally out of line. Get more demand then supply, then we can talk about media coverage

[Soro17]

FWIW and as a follow-up to elricko's original post, I had a look through the Province's Sunday sports section. Canada's victory was mentioned in one paragraph (next to a blurb about Bernie Ecclestone and F1). To be fair to the Province, they had 1.5 pages about Steve Nash's upcoming charity soccer game and his involvement with the Whitecaps. They also had a page on the Whitecaps (both men's and women's). Compared to ten years ago, things have come along way.

[red card]

I was reminded of this thread when reading Dave Naylor's post in the Globe today:NFL has failed to go global.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/blogs/from-the-sidelines/nfl-has-failed-to-go-global/article1207858/

In it, he mentions an FT article: Lost in Translation. It had a good quote from the Int Ice Hockey prez that can apply to Cdn media also:

Rene Fasel, the Swiss dentist who heads the International Ice Hockey Federation, worries about his own sport's future in north America: ''Wake up north America, soccer is coming. I tell you, they sleep while it's coming.''

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d5e3056a-d131-11dc-953a-0000779fd2ac.html

[Full-Time]

Speaking of coverage. You can download/hear the interview Full-Time: Vancouver's Soccer Show did with Stephen Hart on the TEAM 1040 at the following links.

http://www.team1040.ca/podcasts/

http://www.team1040.ca/shared/podcast_rss.php?play=soccer_show

Talked about putting together this squad, his goalkeeper selection, Asmir Begovic, some incredible Gold Cup travel and also his thoughts moving forward in this tournament.

To learn more about Full-Time, check out the show page at http://www.team1040.ca/shows/soccer_show/

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

quote:Originally posted by Califax

It's enough. No one cares. I work at a sports channel. We have to sift through 8 tons of hockey coverage just to find the pisser let a alone anything footy related. But overwhelmingly that is what people want.

I think you may be getting into a bit of a circular argument in that if all you tend to show is hockey then your audience will reflect that fact in demographic terms and it stands to reason that almost nobody within that audience will be hugely interested in something that hasn't traditionally been a big part of their culture.

The lack of interest amongst a traditional sports channel audience doesn't mean, however, that there isn't a huge latent demand for an event like the Gold Cup that could be tapped into if a broadcaster decided to try to build its profile along the lines of what TSN did with the World Junior Hoeckey Chammpionships. One of the reasons stated by the CBC for getting into soccer was that they realized that there was a large younger and more urban demographic that had basically completely tuned them out and as the national broadcaster that was very bad news.

quote:Originally posted by Califax

So where do we start? We could blame the media. I blame people who love soccer but for some odd reason don't follow Canada, in the manner they follow other clubs. It's ground zero for me, and I don't think that is totally out of line. Get more demand then supply, then we can talk about media coverage.

Paul Beirne of TFC has posted elsewhere and I think has been quoted in the Globe and Mail (may have been Richard Peddie in the context) about how MLSE did a marketing study on soccer interest in the GTA and realized that when you add up all the small fragments of interest in various overseas leagues you wind up with a very large overall market for the sport if you can somehow unify it and focus it on something in a domestic Canadian context. That led to the emergence and success of Toronto FC but that's still very much a southern Ontario phenomenon. If/when soccer can also get up to the CFL sort of level in status terms again in Vancouver and Montreal it will be much more difficult for people to argue that there isn't a demand for soccer coverage on a national level.

At that point, when a large portion of the CMNT roster are playing in a high profile domestic league and become celebrity figures in the soccer community from coast to coast it will be much easier for the national team to emerge as a unified focus of interest as well. Right now although the exploits of players like Julian de Guzman and Atiba Hutchison are well known to the 200 or so people using this board regularly most soccer fans in Canada might have heard their names a few times but have no real clue who they are.

[Richard]

I have been in the business of scouring the media for soccer news on a daily basis for the past 10 years, especially Canadian soccer news. I can assure you there is orders of magnitude more coverage of soccer and especially Canadian soccer in the mainstrem media than there was even five years ago. In Vancouver, even since the Whitecaps won their MLS franchise there has been a substantial coverage increase in the local media: print, radio, television and online.

[Bertuzzi44]

quote:Originally posted by Califax

This is dumbest thing I have seen on this forum. Talk about looking for a fight. He in no way implied anything and you just made yourself look like an idiot. I normally don't reply to such idiocy, but when people twist phrases to insinuate bigotry, I draw the line.

[V]

moron

[elricko]

Well, in today's ,( July 11 th.), PROVINCE newspaper here in BC, there is NOTHING about the upcoming match against El Salvador.....absolutely nothing.... however there is a very, very small mention of cricket !!!

This wretched piece-of-a-rag -so-called newspaper IS one huge part of the mainstream media in BC, and once again gives at least FIVE whole pages to hockey.

There is no doubt that Canada is THE WORLD's SOCCER WASTELAND !!!

[soka]

Maybe that's because you're reading the July 11th paper, and the match is already 4 days old:)

Seriously though, not a word in the Vancouver Sun this morning either, so 2 for 2 here.

[Soro17]

^ I am sure there will be a lengthy summary of Canada's big win in tomorrow's paper .

[Richard]

Fact remains, the number of 'column inches' devoted to soccer has increased substantially in recent years, even if occasionally we don't see all the stories we'd like to. There's plenty of soccer news on the The Province and Vancouver Sun websites though I doubt it will ever be considered sufficient for some