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Canada’s women’s U-20 team announced its roster to


CoachRich

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I watched the second half of the USA's 3-0 win over France. Beautiful game to watch. The intelligence and ball movement on both sides was quite high. Skillwise the players are three years from U17, but group mentality and tactics wise the gap is much wider. Just goes to show you how far the women's game has come to watch a U20 like that.

Sydney Leroux came on as a sub at 0-0 and turned the game on it's head. She used her pace to burst to a ball down the right-hand side of the box and cut a penetrating pass along the ground to the center of the box which was finished beautifully by a teammate. Then three minutes later she was returned the favour identically from a teammate in an almost identical goal with her being on the receiving end this time. She finished it all off with a nodding header off a cross from the top of the 6, beating the onrushing keeper to the ball.

Quite the day at the office for her.

The USA has someone on their bench, I presume it's DiCicco who has to be the worst micromanager EVER. All you could hear the entire game was him giving orders every, I kid you not, 5-10 seconds. It was brutal and painful to hear. At one point he yelled something derogatory towards one of his players and they put the camera on her and the look on her face was rage. Her game went south from that moment on. I would have paid a lot of money to hear one of his plays say "Hey, shut the [insert your favourite expletive] up!"

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I want to give credit where credit is due. The CBC has/is supporting this tournament and our team very well.

Today's match is sports headline #2 on http://www.cbc.ca/sports/

There are no less than 5 feature videos on the team here: http://www.cbc.ca/sports/ondemand/

And of course they are bringing us live streamed action followed by Tape Delay on the main network (not Bold thank you very much).

Well Done CBC, well done.

.... Now if we could only switch out Sportsnet for you as our "National Broadcast Partner" we'd be set.....

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  • 3 weeks later...

Actually had an interesting thought on Leroux today. She's a strong player at the U20's, but now the ground rules now change quite a bit. When you consider the American arsenal up front, it's a pretty tough ticket to play on their WNT. For starters, she plays the same position as Abby Wambach. Thanks for coming out until she retires. And even when she does you've got to take a spot from a lot of great young strikers they use:

Lauren Cheney (21)

Amy Rodriguez (21)

Natasha Kai (25)

Heather O'Reilly (23)

Kerri Hanks (23)

Casey Nogueira (19)

Not only that, every year you can add at least another great player to that list out of their massive farm system.

If you look at the age and quality of the players the US WNT uses up front and has coming... the phrase "wrong place at the wrong time" comes to mind.

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In fairness though you could argue that she was in pretty tough company with players on the U20's and on the world stage and still managed to accomplish what she did. With those players that you mentioned, I don't think anyone's spot is solidified per say at the striker position (counting O'Reilly as a flank player), in a "Wambach" type sense. It is kind of sick though when think about the depth of talent that the US has. Also, don't forget Leroux still has one more U20 World Cup to go as well. What I am interested to know is if the US will cap her ASAP at the senior level, so at least they know she is all theirs if they choose to use her.

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Good eye on HAO. Didn't think anyone would notice.

Should be interesting to see how she continues to develop. Will they cap her? At some point they'll bring her to a senior camp and see how she does. And if it works out, from watching her repeatedly pound the US Soccer logo on her shirt when she scored, I doubt she'll even blink when they do.

I read a really great article a few years back on the odds of cracking the ManU lineup. I'll see if I can dig it up in the next couple of days. One of the main points was it's not just being good enough at your age class, because there are guy's like Giggs and Rooney who will hold their position for 10-15 years.

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If Canada had not brought Leroux to Thailand at AGE 14 to a U20 event the US would never had noticed her. Canada made it too easy for Lerouz. How can there not be better U20 than she was at U14. It is much easier to get noticed in the US if you can say that I went to a U20 FIFA WORLD CUP event at U14. That is one of the many problems with the Canadian system.Leroux is still eligible for the Next U20 event. Take your best team. Do not weaken your teams by letting them play up and not playing their own age.IMO Lam Feist should of played with the U17's not the U20. She probably would of scored several goals and the U17 would of had a chance of making it to the final four. Kara Lang should of gone to the U20 event in Russia but she had played so many games with the women team she did not wnat to go to the U20. She was actually told by the technical director at the time that she had to go to CONCACAF. Maybe Canada would of got out of the first round IF she would of been there. There were many 1986 and 1987 that should of been selected to go to Russia that were bypasssed for 1989 and 1988 and 1990's. If Canada would of taken the NCAA players they would of done MUCH better. How could of they had done worse. I know many of the NCAA players said no to Russia as they were not played at CONCACAF.IMO they would of gotten out of their group.The NCAA players have so much experience playing at a high level and the U20 Canadian team in 2006 played many high school players that looked like a deer caught in a headlight. Maybe the CSA will learn their lessons fo the next U17 and U20 events. How did the residency for the U20 team this year help them. They did not get out of their group again in 2008. The U17 team did not have the luxury of Kerfoot money and have a residency and they made it to the fiaal 8 teams. They had to fundraise to go to France and World Cup in New Zealand a week early.The U17 players were not carded and paid over 3000.00 as all of the U20 players were paid.

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quote:Originally posted by basics

If Canada had not brought Leroux to Thailand at AGE 14 to a U20 event the US would never had noticed her. Canada made it too easy for Lerouz. How can there not be better U20 than she was at U14. It is much easier to get noticed in the US if you can say that I went to a U20 FIFA WORLD CUP event at U14. That is one of the many problems with the Canadian system.Leroux is still eligible for the Next U20 event. Take your best team. Do not weaken your teams by letting them play up and not playing their own age.IMO Lam Feist should of played with the U17's not the U20. She probably would of scored several goals and the U17 would of had a chance of making it to the final four. Kara Lang should of gone to the U20 event in Russia but she had played so many games with the women team she did not wnat to go to the U20. She was actually told by the technical director at the time that she had to go to CONCACAF. Maybe Canada would of got out of the first round IF she would of been there. There were many 1986 and 1987 that should of been selected to go to Russia that were bypasssed for 1989 and 1988 and 1990's. If Canada would of taken the NCAA players they would of done MUCH better. How could of they had done worse. I know many of the NCAA players said no to Russia as they were not played at CONCACAF.IMO they would of gotten out of their group.The NCAA players have so much experience playing at a high level and the U20 Canadian team in 2006 played many high school players that looked like a deer caught in a headlight. Maybe the CSA will learn their lessons fo the next U17 and U20 events. How did the residency for the U20 team this year help them. They did not get out of their group again in 2008. The U17 team did not have the luxury of Kerfoot money and have a residency and they made it to the fiaal 8 teams. They had to fundraise to go to France and World Cup in New Zealand a week early.The U17 players were not carded and paid over 3000.00 as all of the U20 players were paid.

Hey basics, did you say the U17 players had to pay $3000? I heard they didn't,cause there were some "mystery" money came in after CONCACAF along with some new players.

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quote:Originally posted by basics

If Canada had not brought Leroux to Thailand at AGE 14 to a U20 event the US would never had noticed her. Canada made it too easy for Lerouz. How can there not be better U20 than she was at U14. It is much easier to get noticed in the US if you can say that I went to a U20 FIFA WORLD CUP event at U14. That is one of the many problems with the Canadian system.Leroux is still eligible for the Next U20 event. Take your best team. Do not weaken your teams by letting them play up and not playing their own age.IMO Lam Feist should of played with the U17's not the U20. She probably would of scored several goals and the U17 would of had a chance of making it to the final four. Kara Lang should of gone to the U20 event in Russia but she had played so many games with the women team she did not wnat to go to the U20. She was actually told by the technical director at the time that she had to go to CONCACAF. Maybe Canada would of got out of the first round IF she would of been there. There were many 1986 and 1987 that should of been selected to go to Russia that were bypasssed for 1989 and 1988 and 1990's. If Canada would of taken the NCAA players they would of done MUCH better. How could of they had done worse. I know many of the NCAA players said no to Russia as they were not played at CONCACAF.IMO they would of gotten out of their group.The NCAA players have so much experience playing at a high level and the U20 Canadian team in 2006 played many high school players that looked like a deer caught in a headlight. Maybe the CSA will learn their lessons fo the next U17 and U20 events. How did the residency for the U20 team this year help them. They did not get out of their group again in 2008. The U17 team did not have the luxury of Kerfoot money and have a residency and they made it to the fiaal 8 teams. They had to fundraise to go to France and World Cup in New Zealand a week early.The U17 players were not carded and paid over 3000.00 as all of the U20 players were paid.

basics, I completely agree. The whole point of the Youth Tournaments is for development, so why not give as many players as possible the opportunity to train for, and the international experience provided with a Youth World Cup. Although I did see Sydney at 14 and to be honest I thought she was in the top 21 for sure and deserved to be there. At the same time, to give a spot to a player that young, unless she was going to be a dominant force in the tournament, I dont think is a good idea. A player with that kind of talent, I think could benefit from having to work to earn the spot, and another player with the experience of a World Cup is never a bad thing. Every other country seems to stick to the oldest birth years, I don't understand why we don't. Why not let a Monica Lam-Feist be with her own age, and if she is good enough with the U20's, reap the confidence from being dominant within her own age group.

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There are a couple of roles you can use with teambuilding. The veteran, the youngster, the outcast, the hard-done-by player, etc. If you pick the right person they can add value to the whole. Some coaches also like to pick a young player to become the captain/veteran the following cycle.

Lam-Feist should have been advised to participate at the U17 if she wanted to participate in the U20. The tournaments were far enough apart. Like I said, other nations (who have a soccer culture if you will) don't play games and have their best on the field.

Fifteen year old Rosie White scored a hat trick in the U17 and another in the U20.

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quote:Originally posted by basics

I did NOT SAY The U17 had to pay $3000.00. I said the U20 ALL received money to go to Chile.The U17 DID NOT RECEIVE any money.

I often read these pages, but have never posted.The one thing I repeatedly see is people posting things, stated as fact, when there is rarely an accurate picture being drawn. I love reading the posts that actually offer some information and refrain from making the big leap to a judgement without considering that the info the decisions are based on might not be complete.

I, for sure, don't have the answers, just some additional questions and observations.

In this case, recently, the budgets for the National Teams for the past two years (and the next one)was leaked to the public. It showed the U20 and U17 budgets being almost identical for the two year cycle leading to the World Cups, with the U17 program having a budget in year one and the U20 having NO budget in year one- that was bizzare. Apparently, that was made up for in year two. The two were funded in an almost identical way in the end.

I asked some people about the Chile and France trips, and I understand that both the hosts countries picked up a great deal of the costs, but I dont know how good my sources are. When I read here that players had to pay to play, I was horrified. This did not happen did it? And you are backing off that statement?

The teams were given budgets and spent to those budgets.

Were you talking about the CSA/Sport Canada carding status of the players? I dont understand that process at all, but it is very rare for u17 players to receive carding to train full time isnt it? They cant train full time, they are in High School? I dont know.

I am also told that Kerfoot did not provide any dollars to the U20 program, only to the seniors. He apparently helped with some subsidized housing for the U20 players during their training in Vancouver.

As for Lam Feist, I have to wonder after she scored several goals in CONCACAF qualifying (and started those games)if she wasnt carrying an injury of some sort into Chile- causing her to not have the impact that eveyone thought she would have. I think the answer to the debate over where she should have played (U17 vs U20) would be effected by what kind of role she would have had with the U20 program and how ready she was for dealing with the higher level of play. It looked to me like she was a core player at the U20 level and handled herself well. We just dont know why that changed in Chile.

And that is the rub, we rarely have all the info, yet based on faulty premises, we make judgements about the decisions taken for the programs.

Just my two cents...

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^ I've been meaning to reply to this one just been away and wanted to get back and dig up this quote I had buried in some research I once did:

"Speech is civilization itself. The word, even the most contradictory word, preserves contact - it is silence which isolates."

- Thomas Mann

It really is quite appropriate. Quick judgements and decisions are the landscape of an online forum, and informal discussion in general whether in the living room, local tavern or workplace. I can't remember the psychologist, but their statistic was we make hundreds if not thousands of decisions a day. Which socks shall I wear, shall I turn left here or the next block, etc. We don't analyze everything we do, and if we did life would be pretty bleak.

I'm adult enough to be able to separate the wheat from the chaff, and opinion from fact. No one has all the facts, and no one has the truth. And that includes those coaching programs and at the CSA. Experience and wisdom is not limited to the individual selected to run any program - there is a lot of it here as well. Point being everyone on all sides bases their judgements on incomplete information (and everyone is also politically derived but that's a story for another day).

Nickel and diming program differences is missing the point. The supply-and-demand economics of soccer is Canada is not like the rest of the world. Soccer here is a pay-to-play sport, and you don't get to the elite level without spending tens of thousands of dollars in money and time value. Even if these ladies were covered for some things, participating in those programs cost them all a lot of money and time they could have gained by not participating. And that's all the programs - U17, U20, WNT.

Our women's programs are both nationally representative programs and involve the public purse, so budgets, staff/player selection, and performance should and needs to be accountable. And to reference the quote above, to close our eyes and ears and mouths and breathe blind faith actually takes us backwards, not forwards.

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quote:Originally posted by Vic

Quick judgements and decisions are the landscape of an online forum, and informal discussion in general whether in the living room, local tavern or workplace.

http://www.gladwell.com/blink/index.html

What is Blink about?

1. What is "Blink" about?

It's a book about rapid cognition, about the kind of thinking that happens in a blink of an eye. When you meet someone for the first time, or walk into a house you are thinking of buying, or read the first few sentences of a book, your mind takes about two seconds to jump to a series of conclusions. Well, "Blink" is a book about those two seconds, because I think those instant conclusions that we reach are really powerful and really important and, occasionally, really good.

The book has some very relevant explanations for a lot of ways we make decisions, and supports those that come from "thin slicing", perhaps we need some of coaching staff and talent identifiers learn to thin slice intelligently

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"... occasionally, really good"

Exactly. And what about the rest of the time?

I read the book and it is excellent. It does imply that we have to have some tools/skills and a load of info from the surrounding environment to make those accurate thin slice decisions... And when we posters do have that, I think some really great things are said- it is what makes the boards interesting to read.

Vic,

I love your response. Excellent. Intelligent and well thought out.

The issue I have is when someone comes on the board and makes a statement of fact (I believe almost always misguided) and then with our own lenses of mostly negative expression, we run with that new FACT.

Having said that, raising questions and having debate is great and creates some interest in a level of play that quite frankly, does not have a big following.

Of course, I am not coming on here and questioning the idea of posting and debating, just the idea that we sometimes get carried away with hogwash.

I am intersted in hearing your experiences/observations from the coaching courses you describe, as you clearly have some thoughts there that might be interesting to share. It is in those experiences that I think we can learn something and be entertained. Please share?

Once again, thin slicing and jumping over a performance or a selection without asking if there is some other info (injury, sickness,team issue,tactical role, discipline, etc.) we dont have, doesn't really make sense to me.

But I don't know too much anyways, so I will just go back to enjoying reading some intelligent posts and some drivel:D

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quote:Originally posted by Bill Ault

^Gladwell's new book "Outliers" is well worth the read and even has some sport related applications - although he uses a hockey analogy - what he say would be applicable to soccer as well. Wow - when did the forum become the Book of the Month Club? :D

Geez... Bill I thought everyone read a book a month, well except a certian national team coach.

Does anyone remember reading the old Football Association manual in hardcover ..with its red and black diagrams, it must have been a thousand pages.

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