fan Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Toronto FC's much heralded youth soccer academy that starts today at BMO Field is in danger of being scuttled by the very same groups that have made a laughing stock of the Canadian Soccer Association, a prominent coach told Sun Media yesterday. Club teams sabotaging TFC academy, coach says By DEAN MCNULTY, SUN MEDIA Add to Facebook Toronto FC's much heralded youth soccer academy that starts today at BMO Field is in danger of being scuttled by the very same groups that have made a laughing stock of the Canadian Soccer Association, a prominent coach told Sun Media yesterday. Barry MacLean, a two-time national championship winning men's and women's soccer coach at Wilfrid Laurier University, is blaming a lighter than expected registration of young players at the TFC academy on local amateur organizations that allegedly are urging their top players to stay away. MacLean, who is acting as a guest coach at the TFC academy tryouts, said such behaviour will only result in Canada's brightest and best young player's having their development stifled. Messages were left for several local soccer clubs yesterday by Sun Media, but none would respond to MacLean's criticism. Ontario Soccer Association CEO Guy Bradbury said in a telephone interview yesterday that the issue of club teams keeping players away from the TFC academy has not crossed his desk. "I'm not aware of that happening," he said. "Nobody has contacted my office about it." MacLean said he has heard from several soccer people that it is happening and that the sport will be poorer for it. Heres the link http://www.torontosun.com/Sports/OtherSports/2008/01/22/4786598-sun.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick10 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 what benefits can you get from the toronto fc academy. Aside from a better development , what else are they offering young players to come play for them? Is there any money involded? international tournaments? do they have to pay to play for the toronto fc? I m trying to think what good reasons can attached the young good players to their clubs. As far as i know there is not money involved in rep and in most cases the players have to pay for their own registration every year right?. I remember when i play oysl , we had to pay our own registration and also get our own rides to the games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forthegoodofthegame Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 There are very few reasons why anyone would want to participate in the TFC youth academy. The MLS has a poor history of developing players from their own academies. Largely in part due to the poor reserve league that they have. The reserve league only plays a handfull of games every year and it's just not enough for quality development. I heard Barry Maclean is the agent of Mo Johnson and that is the reason he is promoting TFC so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmynow Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 the kids do not have to play for TFC... TFC has rights to keep 2 players per year away from other MLS teams at draft time if the kid has been in the academy for 2 years. Otherwise the kid has every right to leave and pursue options elsewhere. here are other details: http://web.mlsnet.com/t280/youth/academy/faq/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by rick10 what benefits can you get from the toronto fc academy. Aside from a better development , what else are they offering young players to come play for them? Is there any money involded? international tournaments? do they have to pay to play for the toronto fc? I m trying to think what good reasons can attached the young good players to their clubs. As far as i know there is not money involved in rep and in most cases the players have to pay for their own registration every year right?. I remember when i play oysl , we had to pay our own registration and also get our own rides to the games It's free. TFC Academy Below you will find answers to frequently asked questions. Information will be posted as we finalize details for the TFC Academy. Q: What is the Toronto FC Academy? A: The Toronto FC Academy is a fully-funded, player development program designed to provide elite young Canadian soccer players with an opportunity to reach their technical, tactical, mental, and physical potential with Toronto FC. Q: What will be the age of the TFC Academy players? A: Toronto FC will start with both a boys U-18 and U-16. Players will need to be born in the years 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, and 1994 to be eligible for the squad. Q: How will players be selected for the TFC Academy? A: Players will be selected from the TFC Academy Open Tryouts. All players who wish to tryout must register online at www.torontofc.ca, and must meet the age requirements. Players will also be assessed through the existing District / Regional / Provincial scouting and player development programs in place at the Ontario Soccer Association. Q: What will be the cost for the players who make the TFC Academy? A: There will be no cost for the players that make the TFC Academy teams. The players who enter the program will have their training expenses and equipment provided for them. In addition to training and equipment, travel expenses for TFC Academy related tournaments and games will also be covered. Q: Will Toronto FC provide housing? A: Toronto FC will not be providing any housing accommodations in year one. Players that are accepted into the program will need to make their own arrangements. All players will be expected to attend all training sessions. Q: How many players will be selected for the TFC Academy? A: No cap has been placed on the number of players in the TFC Academy. The plan is to select approximately 20-30 players for each team. Q: Will players in the TFC Academy be allowed to play for their local clubs? A: Players enrolled in the TFC Academy will not be allowed to play for any additional soccer clubs. Toronto FC will be the player's club. Q: How often will the TFC Academy train? A: Players will train three to four days a week. The schedule for training will be released once the squads are announced. Q: Where will the TFC Academy train? A: Training sessions will take place at BMO Field on the Exhibition Grounds. The grounds are accessible by car, TTC, and by GO Train. The stadium offers opportunities for access to professional locker rooms, strength and conditioning room, media conference room, players lounge, as well all the medical facilities required for a modern professional sports team. Q: Who will be coaching the TFC Academy? A: Mike Matkovich (Toronto FC assistant coach) will be the Academy Director. Qualified and highly professional Head and Assistant coaches will be hired and announced as we approach the beginning of the training season. Q: Will participation in the TFC Academy affect college/university eligibility? A: A player's eligibility will not be affected by participating in the TFC Academy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ag futbol Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by forthegoodofthegame There are very few reasons why anyone would want to participate in the TFC youth academy. The MLS has a poor history of developing players from their own academies. Largely in part due to the poor reserve league that they have. The reserve league only plays a handfull of games every year and it's just not enough for quality development. I heard Barry Maclean is the agent of Mo Johnson and that is the reason he is promoting TFC so much. Well I think it's necessary to differentiate what's going on here. The reserve league for the Dev roster is separate from the "youth teams" TFC fields. I agree that MLS's record on developing talent has been spotty, but it's getting better and it's safe to say it already surpasses what the amateur clubs are offering. The Barry Maclean thing stinks like rotten fish. I understand that it's important to develop good business relationships but having this guy as an agent / club coach creates a clear conflict of interest in my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 MacLean is not TFC Academy Coach,he is around because of situation with Mike Matkovich "MacLean, who is acting as a guest coach at the TFC academy tryouts." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi44 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Did/do the Whitecaps have the same problem with their youth setup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bungey Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Club teams want to hang onto their best young players instead of inviting them to go join another club? Shocking! How dare they! Don't they know that TFC has arrived and automatically deserves access to all the best players in Canada without a fight? The TFC needs to realize that these clubs have been around for years and they are serious about soccer. Of course they will try to keep their players, and it's up to TFC to prove that they're the better option to lure these players away. I'm a bit stunned by the arrogance of TFC that they think local clubs will encourage their young players to leave for an academy that's about to open for its first year of operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 I've emailed a bunch of club execs and coachs from Ontario that are on my mailing list about this issue. I've received replies from a few. None of the people who have replied to me are aware of coaches in their club holding players back from trying out. If I am a club coach and one of my players gets chosen to the TFC academy, I'd be happy for the kid and proud that my club has done a good job of developing that player. 1 big question....does anyone think TFC has an obligation to pay the youth clubs a development fee when they pluck a kid from their club? If there is any arrogance on the part of TFC, it's that they have decided to start up an academy that will draw from the local player pool without any mention (publicly) of compensation to the clubs who will be losing players permanently (because these kids are not allowed to play for anyone but TFC). I think the academy is a great idea but there needs to be some commitment on the part of TFC / MLSE to show goodwill to the clubs that developed these players. Maybe if they promised to pay some type of transfer fee if the player makes it through the 1 year of the program, clubs might be more receptive. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Why should TFC pay anybody, they are providing the TFC academy program including travel, accommodation and subsistence for all away games to the players for free? If they sign one of their academy players to a pro contract at some stage there might be some point but how do you apportion development credit to an amateur club for the player's early soccer exposure after a few years of TFC academy other than some token amount? What if the player was with several different amateur clubs before joing the TFC academy? I don't think that's a workable idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by Bertuzzi44 Did/do the Whitecaps have the same problem with their youth setup? Yes they did in the early stages of their program but I don't believe it is an issue any longer. There was a good measure of resentment and resistance from amateur clubs early on. The Whitecaps have tweaked their programs and worked hard at community relations. Their Whitecaps Affiliate Y-League program is an excellent example of how they have appeased some of the resentment. The Whitecaps youngsters also do get to play in regular leagues depending upon their age, SYL, PDL and PCSL. The TFC academy so far will only play in tournaments and exhibitions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number6 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 With all due respect to the local clubs, I will at this moment assume the TFC club will be the elite club. I know a lot of very good people do club work, but I suspect the TFC academy hopefully will give us an international quality academy. I do think it is likely from how the CSA is dysfunctional that similar people WILL be trying to stifle the TFC development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 "at this moment assume the TFC club will be the elite club". Not unless they can attract the best players, coaches and trainers. "the TFC academy hopefully will give us an international quality academy" On FieldTurf? The pros don't think much of it. Aside from that I can see TFC building an excellent club. I really thing TFC needs to borrow a page from the Whitecaps book and work with the local clubs. The best players will naturally gravitate towards being closer to the pro league club over time. Don't aggravate the locals, reward them! For example: TFC-Jrs start off with the players they get and play against other clubs regularly. Players move from club to TFCJ and back regularly. TFC gets to see more players that way and the players get exposure to the TFC. The clubs can put together an AllStar team that can play the TFCJ team at BMO and split the proceeds. Have a club day at the BMO where you have several clubs playing in one day in a tournament. Split the proceeds. Just some ideas. Rewarding the clubs financially for developing the players is a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 I don't understand how is Youth club suppose to get credit for developing players when they are being payed by parents.I don't remember any of youth clubs in Ontario working free of charge,my kid cost me last year over $1000 for 1 year and he is U8 REP Team,as far I'm concern youth teams don't have any rights on this kids since they didn't spend a cent on them,parents did. To reward the club for developing players only if all costs are covered ,like TFC or Whitecaps academies,all other clubs .... well, sorry reward parents for sticking around for so long and paying a nice chunk of money to see their kids developing. In GTA average per kid is between $100-$150 per month depend is it Youth Club or Soccer Academy,I payed for my older son 10 years ago when we lived in Germany $40 yearly membership and that was covering all the cost and that was small club playing in 4-5 division. This just shows again how f*@ked up is system in Canada and no wonder CSA can't function properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by Richard Why should TFC pay anybody, they are providing the TFC academy program including travel, accommodation and subsistence for all away games to the players for free? If they sign one of their academy players to a pro contract at some stage there might be some point but how do you apportion development credit to an amateur club for the player's early soccer exposure after a few years of TFC academy other than some token amount? What if the player was with several different amateur clubs before joing the TFC academy? I don't think that's a workable idea. you bring up good points. I am certain that TFC could build goodwill locally through various other measures, not just paying a "transfer" fee. Coaching clinics, Player Clinics, Player appearances at important club events, etc... all would suffice just as well as a nominal transfer fee (and although I was not clear when I wrote my first post, I was only talking about nominal amounts of money). However, I am curious to learn how the process works in Europe. If a young man jumps from his local club to Sunderland's academy (just picked any club), does Sunderland pay the previous club a fee? I honestly don't know. Or, do the local clubs just wave the boys goodbye, full of pride because one of their own just graduated to a premiership side's academy. That could be the case. I just don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCF08 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 I think there is a FIFA rule that very little amount of clubs know about. Every International transfer that's being made by a player is of usage to teams that used to ''develop'' the player between the ages of 12/23. Those teams will actually get 5% of the transfer fee. Maybe it's not very clear so I'll try to explain it using a example. Lets say John Doe is a player of Calgary United between the age of 12/17,5 and he's such a talented lad that he makes a transfer to Toronto FC and completely rules the MLS until the age of 23. After that he gets transferred to Feyenoord that will pay MLS/TFC about 10 Million Dollars for his services. That means that both Calgary Utd and Toronto FC can claim a development percentage of 2,5% as they both ''developed'' the player for the same amount of time. 2,5% of 10 Million dollars = 250.000 Dollars for both Calgary United and TFC. Let's say John Doe does really well for Feyenoord which means an even bigger team will get interested and signs him for 50 Million Dollars....it mean that AGAIN Calgary United and TFC can claim their development share of 2,5% each. They can do that over and over again even if the players transfer 40 times to different clubs.. So you could say it's very interesting for amateur teams to sell their top talents to TFC because they can get chunks of cash , if he is succesfull and makes several foreign transfers in his career. It will also help the Canadian NT because young players are exposed to the highest level of football possible in North America , which will only increase their ability and offers them a platform to show off their stuff to the big teams who will never ever go to Calgary United to look for some talent [)] It's quite a complicated rule but it does exist and interesting to bring to the attention. Amateur teams in Holland have claimed huge amounts of cash and improved their facilities because of that. Quick Boys (Amateur side) in Holland received 375.000 Euro's because of Dirk Kuyt's transfer from Feyenoord to Liverpool. They've build a Dirk Kuyt stand , put more money in their youth academies , raised their wage budget a bit and are now shock surprise in the Quarter Finals of the Dutch Cup. Also the amateur teams of Ruud van Nistelrooy and Roy Makaay have done the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 ^ I agree that very few clubs in Canada are aware of how to get that money. The club that developed Owen Hargreaves, for instance, is in line for funds when he transfered from Bayern to Man U. Did they apply for those funds? Who knows. They would be fools if they did not because that's free money that they are entitled to if they are willing to do the paperwork. However, does this still apply if the young man moved from an amateur club to a pro club's academy at the age of 15 or 16? I could understand if the young man moves right into the professional club right away but if he is just moving from an amateur club to a pro academy, is the same access to a portion of transfer fees still an entitlement of the amateur club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick10 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 how can the local clubs hold players???? technically they can not hold anyone because the player is paying to play there. Its no different from you paying a yearly fee for the gym. You can leave whenever you want to. It may be different that the coaches are advicing their players not to try out for the toronto FC. Also , how is the toronto fc advertising its try outs? i didnt know they had a youth team or try outs. Is the toronto FC youth program advertised on tv? on indoor soccer tournaments? are there any scouts going around to the main inddor (or outdoor last summer)leagues or tournaments trying to take a look at the best players and offering them to come play for the toronto FC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 The Academy needs to have regular teams playing in a regular leagues (Super Y?). Top players won't sign on to only play only exhibition games and tournies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fort York Redcoat1555362293 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 At this point there is bound to be squabbling with not much to squabble about. Money will be exchanged after money is made. These kids have to pay to tryout for TFC which is never the best way to find the BEST quality just the best who can afford it. As for the other Canadian clubs, they can't start squawking in earnest till one of their kids become something of note for TFC. TFC is already realigning their focus on Canadian talent so I'm gonna sit back and enjoy the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by rick10 how can the local clubs hold players???? technically they can not hold anyone because the player is paying to play there. Its no different from you paying a yearly fee for the gym. You can leave whenever you want to. It may be different that the coaches are advicing their players not to try out for the toronto FC. Also , how is the toronto fc advertising its try outs? i didnt know they had a youth team or try outs. Is the toronto FC youth program advertised on tv? on indoor soccer tournaments? are there any scouts going around to the main inddor (or outdoor last summer)leagues or tournaments trying to take a look at the best players and offering them to come play for the toronto FC? Bang on !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by forthegoodofthegame There are very few reasons why anyone would want to participate in the TFC youth academy. The MLS has a poor history of developing players from their own academies. It's hard to have a "history" when MLS-mandated academies stretch back all the way to 2007. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyr Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 quote:Originally posted by SCF08 I think there is a FIFA rule that very little amount of clubs know about. Every International transfer that's being made by a player is of usage to teams that used to ''develop'' the player between the ages of 12/23. Those teams will actually get 5% of the transfer fee. This is the kind of thing the CSA should be working to ensure it gets back to Canadian clubs. If they are doing this I'd like to hear about the clubs who have benefited. Perhaps Barry MacLean is already doing this with the Canadian players he represents. If no one is doing the leg work it would interesting to find out why. While a payoff of this nature may be rare it would still be worth fighting for. I wonder if College or University programmes would be eligible to benefit? Are MLS paying NCAA schools? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 "as far I'm concern youth teams don't have any rights on this kids since they didn't spend a cent on them,parents did" Good point. As a parent and volunteer (manager/assistant coach/whatever) myself it is a valid concern that clubs try to milk this too much. Whenever money is involved it gets ugly quickly. A problem can occur when a club coach tells a player that "you can try out for TFC but if you don't make it I can't guarantee your position here" even though he knows as long as the parents are paying they will. The old FUD factor (fear, uncertainty, doubt) comes into play. Parents need to help their kids make the decisions and do what they feel is best for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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