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list of uncaptied Canadians?


mulliganl

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Now, we all know that Begovic WAS cap tied under the old rules, but is now an international free agent. Who are some other MNT players who, like Asmir, were tied but are not anymore? Maybe we could get a list going of these players? Essentially, it would be a list of current players who have played in non cap-tying games for the MNT, but never for Canada in WCQ or the Gold Cup.

eg. (knowing that he played his games after the new rule) Simeon Jackson has 2 caps for the MNT, but is still able to play for Jamaica.

I understand if this might be too depressing for some Vees...

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How about players that WE can pluck? That would be a better list

Besides the obvious De Guzman and Fernandes

O'Brien White - Love to see us cap him we are weak at forward and now that he is living in Toronto and playing for Canada's team I like our chances.

Steven Vittoria - Open to playing for Canada 99% chance he is ours.

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^Good idea. I think Vitoria is probably priority number 1 of those assumed lost. He helped his loan club promote to the top tier, winning the second division. You can never have too many technically gifted central defenders and/or midfielders, so I would think he would have been a no-brainer to call for Gold Cup. I do recall him disrespecting Canada quite badly in the media, but time to forgive and forget I say.

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quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone

^Good idea. I think Vitoria is probably priority number 1 of those assumed lost. He helped his loan club promote to the top tier, winning the second division. You can never have too many technically gifted central defenders and/or midfielders, so I would think he would have been a no-brainer to call for Gold Cup. I do recall him disrespecting Canada quite badly in the media, but time to forgive and forget I say.

He is a second divison Portugal league player. I think there are a few more players in line before him especially considering what he did. I'll forgive him but he needs to actually be good enough for the team first.

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Not sure I really want JDG2 or Vittoria. They made their choice and should stick with it. Fernandes I can forgive a bit more because when he made his choice it seemed to be between Portugal and no international career not between Canada and Portugal. Maybe he would have chose Portugal anyway but at the time it didn't look like he was going to be called for Canada (I mean if they can't call him against Luxembourg when he is one of the top keepers in Greece that is sending a pretty strong message).

I am all for us using the despicable rules that FIFA has for international play as much as possible since our competitors are doing the same thing and we have enough problems to begin with that we should not be playing on an unlevel playing field. Yet I would feel more comfortable with a foreigner who has been given citizenship playing for us because he wants to than a Canadian who has rejected Canada and comes back only because he finds he is not good enough for his first choice. I would never feel comfortable with JDG2 or Vittoria in our lineup. Vittoria is not national team level at the moment anyway and JDG2 has so far not become the dominant player we were expecting either so might also be a borderline starter.

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quote:Originally posted by mulliganl

Simeon Jackson and Dejan Jakovic are now cap tied. Nice!

Not only cap-tied, but more importantly they are ACTUAL PARTS

of Canada's rebuilding process, and they appear to WANT to be

part of that group. There's good chemistry with this GC squad

and that will translate well for the future.

For other countries, they cap-tie a player and may never,

if not seldom, call him again.

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quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

Not sure I really want JDG2 or Vittoria. They made their choice and should stick with it. Fernandes I can forgive a bit more because when he made his choice it seemed to be between Portugal and no international career not between Canada and Portugal. Maybe he would have chose Portugal anyway but at the time it didn't look like he was going to be called for Canada (I mean if they can't call him against Luxembourg when he is one of the top keepers in Greece that is sending a pretty strong message).

I am all for us using the despicable rules that FIFA has for international play as much as possible since our competitors are doing the same thing and we have enough problems to begin with that we should not be playing on an unlevel playing field. Yet I would feel more comfortable with a foreigner who has been given citizenship playing for us because he wants to than a Canadian who has rejected Canada and comes back only because he finds he is not good enough for his first choice. I would never feel comfortable with JDG2 or Vittoria in our lineup. Vittoria is not national team level at the moment anyway and JDG2 has so far not become the dominant player we were expecting either so might also be a borderline starter.

Absolutely. I am totally shaking my head in disblief at some of the thinking in this thread. What kind of message do we want to send here? Yeah go ahead and try your chances with another national side... if it doesn't work, well there is still canada waiting for you with open arms. You can be sure that there will be a floodgate of others who will follow in the footsteps of those that we have lost. Sure, lets become a farm system or second divison of international soccer of international soccer where if it doesn't work out for you somewhere else, you can always play for Canada and if you do well for Canada, well with the more and more liberal FIFA rules, maybe you can switch back to your first choice.

How is that ever going to improve our NT. And, as far as the case of Vittoria and deGuzman. Should I remind people of how we faired at the last U20 WC? Remember? Its the tournament that we hosted.... a tournament in which we didn't win a single game and faced the embarrassment of a host that didn't advance. Doesn't anyone think that we could have used someone like Vittoria or DeGuzman?

Over time we can accept, understand or live with some of these decisions. But so must the players who make these decisons.

This forum has been around for about ten years now and I know that for some, following the scene here, is relatively new so maybe proper context missing. So lets go back a few years with two examples:

Case one involves a certain Canadian player at well know soccer youth system with an EPL club was earning name for himself on the V-board as one to follow. However he was reportedly making waved for his desire to play for England. All evidence points to those stories as factual given that when the qualifying for the U20 WC started, he was not on the team because he didn't want to commit. JDG starred for Canada in the Qualifying and wore the captains arm band. Well I guess, that somewhere between the qualifying tournament at the actual WYC in Argentina, he had a change of heart. Likely realizing that he just wasn't good enough to ever play for england much less the EPL. So Canada, impressed by that pedigree and hype, welcomed him back and even gave him the captains arm band that was worn by JDG in qualifying ad dropped a player to make room form him. Well he sucked when we finaly saw him at the U 20 WC. And so did the team.

Reported case number two: A similar type at a well known youth system in Germany and was making waves about playing for another side in the British Iles. But what made this case particularly special is that everytime that the CSA held a camp for its U20 players, he would show up. So he gladly accepted the monies in travel expenses and accomodations (as well as benefitting from the training and coaching) that the CSA forked out to get him to the all of the camps and he stayed with the team right until the final trip to the U20 WC in the UAE. Thats what he bolted for the team out of fer of getting cap tied. Imagine the hell of getting cap tied to Canada. A far as I know, he has never called up international for any side sime that time. Though he played one game for Wales at the U21 level.

Weird how time passes but it doesn't seem that long ago that we were referring to a certin player as Whoregreaves and now its the total opposite. And yet today, if he could possibly reverse and change his decision, I'd be happy to see that because we know he good and he knows that he could play for England. But the others will have to live with their decsions. Thankfully, the NT coaches do have spine. As far as Vitoria and Jono, IMO the jury is still out on how they will turn out as pros so if their NT of choice doesn't want them why should the CSA accept them.

Lastly, no way should the NT coaches and CSA run around calling up people for no other reason to cap tie them. The coaches and CSA's job should be to aseemble a team that can win. If you are good enough to earn a callup, you will get called and eventually get capped. If your not than what are the chances that you will get called by Germany, England, Holland, Portugal...etc.

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Hoilett is uncapped at every level: no U-17, U-20, or senior matches or callups for either Canada or Jamaica. Not because either country hasn't asked, either.

I do have sympathy for guys like Jonathan De Guzman, Vittoria, etc. who are young men, made a decision while under a lot of pressure from every quarter, and then get locked into it on their twenty-first birthday. I have less sympathy for a guy like Hargreaves, who was more-or-less overtly mercenary, but JDG2 and Vittoria seemed to be motivated to a non-trivial degree by sentiment and love.

(Dani Fernandes is a special case and one not likely to repeated again in this lifetime. I'd welcome him back with open arms but I expect him to remain loyal to Portugal.)

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