Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Since the debate has dried up here and at Facebook, I'm taking it on my initiative to gauge whether there is interest in continuing to debate the possibility of restructuring the Vs. I am asking all Vs to take two minutes to send an e-mail to thevoyageursvote@gmail.com with a yes or no answer to the following question: "Do you believe that a review of how the Voyageurs is structured is needed." One vote per e-mail address. I'm intending this to simply be a gauge of interest. Clearly, others are free to continue the discussion, but before I invest too much energy in the debate I want to know whether there is interest. In the interest of transparency the password for the e-mail address is canadiansoccer I'll report the results back in 48-hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saviola7 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 ^voted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saviola7 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 ^voted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Too much venom flying around has turned people off This Question me-thinks. But I'll vote. Sure, why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Thank you for trying to expedite a resolution to this question but I will not be voting via email for two reasons: 1) This board and only this board is currently the recognized collective communication forum for the Voyageurs and no one has presented a credible reason why a simple voting thread (no comments allowed) cannot achieve the desired result. 2) The public posting of the access code for the voting email account would expose all emails to all persons who use the code and would violate the privacy restrictions members of this forum are currently offered. I email people and use a real name so I have no problem personally but many members choose to use pseudonyms and restrict access to their email as is their prerogative. Would it really be so hard to start a thread and allow only YES/NO reponses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Hombre Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 quote:Originally posted by ted Would it really be so hard to start a thread and allow only YES/NO reponses? This seems like the most logical starting point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted November 13, 2008 Author Share Posted November 13, 2008 If you are uncomfortable "voting" by e-mail, then post here. Again, this is intended as a non-binding gauge of interest - nothing more. As such, I'm trusting that people only vote once. I'll report back with results in about 36-hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 quote:Originally posted by ted 2) The public posting of the access code for the voting email account would expose all emails to all persons who use the code and would violate the privacy restrictions members of this forum are currently offered. I email people and use a real name so I have no problem personally but many members choose to use pseudonyms and restrict access to their email as is their prerogative. Would it really be so hard to start a thread and allow only YES/NO reponses? #2 is the issue for me as well. However, you can count me in as in favour of review. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piltdownman Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 quote:Originally posted by ted Would it really be so hard to start a thread and allow only YES/NO reponses? I think this is a much better way to go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 quote:Originally posted by MediaGuy If you are uncomfortable "voting" by e-mail, then post here. Again, this is intended as a non-binding gauge of interest - nothing more. As such, I'm trusting that people only vote once. I'll report back with results in about 36-hours. Good job MediaGuy. It was a pleasure to vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 quote:Do you believe that a review of how the Voyageurs is structured is needed. Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinna Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 quote:Originally posted by ted Thank you for trying to expedite a resolution to this question but I will not be voting via email for two reasons: 1) This board and only this board is currently the recognized collective communication forum for the Voyageurs and no one has presented a credible reason why a simple voting thread (no comments allowed) cannot achieve the desired result. 2) The public posting of the access code for the voting email account would expose all emails to all persons who use the code and would violate the privacy restrictions members of this forum are currently offered. I email people and use a real name so I have no problem personally but many members choose to use pseudonyms and restrict access to their email as is their prerogative. Would it really be so hard to start a thread and allow only YES/NO reponses? Ted, you are right, but I voted by emailing him. It gets to the point, when you discover so many things are being done without the principle of transparency, that you just have to trust those trying to take the initiative. MediaGuy did, and I think the intention is clear and straighforward, so vote either here or directly by email. I appreciate that MediaGuy, like speekmonk in his attempt, have been straightforward, unlike on other threads where there seems to be all kinds of weird unsaid intentions and veiled venom from people who have no reason not to be direct and honest with the whole Voyageur community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piltdownman Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted November 14, 2008 Author Share Posted November 14, 2008 quote:Originally posted by dsqpr Gentlemen, with all due respect, this question is too simple. There seems to be consensus that the current leadership is doing a good job, so the answer to this question would have to be "no", since a change is not NEEDED. The idea of change has been mooted because some people think that with a more formal structure the leadership could do a BETTER job. This is open to debate and for me it depends entirely on the proposed new structure. I therefore think that we cannot have a vote until we have a proposal for change. Then we can vote for the status quo or for the new structure. I'm afraid that first asking people to vote for change for its own sake is a loaded question. Although I am leaning towards "status quo" I do have an open mind on the issue and some ideas of my own. In the meantime, I'm looking forward to seeing the proposal that has been promised. I don't think we can have a meaningful vote until then. Again, this is a simple attempt to see if there is interest in looking at the issue in a deeper way. If you are 90 per cent status quo, but have some hope that there may be a way to make the group better (but have yet to see a proposal that illustrates how_, then, to me, you are interested in a review. Saying yes to a review is not the same thing as saying yes to change. Tonight at midnight was when I had indicated that I would report the votes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 Oui. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sébastien Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the biologist Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 quote:Originally posted by dsqpr The idea of change has been mooted because some people think that with a more formal structure the leadership could do a BETTER job. This is open to debate and for me it depends entirely on the proposed new structure. I therefore think that we cannot have a vote until we have a proposal for change. Then we can vote for the status quo or for the new structure. I'm afraid that first asking people to vote for change for its own sake is a loaded question. Although I am leaning towards "status quo" I do have an open mind on the issue and some ideas of my own. In the meantime, I'm looking forward to seeing the proposal that has been promised. I don't think we can have a meaningful vote until then. For what it's worth since I read the board since only 4 months, that pretty much resumes what I think for now. MediaGuy, I think people who want the most some change to happen should start to organize a formal proposal (of course with the contribution of people leaning towards the "no"). IMO, it's the only way to eliminate most of the "I'm not sure" answers, the soft nos and the soft yes. Everyone will vote this way and the result will speak for itself undoubtedly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted November 14, 2008 Author Share Posted November 14, 2008 Bumping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted November 15, 2008 Author Share Posted November 15, 2008 It's about an hour short of midnight, but I have to head to bed. In total, 24 people took the time to vote, either here or at the e-mail address. The results were fairly split, but a slight majority voted in favour of continuing the process of review. The results: 13 - Yes (54.1%) 10 - No (41.6%) 1 - Undecided (4.1%) I think this tells us that there is an interest in at least looking at ways that the Vs could be more effective, but that many people are a little leery of too much change. I think it's important that both perspectives are respected, but, since more people did indicate an interest in continuing the discussion than wanted to stop it, that we continue the debate. I think it would be useful to hear a few dissenting views... I voted yes, because I think the only way the Vs can actually have influence in the game is to be better organized. And, I think the game would benefit from having the Vs more involved. It's really that simple. What's complicated is figuring out how to change and what kind of change is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. unlike on other threads where there seems to be all kinds of weird unsaid intentions and veiled venom from people who have no reason not to be direct and honest with the whole Voyageur community. Jeffrey, with respect, that part is not necessary unless you want another flame war. Most Voyageurs I've met (and I've met quite a few) have been straight forward and have no hidden agenda. I (and quite a few other V's) am getting tired of having this board used as a personal blog. Back to the topic of voting ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 quote:Originally posted by redhat Jeffrey, with respect, that part is not necessary unless you want another flame war. Most Voyageurs I've met (and I've met quite a few) have been straight forward and have no hidden agenda. I (and quite a few other V's) am getting tired of having this board used as a personal blog. Back to the topic of voting ... Most Voyageurs who have worked for the group's overall good have done well, I'd say 95%. Amateurly, but well, hardly anything we have ever done has been close to professional, as understandable when we are talking about volunteers. But that is not the point, the point is that we have had three threads closed in the last few weeks on the very subject of this thread, which I am glad has survived (though many have just ignored, it, there are not enough votes to draw conclusions unfortunately). When I see that attempts to even consider reviewing the organizational structure are being drowned out then I get worried, because I think it is unfair and insulting to the dozens of Vs who have worked hard, sacrificed time and money, taken heat, responded to criticism, and have not taken childish fits in the crunch. I think the structure should probably change, for financial reasons especially, but also because if you have accountablity with an elected board they know they are accountable, respond to everyone symbolically and legally, and you have every right and the formal means to channel comments and criticism about their actions. And the chance to replace them if you see fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJB Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masster Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 I know I am late but my vote is yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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