joga bonito Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Ottawa Citizen article today: http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/sports/story.html?id=4565a5fb-8175-429d-baa5-2b00f08aaec6 I think there are also 2 canadian women playing with Santos pro W-league team. Great opportunity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Canuck Oranje, which national competition will Nacional play in next year? I see they were not in Serie A for 2007 and they're not in the top Paulista Torneo for 2008. Are they even going to be in a national tourny? If not, what Paulista competition are they in? Never mind, i found the info. Nacional were relegated from the Paulista A2 last season and will be playing in the A3 competition this year (they won their first match). They will NOT be playing either of the Serie A or B national competitions in 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyr Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 quote:Originally posted by jpg75 Never mind, i found the info. Nacional were relegated from the Paulista A2 last season and will be playing in the A3 competition this year (they won their first match). They will NOT be playing either of the Serie A or B national competitions in 2008. So what does that say about this statement in Richard Starnes article? quote:The five Nepean City Gunners have earned the chance to try out for the under 18 squad with Nacional, Sao Paulo, one of Brazil's most esteemed professional clubs. It could still be true I suppose, but it seems unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joga bonito Posted January 28, 2008 Author Share Posted January 28, 2008 [quoteSo what does that say about this statement in Richard Starnes article? quote:The five Nepean City Gunners have earned the chance to try out for the under 18 squad with Nacional, Sao Paulo, one of Brazil's most esteemed professional clubs. It could still be true I suppose, but it seems unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyr Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 quote:Originally posted by joga bonito After re-reading my post I can see how you could take it that way. So, I apologize. In no way did I mean that these kids shouldn't go or would not benefit from such an experience - regardless as to whether they end up playing professionally one day or not. I simply wanted to know more about the history of Nacional from Sao Paulo as I have never heard of them before. I have heard of Nacional of Uruguay and of Columbia but not of Nacional from Brazil. Starnes claimed they were "one of the most esteemed clubs in Brazil" without any further information (like the information you have provided) which made it sound like he was exaggerating - as does the headline claiming these kids are somehow 'Stars' (Although he may have had nothing to do with the headline). Otherwise, I agree with everything that the article asserts (regarding Rene Simoes and the state of the game in Canada) and I hope these kids blaze a trail for other Canadians to follow. Why are you making this so personal anyway?.. I've never lived in Toronto... that really hurt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 Seriously, JB why would you even bring up Toronto? I only asked what level their senior team was at so i could update the Canucks Abroad list on BigSoccer. http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showpost.php?p=13737351&postcount=48 Might want to keep that chip on your shoulder in check and not spout off... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 Good luck to those kids. My impression from reading post from members over the last couple of years is that if plsyers aren't associated with the a National program,Whitecaps residency program or some other high profile team then those players can't be very good. If Canadian/provincial coaches haven't spotted them, then they must be crap. Only they have the eye for spotting talent.ha,ha. So what if it isn't top level. Hey, its in Brazi and you'll find some of the best coaching there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 ^ I think alot of Canadian soccer supporters know and understand that ALOT of good talent goes unscouted and undiscovered by provincial programs, national programes, etc... Our provincial and national youth team programs are very incestous. They are hardly representative of the best Canadian talent available. As for these young men going to Brazil, I applaud them and their parents for being willing to take a "less conventional" route to a pro soccer career. These boys are about to embark on a unique cultural experience. They will become immersed in Brazilian soccer culture, eating, breathing, sleeping soccer, 24 hrs a day, 6-7 days a week. There is nothing in North America that approximates this experience. Regardless if they are invited to stay with the team or not, these boys are winners just for being willing to take a risk and make the commitment to themselves to be the best players that they can be. I would love to see more youth clubs seek to establish relationships with clubs in South America and Europe that have a tradition of developing young players and try to negotiate player exchanges so that we can send some of our best 16 and 17 year olds to become immersed in the game the way these boys will. The ones who dont make it and come home will be able to tell their teammates back in Canada what its like to REALLY train to be a footballer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 To elaborate on what VPjr. said, most of us do understand that alot of kids get looked over here in Canada. What we'd like to know is "who are these kids?", give us names, facts, who looked them over and what were the reasons for that. Too many people pop in here and make broad statements of discrimination/incompetence without any real facts. And in fact most of the top kids will have bolted before getting to the Whitecaps residency, Provincial teams etc. Like David Edgar, Jonathan De Guzman, Kyle Silva, Abde Sylla and all the other 12-15 year olds who have or will go to Europe because scouts see something special in them. And yes, good luck to the kids. If even one of them gets a pro contract it will have a positive effect on Canadian soccer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joga bonito Posted January 28, 2008 Author Share Posted January 28, 2008 quote: After re-reading my post I can see how you could take it that way. So, I apologize. In no way did I mean that these kids shouldn't go or would not benefit from such an experience - regardless as to whether they end up playing professionally one day or not. Peace then...I did read it the way you though I would read it. As you know...we've been through a near rebellion in 2007 with all the CSA affair and the apparent apathy to change anything, I tend to be very defensive for those who try something different. At least they're trying! quote: Why are you making this so personal anyway?.. I've never lived in Toronto... that really hurt! I lived there once. That explains it? [:I] As for those boys, yeah calling them "stars" was a bit far fetched without any supporting information. I am waiting to hear from my friends in Montreal. They apparently know thatwoman mentioned by Starnes. They're supposed to connect with her today to find out more about the trip. Will let you know, if it is of interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyr Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 quote:Will let you know, if it is of interest. Most definitely. Please keep us informed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joga bonito Posted January 29, 2008 Author Share Posted January 29, 2008 quote:Originally posted by Martyr Most definitely. Please keep us informed! here's the scoop that I got on this story from my contact: 1- Young stars? Well maybe. One player was captain of Ontario Prov squad and the Cdn national U16s training squad last year. Don't know if still involved with the nationals. Two others were part of the Ont. provincial satellite program. 2- All those boys have been to Brazil at least once before. 3- It's the real deal - these kids are not paying a dime to the club for the 2 month stint. They just pay their living expenses because they live off campus. Apparently competing with over 50 brazilians for those 22 spots. 4- Nacional is an old established club on prime real estate next to a few other big clubs, but they're very poor cash wise so they just focus on farming to sell players. Apparently their bleechers have scouts from the big clubs on a regular basis at practices and friendlies. That's all I've got. Man...wish I was in their shoes![8D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyr Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Here are some different views of Nacional AC's stadium in Sao Paulo... as well as some contact information if any media types lurking might be interested and following up on the story. http://www.timesbrasileiros.misterhost.com.br/SP/nacional.htm http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_pictures/south_america/brazil/sao_paulo/sao_paulo_alayon.shtml http://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&hl=en&t=k&om=1&ll=-23.518206,-46.684754&spn=0.003473,0.005021&z=18 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joga bonito Posted January 29, 2008 Author Share Posted January 29, 2008 quote:Originally posted by Martyr Here are some different views of Nacional AC's stadium in Sao Paulo... as well as some contact information if any media types lurking might be interested and following up on the story. http://www.timesbrasileiros.misterhost.com.br/SP/nacional.htm http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_pictures/south_america/brazil/sao_paulo/sao_paulo_alayon.shtml http://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&hl=en&t=k&om=1&ll=-23.518206,-46.684754&spn=0.003473,0.005021&z=18 Thanks! Look again at the google map and scroll southwest for a few blocks...much bigger stadium (and club?) next door? [^] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 thanks for the research Joga. I think these boys were part of a group of young men who went down to Brazil in 2007 for a week or two of training. It was profiled in Inside Soccer magazine. It was a very interesting article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
way2goeh Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 Its funny. I live in São Paulo and I have never heard of this clube. I asked a few friends about them and they have heard of the name but didn't know where they were from. I didn't even know Agua Branca had a stadium and I work in the burb. Shows how little I know[] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 Fantastic to see Canadians playing in South America. I think the SA leagues are often underrated, and I'm glad these Canadians are getting the attention they deserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 First of all, when I posted in the World Soccer section, I wasn't aware that they were just going to Brazil. Ok, About Nacional and the Federacao Paulista de Futebol(FPF). First, the FPF has a regular U-17 and U20 League. Training for these teams begins right after Carnival (I know because the son of a Brazilian friend played at that level last year). There are a few tournaments that take place prior to the league. The biggest one is the Taca Belo Horizonte de Juniores. But this is a U-20 tournament. If they make this team it will be most likely under amateur contracts. As for Nacional AC, they have traditionally had a good youth team and their training centre sits near the Palestra Italia (Palmeiras). Last year, the team did not do that well in U-20 getting eliminated at the first phase of the tournament and they did not field a U-17 team. As for scouts in the stands, that would be the case at any significant youth team in Sao Paulo. AS for their senior team, they are ranked 278th and probably tied for that because the point total is 2. Yes, they are at the A3 level of the Paulista. It is not a bad level but probably not MLS but some teams would be close.. Either way, they will not be playing Series A or B and also not Serie C. Still, spending two months in Sao Paulo playing soccer will be an experience like no other. There are so many good youth teams within public transit distance. Best of luck to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Congratulations to these kids and I hope they realize that being at the practices is NOT "making it". I hope they understand that only extreme effort, patience and acceptance of a different culture will open up the doors to them and any other canadian players who are that serious. Above all I congratulate them because they chose to go to the continent where technique is embrace as the essence of the game, because after all that is the biggest problem we have in Canada's national teams. GOOD FOR THEM and anybody else who supports these kind of initiatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joga bonito Posted February 4, 2008 Author Share Posted February 4, 2008 quote: Still, spending two months in Sao Paulo playing soccer will be an experience like no other. There are so many good youth teams within public transit distance. Exactly...and who knows what will happen! quote:Congratulations to these kids and I hope they realize that being at the practices is NOT "making it". I hope they understand that only extreme effort, patience and acceptance of a different culture will open up the doors to them and any other canadian players who are that serious You got that right. If only one or two can go a bit farther and actually play in that U17 league, it may open the others for some others who would have never thought this possible. I heard Steven Harper wanted to increase trade with Brazil.How about we send them players and they send us coaches! That's the kind of raw material I don't mind shipping to be processed in another country[)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 The U-17's would be for 1991's and younger. However, it could be that Nacional may be looking at 1990's too because the January 2009 Copa Sao Paulo de Juniores would use them as well. But it would be a long process for the boys to make that team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joga bonito Posted February 8, 2008 Author Share Posted February 8, 2008 quote:Originally posted by Canuck Oranje The U-17's would be for 1991's and younger. However, it could be that Nacional may be looking at 1990's too because the January 2009 Copa Sao Paulo de Juniores would use them as well. But it would be a long process for the boys to make that team. Here ya go. Finally found their site: www.nacionalatleticoclube.com.br/futebol.htm Guess we'll have to keep an eye on that "sub17" tab in the coming weeks![8D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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