Possible Structures for Voyageurs Inc.

[River City]

I'm not familiar with non-profit organizations (or for-profit organizations for that matter), but here is a sample structure to start this discussion.

EXECUTIVE:

President (CSA liaison)

Secretary

Treasurer

Media Relations

Fundraising/Merchandising

REGIONAL REPS:

Maritimes

Montreal

Toronto

Winnipeg

Saskatchewan

Calgary

Edmonton

Vancouver

PROJECT MANAGERS:

Voyageur Cup

Voyageur Songs

Christmas Cards

Special Ops Missions (find Archundia, ensure visiting teams can't sleep well at night, etc)

HONOURARY DIRECTORS:

Jack Warner

[piltdownman]

Here something from Industry Canada

http://strategis.gc.ca/epic/site/cilp-pdci.nsf/en/cl00691e.html

[JesseDart]

Okay you've twisted my arm. I'll take the Saskatchewan post.

[River City]

Great to see the enthusiasm JesseDart, but we need to figure out what kind of structure we need first. Once that is decided, we can do a different post to vote for candidates for each position. You're the first candidate for the Saskatchewan post (assuming we agree on regional reps).

[Winnipeg Fury]

quote:Originally posted by JesseDart

Okay you've twisted my arm. I'll take the Saskatchewan post.

Could you start by stating more precisely, where you live. How about putting it under your name like the rest of us. Thanks

[nolando]

quote:Originally posted by Winnipeg Fury

Could you start by stating more precisely, where you live. How about putting it under your name like the rest of us. Thanks

This sums it all up for me really....many are shouting for an organized group (and let me say again that I am not completely against it) and yet the vast majority of us don't even post with our real names, most still don't even want to mention our home cities. The first scarf order also showed many of us what can happen when we mistake friendly board members with reliable partners or friends.

Just don't see it happening guys...but more power to you for trying.

[River City]

Ok guys, if this is to go anywhere, please discuss the merits of incorporating on the other thread. Let's keep this one for possible structures please.....

[hamiltonfan]

This is the ext step needed to grow.

I also believe there should be a USA Rep. Cuncucks like me who live in the States will love their Nats, and with more Canada games in the United States than in Canada, it only makes sense.

[piltdownman]

I found This website which might help : http://www.charityvillage.com/cv/main.asp

Its a website for non-profits in Canada

[CoachRich]

IMO what you should do is have a brief Mission Statement or Goals of the Society in a sticky of your intentions to form a society w/ replies not enabled. State that those that are interested & can agree to the rough draft of the stated Mission Statement or Goals of the Society should PM the Admin.

Once screened by the Admin they gain access to a Private Forum where to you can use your own names & etc to develop a plan for your bylaws, constitution & etc. Creating a NPO is simple & anyone in the forums here that belongs to a Club should have the basic understandings of how a NPO functions.

By leaving the present forum/thread public you are subject to a lot of chatter & distractions.

The concept of a NPO for the fans at a National level is a very good & sound concept as presently there is a lot of pushing & pulling w/in the structure of soccer on what is the best for the game. You have the CSA (NSO) Provincial (PSO) leagues (pro, senior & youth) youth districts, clubs (pro & amatuer), academies & etc. Everyone has there own concept of what the national template or development pathway should be for the sport. Knowing what the fans what as they are the marekt that buy the tickets & suppor soccer top to bottom is appropiate & very valuable.

[rdroze]

quote:Originally posted by CoachRich

IMO what you should do is have a brief Mission Statement or Goals of the Society in a sticky of your intentions to form a society w/ replies not enabled. State that those that are interested & can agree to the rough draft of the stated Mission Statement or Goals of the Society should PM the Admin.

Once screened by the Admin they gain access to a Private Forum where to you can use your own names & etc to develop a plan for your bylaws, constitution & etc. Creating a NPO is simple & anyone in the forums here that belongs to a Club should have the basic understandings of how a NPO functions.

By leaving the present forum/thread public you are subject to a lot of chatter & distractions.

I would agree that a Mission Statement seems to be more important at this stage than the structure of the membership. After we figure out what we're doing, then we can decide how to go about accomplishing it.

I'm not convinced a "private" forum is necessary, but your point about the chatter is well taken. Perhaps it's enough to have a totally separate forum section for this topic. That way at least, you'll only get the people who really are interested, and not just everyone who happens to read the most popular section on this site.

Are the board maintainers willing to create a forum section dedicated to the structure of the Voyageurs (which section could include this type of discussion)?

[The Beaver]

Yeah, I think rdoze and Coach Rich are right--we need to forge a mission statement before we know which structure will best enable us to execute that mission.

Doing any of this will prove challenging while we are scattered across the country, but with patience we can do our best to overcome these challenges. First order of business--very practically--is to get a clear sense of all those interested in playing some sort of role in an organized structure. Perhaps this group will meet in a separate forum--where they can comfortably divulge their real names, the various strengths, skills and connections they could bring to the organized body, and their brief mission statement for this body. To be clear, the brief bio would only be for meet-and-greet purposes, and to get a sense of our collective strengths. We will worry about who runs what portfolio at a later date.

So guys, what do you think? With the U20 tournament taking up our attention for the next two weeks, should we aim for a deadline of July 31 for everyone interested to submit brief bio and mission statement? Not sure the best way--technically--to host this forum, or how to even reasonably discuss the plethora of mission statements we will gather, but it seems a decent place to start.

[The Ref]

I think CoachRich has a good wide-view of the field and some sensible ideas. When CoachRich refers to Admin doing this or that, I suggest that such Admin be a three person committee, residing in the same city, known to each other and at an arms-length relationship. This PIC (pre incorporation committee) will do all the preliminary research, prepare drafts and proposals. An email address can be set up and members-at-large (posters) can submit their ideas under real names (or not). As the PIC completes drafts they can be posted or emailed to those interested for feedback and refinements.

[DJT]

If a special section in which to discuss this is desired, may I suggest the existing Forum Help & Suggestions section? It hardly ever gets used and, despite its name suggesting that it is specifically to discuss the forum, it is really to discuss the Voyageurs in general.

[CoachRich]

Some quicks links on starting a NPO. NPO w/ national stakeholders you have to conside reg'ing as a extra-provincial NPO.

http://www.charityvillage.com/cv/guides/guide4.asp

http://www.corporationcentre.ca/docen/home/faq.asp?id=incnp

http://www.infoentrepreneurs.org/servlet/ContentServer?cid=1081944192585&pagename=CBSC_QC%2Fdisplay〈=en&c=Regs

[CoachRich]

A key person of the group should be someone w/ an accounting background for a couple of reasons. Proper accounting for the members. Also being able to manage the financials & suggest projects that let the NPO qualify for finanical assistance from provincial gaming funds.

[CoachRich]

This is what I was meaning by a Private/Hidden forum. I find they work really well w/ working committees & BOD's as they are for core workers.

Also, I've found that forums work better then Emails when project managing a project.

In the end it's what ever works for the majority of as we all have diff Internet SOP's.

[Johnnie Monster]

I hate to put poop in the party, but what exactly do you hope to achieve by incorporating?

I've heard a few comments on here to the effect of "The media and CSA will take us more seriously if we're a registered society!"

Newsflash: They don't care.

The fact is, the media takes sheer numbers seriously, not incorporation papers.

To them, news is sexy when there's a LOT of people PO'd about something, marching in the streets and calling for heads to roll. A scant few keyboard jockeys across the nation means bugger all to the dailies.

And let's get real, it's not like reporters are going to go trolling through corporate registries to ensure our annual reports have been filed before determining whether our opinions are informed or not... we either have something intelligent to say, or we don't.

The only reason for incorporating is if the Voyageurs are going to put someone on the payroll to speak on our behalf, and to elect a board to ensure the spokesman is accountable.

Otherwise, WTFing point?

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Johnnie Monster

I hate to put poop in the party, but what exactly do you hope to achieve by incorporating?

I've heard a few comments on here to the effect of "The media and CSA will take us more seriously if we're a registered society!"

Newsflash: They don't care.

The fact is, the media takes sheer numbers seriously, not incorporation papers.

To them, news is sexy when there's a LOT of people PO'd about something, marching in the streets and calling for heads to roll. A scant few keyboard jockeys across the nation means bugger all to the dailies.

And let's get real, it's not like reporters are going to go trolling through corporate registries to ensure our annual reports have been filed before determining whether our opinions are informed or not... we either have something intelligent to say, or we don't.

The only reason for incorporating is if the Voyageurs are going to put someone on the payroll to speak on our behalf, and to elect a board to ensure the spokesman is accountable.

Otherwise, WTFing point?

Agreed. There is obviously an agenda behind this that we dont know about.

[River City]

I had no idea it was this hard to keep a thread on topic. Thank you for your opinion Johnnie Monster, but please use the other thread to debate the merits of incorporating.

Free Kick, there is no agenda on my end except to have soccer fans take a hold of the opportunity before us. There is no other 'first world' country in such a sorry, sad state when it comes to soccer. Our national association is useless both to developing the game in the country as well as managing our national teams. I'd like to see Canada at the World Cup in 2010. And 2014. And 2018. And 2022, and every edition after that.

I'm afraid though that without a major change, Canada won't make 2010. Just like they didn't make 2006, 2002, 1998, 1994 and 1990. We can blame external forces all we want (referees, Jack Warner, Kevan Pipe), but it all boils down to the same thing - we haven't qualified in 20 years. That would be unacceptable in other parts of the world that took its soccer seriously.

My opinion is that by becoming well organized as an incorporated group, we will have a say in how soccer develops in Canada, by the sheer facts that 1) we exist and more importantly, 2) we're vocal about it. Johnnie Monster was right that the CSA and the media don't care. But you make enough noise and make yourself visible enough and they'll have no choice but to accept you.

We got some airtime with the CSA letter that was released just before they hired Mitchell. We got airtime on the Voyageurs Cup when we had sufficient teams competing. We can get more.

Bottom line, if you don't think it'll work or if you don't want it, hang tight. Whatever structure is agreed to for a possible incorporated Voyageurs has to be put to a vote. There is a chance the majority won't want it and all this discussion is for nothing. But I think it's worth the effort. Just like I think everything this group has done has been worth the effort even if we haven't qualified for the World Cup since '86.

[Jarrek]

quote:There is a chance the majority won't want it and all this discussion is for nothing.

Who is the majority? Who is elegible to vote? Anyone with a single post on this forum? Lurkers? I can register as 10 different individuals and cast 10 different votes.

Membership needs to be better established.

[The Beaver]

quote:Originally posted by Jarrek

Who is the majority? Who is elegible to vote? Anyone with a single post on this forum? Lurkers? I can register as 10 different individuals and cast 10 different votes.

Membership needs to be better established.

We won't get anywhere if we make this a democratic process involving everyone on the forum. I am not saying this to exclude people--not at all. We need to think of the "official and active and organized" arm of the Voyageurs in different terms than we do this forum. The forum is only a part of what we do, only one of the services we offer as an organized group. Only those truly interested in playing an active role in an organized structure should have a vote. We cannot and should not expect to collect a nominal membership fee when doing so will actually run counter to what we are doing, which is grow support for our teams. We're not going to find any consensus here--on the broader forum--and to be honest, we aren't going to ever get this thing off the ground until those who are interested in playing a real role--only--get together and start discussing what we want to achieve, and how we'll get there. Truth of the matter is that I don't think we've the stomach--or the energy--to do this. We are all so damned busy, it seems. We need somebody to drive this, but it won't happen on this forum. It cannot. Again, who wants to be involved? From there, we need to discuss what we want to achieve. Then we can decide on effective structures.